ArmA 2 I/O analysis results

[december 0]

If you have that amount of RAM and don´t use it anyway it´s worth a try but no one should consider buying a SSD or more RAM just for ArmA2 in my opinion.

I agree entirely. The lengths one has to go to to play this "smoothly" is ridiculous. I wouldn't spend another penny upgrading my rig for it. Guaranteed we will run into more problems needing more upgrades when the expansion arrives.:j:

[TomBabmo 10]

What's the point in having cache disabled in the first place? Please, BIS, for god's sake make arma2 use cache in future patches!

[turin turambar 0]

Add a Radeon 5870 and an E8600 @ 4GHz with 8GB DDR3-RAM and I´m still not able to get more than 20fps in 1920x1200 with minimum AA and normal object detail in those cities, even if I stand still with little Streaming-Activity at all the engine sucks delivering performance.

I have a Radeon 4890 and a E6850@3.6ghz, with 4GB DDR2-RAM and a 75GB Raptor @10K rpm. I have an average of 25 fps in 1680x1050 with medium AA and high object detail.

[qwertz 10]

Very nice thread!

I've tested your analyse tool but don't get it to work.

The "PBO Analysis" sheet doesn't show anything other than default values in the "Ranked by PBO name" chart. The other two charts are empty.

I get a graph showing IOPS which seem to cover the time interval of data I've pasted in the Data Input sheet. The other two graphs don't show anything though.

You seemed to have password procted the forumulas in the sheets so I cannot find the problems in the formulas by myself.

Maybe the formulas are dependent on local (I'm living in Sweden)?

Also the import of the CSV-file maybe should be done in some special way. Can you be more specific on how you import the file into excel.

Hi ReiLar,

that's odd. Are you shure you pasted the data into the sheet as described in the instructions? You need to copy column A to G and row 2 to (max 10,000) from your ProcMon CSV logfile and paste it into cell B9 on the "Data Input" tab in the tool.

Also please try to hit "F9" in Excel in order to make sure the data gets calculated.

If you want to check for yourself, the password to unlock the sheet is "opensesame". I have only locked the sheet to make sure people don't accidentially change formulas.

Could you paste some lines of your ProgMon logfile here so I can see if it is in the correct format? It should look like this:

(...)

08:07.6 arma2.exe 3844 ReadFile G:\Steam\steamapps\common\arma 2\AddOns\sounds.pbo SUCCESS Offset: 7,856,128, Length: 4,096, I/O Flags: Non-cached, Priority: Normal

08:08.0 arma2.exe 3844 ReadFile G:\Steam\steamapps\common\arma 2\AddOns\chernarus.pbo SUCCESS Offset: 34,541,568, Length: 4,096, I/O Flags: Non-cached, Priority: Normal

08:08.0 arma2.exe 3844 ReadFile G:\Steam\steamapps\common\arma 2\AddOns\warfare2.pbo SUCCESS Offset: 311,296, Length: 4,096, I/O Flags: Non-cached, Priority: Normal

08:08.5 arma2.exe 3844 ReadFile G:\Steam\steamapps\common\arma 2\AddOns\weapons.pbo SUCCESS Offset: 401,281,024, Length: 32,768, I/O Flags: Non-cached, Priority: Normal

(...)

Also, can you upload your file so I can see what's wrong ?

Thanks,

qwertz

---------- Post added at 05:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:43 PM ----------

What's the point in having cache disabled in the first place? Please, BIS, for god's sake make arma2 use cache in future patches!

That might be not easily possible or effective. With 9GB of assets, you just run out of cache very quickly with 99% of all gaming rigs. Therefore, it might be better to optimize for direct streaming w/o relying on cache. But I'm not a programmers so I'm just speculating here. More often than not, we should assume they know what they are doing and as with many other things in life, there's always a tradeoff no matter what decision you make.

Edited December 31, 2009 by qwertz

[reilar 10]

Also, can you upload your file so I can see what's wrong ?

Yes, I've followed your instructions. Also tested to press F9.

I've uploaded my logfile at

http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=e183006890798fae312dbd5f2bdc5062e04e75f6e8ebb871

Please, check the file(s) and see if you can find out what's wrong.

BR,

/ReiLar

[Leon86 13]

The excel file isn't working here either. Too bad, it would be great to see the stats of other people.

I have used Qsoft ramdisk (shareware again although this one doesnt seem to expire) to create a 3.3gb ramdisk. Then I moved a lot of the .pbo's (basically anything I thought would be on chernarus) to there and just start it as you would a mod.

When flying around the island I get hardly any stutters at all (with textures on high)

I also made 2 movies to show the difference, too bad fraps is so heavy on my system, normally the game runs fluently (in between the stutters that is), maybe someone with a quadcore could do something similar?

<object width="560" height="340"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5vMhjPoeoI&hl=nl&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5vMhjPoeoI&hl=nl&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="560" height="340"></embed></object>

<object width="560" height="340"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6eiqbxJcQFI&hl=nl&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6eiqbxJcQFI&hl=nl&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="560" height="340"></embed></object>

Edited October 19, 2009 by Leon86

[qwertz 10]

Yes, I've followed your instructions. Also tested to press F9.

I've uploaded my logfile at

http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=e183006890798fae312dbd5f2bdc5062e04e75f6e8ebb871

Please, check the file(s) and see if you can find out what's wrong.

BR,

/ReiLar

I have found the error(s). First, there is an error in the function which parses the PBO name. Second, I have to add functionality to support international number/date formats, i.e. it seems like in Sweden they use "space" rather than "," as a thousands seperator (1 024 rather than 1,024), and that does not work with the sheet either.

I will post a new version tonight that should work with everyone's data.

Thanks for testing !

Edited December 31, 2009 by qwertz

[reilar 10]

Yes, I found that out too.

One possible way around the local number format can be to drop the VALUE function.

Acording to the Excel help file:

"You do not generally need to use the VALUE function in a formula because Excel automatically converts text to numbers as necessary. This function is provided for compatibility with other spreadsheet programs."

[ModeZt 0]

How do i use ramdisk as a mod?

I created the ramdisk R:\. I copyed some pbo's and bi.signs into the root of this drive.

Do i have to simply add -mod=R: to the shortcut?

[Leon86 13]

How do i use ramdisk as a mod?

I created the ramdisk R:\. I copyed some pbo's and bi.signs into the root of this drive.

Do i have to simply add -mod=R: to the shortcut?

I have created the folder B:\@ram\AddOns (B is my ramdisk) and moved some of the .pbo's there, then I start arma with adding -mod=B:\@ram to the shortcut.

[qwertz 10]

Hi guys,

I have fixed my tool - you can download it here:

http://www.mediafire.com/qwertz

Should work with everyone's data now - let me see the results !

Edited October 21, 2009 by qwertz

[Leon86 13]

Here are my results, just flying around in the editor, just me in a F35B, not much activity in characters, wheeled, tracked pbo's etc.

http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=798fb57f39f7f5edaf924764f9977b1de04e75f6e8ebb871

Edited October 20, 2009 by Leon86

[qwertz 10]

Here are my results, just flying around in the editor, just me in a F35B, not much activity in characters, wheeled, tracked pbo's etc.

http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=798fb57f39f7f5edaf924764f9977b1de04e75f6e8ebb871

Great. This is on a ramdisk, correct? You are hitting 500-800 IOPS.

Edited December 31, 2009 by qwertz

[Leon86 13]

Great. This is on a ramdisk, correct? You are hitting 500-800 IOPS.

Yes, I moved the following files to my ramdisk (3.3gb total) now I can fly over an empty chernarus without a hitch but when I'm playing domination online performance is a lot lower, this is because the vehicle's and characters are on the normal HD. still a huge improvement online though, also online.

buildings.pbo

buildings.pbo.bi.bisign

buildings2.pbo

buildings2.pbo.bi.bisign

buildings2_Ind_CementWorks.pbo

buildings2_Ind_CementWorks.pbo.bi.bisign

chernarus.pbo

chernarus.pbo.bi.bisign

chernarus_Data.pbo

chernarus_Data.pbo.bi.bisign

chernarus_Data_Layers.pbo

chernarus_Data_Layers.pbo.bi.bisign

misc.pbo

misc.pbo.bi.bisign

misc2.pbo

misc2.pbo.bi.bisign

misc3.pbo

misc3.pbo.bi.bisign

plants2_Bush.pbo

plants2_Bush.pbo.bi.bisign

plants2_Clutter.pbo

plants2_Clutter.pbo.bi.bisign

plants2_misc.pbo

plants2_misc.pbo.bi.bisign

plants2_Plant.pbo

plants2_Plant.pbo.bi.bisign

plants2_Tree.pbo

plants2_Tree.pbo.bi.bisign

Roads2.pbo

Roads2.pbo.bi.bisign

rocks2.pbo

rocks2.pbo.bi.bisign

sounds.pbo

sounds.pbo.bi.bisign

structures.pbo

structures.pbo.bi.bisign

[GLeek 10]

i'm trying to set DataramRAMDisk for arma2.

i have 4GB ram. i think about put only the most I/Ouputed file on it. Structure first, 886MB , thenb maybe plants2 .

1.2GB will be enough i think. a good start :)

i will try to make a benchmark with fraps . with / without :)

[Leon86 13]

i'm trying to set DataramRAMDisk for arma2.

i have 4GB ram. i think about put only the most I/Ouputed file on it. Structure first, 886MB , thenb maybe plants2 .

1.2GB will be enough i think. a good start :)

i will try to make a benchmark with fraps . with / without :)

Dont forget chernarus.pbo, it's only 91 mb but has a LOT of I/O

[GLeek 10]

Dont forget chernarus.pbo, it's only 91 mb but has a LOT of I/O

;). i should not duplicated file, but move them right ?

[Leon86 13]

;). i should not duplicated file, but move them right ?

I moved them and made a backup, to make sure the game uses the ramdisk. I dont think it matters though if you just copied them, when the ram folder loads as a mod it should "overwrite" the old files I guess. make an AddOns folder on your ramdisk (probably R:\ ?), put the .pbo's there and then ad -mod=R:\ to your shortcut.

[evilfury 0]

Leon86 or qwertz could you write a step by step guide how to install ramdisk? If I understand correctly this can be done if you have 4GB of ram or more?

[GLeek 10]

I moved them and made a backup, to make sure the game uses the ramdisk. I dont think it matters though if you just copied them, when the ram folder loads as a mod it should "overwrite" the old files I guess. make an AddOns folder on your ramdisk (probably R:\ ?), put the .pbo's there and then ad -mod=R:\ to your shortcut.

i wasn't sure . so i backup moved addons and put them in @base2.

i have 2 shortcut. 1 launch ramdisk addons, the second launch @base2 for required base addons ;)

i don't need to move file each time i want switch from one to other.

damn i just think about that . for a real comparo , i need to close my ramdisk . because it would free 1.5GB ram.

Edited October 20, 2009 by GLeek

[liquidpinky 11]

Leon86 or qwertz could you write a step by step guide how to install ramdisk? If I understand correctly this can be done if you have 4GB of ram or more?

Click my sig. ;)

[1longtime 10]

I don't want to sidetrack this thread, but I want to post a counter-example to this post:

To be clear for those who said or might think it: A SSD-Drive isn´t a solution at all (for ArmA2). If you compare qwertz´s VelociRaptor Kamikaze-RAID I/O-Values with those of a Samsung PBJ-22 256GB SSD you see superior values for the SSD of course but you are still not able to go from the Countryside to Chernogorks or Elekrozavodsk without that massive stuttering, no matter if you walk, drive or fly. So a RAM-Drive might be the only solution to get rid of that.

This is the exact opposite of what I have recently posted, particularly how happy I was to drive through Elektroz without stutters. An SSD WAS the solution for me. It solved all the "massive stuttering." I'm not sure why you are still having problems... perhaps you have an older SSD? The older ones had major problems with write caching...

The RAM-Drive is faster, without a doubt. I don't have enough RAM to move the entire Arma2 folder, but even with only the highly used PBOs it will undoubtably be an improvement for performance. However, I'm very happy with my SSD performance now so it won't be a high priority. Very interesting though.

Add a Radeon 5870 and an E8600 @ 4GHz with 8GB DDR3-RAM and I´m still not able to get more than 20fps in 1920x1200 with minimum AA and normal object detail in those cities, even if I stand still with little Streaming-Activity at all the engine sucks delivering performance. So if you get rid off one bottleneck you´re just facing the next. What is it worth to remove the stuttering if you can´t play in cities anyway with the same settings you just had 60fps with on the countryside without lowering the details?

Again, I'm sorry you're having problems with your SSD, but I want to respond as a counter-example: I bought a newer-generation SSD and it makes Arma 2 awesome. HDD reading is a major bottleneck, and SSD solved it. A RAM-disk is no doubt even MORE awesome. I'm jealous.

If you have that amount of RAM and don´t use it anyway it´s worth a try but no one should consider buying a SSD or more RAM just for ArmA2 in my opinion.

Maybe. But we know this is the best game on the market... so a little bit of obsessive behavior isn't so bad.

I chased the dream of ultra-high-resolution Arma2 with ultra-high-performance... and you know what it cost me? Another 8800gtx (eBay for $65) and an SSD ($320 + tax). Totally worth it.

Edited October 20, 2009 by 1longtime

[qwertz 10]

This is the exact opposite of what I have recently posted, particularly how happy I was to drive through Elektroz without stutters. An SSD WAS the solution for me. It solved all the "massive stuttering." I'm not sure why you are still having problems... perhaps you have an older SSD? The older ones had major problems with write caching...

The RAM-Drive is faster, without a doubt. I don't have enough RAM to move the entire Arma2 folder, but even with only the highly used PBOs it will undoubtably be an improvement for performance. However, I'm very happy with my SSD performance now so it won't be a high priority. Very interesting though.

I think it all depends. I am sure that - compared to a mechanical hard disk - a modern SSD is a huge improvement. If you look at the I/O results using a RAMdrive, though, you will see that ArmA 2 can generate a load of more than 1000 IOPS (I will post some results later). Now have a look at SSD performance:

Random I/O maxes out at 300-400 IOPS with these SSDs. So, while 98% of the time ArmA 2 will work in the range of what a SSD can deliver, it is those nasty 2% of times where they don't that can create visible stutter.

Here's a (slow) RAMdisk for comparison:

And here a Hard Disk:

Basically, as a rule of thumb, in random read a RAMdisk is 100x, a SDD is 10x faster than a HDD.

But at the end you are quite right, there is a certain level of perfectionism at work here :bounce3:

Edited December 31, 2009 by qwertz

[wasserkool 1]

My pressing questions is will a 4GB RAM disk work or I have to put the ENTIRE game 8GB onto a RAM disk to see performance. 16 GB of RAM with 4X4GB config cost the same as a smaller capacity SSD.

[.kju 3245]

Old IBM:

Old samsung:

Intel M:

Ram drive: