They better have female soldiers...

[antoineflemming 14]

I dunno. It sounds like greece is being occupied to me.

It's part of Greece. Actually, a little less than half.

http://www.arma3.com/full/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/web_background_europe_map.jpg

[Tonci87 163]

half of Europe ISN'T occupied. Go look at the arma3 wepbage. That was the old story, when NATO was about to be driven into the sea, where CPT Miller was the last of his unit, washed ashore on Limnos, alone. The story isn't that anymore. It's been toned down. There are no more references to NATO being desperate, or about an Iran-NATO war starting in 2021, or about a Second Battle of Brno. All that's gone! BIS toned down the story a WHOLE lot. That's my point.

For example:

OLD STORY:

New Story

See the difference? It's not as desperate a situation as the story once was. That was the point of that post. It's no longer a situation that "calls for irregulars and desperate measures". IDK why BIS toned down the story. Maybe they figured that an Iran conquering all of Europe wasn't realistic or something. IDK

I'd maybe agree with you if you were talking about the Greek resistance, but I mean, in countries today where there are revolts and civil wars, there aren't women taking up arms. There's nothing that would say that the Greek resistance would have men, women, and children fighting. I mean, think about it practically. These resistance members who are against Iranian occupation have families. Someone has to take care of the children. So the men will fight while the women will take care of their families.

This post nor the one you quoted aren't meant to make an argument for or against female soldiers in-game.

1) I was just wondering whether this issue of female soldiers ingame is a game maker or breaker to some people, as I don't know.

2) I was trying to point out to everyone that the story indeed has changed from a year ago.

Maybe it was because half the community was bitching about the unrealistic story with Iran beeing a super power...

Well Ilike the new story.

[antoineflemming 14]

Maybe it was because half the community was bitching about the unrealistic story with Iran beeing a super power...

Well Ilike the new story.

I think you're right. Although, I was really interested in the prospect of an invaded Europe. And, I mean, like, Battle of Brno? Sounded pretty cool. This story's definitely more plausible though. IF the story were still the post-WW3 story, I'd understand why NATO would be in such desperate condition that they'd want every available person who could fight. But, the situation isn't that desperate now, so there's even less reason for BIS to add in female soldiers. Maybe at some point BIS will change their minds. But, isn't a game maker or breaker to me. I'll still get ArmA3 regardless.

[Booster 1]

Yeah, that poll is not my doing, it have been added by someone over the year.

I apologize, I assumed that you created the poll because you started this thread. Sorry about that.

So They have said for over a year ago that there would be no women that can fight in ARMA 3?

I was certain it was confirmed in an interview with Lord Buchta around about the time of E3 2011. Can someone please verify this for me.

[max power 21]

It is possible the poll was added through a merge.

[Booster 1]

It is possible the poll was added through a merge.

Now I understand how it happened. Thanks for explaining Max.

[FUNKSTAR 10]

Ex British forces here, all females in the British Army are REMF's simple as! Get back in the cookhouse lol

[max power 21]

And another one.

FUNKSTAR

I said no flagrant sexism in this topic.

+1 infraction for ignoring moderator instructions.

No moar sexist crap, plox. If you have nothing to add about women soldiers in the sim environment, please refrain from posting.

I'll repeat myself one last time, and tell you the same thing I told n7snk in his warning.

This is not a private hang out with you and your friends to disparage people based on their sex or race for fun, whether you actually mean it or not. This is the public forum for a business.

There will be no more warnings from me in this topic. Public discrimination and humiliation is a problem. Further wanton sexist jokes or statements will accrue infractions.

§1) No Flaming/Flame-baiting/bigotry

Abusive, racist, sexist, homophobic comments (or any other type of bigotry), personal attacks and name calling are not allowed either on the forum or through PM's. If you receive a PM that is abusive or you find offensive please forward it to a moderator who will investigate.

§2) Follow the instructions of the moderators

When a moderator or BIS staff member asks you to do something or to stop doing something, please follow their instructions. If you have questions/complaints/comments about the forum or moderators please PM them to a moderator, we will do our utmost to reply to any that we receive. If you have an issue that you feel cannot be solved by another moderator then please PM the head moderator (Placebo), he will be happy to look into the matter.

[hellfire257 3]

Also, funny stories of female soldiers attached to a Combat Arm unit serving on the frontline?

Operation Herrick 10 - A certain Infantry Regiment based in a Forward Operating Base returns to Bastion on a switch-over. Their RSM walks into the main AGC compound pulling their attached female clerk by the scruff of her neck and says to the female RAO:

"Can we have another one please, this one's full."

The Clerk had slept with the majority of the 100 strong male unit during their three months out at the FoB.

Arf. :D

That is hilarious lol, thanks for sharing that! :D

Sorry if this has already been posted, but it is an interesting opinion piece on the subject:

http://thesoldiersload.com/2012/05/24/women-do-not-belong-in-the-infantry/

[Booster 1]

I said no flagrant sexism in this topic.

*Max reaches for Ban Hammer*

[pathetic_berserker 4]

1) I was just wondering whether this issue of female soldiers ingame is a game maker or breaker to some people, as I don't know.

2) I was trying to point out to everyone that the story indeed has changed from a year ago.

Ans

1. Didn't realy break A2 so it won't break A3, but having combat able females would make it more robust. Taking into account where the community and future DLC's may want to go I think it's in BIs' interest to facilitate combative females from the outset. (So that persistant WW3 MOD is catered for)

2.Your kind of right, the story has changed, and it seems a little less deperate, but I think only from an armchair perspective. The level of desperation a people may feel when in a conflict zone propbably isn't all that dependant on the size of the zone, and the core ideas of a resistance movement are still apparent and females have long added depth to resistance storys, real and fictional.

[max power 21]

To add to point 2, what I was trying to convey is that when your home is invaded by a hostile force, the situation is (arguably) by definition desparate.

[antoineflemming 14]

To add to point 2, what I was trying to convey is that when your home is invaded by a hostile force, the situation is (arguably) by definition desparate.

Oh, relative to the Limnos inhabitants. I thought you were talking about NATO being desperate.

[nodunit 397]

No...female soldier does not immediately imply only military, you lot did, and it's driven this damn topic into loops so many times again and again.

And for the record, why aren't they possible? The assets exist, supposedly they will get animations, so why half ass it, why not just cut them from the game entirerly otherwise. Better and more efficient to have a sausage fest Sahrani case again than to have avatars that can't do jack.

[AramilSiandol 1]

On a real-world pragmatic level, female soldiers are a distraction, and are viewed differently in combat situations (just think about a girl soldier in your squad in some amount of trouble vs a male soldier, and try to be as honest as possible when considering your reaction to that) and there are other pragmatic considerations for different sexes in the field.

-Sorry for my English-

-This is very long (and maybe stupid, I dk) post, you are welcome not to read it-

In the IDF, we address such questions in this manner: relevant and irrelevant.

Relevant: woman have weaker bones due smaller concentration Calcium when compered to man. Solution: feed the the female warriors with Calcium rich meals. Solution effectiveness: high.

Relevant: Female tend to have smaller body structure than man and therefore are less suited for combat. Solution: non needed even due to smaller bodies, (warrior) woman does not tend to be weaker than (warrior) man.

Relevant: Female tend to have smaller (and different) body structure than man and therefore are incompatible with army gear created for man. Solution: supply female worriers with gear specially created to suite woman in order to allow same functionality as male gear while not hurting maneuverability.

Irrelevant: woman are less mentally adapted to combat then man. Woman are less physically adapted to combat than man etc. Solutions are not needed.

I can see were your point of view is coming from; as you are most probably American or European- places that live in relative peace and fighting woman are not needed (and therefore they can allow themselves to live according to western culture that is created for non-fighting woman. generations that really indeed killed the potential that woman had for fighting) . While visiting Europe and the US, I have come to the same conclusion about female as you did. How ever, later, I joined the IDF. While yours truly served only in supporting roles, I saw female (and lots of them) in combat roles. I can assure you that in places where woman are not raised to be incompatible with battle (like what western and not only cultures do)- they are very effective as front line soldiers. Yet, saying that man and female are equal is wrong and high-minded (that's the expression? sorry, my English isn't perfect:()

Man and woman are not equal, they are different: a man will be (as a general rule) better tank driver and even better commander. Female, on the other hand, will be (as a general rule) better snipers (that's why in Israel most of the snipers are woman, their marksmen skills ARE higher and female DEAL BETTER with physical stress required from a sniper such as not moving and eating for a very long time (fan fact: in training snipers are required not to move for 3 days (and female does it better :eek:))).

So do I look forward to fighting woman in the game? As I tried to prove you, woman can be as effective as man in combat (though as I said, they are still not as good as man in some aspects but better in others). All you need to do to make this happen, is switch culture. Now as A3 takes place in semi non-utopian world, I'm pretty sure that people will adapt very fast giving the local woman the option to regain the potential they had for combat.

So yes, I look forward to playable woman in the game, and only for the sake of the woman that play the ArmA gams (yes, I know quite a few girls that play this game, that's not just a myth ;)).

If you read this far, I'm sorry for torturing you and I'll just stop writing this rubbish.

[rye1 21]

Ex British forces here [insert sexism]

Are you ex-British future Arma-forces?

If no -> Build time-machine.

If yes -> Make me a sammich.

[Panda_pl 0]

On a real-world pragmatic level, female soldiers are a distraction

Probably because they are so uncommon. Maybe getting used to them in this role is a good enough reason to change that.

I am sure black soldiers were a great distraction when they were first allowed to serve. /sarcasm

Some of, let's call them "social level" arguments ("it's distracting and hard to organize") sound awfully familiar. Did we not have this debate when coeducational classes and schools were established?

What is the balance of gains and loses?

I would also like to point out the current fashion trends are a factor: the male archetype is muscular, female is thin and flimsy (so it's weight lifting versus aerobics). That might not be the case in the future and your perception might change as a result.

These are changing and if you look at pop artists you'll find some wimpy, skinny man and a couple of athletic women.

[IAshford 1]

All I'm seeing is a bunch of arguements going back and forth regarding real life controversies, but in case people are forgetting, Arma is a video game series? You can try and pull the simiulator card as much as you like, but whats the point? Unless the game plans on adding retarded features like rape, personal in-depth hygeine issues, or gender dis/advantages, I don't see how women can't be just as equal as men in a video game. Don't like it? Don't play as them. No matter how much of a simulator you people claim this game to be, it's still a game and things can be changed outside of the norm. And women being in infantry roles isn't unrealistic, it's just not common in the present.

BIS already stated that setting the game in the future has given them room to create their own sort of universe (of course, trying to keep as realistic as possible), so I fail to see how women don't fit into that.

Edited June 5, 2012 by IAshford

[dm 9]

but in case people are forgetting, Arma is a video game series?

More importantly, that makes it up to BI to decide, if they think that female characters are too much work for too little gain, then they simply wont bother. Whether its right or wrong has little to do with it.

[BinaryCode64 1]

Deleted

Edited March 10, 2013 by BinaryCode64

[Yett 10]

Problem here is the ratio to male and female in the Army is around 1 Female to 50 Men, if you give players the options to have a female character we could be seeing around 60 females to 40 males.

[Aisling 1]

I'm always surprised by how heated this discussion gets and I see it in almost every game community. As a female gamer I think it would be nice if they added female models but it's not really a deal breaker. It hasn't kept me from playing Bohemia's games since the original Operation Flashpoint and it doesn't keep me from playing other games.

I figure the biggest challenge in development would be having to include female voiceover for all the commands and animation (which I don't exactly get.. it's not like female soldiers strut around like run-way models.. and every game I can think of with female option use the exact same animations as their male counterpart.. Mass Effect.. Rainbow Six Vegas..).

[batto 17]

That is YOUR opinion. Other people DO feel bad to shoot women in a military simulation.

Then they're pussies IMO and not milsimers.

How would you feel if its child soldiers you can shoot at? Is that ok for you too?

It isn't. Is it better to be killed by child soldier?

[Black Cat 10]

And that is the exact problem we are facing. Honestly, why not have certain units be female like Riflewoman or Medic (Female); or maybe have a limit on the number of female soldier characters that can be active in one mission.

EDIT: Only female gamers can have female characters, AI is randomly generated?

[BinaryCode64 1]

Deleted

Edited March 10, 2013 by BinaryCode64