FP : DR - News & Discussion

[Zipper5 74]

Ah, so not really that detailed of a playthrough, but overall impressions are "ok" for him. And yes, he did teamkill an AI that was in a HMMWV, lol.

[Apache-Cobra 0]

What majority? How did you quantify this? And have you read the DR forums lately. It's a bloody riot over there - and the game hasn't even been released yet!

According to surveys...

56% were not satisfied with patch 1.03 at all.

93% hoped that 1.03 would be better than it was.

72% are facing some sort of serious or annoying issue with the game.

55% claim that problems are ruining the game.

Only 24% of the community have no complaints.

By the way, that thread in the DR forums has been opened again.

EDIT: Yes, forum surveys, you can find them here in the General and Troubleshooting categories here.

Edited October 4, 2009 by Apache-Cobra

[Ulysses 10]

I sure hope those aren't forum surveys. :P

[derk yall 0]

Apache-cobra:

These polls arent the most objective way of survey, cause no everyone post/vote in these. So dont take them as a 100% source of truth wich they arent. Please ;)

[GunGraveTZA 10]

And sorry if you guys dont like me posting links to reviews. I realise that the only "defence" about them is "reviews don't means crap", but what are you going to do about the players reviews later in the week? No doubt you'll pick the 10% of bad reviews as the truth and dismiss the other 90% as COD players?

I think the issue here is that you keep posting the same one.

Well since the issue seems to be that the guy you quoted seems to be posting the same review for OF2, here's a couple of reviews. Oh yeah, and all of them are positive.

Official Xbox Magazine Review: 8 out of 10

Soft Sailer Review: Positive

CVG Review: 9 out of 10

Power Unlimited Review: 9 out of 10 (Translated)

And my personal opinion on the matter is that OF2 will be infinitely better than ARMA2, mainly because it's nowhere near as bug-ridden, it's coming out on consoles and is not simplified in any way (good for console gamers with crap PCs like me), and because it actually remembers it supposed to be a game and not a simulation.

[echo1 0]

Did you just join to share that nugget of information with me? I feel really flattered, but I don't swing that way...

[W0lle 1050]

These polls are rather pointless as those with no problems just don't bother to vote and play the game instead. You also can be sure that a lot of these votes are from people who just jump on the bashing bandwagon, voting for something negative just for the heck of it. I wouldn't rely on them.

Besides this, and that goes for everyone:

We repeatedly said that discussions about how the forums are moderated "over there" are not tolerated here, after all this is not the "CM forums discussions thread". Same goes for bashing the moderators over there. If you're not happy with the way they are doing their job, just stay away from that... place. :)

Also, the bashing and flaming has to come to an end now. There is no need to feed the obvious trolls even more - just ignore them. It must be possible to discuss in mature manner without the flaming. If not we all simply take a break for a couple of days, no big deal. ;)

[GunGraveTZA 10]

Did you just join to share that nugget of information with me? I feel really flattered, but I don't swing that way...

Yeah, I decided to join to see how interesting this on-going argument would be. And considering this is 400 pages long it definiately will be. :p

[privatenoob 0]

It looks like DR will be a solid game (though I agree I cant vouch for that until I play it and neither can you).

ARMA2 is getting better with the patches, but personally I want a game that works now, and Im not going to base my opinion of ARMA2 on what it might be in the future with mods/xpacks/patches. Having said that, if the game changes in the future then of course that may change my opinion.

I'm a gamer, and the only loyalty I have is to good games (which is subjective of course) ;)

See I marked your problems, I wanted a sim, not a game no matter how "solid" it is. Reviews and scores means nothing to me. But perhars DR will be a nice competitor to AmericasArmy since they screwed that one up.

[Zipper5 74]

And my personal opinion on the matter is that OF2 will be infinitely better than ARMA2, mainly because it's nowhere near as bug-ridden, it's coming out on consoles and is not simplified in any way (good for console gamers with crap PCs like me), and because it actually remembers it supposed to be a game and not a simulation.

Ok, where to begin.

Some reviews have been reporting bugs. With both the AI and the physics, much like ArmA II. Also, that latest 7 minute video of it had missing audio in it, and that was the first mission of the campaign. So it won't necessarily be less buggy than ArmA II.

Coming out on consoles I can understand if your PC doesn't run it well. However, you then go to say "it's not simplified in any way" and then say "it actually remembers it's supposed to be a game and not a simulation." Wow. Ok, so OFP was a simulation. DR is not supposed to be a simulation then? Even though it's being called OFP's sequel? Also, how can it not be simplified if it's now a game and not a simulation? You just contradicted yourself.

So a sequel to a simulation, being called a simulation, is good because it's not a simulation, but a game? I miss the logic in that.

But hey, you came on to this forum just to advertise DR. Couldn't have expected too much from such a post.

Edit: Just saw W0lle's post, but since it was made while I was posting this, I'll leave this here. As it still stands.

Edited October 4, 2009 by Zipper5
Acknowledging W0lle's post

[dm 9]

By the way, that thread in the DR forums has been opened again.

And with it comes another nugget of information:

although I did see a PLA firing his pistol at me from long range

So the AI isnt really any smarter than ArmA's when it comes to weapon choice then... :j:

[Zipper5 74]

So the AI isnt really any smarter than ArmA's when it comes to weapon choice then... :j:

Well, I have yet to see an AI in ArmA or ArmA II shoot at me from unrealistic distances with a pistol unless that's the only gun they have. In that circumstance, it might actually be worse. But we don't know if that's common, or just a once in a while issue.

[GunGraveTZA 10]

Ok, where to begin.

Some reviews have been reporting bugs. With both the AI and the physics, much like ArmA II. Also, that latest 7 minute video of it had missing audio in it, and that was the first mission of the campaign. So it won't necessarily be less buggy than ArmA II.

Coming out on consoles I can understand if your PC doesn't run it well. However, you then go to say "it's not simplified in any way" and then say "it actually remembers it's supposed to be a game and not a simulation." Wow. Ok, so OFP was a simulation. DR is not supposed to be a simulation then? Even though it's being called OFP's sequel? Also, how can it not be simplified if it's now a game and not a simulation? You just contradicted yourself.

So a sequel to a simulation, being called a simulation, is good because it's not a simulation, but a game? I miss the logic in that.

But hey, you came on to this forum just to advertise DR. Couldn't have expected too much from such a post.

Edit: Just saw W0lle's post, but since it was made while I was posting this, I'll leave this here. As it still stands.

Yeah, there have been reported bugs from reviews, fair enough. But one of those reviews which has had experiance with ArmA II said they were WAAY less, and are more like an AI ducking a couple of seconds too late. And that audio bug, they're probably polishing that out right now and will release a patch if they don't A.S.A.P.

Hmmkay, and good point on my post, I was just posting about why I'd be getting OF2. Yes, OF2 is a simulation, but it is more of a game than ArmA II as everything is laid out in a much clearer way, and it's much more accessible as a result, i.e the radical menu for doing orders. PC gamers like yourself may say it's a bit clunky, but it's sure quicker than remembering a random number pattern to say a simple order like "open fire" (which is 9,5,3,1 for OF 1; see my point?).

But yeah, I ain't a dumb console gamer, don't worry. ;)

Edit: Yeah, I ain't a troll either, I'm just coming to OF2's rescue! :p

Edited October 4, 2009 by GunGraveTZA

[maddogx 13]

And my personal opinion on the matter is that OF2 will be infinitely better than ARMA2, mainly because...

Welcome to the forums. You are of course entitled to your opinion, but let's analyze your reasons.

...it's nowhere near as bug-ridden...

Possible but by no means guaranteed. In any case, bugs can be fixed.

...it's coming out on consoles...

Which only means it is accessable to console players. That doesn't make it a better game.

...is not simplified in any way...

Neither is Arma2. But you seem to be referring specifically to the console version again, so how does this make the game better?

...and because it actually remembers it supposed to be a game and not a simulation.

Again, how exactly is this a plus for DR?

[echo1 0]

Well, the radial menu is activated by pressing the WASD keys. So either way you end up memorizing different key shortcuts.

I do agree though, ArmA 2's menu is a downgrade from OFP/ArmA's one.

[Herbal Influence 10]

(....) PC gamers like yourself may say it's a bit clunky, but it's sure quicker than remembering a random number pattern to say a simple order like "open fire" (which is 9,5,3,1 for OF 1; see my point?).

But yeah, I ain't a dumb console gamer, don't worry. ;)

Edit: Yeah, I ain't a troll either, I'm just coming to OF2's rescue! :p

1. There is no OF1 and an OF2. There is only one original OFP.

2. Your numbering for "open fire" is wrong.

3. No we don't see your point.

Once again my question:

How can there be such radical fans of a game that noone of them has never ever played?

Smells like marketing.

[GunGraveTZA 10]

Welcome to the forums. You are of course entitled to your opinion, but let's analyze your reasons.

Possible but by no means guaranteed. In any case, bugs can be fixed.

Which only means it is accessable to console players. That doesn't make it a better game.

Neither is Arma2. But you seem to be referring specifically to the console version again, so how does this make the game better?

Again, how exactly is this a plus for DR?

Well thanks Mad, and yeah I just wanted to have an interesting discussion of the 2 games. :)

If you check my last links while the reviewers noted bugs some said that they were WAY fewer than ArmA II.

True, it does not necessarily make it a better game. However, it DOES make it more accessible to a wider audiance, so Codemasters are helping themselves and makes the game less likely to be a financial failure. :)

Yes, again refering to the console version, because most stratagy games are simplified for the consoles, and so it's refreshing to see that it isn't simplified on consoles. And you can't really say anything about that to ArmA II since it's only on PC.

And being more of a game than a simulation is better, as it's more accessible, and more accessibility means it's easier to get into, and being easier to get into means it can fun quicker.

Edit response to Herbal: Fair enough on the first post.

I can't remember the numbers exactly, but I have edited my post to what I think is more correct.

Well my point is that in a very good/excellent squad-based game you aren't required to remember a random number sequence to send out orders quickly and effectively: You can simply figure it out within a couple of seconds. And while you can do that for ArmA II it takes longer. Surely you can admit that?

And to answer your question: Because we are convinced enough by the gameplay and trailers that the game is fantastic.

Edited October 4, 2009 by GunGraveTZA

[Ulysses 10]

And being more of a game than a simulation is better, as it's more accessible, and more accessibility means it's easier to get into, and being easier to get into means it can be more fun.

Hm, that depends a lot on what kind of person you are. Some people enjoy complexity and depth of a realistic simulation even if it takes patience to learn and get familiar with. Others don't. So being more accessible doesn't mean it's "better". Might be better for the console market as the number of sim fans on there that would play it on a console is small.

[Herbal Influence 10]

Well thanks Mad, and yeah I just wanted to have an interesting discussion of the 2 games. :)

....

And being more of a game than a simulation is better, as it's more accessible, and more accessibility means it's easier to get into, and being easier to get into means it can be more fun.

1. Wrong. It's not "more" it might be "easier" accessibility.

2. Wrong. Fun and "easier" accessibility are not in relation for you don't tell "what" you access: Is it a First Person Shooter or is it a milsim. The latter will always be more difficult to access because it's opener and more complex. Does this mean less fun? Not at all. It means longer and deeper excitement.

[GunGraveTZA 10]

Hm, that depends a lot on what kind of person you are. Some people enjoy complexity and depth of a realistic simulation even if it takes patience to learn and get familiar with. Others don't. So being more accessible doesn't mean it's "better". Might be better for the console market as the number of sim fans on there that would play it on a console is small.

Being accessible doesn't necessarily mean it has to sacrifice depth. ;)

Edit for Herbal: Again, fair enough on the first point.

Edited post.

Edited October 4, 2009 by GunGraveTZA

[dm 9]

Well my point is that in a very good/excellent squad-based game you aren't required to remember a random number sequence to send out orders quickly and effectively: You can simply figure it out within a couple of seconds. And while you can do that for ArmA II it takes longer. Surely you can admit that?

Thats the point tho, the command rose thing in dragon rising is controlled by the wasd keys, so instead of learning 3,7,9,1 or whatever, you have to learn w,d,a,w instead.

I dont see where the advantage is?

As an aside, I used to play OFP with an app called "shoot" which interpreted my voice commands and converted them to keystrokes. You can do the same in ArmA, since it still uses the numbers, I dont see how you would be able to do that when your primary movement keys are also used to give orders?

[Herbal Influence 10]

(....)

Edit response to Herbal: Fair enough on the first post.

I can't remember the numbers exactly, but I have edited my post to what I think is more correct.

Well my point is that in a very good/excellent squad-based game you aren't required to remember a random number sequence to send out orders quickly and effectively: You can simply figure it out within a couple of seconds. And while you can do that for ArmA II it takes longer. Surely you can admit that?

And to answer your question: Because we are convinced enough by the gameplay and trailers that the game is fantastic.

1. Wrong: There is no easygoing possible "graphical user interface" for all those actions which have to be executed very fast. Once again you showing none knowledge of milsims.

2. Wrong: And you never learn these numbers, you use them until you know them - accidentally - by heart.

I think there is quite a lot you don't remember from OFP, not only the numbers.

It's a pooor discussion and I would really recommend Wolle to suspend it.

---------- Post added at 20:36 ---------- Previous post was at 20:34 ----------

Being accessible doesn't necessarily mean it has to sacrifice depth. ;)

(...)

Edited post.

That's a nice philo-soapical theorie.

You see this is so stupid a discussion that you find my answer to your later post - above ! in my post.

[GunGraveTZA 10]

1. Wrong: There is no easygoing possible "graphical user interface" for all those actions which have to be executed very fast. Once again you showing none knowledge of milsims.

2. Wrong: And you never learn these numbers, you use them until you know them - accidentally - by heart.

I think there is quite a lot you don't remember from OFP, not only the numbers.

It's a pooor discussion and I would really recommend Wolle to suspend it.

...In your opinion. In mine the Dragon Rising one is great, and is much simpler than the random numbers. And in responce to the "very fast" part you can just use hotkeys.

"Knowing them "acciently" by heart" is the same as learning. :p And yeah, I don't play it a lot.

Hmmkay, let Wolle decide. :)

Edited October 4, 2009 by GunGraveTZA

[space 10]

I like radial menus personally, and making it contextual is even batter. The easier it is to issue commands, the greater immersion you have ingame = the game feels more real. If you're battling the interface instead of fighting in the game, then that's not a good thing. Sure you can memorise commands over time, but why make life unnecessarily difficult? It doesn't make it more hardcore - it just makes it a pain in the ass.

[GunGraveTZA 10]

What Space said. :p