Mando Missile ArmA for ArmA 2

[froggyluv 2136]

Exciting times ahead.

+1

Damn if those RKSL's countermeasures didn't get me into flying which I generally avoided like the plague. With this added, it's going to be like a whole nother game within a game.

Seriously this game just wins me over more and more.

[raptor 6 actual 13]

I appreciate the compliments. I have more backgrounds coming. It takes a while to find photos and then make create a black and white template, especially one that fits into the viewscreen of ArmA 2.

I'll try to write down the coords of the button placements for Mando, but he's very wise and much quicker than I am in setting these button functionalities up ingame.

I love the fact that every game from OFP to ArmA 2 and OA, allow us to customize the game, and without you all, the community, the game would just be another game.

Thanks Mandoble, and everyone else. I'll try to post progress either in this thread, or another one, so as not to steal Mando's thunder :D

[mandoble 1]

pufu, a bit info about mando missile countermeasures here.

And some more info about the RWR at the bottom of this section.

Mission editor has full flexibility to decide which planes/choppers will have automatic countermeasures, and which planes/chopper types will have them manually dropped by the pilot.

Also, for the automatic conuntermeasures the mission editor may configure (even per each individual plane) which is the maximum range between missile and plane where that pilot gets aware of the missile, and a delay between this and having the countermeasurs on air. This way you may have quite effective "pilots" and quite noisy ones. Basically all this is to simulate the reaction skill of the pilot when a missile is incomming.

As explained in the link above, the geometry fo the attack is everything when it comes to evade a mando missile. For example, if you have a missile at your 6, you drop countermeasures and you dont break left/right, the missile will pass through the flares, will "see" you again and will keep pursuing you. If the missile comes from 12oclock then an evasion is even harder, as you would need to drop countermeasures and then make sure that your plane goes away of both, missile and flares giving the flares closer to the missile and with the missile being able to "see" the flares, else the missile will keep tracking you.

All this might sound complex and risky, and it is as in RL. But for playabilty purposes the mission editor has some parameters to play with and make missile avoidance easier:

- Missile resistance to countermeasures.

- Missile accuracy.

- Missile agility (so that after passing through the flares, and even "seeing" the target again, it cannot turn fast enough to get the kill.

- General flares/chaff extent, with this alone you may create very safe missions or missions where evading missiles requires a lot of skill.

About other countermeasures systems, they do not affect/interfere with mando missiles because Mando missiles are not stock ArmA missiles (while all stock arma missiles may be used as mando missiles).

Now Im testing an ECM system too, that can help pilots to both:

- Make them hard to get locked on by missile launchers.

- Affect negatively the accuracy of incomming radar guided missiles.

The ECM would have an operational rage, so all the planes closer to the ECM emitter than that range will benefit of the ECM effects. Might be this system will not be fully ready for first A2 MMA 2.35 beta release.

[kremator 1065]

Mandoble,

Was just wondering if it is possible to give an indication of WHERE the missile is coming from? It's been so long since I played Arma1 I can't remember if you included that.

Keep on scripting, you guru you !

SERIOUSLY looking forward to playing MMA 2.35beta !

EDIT to acknowledge my 1000th post !

Edited August 26, 2009 by Kremator
ONE THOUSAND POSTS !!!

[mandoble 1]

For that purpose you have the on-HUD RWR:

There you will see as many red lines as incomming missiles as well as the direction of your plane, so you can drop countermasures and maneouver in the most effective way.

The RWR was located in the UR corner of the screen in A1 (as seen in the pic below), in A2 I will change the position to avoid interferences with Hint messages.

[kremator 1065]

Yes of course !!! How stupid of me.

Getting excited with the thought of this release !

[txalin 2]

Mandoble, i think u seriously need a new interface for your web site :D

Regarding Mando missile, as usual, top work ;)

[mandoble 1]

The HUD system is now fully working in A2, it incorporates a new RWR display too ;)

The RWR shows incomming missiles locked on your plane, this allows you to maneouver in best position and drop countermeasures. For playability purposes the incomming missiles are displayed in light green lines in the RWR display which display area covers 2Km around the plane.

This system is applicable to any existing or future plane type with the execution of a single script. The parameters passed configure the system capabilities as well as the hud itself (RWR available or not, HUD info available or not, ammo and countermeasures left info available or not, etc).

WpNWGHmFEBI

[Defunkt 431]

Wicked! :bounce3:

Can I suggest the RWR be placed bottom-center as, when looking forward, this is over the largely irrelevant joystick and amongst the vehicle 'instruments' (or is it perhaps configurable)?

[.kju 3244]

Very impressive Mandoble. :)

Thanks for the detailed explanation of the possibilities. I will come back to that in a moment.

Just to give you an idea how PvP competitive play was adapted to reduce the game mechanics

of locking:

* Viewdistance reduced to 1200 to make tank and air locking less strong,

and to be reduced to the effective range for unguided inf AT (SMAW, RPG).

* No Javelin due to very simple auto lock.

* Inf AA (strela, stinger launcher) still in, yet essentially way too simple via the strong

and fast auto lock.

* No attack chopper or planes (or all guided rockets or more removed).

This is needed to avoid very one side, luck based and simple gameplay - unfortunately.

So any community made improvement, like your work, is very welcome here.

While no military expert at all, for PvP probably in terms of realism WWII or < 1980

vehicle and plane warfare what is best for gameplay.

The possible system:

* Disable direct click and tab lock for any weapon.

* Allow targeting process via center of the HUD / cursor for AA / guided missiles.

Process means to keep the cursor/weapon for several seconds in the target.

The process only works for line of sight and without friend or foe detecting.

* Add laser weapon to more vehicles. Add laser scanner, and to some extent also laser

guided weapon. Either to be get missiles fly to point of impact on launch or to have

them "ride" on the laser beam. Means if the laser target is moved, the missiles adapts

to the new target / position.

In addition to that you have defensive systems like smoke, arena, laser detector, flares.

So the local operational mode for the TV system seems to fulfill one aspect here.

Operation mode semi auto and manual are fitting nicely as well.

Low angles relative to camera center add up as well - can you configure time for the

locking process or is it currently always instant?

So in summary thanks again for the details. It is very very powerful already. Looking

forward to a play-test to see how it works out and what might be still missing. :)

[kremator 1065]

MIssile RWR looks very good Mandoble.

I like kju's idea of a locking time (perhaps you could keep the diamond lok but have a countdown timer INSIDE that diamond) and having it configurable by the mission maker.

Again I can't remember if you allowed the TV camera active on your missiles to view them inflight (for us fighter/bomber jocks to see some of the death and destruction we cause :) )

If you need a beta beta tester then just PM me. Can you tell I'm desperate to get my hands on your scripts yet?

[manzilla 1]

Join that the club Kremator! :) After seeing the most recent video he posted I'm actually looking forward to getting in a plane.

Damn that looked and sounded wicked. Beautiful work there Mando.

[mandoble 1]

Defunkt, actually the placement of the RWR is not configurable, or at least not per plane class, while there are two globals that the mission editor can change to set its x,y (if not set, then default values are used). I would agree with you, bottom center might seem the best place, but then you might have choppers with that area "empty" and in these cases the RWR would interfere with visibility of terrain in front of you.

kju, about your "possible system for PVP".

Mando missile HUD allows you to configure the lock on process in several ways:

- Boresight: You can lock on targets only if quite close to your hud´s center.

- HUD area: You will lock on the closest target to your hud center, between the targets that are displayed in your hud area.

- Remote: You can lock only on targets locked on by others. So you cannot detect and lock on targets using your vehicle. An interesting example is locking on submarines detected by mando sonobuoys ;)

- RADAR: You can lock on enemy active radars only (the lock is lost if the radar is switched off).

No lock at all: Manually guided missiles like the TOW.

In the case of TV camera systems you need always to move the camera and point to the desired target. Between others, you can configure the maximum and minimum deviation angles beetween marked position of the camera and potential target, so you may force the camera user to move the camera to point directly on the enemy, if not, then the camera will lock on a terrain position instead of a vehicle. But once the camera locks on a vehicle, the camera will follow it automatically while visible (LOS nos obstructed).

the camera also support what you call "laser mode", it generates also remote targets able to be locked on by other units. For example, you may have a reco chopper armed only with a mando laser camera, but you can use it to mark targets for a ship armed with cruise missiles and able to lock on targets locked on by others (your chopper).

Im looking for a way create a feasible locking on way based on time with the desired target centered on HUD or camera center. But I cannot promise to have it implemented in next A2 version, or implemented at all in the future.

Kremator and Manzilla, PM me if you are interested into some testing, might be we can arrange something there ;)

[kremator 1065]

Have send you the PM Mandoble ..... I'M IN !

[kremator 1065]

Dear All,

Mandoble has allowed me to see MMA2.35beta for Arma2 to do a little testing before it is fully released. This post will satisfy two positions 1) for infomation on what the addon can do 2) issues to be addressed.

It's looking GREAT !

The addon comes as an addon and in installed in a mod folder. The init.sqf is very easy to understand and modify (for you budding tinkerers) and mission.sqm just needs a mando_missile_Arma logic.

All missile functions are modifiable and flares are included as standard for AI and players.

Mandoble gave me a series of missions to try and without listing them all I will give you a breakdown of what you can see.

- Action menu items for the different gun/bomb/missile cameras (yes I did say GUN !)

- On entering the camera you get a lovely MFD (working function keys with updating information)

- There are instructions on how to use that camera on top of the window

- The camera is moveable using the mouse ONLY if the mouse is inside that window box

- Targets have a dull green box around them (if in range) that changes to a bright green box containing a diamond and a lock tone when you LEFT click on it.

- Missiles/bombs/guns can then be fired using the RIGHT mouse button.

- The aiming window can be given limits and direction (for instance out the LEFT side *COUGH* AC130U !!!!!!!)

As for improvements that need to be made....

- Mouse control in the camera view is very sensitive ... needs to be less so (perhaps dependent on zoom level ?)

- FLIR needs work - have you seen the FLIR addon - that's perfect.

- In the AC130 if oyu go past the 90deg limit (towards the front of the aircraft) the window shoots upwards and will not reset until you come out of the camera.

- VERY easy to damage you own AC130 - limits to be investigated that they dont conflict with model.

-Once in camera view the aircraft retains its speed/direction/angle etc which can look REALLY wierd (hard bank remaining for ages while going in the same direction!) - perhaps a way to just level the wings (unless in AC130?)

- Add a HOLD WP for the C130 so that it actually flies a circular orbit

- Kamov crashes in the destroyer mission unless you give a WP to the left of the kamov - it is fine then.

- Rotor is appearing in the camera window - not good for epileptics ! needs a little lowering

-LGBs look good and fly well - can there be a bomb camera to follow the death and destruction ? Perhaps having a 'guided' option where the pilot actually flies the bomb to target?

- Hawk console - can the mouse wheel be used for the zoom level?

OK that's all for now. I'm now going back for more testing.

Thanks again for the opportuntiy Mandoble.

Kremator

[.kju 3244]

Thanks once again Mandoble!

Very much looking forward to it. :)

[mandoble 1]

Hi Kremator, and thanks for testing ;)

Now about the improvements you proposed:

- Excesive mouse sensitivity is a problem related to last A2 beta.

- Everything related to camera/weapons angles, position and arcs is configurable via script parameters or globals for any vehicle class.

- About FLIR, I will check what you are looking for there.

- Kamov crashing: This is unrelated to MMA, and quite related to A2 pilot skills (or lack of them ...) ;)

- LGB or missile nose camera (not in manual guidance mode): this is something I was considering to introduce, not sure if in first open beta.

- MCC using mouse wheel to zoom in/out: I will include that :)

[manzilla 1]

Mando,

I got you set up on hotmail, I hope.

[Defunkt 431]

Thoroughly looking forward to it. Just one thought I had when viewing one of the WIP videos which is now on my mind again having read Kremator's summary; is there really going to be a visible mouse pointer to select targets? Ideally given the MFD paradigm it'd be function keys for everything and TAB to cycle targets, click-and-shoot with a little white arrow strikes me as a trifle 'gamey' though I guess it'd be a lot of work to change. Maybe in a later version or if somebody else (like me) submitted a tweak/patch at a later date?

[mandoble 1]

No, you cannot use the mouse to select any target (except in a prototype of targeting radar I'm planning to include sometime). The mouse is used in the TV system to move the camera, it is used as an "analog" virtual joystick. There is an steerable area in the center of the camera, moving the mouse inside this aera makes the camera to move (but not to move where the mouse is pointing, just getting some movement speed and acceleration depending on the mouse position).

[manzilla 1]

Here's something I've noticed so far:

-I'm having a helluva time locking onto heli's with the Vikar AA and the AIM9's. I can't seem to do it at all. The planes are fine.

-The Su-25's are marked as Su-39 when you get a lock on them:

http://s806.photobucket.com/albums/yy344/Manzilla_photo/?action=view&current=arma22009-09-0115-03-37-46_CROP.jpg

[kremator 1065]

A useful thing would be for the pilot of the C130 (that controls the camera) to be able to directly steer the aircraft whilst in camera mode. Something similar to the way the bombadiers were able to control the bombers on bombing runs. It just needs left/right enabling.

I have also seen that the camera window flashes when it comes up. Any way to smooth that out ?

Tracking with Mando Gun is sometimes a little off (firing a line of rounds). Possible to do a spread around the desired location ?

Lock growl ... possible to vary pitch in relation to kill probability ?

Still testing and LOVING IT !

[mandoble 1]

Manzilla, you should not have any problem at all locking on choppers, that sounds quite weird. About Su39 tag, that is correct, these are Su39s (or Su-25TM BTW). In any case this is the A2 class name for that plane.

Kremator, there is no plan to incorporate a "fly" while in camera mode for the TV system, what youd be good is to have a C130 with pilot and gunner (even without any gun) this way from the game you would be able to indicate destinations for the AI pilot.

I do not notice any initial flash effect with the camera, while I keep trying overloading the mission, might be temporal low fps would be causing that.

For mando gun lite you may define dispersion factors (vertical and horizontal), that might help to get the spreading effect you are looking for.

About growl sound related to kill probability, this cannot be done A2 doesnt allow to "modulate" or modify the played sound, and changing the volume would affect also to anyother sound.

Thanks guys for keep testing :)

[manzilla 1]

Mando,

This is great. I forgot how much this adds to flying.

Some more problems with the Heli targeting:

-I can't get the AIM9 AA's or Vikhr AA's to lock onto any opposing heli's in the example missions. Unlike planes left-clicking on the acquired target does not lock. The box just sits there.

-The AG missiles fired from heli's will not accurately head towards the target. The seem to go off in the distance and never really head towards the ground. When they do hit the ground, it's pretty far away from the target.

- When tracking an air target sometimes the viewed area in the HUD jumps straight up once the camera is 90 degrees from the front of the heli. I can be following an Su-39 that is flying level with me on the "mma_test_frigate_addon.utes" mission.(Without locking on) Once I get near perpendicular with the nose of my heli the screen all of a sudden heads straight up towards a focal point in the sky. Eventually I can get the camera back under control. I hope this makes sense.

[mandoble 1]

Hi Manzilla,

- Being able to lock on planes but not on choppers is really weird, as the TV in AA mode doesnt make any distintion between them. Definitively this is a point that needs further investigation, mostly because I'm unable to recreate that problem with my ArmA2.

- The Vikhr present in the demo has a quite small "tartetting" window, marked by the red arrows to in the camera, only when the target is inside the area pointed by the arrows and the range is in green you should fire the missile with high % of hit. Else that missile will fail in most cases, quite the opposite to the hellfire example for the TV working on the AH1Z.

- The camera in AA mode for the Ka52 has some angle limits configured, if the point you are looking at or targeted gets out of these limits, the camera tries to track but finally breaks the lock and gets free again.