Stealth needs a buff

[Xen0tech 10]

Is it just me or is the enemy too psychic in this game? The ai is so random in how it detects that it almost make stealth tactics pointless. I made a test mission with detection triggers and tried firing my gun knowing the enemy should hear but he didn't. Then I shot him with a suppressed gun and another unit not even joined or equipped with a radio was aware. I have always loved making stealthy missions in arma but now I remember why I stopped playing arma 2. I know its only alpha but so far its troubling to think these issues still exist.

[metalcraze 290]

There's no subsonic ammunition in ArmA3 yet and it seems that BIS finally made suppressors realistic - e.g. they make little difference to usual ammo.

And stealth isn't about killing everyone. It's about being undetected. I never understood the complaint "I go in guns blazing and I'm getting detected?! BIS fix my stealths"

[Smurf 12]

When the AI can see and shoot me through a window, at night, just after being ambushed with mines and explosives, yeah, there is something wrong with their detecting skills not only for stealth porpouses.

Guess we are not yet in the AI focused tests\fixes, hope to see it soon.

[Mattar_Tharkari 10]

The old problem of AI jumping out of damaged vehicles that you just blew up and killing you instantly is still there - did that eventually get fixed in A2?

[DaRkL3AD3R 1]

When the AI can see and shoot me through a window, at night, just after being ambushed with mines and explosives, yeah, there is something wrong with their detecting skills not only for stealth porpouses.

Guess we are not yet in the AI focused tests\fixes, hope to see it soon.

This. They don't actually detect you through conventional means. It's more like a toggled state of combat with wallhacks.

[froggyluv 2136]

Scuba guys at night are also getting detected a little too easily both under and above water.

[wipman 1]

Hi, on the ArmA2 the AI was able of know exactly, where you were and track you, behind 'live' or empty vehicles, objects as walls and buildings and even behind hills without any kind of air support or drone of their side on the air. I doubt that they've changed really that much the AI on this field, as they would have had to re-write from zero the AI detection routines to fix this sensible field; i don't think that this thing ever get properly fixed to make the AI react close enough to how trained soldiers would react, to contacts or to suspected contacts. Let's C ya

[Xen0tech 10]

Okay I just watched this video

It made me feel alot better to know suppressed guns are still really noisy. The thing arma is lacking is the realistic suppressed gunfire sfx. I do still strongly believe enemies sight is unrealisticly overpowered though.

[maturin 12]

The AI do detect you through a two-step process of normal means, using simulated hearing and vision to acquire targets.

They only see you when they have line of sight to your position. The problem here is that upon being alerted to the presence of enemies (after hearing gunshots, taking causalities or getting mined), they will detect threats almost instantly as long there is line of sight. Through windows, darkness and cluttered forest environments this makes them a lot better at detection than most players in many situations.

I am quite disappointed that BIS hasn't re-written their threat detection from the ground up, preserving their acute senses but making them gradually locate sources of fire after suppressing area targets and moving to cover.

Hi, on the ArmA2 the AI was able of know exactly, where you were and track you, behind 'live' or empty vehicles, objects as walls and buildings and even behind hills without any kind of air support or drone of their side on the air. I doubt that they've changed really that much the AI on this field,

Barring a very limited number of glitched assets and occasional momentary exceptions, this is utterly false. Let's C ya.

[Jex 1]

The AI do detect you through a two-step process of normal means, using simulated hearing and vision to acquire targets.

They only see you when they have line of sight to your position. The problem here is that upon being alerted to the presence of enemies (after hearing gunshots, taking causalities or getting mined), they will detect threats almost instantly as long there is line of sight. Through windows, darkness and cluttered forest environments this makes them a lot better at detection than most players in many situations.

I am quite disappointed that BIS hasn't re-written their threat detection from the ground up, preserving their acute senses but making them gradually locate sources of fire after suppressing area targets and moving to cover.

Barring a very limited number of glitched assets and occasional momentary exceptions, this is utterly false. Let's C ya.

Presumably when you say through windows or forests, LOS means even a gap as wide as your thumb?

[maturin 12]

Presumably when you say through windows or forests, LOS means even a gap as wide as your thumb?

Now go find me where a forest made of large polygons actually has gaps as wide as your thumb. The viewblock geometry is never that complex.

In ArmA 2, the game gives you an enormous amount of leeway. There's legions of whiny newbs complaining about being spotted when partially concealed, and yet the AI won't recognize your legs, arms, weapon or even pelvis as a target. The problem is 100% in the other direction, giving the advantage to the player.

Now, I am simply referring to the natural limitations of the human eye to pick out small objects in complex scenes of differing shapes and colors. In short, you can see better than the AI on an empty runway, but much worse in a dense thicket. Then there's the issue of darkness and weather, which will never be made perfect because AI scripts can't mimic how the human eye works in every situation.

[bad benson 1733]

the issue of darkness and weather, which will never be made perfect because AI scripts can't mimic how the human eye works in every situation.

or just wait for ASR to be fully ported. i know what you mean about the vanilla AI. but ASR shows how this can easily be solved by dynamically changing the several skill parameters on the fly. meaning lowering spot time and distance automatically when it's night. ASR uses a night coefficient for that. i fail to see how that can't be implemented in the full game.

but yea it's alpha. let's wait and see/hope.

but i agree on being spotted in general. i really like it when the AI is good at it because it makes you play more stealthy. same with the accuracy. i first hated it but now i love it since it makes you play more like you are really in danger (because you are ;)).

in general if you want to play stealthy make guards that are not a in a group and make them "careless" or "safe". you can easily sneak up on them that way at least at night. in fact it makes the inability of the AI to quickly aim in close quarters painfully obvious.

oh please BIS. hear our prayers. make the AI functional. we don't need a better AI if you can't put in the resources but at least what we have should function properly. that would improve the experience a lot already,

[maturin 12]

You are very easily pleased if you think ASR does anything more than re-balance slightly. It cannot and does not do anything to actually change the target acquisition system. The AI will still be oblivious to the impact of shadows, not be affected enough by moon phases, and home in one muzzle flashes with supernatural precision.

[bad benson 1733]

You are very easily pleased if you think ASR does anything more than re-balance slightly

i exactly described what ASR does for the night so just reread and you'll see what i think...

so...not easily pleased. just keeping my expectations low since i know the AI very well since OFP and well, not much has changed in some regards. you have to agree though that having the spotting ability just lowered like ASR does in vanilla would be better than being spotted at night the same as at daytime like it is now.

i'd prefer vanilla having solid AI over mods everyday. reality looked different in the past though so yea if they won't change it they could at least adopt what improves it instead of leaving it the same.

[wipman 1]

Barring a very limited number of glitched assets and occasional momentary exceptions, this is utterly false.

It isn't. On the ArmA2 the AI was able of see through most buildings, the fat trees, empty vehicles as APCs or MBTs, destroyed ones or alive ones (with manning crew on 'em); also on dense forests and land accurate shots through a 2cm hole on a bush, always after that you'd shoot at least a round. This is my experience with the ArmA2 without mods that change the AI dinamics, i'd always used textures and models replacements or mods to remove the blur and all that dirty glow "ala BF series" or worst; i'd used an AI mod once that made 'em to not shoot RPGs on infantry, but i'd removed it as the AI didn't just fire the RPGs on vehicles that were linked to INFantry, but the dafault AI...!? was able to see and track you through solid objects at least for the player; is/was clear playing on Player+AI PvP missions, my AIs were singing the NME possitions all the time very accurately so was the AIs on the OPFOR, booth side were trusting on their respective AIs to put down targets and did work; like that... many more times. Let's C ya

[DaRkL3AD3R 1]

It isn't. On the ArmA2 the AI was able of see through most buildings, the fat trees, empty vehicles as APCs or MBTs, destroyed ones or alive ones (with manning crew on 'em); also on dense forests and land accurate shots through a 2cm hole on a bush, always after that you'd shoot at least a round. This is my experience with the ArmA2 without mods that change the AI dinamics, i'd always used textures and models replacements or mods to remove the blur and all that dirty glow "ala BF series" or worst; i'd used an AI mod once that made 'em to not shoot RPGs on infantry, but i'd removed it as the AI didn't just fire the RPGs on vehicles that were linked to INFantry, but the dafault AI...!? was able to see and track you through solid objects at least for the player; is/was clear playing on Player+AI PvP missions, my AIs were singing the NME possitions all the time very accurately so was the AIs on the OPFOR, booth side were trusting on their respective AIs to put down targets and did work; like that... many more times. Let's C ya

Yep this is my exact findings with Arma and has been the number one turn off for me in playing single player AI missions.

I'd much rather play online and face the perils of hackers as that's essentially what the AI is. Wallhacking aimbotting NPC's with god like reflexes.