The Iraq Thread 2

[The Frenchman 0]

And this too.

[Gollum1 0]

Hoboman, all your attacks against France etc. are disproved by 5 seconds of Googling. And what´s this WE (even putting emphasis on it)? You aren´t even remotely old or mature enough to join the armed forces, be in Iraq and "OWN" the country. Get your facts straight and don´t reinforce stereotypes of war-supporters by making a fool of yourself. The truth will probably shock you.

[EiZei 0]

hoboman has a very picky memory it seems.

[quicksand 0]

OK so has the US gone mad?

american tactics

"As the guerrilla war against Iraqi insurgents intensifies, American soldiers have begun wrapping entire villages in barbed wire."

they are humilating iraquis,making them live in their prison  

"With a heavy dose of fear and violence, and a lot of money for projects, I think we can convince these people that

we are here to help them," Colonel Sassaman said."

it`s clear for me..americans are simply crazy   ..how could they possibly imagine that by fear and violence they could convince a nation that they are trying to help

and this is my favourite..

Quote[/b] ]"You have to understand the Arab mind," Capt. Todd Brown, a company commander with the Fourth Infantry Division, said as he stood outside the gates of Abu Hishma. "The only thing they understand is force

So they invade Iraq,kill countless civilians,bring chaos to an entire country that was a threat to noone only to reach the same conclusion Saddam reached 20 years ago..Oh the irony...

[theavonlady 2]

OK so has the US gone mad?

american tactics

What are your counter-suggestions?

Or do you simply think that the US should pack up and leave Iraq in the mess that it's in right now?

[walker 0]

Drat error post sorry

[walker 0]

OK so has the US gone mad?

american tactics

What are your counter-suggestions?

Or do you simply think that the US should pack up and leave Iraq in the mess that it's in right now?

Hi Avon

I made some counter suggestions a few pages back. Just a sec I will get the quote

Quote[/b] ]Hi all

Nice to see that people are finaly taking the Iraq situation seriously instead of living in "We have the Technology!" Cuckoo land.

Occupying a foriegn country requires people on the ground. Infantry. Lots of it. Enough to crush any attempt at rebelion before it starts. The US needs at least 4 times as many troops as now and they need to have a liberal number of mature reservists from the first responder units such as the fire, police, and ambulance services. They may need to consider a Draft of policemen to fill it out.

All the troops going in need to have Arabic in particular local Iraqi dialects as part of their Basic Training. Best to use deep imersion (only alowed to speak Arabic for the whole of their basic training)

They also need a thourough understanding of Iraqi culture and history.

With these skills they will be able to do the job quicker.

For the transition to an Iraqi army they could do worse than use a few more kurds it will bring them more into the southern politics which is needed anyway. Forcing a mix of Kurds Shiites and the minority Sunnis would also allow better integration of the three cultures. You could also mix in a right to a free college education as part of the Iraqi volunteer profesional army benefits. This would help use more of the educated classes in teaching; Iraq was in the past famous for its education. This could be used to restart it.

The whole idea is to get the country back in motion. industrialy Iraq was once the most active countries in the Middle East. We need to get it back there and to push it beyond that level.

Kind Regards Walker

[theavonlady 2]

OK so has the US gone mad?

american tactics

What are your counter-suggestions?

Or do you simply think that the US should pack up and leave Iraq in the mess that it's in right now?

Hi Avon

I made some counter suggestions a few pages back. Just a sec I will get the quote

Quote[/b] ]Hi all

Nice to see that people are finaly taking the Iraq situation seriously instead of living in "We have the Technology!" Cuckoo land.

Occupying a foriegn country requires people on the ground. Infantry. Lots of it. Enough to crush any attempt at rebelion before it starts. The US needs at least 4 times as many troops as now and they need to have a liberal number of mature reservists from the first responder units such as the fire, police, and ambulance services. They may need to consider a Draft of policemen to fill it out.

All the troops going in need to have Arabic in particular local Iraqi dialects as part of their Basic Training. Best to use deep imersion (only alowed to speak Arabic for the whole of their basic training)

They also need a thourough understanding of Iraqi culture and history.

With these skills they will be able to do the job quicker.

For the transition to an Iraqi army they could do worse than use a few more kurds it will bring them more into the southern politics which is needed anyway. Forcing a mix of Kurds Shiites and the minority Sunnis would also allow better integration of the three cultures. You could also mix in a right to a free college education as part of the Iraqi volunteer profesional army benefits. This would help use more of the educated classes in teaching; Iraq was in the past famous for its education. This could be used to restart it.

The whole idea is to get the country back in motion. industrialy Iraq was once the most active country in the Middle East. We need to get it back there and to push it beyond that level.

Kind Regards Walker

Yes, I read those. Very good suggestions. But even if TBA agreed to implement them today, there's still the need to deal with the current situation in the interim.

[Acecombat 0]

Quote[/b] ]"You have to understand the Arab mind," Capt. Todd Brown, a company commander with the Fourth Infantry Division, said as he stood outside the gates of Abu Hishma. "The only thing they understand is force

Whos talking ?

Elmo from Sesame street is explaining how a nuclear reactor is assembled?

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Quote[/b] ]France sold iraq weapons in the 80's but those haven't poped yet.

LOL are you saying France sold Iraq Nukes or chemical weapons?

we've done some nasty businesses with iraq in its good period ....

we may not have sold complete or real weapons , but we've sold components and materials which could be used to make those .... just like most western countries did back then ....

The only reason why you didnt sell them more is because the Iraqis didnt want it. They are smart people and know how to value GOOD QUALITY! That is why they bought so much illegal staff MADE IN GERMANY  

Quote[/b] ]I would first like to say I'm not try to offend anyone and I am a proud american patriot.

Aehm, Hoboman, I am not trying to offend you either but that is a pleonasm. Say you are proud to be american or an american patriot but a proud american patriot?....Have seen that before on several times on the NRA forum !!!   Just kiddin...

They knows my ugly cynism! Not meant to be evil or agressive  

[Acecombat 0]

Quote[/b] ]France sold iraq weapons in the 80's but those haven't poped yet.

LOL are you saying France sold Iraq Nukes or chemical weapons?

we've done some nasty businesses with iraq in its good period ....

we may not have sold complete or real weapons , but we've sold components and materials which could be used to make those .... just like most western countries did back then ....

The only reason why you didnt sell them more is because the Iraqis didnt want it. They are smart people and know how to value GOOD QUALITY! That is why they bought so much illegal staff MADE IN GERMANY  

I can see why a joint EU army just isnt possible now

[theavonlady 2]

France sold iraq weapons in the 80's but those haven't poped yet.

LOL are you saying France sold Iraq Nukes or chemical weapons?

What's so funny?

It was the French that assisted in building the Osirak nuclear facility near Baghdad in the 70's.

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

The americans should be happy that it was France who supplied the illegal weapons. Probably that is the only reason why so few americans got killed, none of those PRODUIT EN FRANCE turned out to be working.

I mean how are workers supposed to build complicated weapons if they are allowed to drink WINE in the lunch break. Before the break maybe but after... I wouldnt like to be pilot in the new eurofighter if I knew the wings and the jet-turbine were made in France  ...  

and probably installed after the lunch break!  

[denoir 0]

France sold iraq weapons in the 80's but those haven't poped yet.

LOL are you saying France sold Iraq Nukes or chemical weapons?

What's so funny?

It was the French that assisted in building the Osirak nuclear facility near Baghdad in the 70's.

Yes and USA gave them technology for chemical and biological weapons. And everybody was smiling and friendly to Saddam after he used chemical weapons against the Kurds.

Kind of silly to do the blame game when everybody supplied Saddam back then.

[theavonlady 2]

Kind of silly to do the blame game when everybody supplied Saddam back then.

I personally am fully aware of the US and European contributions to Sadam's powers. I was pointing out what may have been a particular unawareness on Tovarish's part.

[bn880 5]

The americans should be happy that it was France who supplied the illegal weapons. Probably that is the only reason why so few americans got killed, none of those PRODUIT EN FRANCE turned out to be working.

I mean how are workers supposed to build complicated weapons if they are allowed to drink WINE in the lunch break. Before the break maybe but after... I wouldnt like to be pilot in the new eurofighter if I knew the wings and the jet-turbine were made in France ...

and probably installed after the lunch break!

You know Albert, there is an equal and opposide statement to be made against Germany, so I'd watch your step.

Schneller! Schneller!!!

[theavonlady 2]

I wouldnt like to be pilot in the new eurofighter if I knew the wings and the jet-turbine were made in France  ...

But what if the flight training films are made in Germany?

[HOBOMAN 0]

I am not blaming france for the deaths of US soldiers, but I blame them for mishandling their weapons.

[HOBOMAN 0]

Nor are my opinions efected by the media, I have first hand accounts of iraq

[Tamme 0]

I am not blaming france for the deaths of US soldiers, but I blame them for mishandling their weapons.

Oh c'mon! Everyone sold Iraq weapons. Why don't you blame Finland for building bunkers in Iraq?

[theavonlady 2]

Why don't you blame Finland for building bunkers in Iraq?

Wasn't that offset by Iraq's slow deployment problems caused by Finnish snowshoes?

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

yes.. good old finish bunkers

[bn880 5]

I am not blaming france for the deaths of US soldiers, but I blame them for mishandling their weapons.

Then you can probably blame USA as well right. I mean, watch the cartoon, and after all Saddam was a western ally... so.

[Gollum1 0]

I am not blaming france for the deaths of US soldiers, but I blame them for mishandling their weapons.

Oh c'mon! Everyone sold Iraq weapons. Why don't you blame Finland for building bunkers in Iraq?

Finland probably wasn´t as involved as France...but I think the real question is, Hoboman, why don´t you blame your own country for mishandling your weapons and being all nice to Saddam AFTER he gassed all those people?

Donnie Rumsfeld and Saddam being all chummy during the Iran-Iraq war.

Surely the U.S supported Saddam more, or at the very least as much as France.

edit: bn880 beat me to it.

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Ok, back in loops! We can chew the discussion about the past over and over again, but it doesnt make this thread more interesting. I could just post ... please read page 21.....please refer back to post 29939441.

Sad enough that many of TBA only know to defend their present actions by hitting on past actions of other nations. There is time enough to discuss both..but seriously I get bored cause I think we already digested the PAST chapter, didt we!