PitViper 0 Posted June 13, 2003 Quote[/b] ]I will just use it when i'm particurly annoyed and bigoted then. well.. at least you're honest Quote[/b] ]Also you don't need two verbs in that sentence, desist sounds better so cease is superfluous. It's like saying "Would you kindly stop and stop what you are doing sir".It sounds silly and as my Dad used to say it (i nagged him until he stopped) i assume it's an Americanism It's a legal term. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted June 13, 2003 Anyhow, EU draft constitution agreed. It would seem that the last-minute objections from the UK (and threat of veto) has been resolved. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NurEinMensch 0 Posted June 13, 2003 A great day for Europe I think. While it's still far from perfect its the best that was possible in our days. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IsthatyouJohnWayne 0 Posted June 13, 2003 Quote[/b] ]I believe that "yank" is an insensitive and bigoted slur for an American. Please cease and desist in using that term. Thank you Damned bleeding heart liberals! Browsing through the constitution it reads a lot like what it is: a series of compromises debated paragraph for paragraph by a commitee. Not exactly blood stirring but that doesn't matter as long as it will actually serve the purpose of bringing europe closer together rather than simply illuminating lines of division. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Crazysheep 1 Posted June 14, 2003 Quote[/b] ]Well, I`ve got some distant family members (somehow connected to my dead grandmother) in Canada. That sure explains a lot, too. A lot of my family moved to Canada to live together in a huge mansion, but most of them were brutally slaughtered by their Butler so the survivors moved back to England. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
killagee 0 Posted June 14, 2003 A lot of my family moved to Canada to live together in a huge mansion, but most of them were brutally slaughtered by their Butler so the survivors moved back to England. Woah Dude! thats heavy! Why the funny face? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Crazysheep 1 Posted June 14, 2003 A lot of my family moved to Canada to live together in a huge mansion, but most of them were brutally slaughtered by their Butler so the survivors moved back to England. Woah Dude! thats heavy! Why the funny face? Not really that heavy. It was over a century before I was born, so...... I put a funny face in? It was meant to be I guess my finger slipped. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NurEinMensch 0 Posted June 14, 2003 More good news! Welcome, Czech Republic! Hey BIS guys, welcome in the club! Czechs Embrace EU Membership Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted June 15, 2003 Example of the benefits of European cooperation Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IsthatyouJohnWayne 0 Posted June 15, 2003 Yes it is a good example of the benefits of European cooperation but its at least as much as example of the benefits for european companies of American rivals hitting harder times (the american airline industry post sept.11 anyone?) . Not wishing to throw manure on the parade of course.. hooraay EU Glad to hear the Czechs are in, i dont think they'll stand for too much being dictated to. And many of the eastern countries are more atlanticist in outlook (counter to franco-german view). A little reassuring. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted June 16, 2003 And many of the eastern countries are more atlanticist in outlook (counter to franco-german view). A little reassuring. Only their governments. The people are not. For example the popular opposition against the Iraq war was the greatest in eastern Europe. Quote[/b] ] i dont think they'll stand for too much being dictated to. On the contrary, it's just that they'll be dictated to from Europe and not USA. Their economies are still too weak to make them a significant player. That will of course change over time, but until then they'll just have to attach themselves to the strongest side available. Edit: On the other hand one can wonder about how good idea the EU is when you see what idiot politicans Italy always manages to spawn. Their politicains make George W. Bush look like the reincarnation of John F. Kennedy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallenPaladin 0 Posted June 16, 2003 Edit: On the other hand one can wonder about how good idea the EU is when you see what idiot politicans Italy always manages to spawn. Their politicains make George W. Bush look like the reincarnation of John F. Kennedy. Geez... I hope none of our Bush-friends reads that and takes the reincarnation theory for granted!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HotShot 0 Posted June 16, 2003 Quote[/b] ]The row comes days after figures showed a large drop in the number of immigrants reaching Italy this year. LOL. Think the army used the guns before the Politicain said go? Oh and look at the poll! Neck and neck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedyDonkey 0 Posted June 16, 2003 Quote[/b] ]Oh and look at the poll! Neck and neck. Not anymore! 50,53 for the correct answer Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NurEinMensch 0 Posted June 16, 2003 OMG W3 R TeH L0S3!!! H4X!!!! Sorry about that outbreak. I think while this poll is far from being representative it shows the trend. We are at this moment not ready for a closer and more "federalized" EU. Yet. I think in ten years the same poll may show a clearly different result. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HotShot 0 Posted June 17, 2003 Quote[/b] ]Oh and look at the poll! Neck and neck. Not anymore! 50,53 for the correct answer  Looks like the <s>Mainland European bitches</s> pro EU fed guys are loosing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IsthatyouJohnWayne 0 Posted June 19, 2003 *rant mode enabled* Denoir- Quote[/b] ]Only their governments. The people are not. For example the popular opposition against the Iraq war was the greatest in eastern Europe. So i have heard but in the short term (that i am concerned about here) it doesnt matter. If the ruling strata see engagement with America as broadly positive then im sure they will do everything they can to sell it to (or disguise it from) their people. And you mention Italy... thats kind of what i have been talking about. For the European Union to work it is important to have at least a vague idea of our shared ideals, and yet in Italy theres a billionaire leader on trial trying to change the law just to cover his own arse, aggressively taking over the media (compared to which the BBC seems clean as snow) in a coalition with former neo-nazis. In Britain we have just gone to war despite most of the rest of europe being opposed (and half of this country) , in Belgium theyll soon be bringing charges against Satan and his demon armies for crimes against niceness. Some people in europe seem to view the whole point of the EU as providing a military and economic counter weight to the US and to become a new world superpower, others want it more simply to be a trade bloc and perhaps a way of making their countries more prosperous blah blah... There are lots of problems and every country has a different solution. It is quite frequently said by Scandinavians on this forum that we in west (often America) do not have the right to dictate to others what is the 'right' way of living. We cannot tell people how to live. And yet that seems at the moment to constitute a significant part of what the EU actually does. Legislating on how people should live (or at least on most aspects of life). Perhaps its just a necessary phase but it doesnt feel very necessary here. I am not inspired by the EU at the moment. I should be and i want to be but im not. What inspirational or visionary figures are there? Its not working yet in Britain, its pissing people off. We dont feel included i think. The EU is not 'us' but rather its 'them' . I wonder if/when that will change. So the EU cannot be a federation (a feared idea in the UK) until we decide precisely what it is that joins all of us (or if there is such a thing) or else its doomed to failure. What is the core EU ideology? (and how many could agree on it?) Perhaps we need a war Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Frenchman 0 Posted June 19, 2003 *Perhaps we need a war  Sure. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pukko 0 Posted June 19, 2003 Some people in europe seem to view the whole point of the EU as providing a military and economic counter weight to the US and to become a new world superpower, others want it more simply to be a trade bloc and perhaps a way of making their countries more prosperous blah blah...There are lots of problems and every country has a different solution. It is quite frequently said by Scandinavians on this forum that we in west (often America) do not have the right to dictate to others what is the 'right' way of living. We cannot tell people how to live. And yet that seems at the moment to constitute a significant part of what the EU actually does. Legislating on how people should live (or at least on most aspects of life). Perhaps its just a necessary phase but it doesnt feel very necessary here. I am not inspired by the EU at the moment. I should be and i want to be but im not. What inspirational or visionary figures are there? Its not working yet in Britain, its pissing people off. We dont feel included i think. The EU is not 'us' but rather its 'them' . I wonder if/when that will change. So the EU cannot be a federation (a feared idea in the UK) until we decide precisely what it is that joins all of us (or if there is such a thing) or else its doomed to failure. What is the core EU ideology? (and how many could agree on it?) Perhaps we need a war  As I wrote some pages ago, I'm most worried about how and of what and European identity is developed. The kind of strongly uniting identities are always made up of quite few 'components', I dare say after reading some behavioral science. Concrete 'categorisations' of one self; most often in a binary contrast to 'what others are'... Ah, i'm not gonna try to rant about such shitty stuff in any larger extent here, but put it like this: I believe that if Europe is not united by a cheap, ingroup/outgroup, identity; I then think that the EU could become a positive force in the world. Both for our selves and for others, in the long and maybe also very long term. To put it real easy and silly: If EU is built, and united, around "peace, love and understanding" stuff , I'm all for it. And I have, no, matter how stupid and naive it might sound, quite some belief in that it has clear potential to do so. One academic reason I could give for it, is for example the quickly growing 'postsructuralist' and 'postmodern' perspectives in all scientific traditions... If the EU should become united in a cheap way I'm sure it will not last very long, probably just follow the path of other superpowers in history. That would not be very positive in it self, in my opinion. But I strongly believes that even that will be for better in the long run, because of the very likely and present (in my eyes) 'downfall' of the USA . I know that you hold cross-atlatic realtions dear. But I really fear what could happen if no balancing power appears when the superduperpower USA  really starts to desperately fight for its survival. I cant but think that the present Bush administration's actions is but a pale start of whats gonna happen otherwise. Militarily because it probably starts to desperately hit hard and fast against everything and everyone it (USA) thinks can save it. Economically because almost the entire world, to big parts, depends on the USA today; there would be a global real deep depression in that powervacuum. Maybe the superpower USA does not follow the path of every other 'empire' in history, or at least not now. But I'm willing to risk my life in making sure that there is something (EU) still standing up in case USA is on its downfall. Call it a 'preempive survival constrution' ( ) if you want; at least something that can bear a crucial, at least in the present day global society (Eurocentric indeed ), role in a quickly developing post-US world - if it happens... So even if I believe that the EU have clear potential to become a positive force in it self, I think it is crucial - in any form - in case............ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PitViper 0 Posted June 22, 2003 http://www.dailytelegraph.co.uk/money....ty.html corruption and financial fraud in the EU? it can't be! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
McHale 0 Posted June 22, 2003 Centralised power = bad. Democracy is watered down enough today. Imagine what it'd be like if there was only one government in the whole EU? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NurEinMensch 0 Posted June 22, 2003 Federalizm != Centralizm (is that even a word???) I agree only one government is bad. That's why there are local/regional/national governments already. But what we urgently need in Europe is a common foreign and security policy for Europe. If every european country is just doing its own thing we will be screwed by more powerfull "global players" over and over. The people in Europe deserve better. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Necromancer- 0 Posted June 23, 2003 *Perhaps we need a war  Sure.   a war fought with sticks and stones?? how lovely. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Die Alive 0 Posted June 25, 2003 No more sexy bitches in EU media? Advertisements that affront "human dignity" by demeaning women would be prohibited under proposals being drafted by the European Commission. Television programmes would also be censored to ensure there was no promotion of gender stereotypes. The plans, still in their infancy, are already provoking bitter dispute in Brussels and were described by one commission official yesterday as "lunatic". Tabloid newspaper "Page Three" pictures would also be threatened. Most forms of gender discrimination - either for or against women - would become illegal, affecting welfare benefits, education and health insurance. But plans to ban London gentlemen's clubs have been abandoned as a step too far. Click here for a preview of future Page 3 girls -=Die Alive=- Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PitViper 0 Posted June 25, 2003 heh.. tip of the iceberg there Die Alive. The bureaucracy heavy EU will have all kinds of special interest groups dictating this kind of stuff. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
