So ive spent more time tweaking than playing...

[Malecite 10]

Hello.

First time purchasing a BIS product needless to say im less than impressed, now I could go ahead and swear pointlessly about the countless hours ive tried to actually get this shoddy piece of codding nightmare to run, instead im going to intelligently ask a question.

Is it now, or is it becoming, a general trend for software developers to release completely substandard products early for the sake of monetary gain?

If so, I believe this ARMA 2 to be a shining example of this kind of practice. At first when I booted up the title and managed to retreive around 11 - 15 FPS on a machine boasting an overclocked 3.6ghz Q6700 and gtx 295 I was slightly dismayed. After countless hours of reading the forums, guides, and trying every GPU NVIDIA tweak ive come across, im downright shocked. To date, ive gotten it to "run". I use that word loosely because it seems that my multiplayer experience becomes a choppy bloody nightmare when in any sort of situational combat. Add this to the numerous graphical glitches, CTD's, and other horrendous bugs, and youve got yourself a winner! Dont even get me started on the voice acting.... seriously guys?

This comes on the heels of purchasing "Tales of Valor" another wonderful example of the kind of ridiculous hyped up, over sold, kind of marketing that ultimately leads to consumers wasting their money.

I just read a post where a user actually intelligently, albeit fascetiously reccomended virutally space aged 16 core technology to run the game, and was immediately and visciously attacked/flamed. Am I to understand that the following of this Bohemia interactive studio defend this practice, rather ENDORSE a system where users purchase a title and simply wait for patches to make it playable? To be blunt im shocked. Im not one for perfection, but I certainly cant abide this kind of idiocy. Despite every red flag I red, every instinct that said "dont buy this title" I purchased it anyways as I LOVE the BF2 genre simulation combat. Im also a big fan of Company of Heroes, recently hilariously buggy patches ultimately annihlated the game play experience post Tales of Valor release. 5 months later patches restored THE ORIGINAL GAMEPLAY. I figured it was a phenomenon unique to Relic and their bumbling Q and A team.

What a dissapointment to learn that ive fallen, yet again, victim to what I can only assume to be an emerging policy in software development.

Release Now

Patch Later

I would offer my copy of the game, for free, to anyone who would have it. But ultimately I purchased it off steam and this is not possible.

I guess this is where you cue the followers to jump in and tell me to be patient and humble, awaiting the glorious patches to follow. Frankly you can keep your patches, this has been one of the most infuriating and disgusting pieces of software ive ever been tricked into purchasing. Part of me still hopes that patches WILL follow and I might actually see some of what the others are talking about. However this only serves to frustrate me further as it reminds me that I can only sit on my hands and wait as others, who paid the same dollar, enjoy the title I cannot.

[i am haji 10]

I dont understand how this works myself. I can settle for bad path finding, ai issues, and texture problems and patiently wait for patches to release but c'mon, there is a big performance issue.

Running arma 35-40 fps with med-high settings, than playing arma II with everything set to the lowest value and cant top 22 fps.

Please allow us to adjust the shaders settings and Building details!! its really killing the FPS

Edited July 23, 2009 by i am haji

[maddogx 13]

Needs moar concrete info.

What settings are you trying to run the game on?

[maka12 10]

good post Malecite, i agree with what you say the game is very poor even on a top end machine, i went out and bought a new machine just for this game, and i find it wont run smoothly so iam really pissed off my specs

phenom 2 x 4 955 black edition

8gb ram

crosshair iii mother board

ati 4870 x2 3 gb

os vista 64bit gamer

i did get aliitle improvement after i downloaded fusion gamer tweak from amd

but only 2-3fps. what i have seen of the game itself it looks to be really good

but whats the point of spending all that money on a new rig and having to play the latest game on low to med settings..its bullshit

[Bulldogs 10]

Hopefully it'll be fixed for you lot soon, I'm running it smooth as butter on pretty subpar hardware (e7300 OC, 9800gt, etc) but only running at 1280x1024, with everything on high to very high, no AA, 2000 view distance (do you really need to see more than that?!)

Then again, the same setup runs Arma 1 maxed out at 100 fps, so not sure what you're running to only get 40fps on Arma 1

[Mudkip 0]

Very true, the performance issues are really annoying but for me, the awesome gameplay makes up for it.

[Master gamawa 0]

Hello.

First time purchasing a BIS product

as I LOVE the BF2 genre simulation combat.

Well I think I found your problem. :)

You have to understand us man. Most of us have been there since Operation Flashpoint. We know the story. We got the thousand yard stare. Jaded bitter veterans we are...

And we know the Arma series is always rough when it starts. We have dealt with most bugs and we have more or less expressed the same complaints.

It's gonna work eventually.

Don't you know the golden rule? If you want to enjoy the Arma series you must buy the game a year after it comes out~!

[lockjaw-65- 0]

Sad but true, stick with it, it will all work out in the end

[thr0tt 12]

I have to score the post 8/10, the overall readability was good, structure was well presented, nothing too hateful for folk to jump on and nothing too loving of the game or BI either. Some overuse of the word 'shocked' had a negative effect on my score of the thread as it made me feel that the seriousness had been diminished by a very emotive word.

Keep up the good work.

[maddogx 13]

I still want to know what settings he's running on. 11-15 FPS with everything on very low and 500m view distance would be a cause for concern. With everything on very high and 10km view distance, it would be nothing unusual.

[thr0tt 12]

I get 14-60 FPS, depending on where I am on the map, amazingly trees and grass has little to no effect on FPS. Settings everything on normal, pp=low, 1680x1050 screen and 1440x900 game.

Buildings are the killer, the texture load and stutter throws the frames, if they sorted buildings out, fixed the textures then all would see performance increases, probably.

[wooly-back-jack 10]

I'm with Malecite also, this is unacceptable.

I have taken my complaint to BBC's Watchdog now, I suggest other people as unhappy as us do the same.

[thr0tt 12]

wooly, this is more of a One Show throw away article, no way WatchDog would touch it although would be cool for Nicky Campbell to get his teeth into it.

[wooly-back-jack 10]

we can but try, only takes a minute to fill out the online form.

And they do have a section for this, choose computing then games :)

and why wouldn't he touch it when you can say BI and 505 games tick all these boxes:

Covers all contracts made by consumers when purchasing goods, consumers are given full rights under this Act in all circumstances, these rights cannot be restricted by the terms and conditions of the contract.

Consumers can expect that goods will be:

* As described. Goods provided must conform to any description applied to them; this description can be made verbally or in writing.

* Of a satisfactory quality. Satisfactory quality means that the product should be of a quality that a reasonable person would expect from the goods taking into account any description, the intended purpose and the price that is paid.

* Fit for the purpose made known. If a consumer intends to purchase goods to use for a specific purpose other than that which it is intended and this is made known to the seller, then the goods should be suitable for that purpose.

Generally a consumer can claim a repair or replacement of the goods if they become faulty or do not conform to the contract, if this is not possible or not economical the consumer can look to claim a full or partial refund. If the consumer notices the fault, misdescription or unsuitability quick enough after the purchase then they may be able to reject the goods for a full refund.

Edited July 23, 2009 by wooly-back-jack

[Jackdaniels 10]

This post sums up exactly how I feel. Well done Malecite, on a very fair post that tells people how it really is.

I'm with Malecite also, this is unacceptable.

I have taken my complaint to BBC's Watchdog now, I suggest other people as unhappy as us do the same.

I Look forwards to watching that episode - Lmao.

Edited July 23, 2009 by Jackdaniels

[DarkBytes 10]

have to agree with OP , I have given up on this game , dropping in to forum 1 a week to see if there is any improvment / patch , and will look elsewhere for my gaming kicks

[CaptRio 0]

Theres no room for amateurism in the game industry anymore!

Enough of this free worldwide players Beta test cr*p!!!

[private plowjoy 0]

I still want to know what settings he's running on. 11-15 FPS with everything on very low and 500m view distance would be a cause for concern. With everything on very high and 10km view distance, it would be nothing unusual.

The fact that they haven't responded speaks volumes. Most likely cranked every single setting onto Very High with max View Distance.....

[wooly-back-jack 10]

I still want to know what settings he's running on. 11-15 FPS with everything on very low and 500m view distance would be a cause for concern. With everything on very high and 10km view distance, it would be nothing unusual.

Obviously by his post he has tried every setting he can think of, and I believe him.

"Pic's or it never happened" attitude does nothing for him or the other frustrated people who have been 'tricked' into purchasing this "ultimate military simulator"

there are regularly 400+ people logged into these forums, probably 50 helping each other with editor stuff, 1 or 2 moderators, 50 probably just browsing between their working perfectly game and I bet about 250-300 are franticly awaiting a patch and trying to get their game working inbetween browsing/posting/tweaking.

I think it's either down to us being shoved to one side while they work on a console version race or it's some viral way of gaining a big community on the forum lol.

I bet if the game actually worked as it should you wouldn't have so many forum members/posts, they would just simply be playing the game. Not all people are into browsing forums.

With this game it is a different story, people are signing up to see what is going on? why doesn't their game work? why have I got Amstrad graphics with my xxxx card? and the old classic WHERE IS THE 1.03 PATCH?

[SemiFrank 10]

Good post. I've been a lurker up to this point, actually just register for the sole purpose of responding to this post.

To get to the point; I feel tricked.

I had a athlon X2 64 3800+ and a 8800GT OC2, 3gb of ram.. decent machine, few years old.

I can run Crysis decently well on that rig, I figured if it plays crysis it will play anything.

Before I bought the game, I checked out the required specs.. "hmm.. im better than minimum, and floating right around the recommended specs. nice!".

I downloaded the demo, installed it and "Hey! it runs great". So I jump onto Steam, drop the $50 and buy the game. The first few levels were somewhat playable and then as I got closer to town, it took a turn for the worse.

If a game manufacturer tells me that I'm meeting the recommended specs, I would assume that this meant that the game will be playable to at least some capacity. I would assume that the specs are for the entire game, not just the demo. That hasn't been the case, at all, even on the lowest settings the game is not playable. I'm talking 4-6 fps. What does "recommended requirements" mean? That I can navigate the menus? What would it do on their minimum requirements? Install an icon on my desktop but not open?

I feel utterly deceived. A game demo, especially one with a benchmark should at least be of some relevance to the final product. I feel like the demo duped me into buying the game because it gave me the impression that my current hardware could play the game. Not cool.

I really really want to love this game, I love slow paced military sims with one-shot kills and stalking gameplay but the performance issues have just sucked the life out of me. Like others I will give up for now and check back weekly for patches, hoping they haven't taken my money and ran.

Oh, and another thing, I actually (as I did with Crysis) went out and bought a new video card *just to play this game* yet even with the new card (sapphire 4890 1gb) it is barely playable with medium settings.

As is, this product is broken. At the very minimum, as paying customers who deserve their money back, BIS should plead with it's customer base *not* to call their credit card companies to initiate a refund/fraud investigation. They can do this by simply acknowledging the problems: "Yes, we are aware that there are performance issues that are stopping users from enjoying the game to it's full potential, we assure you, our loyal customers that the minimum specs posted on our website are based on real tests and we are currently working on providing this level of performance through an upcoming patch. we appreciate your patience and we ask that you trust us when we we say: 'we will make this right'."

That's all I'd need to hear to not feel ripped off. Please, we are your initial buyers, the initial cash flow, throw us a frigging bone.

[kremator 1065]

This game is MUCH more than the campaign. Play in the editor, load some custom maps, have fun.

In my opinion the 'product' is not broken. It just needs a few tweaks. Please continue to check for patches - we don't want to lose the members of this community that are having trouble.

However, a machine a few years old just won't cut it I'm afraid.

[Mattoso 0]

As is, this product is broken. At the very minimum, as paying customers who deserve their money back, BIS should plead with it's customer base *not* to call their credit card companies to initiate a refund/fraud investigation. They can do this by simply acknowledging the problems: "Yes, we are aware that there are performance issues that are stopping users from enjoying the game to it's full potential, we assure you, our loyal customers that the minimum specs posted on our website are based on real tests and we are currently working on providing this level of performance through an upcoming patch. we appreciate your patience and we ask that you trust us when we we say: 'we will make this right'."

That's all I'd need to hear to not feel ripped off. Please, we are your initial buyers, the initial cash flow, throw us a frigging bone.

I totally agree.

I'm an old fan, since OPF, fully decided to leave this series, but every day I get me entering in the forum in the hope to see a miracle patch that would solve the performance problem... Oh man... Why I just can't leave and play other games?! The game's idea is phenomenal, but it is a techinical disaster...

backing to my pray...

[thr0tt 12]

This game is MUCH more than the campaign. Play in the editor, load some custom maps, have fun.

In my opinion the 'product' is not broken. It just needs a few tweaks. Please continue to check for patches - we don't want to lose the members of this community that are having trouble.

However, a machine a few years old just won't cut it I'm afraid.

Agreed, the game just needs a new image on the loading screen and it will be perfect, there are no other issues just play with the title menu, scrolling up and down, its so fun, please be patient until BI allow you to do more like play it.

And yes, a machine more than 6 months old is just so yesterday and was not designed to cut it.

[=SEALZ= REt. Bruce 10]

As noob or dumb as this sounds...I changed the name of my Arma2.exe to Crysis.exe...all works very well now on high settings with view disatnce set to 4000. post processing disabled.

AMD Phenom 9950 Quad Core 2.61 GHz

4.0 GB Ram

vista 64 Os

ATI 4870x2 2GB

---------- Post added at 05:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:25 PM ----------

I was getting less than 20 FPS before i did the name change now i get mid to upper 30's

[wooly-back-jack 10]

that will be because you are using a 4870x2 and tricking it into crossfire?

---------- Post added at 23:45 ---------- Previous post was at 23:39 ----------

This game is MUCH more than the campaign. Play in the editor, load some custom maps, have fun.

In my opinion the 'product' is not broken. It just needs a few tweaks. Please continue to check for patches - we don't want to lose the members of this community that are having trouble.

However, a machine a few years old just won't cut it I'm afraid.

you just don't get the thread do you? especially the highlighted bit.

If our machines "just won't cut it" why is the box advertising the fact that our machines WILL cut it, infact we are on Optimal requirements bar our CPU's which still exceed the minimum requirements.

We aren't asking for 200fps in 1650x1080 with everything maxed out, we just want a working game that we can play with our mates online.

I would be quite happy to accept low settings on my 8800GT if the bloody thing worked!