Syria - What should we do if anything?

[eble 3]

Undoubtly like myself everyone has been watching what has been happening in Syria.

What appeared to be a small uprising now seems to be spreading with the introduction of the supply of weapons to the rebels.

Is the West and Saudi Arabia trying a defacto change of government similiar to Libya?

My thoughts are the Syrian army is much more organised and professional than anything that Libya had to offer, does the West intend to have limited intervention i.e airstrikes? With Syria's good array of local air defence systems could be a good chance Syria could defend itself to some extent. (Taken from Wikipedia):

Inventory

320 Lavochkin CP-75 Dvina/S-75M Volga (SA-2) launchers - under upgrade

148 Isayev S-125 Neva/S-125M Pechora (SA-3) launchers - under upgrade

48 S-200 Angara (SA-5) launchers

200 2K12 Kub (SA-6) launchers

60 9K33 Osa (SA-8) launchers

48 S-300 (SA-10) launchers[5][6]

48 9K37 Buk (SA-11) launchers

N/A 9M311-1M Tunguska (SA-19) launchers

N/A TOR-M1 (SA-15) launchers

50 Pantsir-S1 (SA-22) launchers[7][8]

This is excluding the 4000 + manpads etc

We have seen recently the bombing of the US embassy in Libya, has the Arab spring backfired in Libya?

[batto 17]

Rebels in Syria are anything but freedom fighters. You've been brainwashed. Try to get better info. Those headshots in children in Hama weren't caused by artillery. There's much more evidence showing that those rebels are terrorists (waving al-Qaeda sometimes). It seems they're constantly killing civilians to make propaganda videos blaming Asad but fortunately sometimes they failed and whole scenes were exposed. I'm not trying to say that Syria army is good as I'm not going to say that US army in Iraq is bad but all they're are doing is freeing Syria from those un-armed peaceful freedom fighters.

Inb4 PELHAM pointing to NATO links with no useful information at all, talking non-sense about RT which will never be mentioned in this thread, ...

Have you seen the news where Syria army supposedly buried some poor victim alive (less than 1 month back)? All major (= brainwashing) sites had articles and they were totally sure it was Syria army. Have you noticed that audio was completely fabricated (the man still talks without problem even when he has sand in mouth and the audio was recorded in room)? I'm amazed how easily can people accept anything that's on major news. Syrian terrorists are such bad movie makers...

Ontopic: We should stop being dicks, remove sanctions, stop supplying weapons/money to al-Qaeda terrorists. But it will never happen because I fear that Syria uprising, as Lybia uprising, is part of plan made several years ago.

Edited June 8, 2012 by batto

[slatts 1978]

Without doubt both sides have killed civilians, but I think military action is pretty much off the table at this point as no one really knows how much support for the "rebels" there is, whats the point of bombing the Syrian army if 90% support Al Asad?

The U.N peace plan has failed, today I heard even the U.N observers were being fired at. I'd say if it was the rebels, leave them to it and go home, let them slug it out.

[Tonci87 163]

I don´t trust thos syrian "freedom fighters"

Why are they so well armed? Who gave them those Weapons? What is their ultimate goal? Unless I don´t know these things I will not support any foreign intervention in Syria.

Maybe the only chance to stop the violence would be to bring in Peacekeeping troops from Turkey

[icebreakr 3157]

Interesting fact: Massacre happens and immediately (after few hours) western media reports that *government* (no facts checked) killed 86 people, including women and children. What government would do that to their own people? Only possible explaination is that these acts are commited by terrorists (maybe even supplied with western $$$ and backed personel/intel).

See the interview about the previous massacre by an eyewitness:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyi-tJ_0PPg

Edited June 8, 2012 by IceBreakr

[batto 17]

I'll repost another great example of brainwashing from March. Firstly, here is a description for the video:

At least ten people were killed when Syrian security forces fired a mortar on a protest against Syrian President Bashar al-Assad in the town of Rastan in Homs province, according to the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights.

Here is the video (note I've permisson for that link): http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7400719n

Syrian army started using homing pigeon grenades to avoid contact with roof !!!

Poor PELHAM couldn't find arguments and tried to shield with forum rules instead.

[STALKERGB 6]

Have you seen the news where Syria army supposedly buried some poor victim alive (less than 1 month back)? All major (= brainwashing) sites had articles and they were totally sure it was Syria army. Have you noticed that audio was completely fabricated (the man still talks without problem even when he has sand in mouth and the audio was recorded in room)? I'm amazed how easily can people accept anything that's on major news. Syrian terrorists are such bad movie makers...

After a quick search on Google News and BBC/Sky I found no mention of this story being carried, not to say it did/didn't happen or was/wasn't faked but still.

stop supplying weapons/money to al-Qaeda terrorists.

I'm by no means saying the Free Syrian Army is "good" (they abandoned Annan's ceasefire as much as anyone) but could you honestly say that ALL of the "rebels" are terrorists? I wager that the majority are Syrians who want regime change.

As for the term "freedom fighter" or "rebel" when I spoke to Stephen Cole (Al Jazeera English presenter) he said that a lot of news sites will avoid using the terms as much as possible as both imply a political/morale stance on the site's view of a conflict.

[Darkhorse 1-6 16]

It'll probably never happen, but I think what should happen is the assembling of a coalition of middle eastern states. Have the US supply the intelligence/sat recon, either raw or already sorted (I believe we did this for the Brits during the Falklands, to great effect. We've got one of the best systems in the world.), have US/UK/etc. supply AWACS birds & refueling where needed, maybe field hospitals, even have us do CSAR etc., but have the Arab states do the actual ground pounding. It works out better for everybody, in the end. The West shows that we want peace, not just to constantly invade any nation we want, it would show the world that we can work together in the middle east, and it would probably greatly strengthen ties between the nations involved, strengthening the entire region. There's even the possibility Israel could offer assistance, although that would understandably be a touchy subject.

[celery 8]

What government would do that to their own people?

Syria's?

[Desert1 1]

removed! This is the Free Syrian Army blowing up a BMP, from this it looks like they are ok with taking out light armour

Edited June 8, 2012 by Foxhound

[ProfTournesol 956]

In fact this is a civil and regional war at the same time.

On one side, the Sunni muslims, accounting for 70% at least of the Syrian population, supported by fundamentalist Wahhabi countries (mainly Saoudi Arabia and Quatar) ;

One the other side, the leading minority of Shia (Alawite mainly, Assad clique and supporters), accounting for something like 15% of the population, and very directly supported by Iran and Lebanese Hezbollah (itself supported by Iran, and very often crossing the border to help Assad). It seems that this minority is, ATM, supported by the other religious minorities of Syria (Mainly Christians and Druze), frightened by what is happening in Irak, for example.

Thus, it's no need of name calling or other "you brainwashed" kindergarten mottos, it is simply a religious war between Muslims (which "champions" are Saoudi Arabia and Iran), which is raging in Irak and will extend wherever it could in Middle-East.

The other non muslim "powers" are choosing their side (and their oil suppliers or weapon buyers) : Russia and in a lesser extent China have chosen Iran, and the USA and Western countries have more or less chosen Saudi Arabia. Strategic and economic interest of both sides are very obvious, so there is no good guys and bad guys here. But as supporting Saoudi Arabia and Pakistan is a very dangerous game for the US, supporting Iran for Russia and China may be very dangerous too.

Edited June 8, 2012 by ProfTournesol

[dysta 10]

... supporting Iran for Russia and China may be very dangerous too.

For both countries, it surely issued with security concern with both religion and terrorism. However, SCO seems not to care about it.

[Guest]

@Desert1

You should read the forum rules again:

§6) No posting of explicit images

No posting of pictures containing porn, real killing, mutilations, wounds, carnage, and other disgusting/explicit images. This also includes links to pages that contain such images. If you are in doubt, contact a moderator via private message before posting. You won't be banned for checking out if a link is ok to post if it's a genuine request.

Rules:

http://forums.bistudio.com/misc.php?do=showrules

It is obvious people are dying in that vehicle and as such posting a link to such video is not allowed. Also you tried to embed it but luckely failed.

[batto 17]

After a quick search on Google News and BBC/Sky I found no mention of this story being carried, not to say it did/didn't happen or was/wasn't faked but still.

Try googling "syria buried alive" (and append &hl=en to URL). First cca 50 results are all like "Rebel burried alive by Assad army". Of course there is no evidence and the audio is completely fake.

I'm by no means saying the Free Syrian Army is "good" (they abandoned Annan's ceasefire as much as anyone) but could you honestly say that ALL of the "rebels" are terrorists? I wager that the majority are Syrians who want regime change.

Majority of those holding/shooting guns? First of all Assad promised slow democratic reforms later this year. Sure it's just promise. Second, the rebels are not majority of Syria nor are Assad's supporters. Majority is the middle (his words, he's actually smart guy.).

Thus, it's no need of name calling or other "you brainwashed" kindergarten mottos, it is simply a religious war between Muslims (which "champions" are Saoudi Arabia and Iran), which is raging in Irak and will extend wherever it could in Middle-East.

If it's just religious war why are all western major news filled with fake crap?

Edited June 8, 2012 by batto

[maturin 12]

Assad has pretty successfully turned the Arab Spring into a religious and ethnic war, rather than a popular revolt against an autocrat.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Assad has pretty successfully turned the Arab Spring into a religious and ethnic war, rather than a popular revolt against an autocrat.

True, but he's a puppet in Iran's hands.

[batto 17]

Assad has pretty successfully turned the Arab Spring into a religious and ethnic war, rather than a popular revolt against an autocrat.

On what facts do you base this statement? All I know is that there is Syria army fighting rebels. How is it religious and ethinc war?

True, but he's a puppet in Iran's hands.

Why do you think so? Why are you ignoring me?

Edited June 8, 2012 by batto

[nettrucker 142]

Most probably the rebels are US backed. My guess CIA. Do as you're told . . . otherwise we bring you democracy.

[Darkhorse 1-6 16]

Bah. The CIA always gets blamed. Why don't we ever hear conspiracy theories about Finland controlling things, or some madman from Tasmania, etc. ;)

[-GR-Operative 10]

We all know almost every Arab Spring revolt is carried by jihadists/extremists. See what's going on Egypt/Lybia.

Also, I'm all against western intervention, and, in all fairness, any foreign intervention at all.

The western media is also totally biased.

---------- Post added at 06:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:19 PM ----------

Bah. The CIA always gets blamed. Why don't we ever hear conspiracy theories about Finland controlling things, or some madman from Tasmania, etc. ;)

I call it background ;)

[maturin 12]

On what facts do you base this statement? All I know is that there is Syria army fighting rebels. How is it religious and ethinc war?

Support for Assad breaks down on ethnic and religious lines in many cases. You could see it in to divided neighborhood of Holms.

Assad tells the Christian minority that the rebels will enforce Shariah law and that they are only safe under his rule. Works the same way with different sects. He says the same thing Mubarak said; that the country would fall apart without him. Unlike Mubarak, he's sowing seeds of division to prevent a unified movement against his dictatorship from forming. A self-fulfilling prophecy.

Syria is probably too much of a basket-case for useful outside involvement.

[icebreakr 3157]

I wonder if Western media would also call a group of muslim citizens revolting in US a Free American Army or just plain & simple terrorists? :)

[spooky lynx 73]

I wonder if Western media would also call a group of muslim citizens revolting in US a Free American Army or just plain & simple terrorists? :)

IRA and ETA were not Muslims, but... You know the end.

[ProfTournesol 956]

IRA and ETA were not Muslims, but... You know the end.

But they were terrorist.

[spooky lynx 73]

But they were terrorist.

From the very beginning of their history?