I said "CEASE FIRE"!!!

[santafee 10]

Yep,thats what i often say.ALLWAYS theres one Rambo in the Squad which means to ignore my Orders and start engaging the enemy.....I give all the Order to stop fire/cease fire then suddenly the symbol to cease fire over Nr.3 dissapears and he´s starting ...What´s the problem...Still Bugged??

[neokika 62]

I dont think is a bug, I think that even in hold fire mode, units IF in dangerous will fire.

Im not sure though!

[InFireBaptize 0]

happens a lot when i command a tank, the gunner keeps ignoring my order unless i disembark the s.o.b

[paragraphic l 2]

3> HOLD FIRE

3> DISENGAGE

7> STEALTH MODE

if you have set them to these 3 settings they will hold fire the longest, but still when they are detacted or feel they are in a dangerous position, they will fight there way out.

Survival mode kicks in. At least that's how I've experienced it, never did proper testing.

[InFireBaptize 0]

I dont think is a bug, I think that even in hold fire mode, units IF in dangerous will fire.

Im not sure though!

it doesn't matter, if you give an order it should be obeyed.

[Väinämöinen 0]

Somewhere in the past i remember reading something from Arma1 about the skill level of the unit affecting morale and units ordered to cease fire start shooting.

Not 100% sure about Arma2

[NeMeSiS 11]

it doesn't matter, if you give an order it should be obeyed.

So you rather have your troops shot without doing anything back then having them at least trying to fight back? :confused:

[InFireBaptize 0]

So you rather have your troops shot without doing anything back then having them at least trying to fight back? :confused:

no, there are occasions when i accidently right mouse clicked friendly targets and the stupid A.I would not obey my "no targets" or "hold fire" commands unless i disembark him, sometimes it is too late and he has already killed friendlies.

[santafee 10]

well fact is,its an gamebreake-.-pretty!! annoying stuff.

and i cant say its often cause of the situation.if im in the wood 200 meters from an enemy position,want to call in an air strike,wheres the reason to ignore my orders and start firing.this guys was not in danger....

What i would wish is just Engagment Options would be a little different.

Cease Fire:Means Cease Fire.....U just NEVER fire.

Join my Attack:U give the first shot and they automaticly start engaging.

One of the most important thing,if not the most important[expect u play much SP] is the command system,and i just hope BI is taking more care of this gameplay things now. I say its a bug and it really should be fixed.

[Beagle 684]

it doesn't matter, if you give an order it should be obeyed.

Dream on!

That would not even work in WWII soviet army.

This is funny...people are crying for realism..and when they get it they don't like it.

Might be more your stile of commanding or giving incorrect orders.

I never run into this.

The most important thing ist to oder "disengage" to prevent fire on own will.

Edited September 3, 2009 by Beagle

[InFireBaptize 0]

Dream on!

That would not even work in WWII soviet army.

This is funny...people are crying for realism..and when they get it they don't like it.

Might be more your stile of commanding or giving incorrect orders.

I never run into this.

The most important thing ist to oder "disengage" to prevent fire on own will.

read post #8

[sle 0]

Bloody hell, I think the opposite. If my troops are in danger, I EXPECT them to fire back, and fuck it.

The only time I use "hold fire" is sneaking up. If we get discovered and the element of surprise is lost, I'll be glad when they fight back.

[neokika 62]

Bloody hell, I think the opposite. If my troops are in danger, I EXPECT them to fire back, and fuck it.

The only time I use "hold fire" is sneaking up. If we get discovered and the element of surprise is lost, I'll be glad when they fight back.

Exactly...

[nettrucker 142]

I'm working on a stealth mission and during testing one of the guys under my command starts to engage not withstanding I've set them to hold fire. I experienced that they engage and ignore the hold fire in case there's danger and they might gonna get killed. I used Kronzky's patol script and it happened twice during testing that a unit disobeyed the hold fire order and started to engage because the enemy was damn close to our position and he has been spotted therefore the AI ignored the order and openend fire which is the most logical action to take in my opinion. The AI can chose between killing or dying. He prefers living so he kills the enemy. I don't see anything wrong in the AI behaviour even they disobey orders in this case.

regards

nettrucker

[jakerod 254]

I like this feature. If my men are detected I expect them to fire back. In OFP if you gave them the hold fire order they would hold fire no matter what. There were several times I lost men because I didn't see the guy moving up on us and poor jimmy just watched the enemy walk up and shoot him. This is a welcome response for me. The only thing I don't like is that is makes it really hard to withdraw while under fire because your men won't disengage quickly enough.

[santafee 10]

Comon,thats just stupid.Thats no feature it IS a bug.It OFTEN happens when my guys are not in Danger and it kills the whole plan to call in an air strike first and then attack.

Also its impossible to create real stealth missions.Feature........:confused:

There could be a option like "never fire"....And i repeat...The guys doing it not for self defense..If i lying in the grass waiting for a passing patroul to NOT see me and we have NOT been spotted theres no reason to shoot.

This "feature" takes away many possible combat situation i say.

[JuggernautOfWar 1]

I've been told to hold fire before. My English allies were in danger so I opened fire disobeying a direct order from a Colonel. I was awarded with a Bronze Star and Distinguished Flying Cross. It happens.

Edited September 3, 2009 by JuggernautOfWar

[Sniperdoc 0]

I'd love to see the papers on that and I'd like to see the story of the referenced incident. I'd say you got REALLY REALLY lucky if that was the case. We had snipers court-martialed because they IMITATED shooting people that were over a mile away.

[W0lle 1050]

One of the most important thing,if not the most important[expect u play much SP] is the command system,and i just hope BI is taking more care of this gameplay things now. I say its a bug and it really should be fixed.

Not everything you call a bug is actually one. ;)

[JuggernautOfWar 1]

I'd love to see the papers on that and I'd like to see the story of the referenced incident. I'd say you got REALLY REALLY lucky if that was the case. We had snipers court-martialed because they IMITATED shooting people that were over a mile away.

I expect you are in the Army as a fairly low rank then, correct? Usually the position of "Sniper" is used in the Army. Of course this is assuming we are talking about the US military.

[-RIP- Luhgnut 10]

heh, usually it's my #2 guy that looses his bladder and starts firing and he's the next in command/rank. The other guys are usually pretty cool.

I don't use it anymore. It's a pointless command in the game. Doesn't work as you think it would. If you want to sneak up to anything, leave the squad at base.

We were attacking the airport, and got through the fence and hiding behind a hanger with do not fire command/stealth. #2 (most of the time) decides that hiding from the enemy on the other side of the airport is pretty dangerous and starts shooting at them. He's not shooting anything close, there's nothing even remotely close. But he'll do it anyway. So I shoot him, to make myself feel better. Course the all shoot me back anyway, but we're as good as dead at that point cause of Johnny.

[santafee 10]

Not everything you call a bug is actually one. ;)

Well if its no a bug,it just fails what it would be good for.

If the guys really would only return/open fire if they were engaged so they not die i wouldnt have started that thread.

BUT engaging the enemy in a SECURE Ambush or Overview Situation[similar like the last poster says] it is just pointless,if u guys dont get that.....for what is this command good for then...

[Xenios 0]

In Arma 1 or 2, if your AIs start shooting even though ordered to hold fire, they were spotted. Your stealth approach was screwed before you heard the first shot, because one of your guys was spotted. They don't wait for the enemy to shoot first; your guys will shoot the instant they know they've been spotted. Maybe you didn't think your guys had been detected, but your AIs were aware of this instantly--because they have a bit of inside information after all. It's that simple.

If you went back and played OFP, where AIs would hold fire no matter what, you would instantly hate it. When one of your guys was detected (and they always were, especially if they moved at all), you had to manually order them to fire back, and in that second or two it took to issue your order your whole squad would usually be killed. It was probably the leading cause of mission failure for most people, and one of the 'bugs' that so many were begging to be fixed.

What hasn't improved since OFP is your AIs ability to use stealth effectively. In OFP, they usually gave your position away, and they continue to fail in Arma 2. So it's not their shooting that's causing your missions to fail, it's their poor ability to use stealth. As in OFP, you're still better off going it alone and not using the AI at all during any stealth movements.

[-RIP- Luhgnut 10]

They weren't spotted. I guarantee you we weren't spotted. So to simulate, I redid the situation in the editor. Shoved a bunch of OPFOR on the other side of the airstrip. Now, in broad daylight I can run all over the other end of the strip, do jumping jacks, whatever. The enemy doesn't see me doing my antics. I can see them in the scope walking back and forth. So I run around like a loony. Nothing. If I fire... you betcha they come in force. But other than that, I can run around naked.....

If I do the same with my squad... and tell them to hold fire, he'll shoot. It's a bug. Seriously.

[Xenios 0]

I know it's frustrating, I don't like it either. But that's not how you test it--it's the AI who are being spotted, not you.

Have your AIs drop all their weapons, and try to make a stealth approach with them unarmed. They can't give away your position by shooting if they don't have any weapons--but that's not what is giving them away, it's their poor stealth abilities. Trust me, they suck at stealth and always have.

Try playing OFP leading AIs in a stealth mission with hold fire orders, and see how quickly they are detected and shot with impunity before you can even act. Now that was a real 'gamebreaker.' Possibly one of the worst problems with OFP, and I never want to see that again.