Ai thread

[maturin 12]

I'm talking about both the skill level adjustment bar ALONG with the A2profile config tweak. I continually see BLUFOR AI set to 1.0 in Config....with enemy AI set to .5 (in both skill and accurcy)....and I see enemy win lots of these battles.

Friendly AI accuracy is awful - It should be tweaked up as should their reaction times to enemies within 100 yards -

It's not awful. It's exactly the same as enemy AI accuracy.

That you've seen the enemy 'win fights' in meaningless. I can't think of a more unscientific test.

In my experience, the accuracy and experience advantage of friendly units in my game is decisive.

You have to play as a chicken or other animal to get a truly objective result when testing the balance of scenarios.

[NeMeSiS 11]

I'm talking about both the skill level adjustment bar ALONG with the A2profile config tweak. I continually see BLUFOR AI set to 1.0 in Config....with enemy AI set to .5 (in both skill and accurcy)....and I see enemy win lots of these battles.

Friendly AI accuracy is awful - It should be tweaked up as should their reaction times to enemies within 100 yards -

Maybe its because you are leading the team, and you do not spam 50 orders per second like AI leaders do. The AI is exactly the same for all sides.

[meade95 0]

It's not awful. It's exactly the same as enemy AI accuracy.

That you've seen the enemy 'win fights' in meaningless. I can't think of a more unscientific test.

In my experience, the accuracy and experience advantage of friendly units in my game is decisive.

You have to play as a chicken or other animal to get a truly objective result when testing the balance of scenarios.

It is awful (especially so if there is any difference in elevations). I have repeatedly watched a AI team member fire clip after clip on a target - Only to then target the "enemy" he is shooting at and hit it within 2 shots. This typically happens when there are elevations differences between friendly and enemy targeted.

I don't know any other word to describe that level of inaccurate shooting ...than awful.

[lugiahua 26]

I always feel that AI machine gunners fire way too fast, that they were always fire in full-auto instead short burst as real world.

[MoS 0]

I started playing OFP again yesterday and had to realize a shocking truth... the AI has not made any steps forward since OFP!

I´m serious. I can´t name a single category of AI behaviour which has improved since OFP. I remember all those posts were people ranted about how the "stupid" AI lay down in the middle of the street in OFP and ArmA I. This hasn´t change to this very day. Another big issue was the reaction time when standing directly next to an enemy. He would take a few seconds (which is very long when someone stands in front of you with a gun in your face) to aquire the target and start shooting... well guess what? This hasn´t change either.

I really don´t know how I could miss that out. Guess I slowly accustomed and never thought back on how things were back in the old days.

I write this cause I fear that we will see another graphical update in ArmA III with next to no improvements in key areas that needed an overhaul since Armed Assault like the AI.

[ProfTournesol 956]

I started playing OFP again yesterday and had to realize a shocking truth... the AI has not made any steps forward since OFP!

I´m serious. I can´t name a single category of AI behaviour which has improved since OFP. I remember all those posts were people ranted about how the "stupid" AI lay down in the middle of the street in OFP and ArmA I. This hasn´t change to this very day. Another big issue was the reaction time when standing directly next to an enemy. He would take a few seconds (which is very long when someone stands in front of you with a gun in your face) to aquire the target and start shooting... well guess what? This hasn´t change either.

I really don´t know how I could miss that out. Guess I slowly accustomed and never thought back on how things were back in the old days.

I write this cause I fear that we will see another graphical update in ArmA III with next to no improvements in key areas that needed an overhaul since Armed Assault like the AI.

Well i play both games on a very regular basis, and i must say that AI has made some great progress recently, mainly using cover much better.

[maturin 12]

I started playing OFP again yesterday and had to realize a shocking truth... the AI has not made any steps forward since OFP!

I´m serious. I can´t name a single category of AI behaviour which has improved since OFP. I remember all those posts were people ranted about how the "stupid" AI lay down in the middle of the street in OFP and ArmA I. This hasn´t change to this very day. Another big issue was the reaction time when standing directly next to an enemy. He would take a few seconds (which is very long when someone stands in front of you with a gun in your face) to aquire the target and start shooting... well guess what? This hasn´t change either.

I really don´t know how I could miss that out. Guess I slowly accustomed and never thought back on how things were back in the old days.

I write this cause I fear that we will see another graphical update in ArmA III with next to no improvements in key areas that needed an overhaul since Armed Assault like the AI.

Good job naming two problem areas.

Can someone rename this the AI Hyperbole thread?

[-Paladin- 10]

The AI did progress from OFP times I must admit slowly and maybe not so beautiful like every one of us wishes.But there is progress. :-)

Makes me happy to see that the AI get some love.

For the AI now in arma2 OA I would wish that normal AI units bound forward like Soldier's do in the real world.

Not the Arma ridiculous dance bound, stand up walk 10 meters stop and this for every solider himself while standing up and drooping on the ground. :-(

As far as I a know bounding in US/UK forces is done by 4 men at once.

So having a British 8 man section means to have two 4 man teams that can bound.

The US teams have 9 man so one 5 and one 4 men team, so that the AI don't get confused the we could color the teams in green and red in the editor and the coders at BIS "Teach" the AI if you have one red and green team bound in color strength and not one by one.The Yellow color could be no bound for rag tag militia or unexperienced enemy's.

Also the Bound reach should be set up to 100 up 200 meters or to the next object that lies between Op for and own team.

It would be also nice if the AI doesn't send 2 or one man away from the team to go and kill the enemy.

A fire team yes but not one man.

The same for flanking a fierteam flanks not one or two soldiers, keep it real.

[maturin 12]

Also the Bound reach should be set up to 100 up 200 meters or to the next object that lies between Op for and own team.

That would result in formations pulling apart immediately.

A fire team yes but not one man.

The same for flanking a fierteam flanks not one or two soldiers, keep it real.

Definitely.

[-Paladin- 10]

That would result in formations pulling apart immediately.

Dont understand? when you bound now in arma you have no formation at all.

[Obliteratii 10]

ya ai can be downright painful sometimes. Just had a game where i had an entire city shooting up at me on the mountain side where im 6-900m away and they all have iron sights. They are litterally walking right in front of the 6 players on the ground, and end up scoring a kill on me finally when im 100% behind cover, never exposing myself once.

Many times both ai and player icons appear through walls etc resulting in a hellva lot of free kills on both ends as well.

nothing else matters until they fix this bs. I am always going to lose the arguement with my buddies that arma is not broken and worth playing. (they are a bunch of pilots that are already turned off by armas increadible unrealistic flight controls on a supposed simulator type game).

[CarlGustaffa 4]

Well they can't see you from behind a wall, but they may get positional updates based on hearing. Those 6-900 meters away, are you sure they didn't suppress? I have only one big gripe about suppression, and that is that they will do it regardless of being able to watch those kinds of distances due to low visibilities from fog or rain. As for them shooting you, what kind of solid cover were you behind? This game simulates material penetration, something we've asked for. Hangar walls in particular - just tin foil :p But wooden fences too. Not that I'm not annoyed myself at times. Also, did the mission feature information sharing, that it was somebody else that you didn't see that got you?

What I will agree on is their ability to walk through wooden fences. Makes life hard some times...

[icebreakr 3107]

Yesterday I've been shocked to see that AI managed to find a rare tree in an open Duala terrain and took a peak around it with occasional burst toward our squad position... he kinda died when a squad of 14 players unleashed a hell on that poor tree ;)

[EasyC 10]

Honestly I'm so sick to death of AI doing goddamn 360's on the spot when your a gunner in a tank and you tell your AI driver to reverse if your on an incline or amongst bushes or trees. CHRIST..........*vein burst*

[WeltEnSTurm 10]

AI gunners for the win.

Gunner targets enemy, but aims too high and so never shoots.

Enemy is directly in front of us but is not spotted.

(Sorry for image size, this is my first post and apparently there's no img_thumb tag)

[ZeosPantera 0]

I recently did the helicopter training again in a2.. I selected troop transport.. The AI trainer runs the completely opposite direction away from the helicopter for 20 feet then around another helicopter for 100+ feet and then gets in.. He could have side-stepped me and walked 6 feet.

AI FAIL!

[Bejmo 10]

I would dearyl love the ai to stay in the blody formation i put them in. For example when i say file id like them to stay in file not wander into some file/wedge mess. Also i would love for them not to overtake me and require me to stop and wait for them to eventualy find their way back. Also also how about they orient to the player like when i say file line up behind me not to either side or as has happened in front of me LOL and when i want them in a line it would be nice to have the line to either side as it makes sneaking up to the edge of a forrest or hedgerow pointless if half of them wander into the open. Would also like them to crouch when stopped of if i say danger actualy get down which they only do %50 of the time.

Ok thats my rant thanks ;P

Why wont my unit MOVE when i tell them for the love of god. They are not engaged they are just standing there. They may as well be knitting. I say move they say knit 1 pearl 2 ARGGGHHHHH

Edited December 7, 2011 by Bejmo
Frustration ;P

[instagoat 133]

It´d be nice if the AI commanders stopped giving "attack" orders altogether. No sane commander would send his squad out to attack the enemy piecemeal. Not even stupid commanders would do that.

That´d be a great change.

[maturin 12]

Um, that would break the game. AI commanders just need to give attack order to groups of four or more.

[-Coulum- 35]

Um, that would break the game. AI commanders just need to give attack order to groups of four or more.

Not when defending. But yes making it so that leaders would issue orders to a team instead of individual soldiers would be nice. I think each group should be split up into teams and the leader only has control of the leaders of the teams. Ie a squad of nine is split into the leader, and 2 teams of four. The leader would only control the 2 team leaders. If he gave on an order to engage, that teamleader would coordinate his troops to help him complete this order. This would minimize micromanagement, would add realism, and make it possible to play as a team leader with both subordinates and superiors.

[foffy 58]

I've wondered something with ArmA I and II lately when it comes to AI. Usually in games I try to leave the settings as default, but I'm not sure if I should do that anymore. Both in ArmA and more notably ArmA II, the friendly AI, despite having better default settings than the enemy, is almost always at a disadvantage from my experience. Many times I see my teammates blown to smithereens by an enemy in clear view, or I end up dying by some absurd shot so far away that I can only that fathom launched the person that far away. I've always found it frustrating that if I take cover in grass, and it's above an enemy on a hill or something akin to that, I can clearly be blasted apart as if they believe I'm hiding with nothing covering me.

I guess this comes to my question: what would be good settings to tweak the AI? I tried friendly with 1.0 and enemy with 0.5, but I feel that perhaps my friendly allies are superhuman and the enemy is too slow. Leaving both at default values tends to leave my teammates down more than the enemy, most of the time, especially in ArmA I.

[maturin 12]

Many times I see my teammates blown to smithereens by an enemy in clear view, or I end up dying by some absurd shot so far away that I can only that fathom launched the person that far away.

This happens to the enemy as well, but you don't notice it. The friendly AI have no handicaps whatsoever, just your high expectations.

It used to be, you could have high skill AI with reduced enemy accuracy, but 1.60 broke that. The AI are useless on anything less than .90 skill, and too good at shooting at .90 precision. I recommend ASR AI.

[foffy 58]

That's an add-on, right? What of the vanilla game? What should they be scaled at in both games? Either the enemy AI is super tough and I get destroyed, or the enemy AI is easy to the point I can pick them down bit by bit. It's hard to find a fair balance. I'd assume putting enemy skills at halfway (.5) would make them "normal" without being easy or hard. :<

[nkenny 1051]

@Foffy.

Its probably a matter of perspective. Remember that Insurgent you shot at that last night mission on Chernarus? The guy who was standing up between two bushes-- he was looking at you too! Mighty good shot there. No?

His mate was probably shaking his head too.

As a leader of AI you must realize that your AI teammates take following your position quite seriously. If you are constantly on the move, your AI will attempt to keep up with you. They'll do so to the extent that they may not spot the enemy. Sometimes the best thing to do is just to go prone and let the situation develop.

-k

[foffy 58]

Hmm. I do that, but sometimes the AI seems either dumb or have the ability to be sharpshooters with crazy accuracy. What exactly do the sliders do in the ArmA games? I thought they tweaked the max values for lots of stats under the hood. But what are the key differences between 0.0, 0.5, and 1.0? From casual play, it seems to be the reaction time and visual distance the AI has before they start attacking. 0.0 seems too easy, and 1.0 makes it seem like they're too hard. I'm not looking for a super realistic mode where every enemy is the Predator here, but I'd like to hit a spot where the difficulty seems normal as a game, not a simulation.