Stealthy play style still sucks......?...

[nuggetz 0]

Not sure if the mission is scripted this way or not but every mission I've played that requires stealth always ends the same way. I used my silenced sniper rifle to pick off a guard that must have been at least 100 yards away from the next enemy soldier and instantaneously the entire camp goes into panic mode. Are the silenced weapon implementations in Arrowhead supposed to be any better than this? I thought I read that AI shouldn't be able to hear them.

Another thing that bothers me is that if you kill a unit that is riding in a vehicle, the stupid normal death animation kicks in and he just falls out which just looks unnatural and ridiculous.

And while I'm ranting, if an AI is getting shot at, it'll just sit there. I know I'd be hop, skippin' and jumping like a mother fucker and duckin for cover. For a military sim, I've seen AI react a lot more intelligently in FEAR and Halflife.

Dont get me wrong, I love this game but it pisses me off at the same time.

Thanks .

[Richey79 10]

http://uk.gamespy.com/pc/fear/698080p1.html

Monolith fully integrated this system with the enemy's dialogue and game environments in an effort to create the illusion that the AI was smarter than it actually is. F.E.A.R. was widely lauded for the ability of its soldiers (both singly and in squads) to flank the player. In reality, the AI wasn't flanking at all -- it was moving from one cover area to another cover area. Because of the skill exhibited by the level designers, that next cover area was to the side of the player's location (or where the designers assumed the player would be), so when the AI moved to that location, it created a seamless illusion of the enemy flanking you.

Adding a final layer to the illusion was the notion that the AI called for reinforcements. As the player slugged it out with the game's bad guys, one of them would call out for reinforcements. Then, when the player moved forward, they would come across an enemy squad rushing toward them. The squad was always there, regardless of whether or not reinforcements were actually "summoned," but because of the dialogue, the player creates a connection that really isn't there.

You can use these cheap tricks in a room 20m x 20m.

It becomes more problematic in an open environment of 20km x 20km.

[EDcase 87]

Its true that the AI in ARMA can be very impressive and convincing SOMETIMES and other times almost non existent.

I think that the awareness and direction to threats needs a bit of work.

Sometimes awareness is too high such as throwing a grenade, firing an RPG or detonating satchels gives your position away too accurately.

And other times when firing at a group some will not react at all while their buddies are falling in front of them.

I have to say that on whole the AI is very good and better than any other game of this scale (beacuse there aren't any ;))

Its just a pitty that sometimes they completely fail and that ruins their reputation.

Edited July 3, 2010 by EDcase

[Feint 137]

Part of the problem might be how the mission is made. For example, if the trigger is set so that if any of the AI are killed, they detect you, that's lame. But if the trigger is set so that if an individual AI detects you and he alerts other AI with his radio, that's legitimate, I think. But there needs to be some keyoff that he's using his radio to alert others, like a delay. Some sort of radio animation or sound effect though would be preferable. There should be a delay for him to get on the radio, a delay on the other end for the radio call to be acknowledged, and a delay for the alarm button to be found and pushed. And if any of those AI are killed, or already dead, the alarms shouldn't be sounded. And if there are barracs of soldiers and it's 3am, and the alarm goes off, there needs to be a delay for them to wake up, put on their shoes, and scramble out. They should not all pour out at the instant the alarm goes off.

[Adrenaline4real 10]

I honestly agree there. Sniper: Ghost Warrior is great in this perspective. it actually has some more means of AI discovering you and alerting. there is a raid alarm in enemy camps. and the AI does shout loud to alert others.

[Zipper5 74]

Jesus, the hype around Sniper: Ghost Warrior... It's made by City Interactive. They've made nothing but budget games and SGW is no different. This huge amount of hype that the game has received, for some unknown reason, has somehow made people not see all the incredibly budget game-like parts of this game and think it's the best thing since sliced bread. I've played it, and it was an utter waste of money. It. Sucks. And most reviews have actually said that. It's no better than Terrorist Takedown...

Just goes to show you that with enough hype you can get sales...

[arthur666 10]

Jesus, the hype around Sniper: Ghost Warrior... It's made by City Interactive. They've made nothing but budget games and SGW is no different. This huge amount of hype that the game has received, for some unknown reason, has somehow made people not see all the incredibly budget game-like parts of this game and think it's the best thing since sliced bread. I've played it, and it was an utter waste of money. It. Sucks. And most reviews have actually said that. It's no better than Terrorist Takedown...

Just goes to show you that with enough hype you can get sales...

Hey, did you ever see this one? http://www.simhq.com/_land3/land_110a.html :D

In defense of the situation the OP described, if you are within 100m of a "silenced" sniper rifle being fired, you will most definitely hear it, and probably realize that it was a gunshot.

But I do agree that the AI seems to be able to alert their mates much too quickly. If I shoot a guy in the chest and he doesn't die, his first reaction is probably not gonna be to key his radio. He will first probably sh#t his pants, panic, run, hide etc... Alerting out of sight teammates should take at least 10 seconds.

Arma is better than it used to be, when a killed soldier automatically alerted all enemies of the shooter and their position when. Glad they fixed that.

Question: if I remove a soldier's radio, can he no longer communicate with others? This might make for more interesting stealt missions.

Edited September 16, 2010 by arthur666

[Gunter Severloh 4051]

Just goes to show you that with enough hype you can get sales

O F P 2 sounds familier, in reguards to this :D

[Evil_Echo 11]

Feint seems to have a good point. A lot depends on the mission design. How and whom you pick off seems to matter.

I've seen the opposite as well, a shell landing or mine going off with the AI not reacting much.

I'd call it "room for improvement" - BIS has done a lot recently in patches for AI behavior. Have hope.

[xman1 10]

Have you ever shot silenced weapons? They are still noisy. Even with subsonic ammo.

I have some time on MP5-SD's and they are still loud. The only real difference is that you just don't wake up the whole world when you fire. Anyone in the area around you will still hear it however.

Nothing beats a knife for silenced.

-X

[-)rStrangelove 0]

Yeah, we need throwable knifes.

[ProfTournesol 956]

)rStrangelove;1751432']Yeah' date=' we need throwable knifes.[/quote']

As there are throwable stones, it's very easy to create throwable knives.

[maddogx 13]

Any kind of unarmed combat would be a step forward. Right now, when you're out of ammo and not in range of any crates or vehicles, you may aswell have magically turned into a tree, because there's pretty much fuck all you can do.

[HyperU2 11]

As long as the dead bodies stick around I don't mind scavenging. I wish I was recording the other day. I was far removed (500m) from any enemy AI on the Baghdad map, climbed up an enclosed tower and was promptly shot in the head as I was getting off the top of the ladder. Their all knowing wonders never cease to amaze.

[wipman 1]

Hi, this is a video showing how much noise two diferent suppressors work on a .45ACP gun.

It's noisy, and it can be heard inside a common house from any of the rooms being fired at the other side of the house; so a rifle i guess that can be heard more far away. In most if not all the SP, Campaign & coop/MP missions that i've played... when you kill a single NME the rest of the NME AIs know it and do whatever they're ordered to do or just go from aware to danger or stealth for a while, then danger and they stay that way. I think that that's another bad point of the AI, just like the objects detection, their "yeltsin pathfinding" etc etc.

Seems to be impossible to maintain the stealth during a entire mission because of the AI's superpowers, as the super accuraccy and the superear; and if the only way to avoid this is to make a trigger for each NME unit... then is better to steal a tank and drive over 'em because that's all the stealth that you gonna get as make a trigger for every individual NME unit will make the mission a true lag fest aside of make it very complex for the mission maker, to do it and test it. Let's C ya

[xman1 10]

Hi, this is a video showing how much noise two diferent suppressors work on a .45ACP gun.

It's noisy, and it can be heard inside a common house from any of the rooms being fired at the other side of the house; so a rifle i guess that can be heard more far away. In most if not all the SP, Campaign & coop/MP missions that i've played... when you kill a single NME the rest of the NME AIs know it and do whatever they're ordered to do or just go from aware to danger or stealth for a while, then danger and they stay that way. I think that that's another bad point of the AI, just like the objects detection, their "yeltsin pathfinding" etc etc....

The quietest gun I ever saw fired was a .22 LR fired through a suppressor. Less sound than a pellet gun.

BTW, most people don't realize this, but when you fire suppressed, even though the bullet crack is removed, the bullet still makes sound, and the entire operation of the mechanism of the gun still operates. The bolt moves back with blinding speed, extracts the spent cartridge, and then slams forward the new round into the chamber. All of this makes noise that you can't get rid of.

Hollywood has us trained well I guess.

Most people don't realize that you don't fall down instantly (some people might due to the shock factor that they have been hit, but this is a mental thing, not a physical thing.) when hit with a round either unless it hits your brain or spinal cord. The Red Baron for example had his heart completely removed by the bullet that hit him and he still managed to land his plane and have a conversation with the troops that came up to his plane with no heart!!! They estimate he retained consciousness for up to 20 seconds before passing out without his heart.

As I said, Hollywood has us trained well.

-X

Edited September 17, 2010 by xman1

[CaptainBravo 0]

there is a script where you use weapons butt to knockout the enemy unit. snaek from behind and .. BOOM. That seems like the only way to mainatin your stealth.

Edited September 17, 2010 by CaptainBravo

[xman1 10]

there is a script where you use weapons butt to knockout the enemy unit. snaek from behind and .. BOOM. That seems like the only way to mainatin your stealth.

There is nothing stopping you from using your silenced weapons though. The trick with silenced weapons is you need to know where everyone is in the immediate area. The reason is that you need to kill them all. The good news is, if you get the few guys in the immediate area, you can take them out without setting off any alarms with any other troops anywhere else - assuming one doesn't get away!

The downside to suppressed weapons, and especially to subsonic ammo, is that it doesn't hit hard, so you probably need to burst into each guy.

I haven't done much yet with ARMA 2, but if I remember anything from Op Flashpoint and playing through Op Flashpoints entire series on Expert, crawling through the mud and not firing a shot until the right time is your friend. Take your time and move on your belly. They hardly notice you if you never get off your belly.

-X

[CaptainBravo 0]

you are right xman. Used to work perfectly in OFP. But here speially with OA, with the nearest unit 150m away, it can still detect firing of silncers in total darkness. Eventough I shot the enemy a headshot.

The AI seems to have SUPER hearing.

Hope it gets fixed soon.

[xman1 10]

you are right xman. Used to work perfectly in OFP. But here speially with OA, with the nearest unit 150m away, it can still detect firing of silncers in total darkness. Eventough I shot the enemy a headshot.

The AI seems to have SUPER hearing.

Hope it gets fixed soon.

Thats not what I mean. What I mean is that you should try and do everything without firing a shot. That is the ultimate goal of SF. If you must engage the enemy, your mission may already be compromised.

That is what I mean about crawling around on your belly near enemies. Not shooting them.

-X