Damage handling is ridiculous

[daman3 19]

Hello,

my suggestion is to get rid of the system of halving the damage a unit receives

when prone.

It sure makes sense when there is an explosion going off but when I only have

small arms fire, it can take up to 4-7 hits to kill someone with a M16 or AK at 150+ meters, including several headshots.

This is making ordinary soldiers to ubersoldiers.

Here is a link to the issue:

http://dev-heaven.net/issues/20441

Is this essential or do you think the developers should get rid of it?

[metalcraze 290]

Yes it is essential. It is very annoying when I have to hit the lying dude 6 times from my M4A1 just to make him die.

BIS it doesn't do what you think it does. Lying dude is already hard to hit as it is. Just add more objects rendered in the distance ike in VBS2 if you want to make a prone dude less noticeable.

[Nielsen 10]

...it can take up to 4-7 hits to kill someone with a M16 or AK at 150+ meters, including several headshots.

This is making ordinary soldiers to ubersoldiers.

Agreed. It's annoying when sniping and you see an AI take several rounds to the face, then get up and run to safety.

[kylania 568]

There's nothing in that ticket that proves that damage on prone units is "halved".

[metalcraze 290]

Isn't it like a common knowledge about the prone damage?

[HyperU2 11]

It should be.

[KC Grimes 79]

There's nothing in that ticket that proves that damage on prone units is "halved".

I agree, just lots of "oh I tested it" but no numbers other than ranges of shots.

Honestly I've never even heard of this.

[Bouben 3]

I have never noticed such issue with prone units. Strange.

[theblessedpig 10]

This issue persists. It's pretty visible when you are trying to drop a guy and he is still alive even after 2 headshots. This happens quite often when you try to drop a guy from a larger distance and it still takes at least 2 headshots to kill him when he is prone.

[ziiip 1]

I have had the "headshot wont kill" phenomenon many times and it annoying as crap.

[metalcraze 290]

I have never noticed such issue with prone units. Strange.

That depends on the distance too. As I understand much like in real life bullet slow downs over time.

So if you are shooting at the guy who lies down right in front of you he will take a lot of damage, while the guy 200m-300m away much less

[CarlGustaffa 4]

My opinion is to just let it be. It helps to create firefights and ammo situations. Accurate shooting with 5.56 over distances is ridiculous expectations. Personally I haven't observed anything unusual due prone, only due distance. I might be wrong though. But it doesn't "feel bad". But that's just me.

[celery 8]

Here is a scientific method to see for yourself.

Place a player unit, copy him as two friendly soldiers, and in both of their inits:

this addEventHandler ["HandleDamage",{if (_this select 1=="") then {hintSilent format ["%1",_this select 2]}}];this setUnitPos "DOWN"

Change "DOWN" to "UP" for one soldier.

When you shoot either soldier, you'll get a hint with the damage suffered. The standing soldier will get roughly 0.7 damage from an M16, and the prone soldier will get 0.35. Head and body get normal damage as far as I can tell, and what this means is that you have to shoot a double amount into a prone enemy's arms and legs until he dies. And since the arms, legs and rifle cover much of the body in many cases and with the recent damage model change of reduced damage "splash" to other body parts from normal bullets, it will make prone enemies seem like bullet sponges.

Edited September 4, 2011 by Celery

[rye1 21]

I've came across it too. Hitdetections needs work over range. It mainly happens with our clan for longer range hits, headshots or not, they can survive though sometimes they do not. It's a kind of hit and miss bug, sometimes it happens and other times it works fine.

ACE wounds as it stands now (not earlier versions) makes it better and more reliable but the problem will persist as it's a BIS bug.

Though sometimes it can happen at closer ranges it's less common. And I thought everyone knew about prone soldier's getting less damage? And the fact a toe shot will send some amount of damage ALL over the body including head? =D

[celery 8]

And the fact a toe shot will send some amount of damage ALL over the body including head? =D

Nope. There's an overall damage "part" that accumulates the same amount wherever you shoot. When that part, head or torso has more than 0.9 damage, the unit dies.

[.kju 3245]

Demo mission attached

The problem for headshots is that when an unit is prone,

the hit selections don't always work well in addition. See:

# Grass layer doesn't lower "fire LOD" on infantry

# Infantry weapon model blocks bullets, shields infantry as no/very little subsequent damage gets applied

[metalcraze 290]

Well I kinda like that weapon does block bullets. Shouldn't it be like that when a bullet hits the weapon?

Better implement weapon wear/damage instead and connected to that as well. Will be more realistic too.

[.kju 3245]

This is not what this thread is about.

[metalcraze 290]

This thread is about fixing, not cutting out though

[sgtfishmen 10]

Isn't it like a common knowledge about the prone damage?

Only amongst cooky RPGcodex posters ;)

[.kju 3245]

For me the thread title is:

> Damage handling is ridiculous

and he says:

my suggestion is to get rid of the system of halving the damage a unit receives when prone

[Nielsen 10]

My opinion is to just let it be. It helps to create firefights and ammo situations. Accurate shooting with 5.56 over distances is ridiculous expectations. Personally I haven't observed anything unusual due prone, only due distance. I might be wrong though. But it doesn't "feel bad". But that's just me.

I've mostly seen this when sniping. I've had it happen many times with 7.62 at medium range.. I do recognize your point, but when you put your rounds on target as a marksman, you kinda expect them to kill..

Not sure if it is hit detection or reduced damage that does it, but I've had many 7.62 rounds fail to kill with headshots at around 500m.

[rye1 21]

Tell you what as well, somewhat related, death anims should be ignored when the player is trying to walk through a body. Put your team in a hallway with 1xOPFOR at one end and walk towards him in single file, have that OPFOR shoot dead the front man. Then try walk and you get stuck on the body, even when it's on the floor, for a few seconds while it ends the 'death anim' and it's friggen annoying! It should ignore it and you walk straight through or over the top. Happens when people are injured too then you just get clogged up, it's a big fail in CQB.