Can someone from Bis comment on the FPS issue!!

[Placebo 29]

I really wish they'd iron out the kinks before they release a game

Problem is that's simply not possible, it's the downside to games being so open, look at Stalker, 7 years in development? And it still took a THQ producer to take over the project for the final year and cut out numerous features to get the game published, and then it was buggy and poorly optimised initially, look at FPDR, depiste a £15m budget and 350-400 person dev team where is it? Already missed a number of deadlines and started having features culled to try to get something out the door.

[slynchy 0]

Problem is that's simply not possible, it's the downside to games being so open, look at Stalker, 7 years in development? And it still took a THQ producer to take over the project for the final year and cut out numerous features to get the game published, and then it was buggy and poorly optimised initially, look at FPDR, depiste a £15m budget and 350-400 person dev team where is it? Already missed a number of deadlines and started having features culled to try to get something out the door.

Well, I'll wait till OPF:DR comes out before I pass judgement. However, I haven't seen anything that impressed me so far.

[Bulldogs 10]

Back on the Frames per sec issue.

I've noticed a lot of people complaining that there is little to no change in FPS when they change their video settings.

From personal testing I can tell you that I run a pretty old card core (9800GT) and I get little framerate change with settings changes, but I do get a good overall framerate.

I'm running an E7300 CPU. I had it at 2.6GHZ stock and the game ran well, I OC'd it to 3.25GHz clock and I got a nice overall FPS increase.

This is backed up by reading up on the Arma mark 2 results.

That said, the CPU isn't the only issue, but there may be a bottleneck between the CPU and the Graphics card. If you have an ATI card you can test for a bottleneck (check the bottleneck thread)

[jaundiced 10]

Problem is that's simply not possible, it's the downside to games being so open, look at Stalker, 7 years in development? And it still took a THQ producer to take over the project for the final year and cut out numerous features to get the game published, and then it was buggy and poorly optimised initially, look at FPDR, depiste a £15m budget and 350-400 person dev team where is it? Already missed a number of deadlines and started having features culled to try to get something out the door.

Stalker ran like a dream for me compared to Arma I & II. it may have had bugs, but it certainly didn't suffer in the performance department for myself or anyone i know....

[Yapab 10]

I'm still playing the demo and LOVE the game feel and gameplay... however I'm a bit reluctant to purchase as I know there are major issues with FPS.. and I'm a person who just cant play FPS games below 25fps.

I've heard there are problems with FPS in the campaign which seem to be CPU related.

I have done a few tests and in the EDITOR demo I can get pretty good 40 to 50fps... also in the warfare game in the demo I can also get about 35 to 45 fps.. .however as soon as I enter a town (approach it) the fps DROPS to 10 and 15... its unplayable and not fun.

hard to aim and feels just bad... it really would be nice if BIS came here and did a simple post saying yes we are optimising the game, hold on!

Yapa

[Jackdaniels 10]

Sorry to have say this, but the joy I first had when switching to windows 7, has now turned to disappointment again. I tried out a number of 30 player Evolution severs today and have to say my FPS sucked again. I could only manage a frame rate of around 16 -27 and this is on a clean install of windows 7. I was also getting horrible player clipping, so shooting at any moving targets was a nightmare.

I really don’t see the point in having such a massive map when it struggles with only 30 human players and a number of Ai on it. What FPS were Bis getting when they tested this game? And what hardware were they using?

I would also like to know if Bis see the Fps as a problem they can fix, or are we just going to blame it on mine and other people's computers?

Edited July 3, 2009 by Jackdaniels

[Winkl_BOttOm 10]

We come here to discuss and with the "process of eliminations" we hope to help players having problems. As in this case, Jack mentions Vista 32 was his problem.

As Placebo stated........more info and specs of the pc will help us.

Guess what........it worked for Jack!

So how in the hell can you claim Placebo "dogging" him?

Read his statement that you quoted, slowly this time, let it soak in.

You will notices words like "I'm sorry" and defended BI against Jack's rant.

He was offering help, unlike your self, Winkl_BOttOm

lol , he did not offer help , he put in his critisim and then put in a small question which is fine post w/e the hell you want to about help , but i critise the people that critise the people for venting , people like you for example try and critise me and i have a very valid argument that we shouldnt have to reinstall one thing on our system driver or OS system wise to play a game...which is fine for the people that want to try it , i just dont think we should have to regardless and yes i did try the os reinstall to XP 64 and only 3-8 FPS increase on medium settings , so it was a joke and a waste , but any who your defence of him was stupid

---------- Post added at 01:50 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:46 PM ----------

How exactly do you think that potential causes are eliminated? By having people saying "Hey I use those drivers, and that OS and the FPS are fine for me", so that means the problem is elsewhere, so you, we, all start looking at the next possible cause, that's how troubleshooting issues are resolved, if you don't like them being resolved that way then I would suggest you Email the publisher's support Email with your issue and wait for a solution.

And telling me or anyone else to "screw off" will not help you get troubleshooting issues resolved, in fact it'll not help you post to these forums at all, cut it out thank you.

"So if people post something which counteracts your claims about FPS issues you reply with a post attacking BIS? I'm sorry you're having FPS issues but as a number of people have clearly stated they have no such issues, so instead of slagging us and the game off why not stick to point and see what can be resolved?"

is your original post , i dont see one thing that is helping him in that paragraph just you basically telling him to shut up. So , if you want to post help thats fine but he can vent if he wants to , he has every right too.

[S!fkaIaC 10]

I'm sorry I guess my irony was too subtle, that was the point I was making, whether he likes it or not these troubleshooting forums are the best place to get issues solved, whether he likes it or not people posting that something is working for them is a way for people to get their problems solved.

Hmmmm, my point was that "sometimes the best is not good enough".

And if one want to be the #1 it makes no sense to look at the bad examples.

It is like "Stop farting! ...........Huhhhh, but Harry does it tooo!"

Rather look at DCS:BS if you want an example how good PR looks like IMHO.

remark: I do NOT compare the games ArmA 2 & DCS:BS, just the way the dev behaving.

Edited July 3, 2009 by S!fkaIaC

[REMOVED_ACCOUNT 10]

Yeah, you can't really say ARMA would be the same as some other FPS. However "it's not like other games" can't be the reason for all the problems.

I know it's impossible to create a full scale software/game that wouldn't have any bugs, but if and when the bugs appear, the developers NEED to comment them and tell what they are going to do about it.

The FPS issue isn't something you can blame the users for. People are posting that they have 20-30 fps on LOW settings with two dualcore graphic cards, quadcore processor and 8gb of fast ram. All the drivers up-to-date.

Only solutions so far have been confusing workarounds, what I want, is a word from BI about what they are going to do about this problem. Even "We can't tell what the problem is, but we are working on it" would do, but they have to admit there's something wrong.

Games are different, but other new games work fine on the people who post about the problem. Please don't go for "ARMA is different", but rather tell us what you know about this.

[Winkl_BOttOm 10]

yeah i wouldnt be quiet upset with BI if they would comment and fill us in on whats going on , on their end of the bottle. They wont update us with anything i can see on the forums unless i am missing something which i probably am , i wish they would communicate with their player base with all these issuies and they arnt because they dont have to they got the money and thats all they need to can take as long as they want too.

[Jackdaniels 10]

yeah i wouldnt be quiet upset with BI if they would comment and fill us in on whats going on , on their end of the bottle. They wont update us with anything i can see on the forums unless i am missing something which i probably am , i wish they would communicate with their player base with all these issuies

I don't think you will be granted your wish. From what I am reading into here, it looks like anyone suffering a bad FPS will just be told that it is their computer at fault. Even though I have done a fresh install of windows 7, and my computer more than matches the specs required to run this game. Or maybe you will be told that it's all Nvidia's fault - The Driver's for the cards or even the 200 series Cards themselves that are at fault etc...etc... But I have heard all this somewhere before and I don't buy into it anymore now. Me thinks it's time to move on, I get the feeling I am wasting my time with this issue!!

Edited July 3, 2009 by Jackdaniels

[Placebo 29]

is your original post , i dont see one thing that is helping him in that paragraph just you basically telling him to shut up. So , if you want to post help thats fine

You should try reading my post without your blinkers on:

why not stick to point and see what can be resolved?

As in stick to the point of the troubleshooting issue you have and we may be able to help you find a solution.

I don't see any mention of which drivers you're using for example?

Funny how you deliberately missed that part out when you quoted me isn't it ;)

but he can vent if he wants to , he has every right too.

No he doesn't.

He has the right to try to resolve troubleshooting issues on our troubleshooting forums, if he abuses that right by venting, ranting and generally being abusive it will very quickly be taken away, which goes for everyone of course.

[Winkl_BOttOm 10]

I havnt seen it done? And yes he does have a right , and the arguing is comming from both sides and i dont like myself or other being critised for something that isnt our fault. Also the way you stated yourself in the post that upsetted me could have easily been dealt with , with just posting the rules of this section and posting the information needed to troubleshoot the problem (theres a sticky of it) than you using your own words which wasnt the best of choice for the people that are already aggervated.

[Lunatic 10]

Problem is that's simply not possible, it's the downside to games being so open, look at Stalker, 7 years in development? And it still took a THQ producer to take over the project for the final year and cut out numerous features to get the game published, and then it was buggy and poorly optimised initially, look at FPDR, depiste a £15m budget and 350-400 person dev team where is it? Already missed a number of deadlines and started having features culled to try to get something out the door.

Placebo, don't want to wade in, but as i know you from old, I'm sure you will take my comments in the spirit that they are meant.

If you bought a new car that ran at 5 Mpg you'd wonder why, after a lot of discussions with the manufacturer you were told it was teething trouble, live with it, and then two weeks later no resolution, I believe you too would be rightfully annoyed.

This does not make it acceptable that for some that car works as planned and for some it does not. When we have all payed the same amount for the same thing. I understand that the components under the hood differ and therefore are hard to quantify, but none the less, if my pc meets the minimum and recommended specs, then I expect it to run decently if not well.

I also understand that you are a mod and as such have litttle or no say over development, so the vent is not personal. More at the devs.

Although I would like to add that if Marek or Suma were to post a response this would go some way as to relieving the community of their desire for knowledge, that something is being done; that BIS can replicate the problem; and that all will be well as soon as a fix is found.

All that we are hearing at the mo is a mixed bag of "it works fine for me" and a lot of "I can't get above 25 fps". Something somewhere is wrong with the game, that much is plane to see. Please don't fob us off with excuses that "xxx's works ok therefore that game isn't to blame".

The constant trawl of posts that complain about performance etc prove that something ain't right!

But like i first said this isn't personal, we just need to know what is happening!

[scorpio17523 10]

Placebo, don't want to wade in, but as i know you from old, I'm sure you will take my comments in the spirit that they are meant.

If you bought a new car that ran at 5 Mpg you'd wonder why, after a lot of discussions with the manufacturer you were told it was teething trouble, live with it, and then two weeks later no resolution, I believe you too would be rightfully annoyed.

This does not make it acceptable that for some that car works as planned and for some it does not. When we have all payed the same amount for the same thing. I understand that the components under the hood differ and therefore are hard to quantify, but none the less, if my pc meets the minimum and recommended specs, then I expect it to run decently if not well.

I also understand that you are a mod and as such have litttle or no say over development, so the vent is not personal. More at the devs.

Although I would like to add that if Marek or Suma were to post a response this would go some way as to relieving the community of their desire for knowledge, that something is being done; that BIS can replicate the problem; and that all will be well as soon as a fix is found.

All that we are hearing at the mo is a mixed bag of "it works fine for me" and a lot of "I can't get above 25 fps". Something somewhere is wrong with the game, that much is plane to see. Please don't fob us off with excuses that "xxx's works ok therefore that game isn't to blame".

The constant trawl of posts that complain about performance etc prove that something ain't right!

But like i first said this isn't personal, we just need to know what is happening!

I think that sums it up perfectly

[B-oodThorn 10]

Placebo, don't want to wade in, but as i know you from old, I'm sure you will take my comments in the spirit that they are meant.

If you bought a new car that ran at 5 Mpg you'd wonder why, after a lot of discussions with the manufacturer you were told it was teething trouble, live with it, and then two weeks later no resolution, I believe you too would be rightfully annoyed.

This does not make it acceptable that for some that car works as planned and for some it does not. When we have all payed the same amount for the same thing. I understand that the components under the hood differ and therefore are hard to quantify, but none the less, if my pc meets the minimum and recommended specs, then I expect it to run decently if not well.

I also understand that you are a mod and as such have litttle or no say over development, so the vent is not personal. More at the devs.

Although I would like to add that if Marek or Suma were to post a response this would go some way as to relieving the community of their desire for knowledge, that something is being done; that BIS can replicate the problem; and that all will be well as soon as a fix is found.

All that we are hearing at the mo is a mixed bag of "it works fine for me" and a lot of "I can't get above 25 fps". Something somewhere is wrong with the game, that much is plane to see. Please don't fob us off with excuses that "xxx's works ok therefore that game isn't to blame".

The constant trawl of posts that complain about performance etc prove that something ain't right!

But like i first said this isn't personal, we just need to know what is happening!

Im sure the graphics drivers have a big hand in how this game runs like many other games,Nvidia are still improving performance on games like Crysis still as im sure ATI are,so the performance issues dont solely fall on BI's shoulders.

We will probably see in the near future some new drivers from Nvidia and Ati coupled with some BI patches which will increase game performance.

[cjsoques 0]

Sorry to be off-topic but the vista comment irked me. I agree Vista was and is very unstable on older machines, but the new guy in town, Windows 7 is absolutely incredible.

It starts up in seconds, extremely stable (not a single crash in 4 months) and faster than windows xp and prettier than windows vista. I really am shocked how well Microsoft has done with 7.

[SWAT_BigBear 0]

lol , he did not offer help , he put in his critisim and then put in a small question which is fine post w/e the hell you want to about help , but i critise the people that critise the people for venting , people like you for example try and critise me and i have a very valid argument that we shouldnt have to reinstall one thing on our system driver or OS system wise to play a game...which is fine for the people that want to try it , i just dont think we should have to regardless and yes i did try the os reinstall to XP 64 and only 3-8 FPS increase on medium settings , so it was a joke and a waste , but any who your defence of him was stupid

What is your problem? Are you just incapable of reading fine print here?

I wasn't defending anyone! I also would like to know more info of those having issues. We can't just magically guess what may help them.

[nuggetz 0]

If this game runs so freaking well for BIS then why don't they tell me how many FPS they were getting and at what resolution and on what hardware/GPU driver. I'll build that machine this weekend if it will allow me to run Arma2 the way I expect.

Edited July 4, 2009 by nuggetz

[Jackdaniels 10]

I also would like to know more info of those having issues. We can't just magically guess what may help them.

Maybe a word from Bis that such a problem does exist would help. Followed by a patch to fix it.

Can people also stop blaming the Nvidia drivers and the fact that people have the Nvidia 200 series cards. This game should have been tested and built around such cards, so please drop the it's all Nvidias fault!!

BigBear - What more info do you require exactly? People have given you the specs of their computers and told you they have a FPS Issue. What more info can they give you that would help matters?

Can you also tell me, in a 30 player Evolution game, what your Fps are you getting BigBear? And if you do get a good Fps, then maybe could divulge what computer specs you have aswell? Not that I'll be rushing out and getting the same specs as you, but just out of curiosity I would like to know.

Edited July 4, 2009 by Jackdaniels

[cosmokev 10]

What is your problem? Are you just incapable of reading fine print here?

I wasn't defending anyone! I also would like to know more info of those having issues. We can't just magically guess what may help them.

I'm afraid the problem is with the coding of the game.

Irrespective of all and any troubleshooting conundrums we all try it's all boiling down to a simple common problem.

The problem is the game was released with extremely poor performance

even with the latest quad cores and high end graphics cards.

A few simple test runs with different cpus and cards would have shown this to BI.

They released the game anyway - without having a demo to try beforehand.

I brought the game and it was a mistake - with the previous track record of BI releasing extremely poor performing games i'm amazed that people spend countless hours trying to fix a turd.

The choice to use all sorts of extremely strange and bizarre coding methods for false AA / menu sizes / piss blur filtering etc. has resulted in a mismash of problems and performance issues.

BI should have used tried and trusted rendering methods,they should have

released WIP demos to enable an excellent community resource base to help them with problems blah blah blah.

I've given my money in spite of all the above problems - it's really a shame

Bi don't appear to be very forthcoming in addressing the issues.

Perhaps if they released mission packs and sub campaigns etc. that they can now optimise for more fluid gameplay the community would think better of them whilst waiting for performance patches.

It is a simple fact the game is excellent -unfortunately it's not playable for the huge majority of people that have bought it.

[nocturna 10]

I'm afraid the problem is with the coding of the game.

Irrespective of all and any troubleshooting conundrums we all try it's all boiling down to a simple common problem.

The problem is the game was released with extremely poor performance

even with the latest quad cores and high end graphics cards.

A few simple test runs with different cpus and cards would have shown this to BI.

They released the game anyway - without having a demo to try beforehand.

I brought the game and it was a mistake - with the previous track record of BI releasing extremely poor performing games i'm amazed that people spend countless hours trying to fix a turd.

The choice to use all sorts of extremely strange and bizarre coding methods for false AA / menu sizes / piss blur filtering etc. has resulted in a mismash of problems and performance issues.

BI should have used tried and trusted rendering methods,they should have

released WIP demos to enable an excellent community resource base to help them with problems blah blah blah.

I've given my money in spite of all the above problems - it's really a shame

Bi don't appear to be very forthcoming in addressing the issues.

Perhaps if they released mission packs and sub campaigns etc. that they can now optimise for more fluid gameplay the community would think better of them whilst waiting for performance patches.

It is a simple fact the game is excellent -unfortunately it's not playable for the huge majority of people that have bought it.

+1, i just played on a server that didnt even have grass and i had to set everything to normal/low to be able to play without slowdowns (textures only get detailed when u are 5 meters away, awesome) and even like that the FPS wasnt great, just playable, however, the graphics looked like crap. BIS could at least say if they are planning to do something about that, thats if they can do anything about it at all. This is the first game im not able to run at max settings with good FPS so dont come with "upgrade your pc" crap. Cant wait for OPF2 to come out just so BIS can see that even tho the game itself is great theres no point making a game that is unplayable.

Edited July 4, 2009 by nocturna

[cosmokev 10]

I think it is related to a driver or possibly a security update or configuration problem, not the OS itself.

That's why trying a different OS usually helps, because you're not going so drastic as to reinstall your OS but testing another OS that is freshly installed (on a seperate partition) takes away all the clutter that has built up on your current OS.

It's amazing that many people ask for help, and when I tell them to, if at all possible, try a different OS I get the response of "No, that can't be the problem"

Perhaps you could explain why if you do a fresh install of the OS that was giving the problem gives the same problem again.

For the retarded people that keep posting about temperature / overclocking/

system clutter and other such advice i suggest this;

If you've got exactly the same problems with the game when you've done a fresh install and every other game you install runs like butter - DRUM ROLL-

ITS THE GAME you thumbless monkeys.

Rant over.

And yes i'm running a ATI 4850 - simply does not run the game under XP 32.

Installed win 7 and game runs.

Same card - same hardware -exactly the same system.

Game does not run under afresh install of XP 32.

By a simple transposition of logic - on my system - its either XP 32 O/S or ATI XP 32 drivers that are the problem.

What testing did BI ACTUALLY DO on XP O/S and ATI cards?

You will find they probably did and found slug like performance on ALL CARDS AND SYSTEMS tested but released the game anyway.

There are simply too many people with similar and different systems that are all having common problems.

The only common problem is that everybodys having problems - that should give a clue as to where the problem lays.

[SWAT_BigBear 0]

Can you also tell me in a 30 player Evolution game what your Fps are BigBear? Maybe if you get a good Fps you could also tell use what computer specs you have aswell.

I will when I recieve the full version.

I'm afraid the problem is with the coding of the game.

Irrespective of all and any troubleshooting conundrums we all try it's all boiling down to a simple common problem.

The problem is the game was released with extremely poor performance

even with the latest quad cores and high end graphics cards.

A few simple test runs with different cpus and cards would have shown this to BI.

They released the game anyway - without having a demo to try beforehand.

I brought the game and it was a mistake - with the previous track record of BI releasing extremely poor performing games i'm amazed that people spend countless hours trying to fix a turd.

The choice to use all sorts of extremely strange and bizarre coding methods for false AA / menu sizes / piss blur filtering etc. has resulted in a mismash of problems and performance issues.

BI should have used tried and trusted rendering methods,they should have

released WIP demos to enable an excellent community resource base to help them with problems blah blah blah.

I've given my money in spite of all the above problems - it's really a shame

Bi don't appear to be very forthcoming in addressing the issues.

Perhaps if they released mission packs and sub campaigns etc. that they can now optimise for more fluid gameplay the community would think better of them whilst waiting for performance patches.

It is a simple fact the game is excellent -unfortunately it's not playable for the huge majority of people that have bought it.

I'm only at the Demo level, playing on DWardens in game server atm, with a 192+ ping. My cpu's are not quad, they are 2x2. I'm watching a average of 32fps, it drops to 25 occasionally, yet it is very playable.

So lets start over, what may be causing others to have issues?

AV?

OS?

Faulty hardware?

Spyware?

Malware?

This list could go on and on, that is why we ask for specific info.

[Jackdaniels 10]

cosmokev - I cannot wait to see a reply to your posts. Someone will really have to come up with something good to make you look foolish. Maybe they will use the cheap tactic and accuse you of whining/nagging lol. I just hope nobody considers locking this thread just yet.

Edited July 4, 2009 by Jackdaniels