Hold fire

[zwobot 17]

In the editor if you order your squad to cease fire (3-2 in the menu) they automatically start firing at a certain distance to enemies althogh they are in hold fire mode and have no targets assigned via command menu.

No, they open fire because the enemy spotted them first.

Check boecko's test missions on the first page of this thread.

Mh okay. But nevertheless it is impossible to make them seize fire again. Deassigning targets, order to disengage, change behaviour, order hold fire nothing helps.

[armored_sheep 56]

I played all three boecko's test missions reported above. The only bug that I see is that in mission 2 and 3 the teammate AI is not in HOLD FIRE mode. There is no sign of hold fire on my command bar at those missions.

As GREEN mode is described in documentation as "Hold fire - defend only" I assume the proper setting should be "BLUE" mode or use same Waypoint combat mode called NEVER FIRE that was set for OPFOR soldier.

[Blanco 0]

Hmmm, actually they are in green mode.

The unit has "this setcombatmode "GREEN" in his init and I can see the hold fire sign in command bar in all three missions...

Edit : so it only works when the combatmode is set via the waypoint settings?

[Chris Death 0]

Wasn't 'GREEN' in ofp: hold fire + engage at will?

And like Armoured_Sheep said: "BLUE" = hold fire

Though as far as i remember in ofp 'hold fire + eng at will'

didn't do lot of more than hold fire but i don't wanna nail

that down since i haven't had to much experience with

"GREEN" combatmode.

What i like though is one thing:

One comes and says: something from ArmA is not same like in ofp anymore - well that's a point yeah...

...but - funny is that as soon as someone does this, others

show up and start saying it's a B U G

it must be fixed.

I mean - it could be a feature aswell who knew - from first

reading i could see some sense in units opening fire against

their orders due to panic because of enemies in the near.

However - the solution in this case here seems to be to

only use the correct combatmode to let the ai act how

they should.

~S~ CD

[boecko 0]

Wasn't 'GREEN' in ofp: hold fire + engage at will?

And like Armoured_Sheep said: "BLUE" = hold fire

RTFM

http://community.bistudio.com/wiki/setCombatMode

The point is ... you can't set combat mode "BLUE" via the command interface.

Regards

[INNOCENT&CLUELESS 0]

lol do I need to go with my AI back to military drill to teach them what "hold fire" means? I do not care if they are in combat or careless, "hold fire" means "hold fire". Maybe another option settable I would accept like "return fire if attacked".

What we see here is again a design bug.

[NeMeSiS 11]

What we see here is again a design bug.

IMO 'hold fire' meaning 'hold fire unless being fired upon' makes more sense then 'hold fire even when shot at'.

For that last option there is the 'never fire' option, but IIRC its only accessible from the mission editor.

[INNOCENT&CLUELESS 0]

Maybe it is like that? I will read the exact meaning of those settings in the extensive documentation set provided and approved by BI. I am a "pöser Pursche".

If some settings / setting combinations are only accessible via editor, the best workaround would be to script the access into the action menu? Maybe in conjunction with my favorite: The settable distance between the units in formation? It still makes me crazy that you can still wipe out AI lead infantry squads with 1 - 2 hand grenades because they sit so close together.

[Armalite666 0]

I noticed this issue with the aux mission where you have to blow the two Urals.

I leave one sniper on the hill taking cover behind the downed Blackhawk. He stays on hold fire no problem.

I take the Saboteur with me. I select engage/hold fire and get the stop sign across the squad member. he opened fire on two guards, i tested this a number of times, the guards did NOT see him.

Anyway after some playing around it seems every time someone calls a target you have to order him to hold fire again. If you keep him moving while you do this he doesn't get chance. He will also stop firing if you tell him to hold fire and then halt. He'll happily sit there minding his own business for hours then.

Do what I did the first time if a colleague opens fire deliberately disobeying orders. Shoot him in the head!

[INNOCENT&CLUELESS 0]

If someone remembers the KICTI from LaKing for OFP, there you could almost control everything over 2 layers down the CoC. His GUI was not perfect, but at that time you could set for almost every AI unit all behavior which was accessible via editor PLUS the distance between the units in formation. So I suggest to recycle LaKings scripts, making a new GUI (less strange colors :-) and maybe new callsigns and CoC reflected in GUI layout) and we would be already in Game4 !

[Col.Flanders 0]

I've noticed this too but with AT soldiers. I give the 'hold fire' command...move him into position...and then he simply engages the armour on his own. You'll notice that the units with 'hold fire' issued to them have a sort of no-smoking icon over the unit icon. At some random point this icon dissappears and he goes John Rambo on the situation. In the demo it worked properly...why not now?

Another thing I wish they'd fix in a hurry, is the AT-using-up-all-his-valuable-AT-rounds-on-one-infantryman bug.

Do not use those #$%&^ing rounds, soldier! You will die before you use all my AT ammunition on one rifleman running away into the treeline at 200m! Do you understand, son!??!

[Second 0]

You'll notice that the units with 'hold fire' issued to them have a sort of no-smoking icon over the unit icon. At some random point this icon dissappears and he goes John Rambo on the situation. In the demo it worked properly...why not now?

That is strange... It seems that some individual guy just decides that he doesn't want to hold his fire, no matter how many times he's been ordered to hold fire (usually at that time i organize temporary execution squad and no last wishes granted). Is this some new feature not finished yet? like: you-never-can-know-who-is-the-loose-gun-of-your-group.

[Col.Flanders 0]

Is this some new feature not finished yet? like: you-never-can-know-who-is-the-loose-gun-of-your-group.

1-"2, move to Ec36! 2, hold fire!"

2-"2, roger."

*badda-da-da!* *badda-da-da!*

3-"11 o'clock, LOOSE CANNON, 100m!"

*bang!*

1-"*cough* oh no. two is down."

3-"RRRRRRROGER!"

[Possessed 0]

This is just one of the thousand bugs which destroy the whole SP experience. Bugs, friendly AI stupidness and enemy AI wallhacking/aimbotting are the main things to fear, not the enemy itself. It just make me mad when I micromanage a perfect attack and the AI and bugs ruin everything. And of course this happens 10 minutes after the save point.

[GreyKnight 0]

I think that you missuse ENGAGE and TARGET commands.

In hold fire mode AI should fire only when you order him ENGAGE (SpaceBar+Left mouse button which will also release him from formation) or FIRE comand (via comand menu).

If you just order TARGET (from comanding menu, StaceBar+RMB will work on 1.06), AI will respond READY and waiting for FIRE command (check Squad training mission).

Not sure what you're saying here. Are you saying that the hold fire bug doesn't exist and that hold fire works correctly? If so I can assure you it doesn't... In both campaign missions and multiplayer with AI team mates the hold fire command fails reguarly, your men just start shooting even though seconds before they had the red "hold fire" icons above their team icons which just vanish for no reason.

Sorry if I misunderstood you though.

[Clavicula_nox4817 0]

Is this some new feature not finished yet? like: you-never-can-know-who-is-the-loose-gun-of-your-group.

1-"2, move to Ec36! 2, hold fire!"

2-"2, roger."

*badda-da-da!* *badda-da-da!*

3-"11 o'clock, LOOSE CANNON, 100m!"

*bang!*

1-"*cough* oh no. two is down."

3-"RRRRRRROGER!"  

That probably made me laugh much more than it should have.

[froggyluv 2130]

The settable distance between the units in formation? It still makes me crazy that you can still wipe out AI lead infantry squads with 1 - 2 hand grenades because they sit so close together.

Definitely agree here. I thought for sure they would put this in having that CoC did it so long ago. I would have also liked a 'stay tight' and 'loose' formation command that could apply to all formations.

[Chris Death 0]

The settable distance between the units in formation? It still makes me crazy that you can still wipe out AI lead infantry squads with 1 - 2 hand grenades because they sit so close together.

Definitely agree here. I thought for sure they would put this in having that CoC did it so long ago. I would have also liked a 'stay tight' and 'loose' formation command that could apply to all formations.

hmm - that's not that true

Since you can put now bigger groups than of only 12 men

you can make them so large that even 30 grenades won't

take out the whole squad now.

~S~ CD

[INNOCENT&CLUELESS 0]

Arrg, right, it was true only for 12, I rephrase, I can kill 5-12 soldiers with one grenade.

Anybody also tried KICTI? I had 2 test sessions with LaKing when he tested before release, with Autotanks, we had several hundred AI on map without problems already in OFP!!.

You just have to avoid to meet all of them at the same time :-) both to survive and avoid laag.

I used there the distance feature extensively, for tanks to avoid tank-sex and dead-locks at bridges, and for infantry to screen large areas with just 11 men, for copters which always crashed together if in same squad.

[Stugwi 0]

Controlling AI is like herding a flock of sheep, remember One man and his Dog? (Sheepdog trail TV show). Mostly the sheep were obidiant but now and then a rebel sheep would break from the pack and cause all sorts of bother

So please Bohemia give me a nice Border Collie, a flat cap, tweed camo and a whistle. While your at it give us commands like "Short whistle, 2 whistle, Come By..." and a piece of hay to chew or pipe to smoke

The most annoying bug for me is when i have just individualy placed most of my team for an assualt or ambush. Everything is set up how i want. I then i decide to move 1 team8 to another position and the commands comes out as: Team move to ........

[boecko 0]

I'v made another example, which illustrates the problem more clearly.

See:

http://bugs.armed-assault.net/view.php?id=2218#bugnotes

and

http://bugs.armed-assault.net/file_do....ype=bug

[legolasindar 3]

In my opinion this is not a logician. The Hold Fire is an order given by a Superior, this order not this one holds neither to personal opinions of the soldier nor to variables, is an order to never shoot until the opposite is said. Therefore they should not shoot they have detected them or not.

We should not need to put a few lines of commands in the editor for every soldier in order that in the missions the soldiers fulfill his(her,your) orders.

It is my humble opinion.