Constructive Criticism, Rants And Locking Threads

[infiltrator_2k 29]

There's no if or buts, there's a 'lot' of disgruntled Arma players on this forum right now given the current FPS issue and who are openly airing their frustration and 'rants' on this forum. With that said, I couldn't help but notice that many threads that openly criticise BIS are being locked by mods for no other good reason other than they're either irritated or disagree with the poster's criticisms, opinions, accusations or claims; supressing the freedom of speech and expression by locking threads can be counterproductive and only serve to validate and propagate further criticism towards BIS.

Debate needs to breath and should never be stifled. Regardless of that side of the fence a person sits on, democracy and the freedom of speech should be left unabated.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

There's no if or buts, there's a 'lot' of disgruntled Arma players on this forum right now given the current FPS issue and who are openly airing their frustration and 'rants' on this forum. With that said, I couldn't help but notice that many threads that openly criticise BIS are being locked by mods for no other good reason other than they're either irritated or disagree with the poster's criticisms, opinions, accusations or claims; supressing the freedom of speech and expression by locking threads can be counterproductive and only serve to validate and propagate further criticism towards BIS.

Debate needs to breath and should never be stifled. Regardless of that side of the fence a person sits on, democracy and the freedom of speech should be left unabated.

first, inb4 locked.

Second, you wouldn't mind if you clicked the General Discussion thread, only to scroll and find that every single thread of on the first page were rants? I mean, it's ok if there are one or two threads for that, because people with the same problame can discuss whats wrong there, and BIS could look at those one or two threads, and see what can be fixed. But no, instead BIS has to search each and every single thread, which wastes time, and time is money, and money is what most of us used to buy Arma 3 in the first place, and they can't improve the game if their searching threads complaining bout bad FPS when someone spawn 300 AI on a map... No. Just no.

[Jona33 51]

§5) No Spam

We deem spam as making a thread or posting a reply that has no real worth, is irrelevant, useless and offers nothing to a discussion. Posting "any news" or "is it out yet" type posts are also spam. Messages of banned members are also considered as spam. If your post/thread is not able to illicit or sustain an in depth conversation then it's spam. This also applies to other areas of the forums such as leaving visitor messages on people's profiles. Spam may be dealt with by post count reduction, Post Restriction and/or formal warning.

Most of the threads appearing seem to fulfil the criteria of "no real worth" or "offers nothing to a discussion". Swearing at BI isn't a discussion or the basis for one. Bearing in mind each and every forum member clicked "I agree" on these rules, breaking them ought to be punished.

[jakerod 254]

I feel like they have been fair about it for the most part. There are plenty of ranting ones still open. I really have no problem of sifting through them.

[...] and money is what most of us used to buy Arma 3 [...]

I like to think you traded some guy on the street a family of gophers for your copy... mostly because I find it humorous.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

I feel like they have been fair about it for the most part. There are plenty of ranting ones still open. I really have no problem of sifting through them.

I like to think you traded some guy on the street a family of gophers for your copy... mostly because I find it humorous.

Lol, including me, just to clarify. The internet is a weird place...

[infiltrator_2k 29]

Most of the threads appearing seem to fulfil the criteria of "no real worth" or "offers nothing to a discussion". Swearing at BI isn't a discussion or the basis for one. Bearing in mind each and every forum member clicked "I agree" on these rules, breaking them ought to be punished.

What the hell is ^that^ about? "No real worth"? "Swearing at BI"?..... "real worth" is a perception and interpreted by individuals which can depend on many factors. Unless of course you live in a communist state. As for swearing? There's no swearing here so why even mention it? Or are you attempting to mar posts that criticise BIS with the assumption that people who criticise also abuse BIS by sweating in their posts?

[vran. 13]

Maybe this forum is more a 'liberal dictatorship' than a 'democratic free speech' one... ;)

[Jona33 51]

What the hell is ^that^ about? "No real worth"? "Swearing at BI"?..... "real worth" is a perception and interpreted by individuals which can depend on many factors. Unless of course you live in a communist state. As for swearing? There's no swearing here so why even mention it? Or are you attempting to mar posts that criticise BIS with the assumption that people who criticise also abuse BIS by sweating in their posts?

My point is most of these threads are rants. They serve no basis for discussion (and perhaps an exaggeration) some are simply there to be angry at BI. Some are genuine complaints, and when presented in a mature matter then they absolutely shouldn't be closed but to use a fictional example:

OH MY GOD ARMA III IS SHIT THEY STOLE MY MONEY I HATE THEM

is utterly pointless and should be locked. And "no real worth" is a quote from the rules, and is presumably up to the interpretations of the moderators. I believe the PR team are the guys to contact if you think it's worded badly.

[dmarkwick 261]

The rant threads get closed because they offer nothing new, and certainly nothing that is not catered to by existing threads. I might make the assumption that you (op) made this thread after your own rant thread was closed? And having seen other similar threads closed? I just read through them and they offered nothing new that wasn't catered for in other threads. They certainly didn't seem to be interested in much discussion.

Take note also, that positive threads with no real purpose or point are also closed.

And, as far as freedom of speech goes, the freedom here is defined and defended by the moderators, to the forum rules. There is no external definition that overrides it. :)

Like others have said, rant threads are becoming tedious to the rest of us who wish to find out things or look for solutions to something. Threads with titles like "Flogging a dead horse" have their negative bias set even before reading a single thing, and even after having read it I personally didn't read a thing not already discussed comprehensively and more constructively elsewhere.

My opinion, natch.

[jshock 512]

TBH I think this thread is questioning/complaining about the way these forums are moderated:

§18) No public discussion on how the forum is moderated

If you have questions/complaints/comments about the forum or moderators please Private Message them to a moderator, we will do our utmost to reply to any that we receive. If you have an issue that you feel cannot be solved by another moderator then please Private Message the Bohemia Interactive Forum Moderation Team Leader (Matt), he will be happy to look into the matter. You may also ask your questions in the "Ask a mod" thread; however that thread is not to be used to attack/rant against specific moderators or about specific rules but more for questions/answers.

[infiltrator_2k 29]

TBH I think this thread is questioning/complaining about the way these forums are moderated:

When you attempt to suppress a person's opinions with rules all is lost.

[Tacti-Cool 10]

Sounds like all is lost for you then.

[OMAC 254]

I feel like they have been fair about it for the most part. There are plenty of ranting ones still open. I really have no problem of sifting through them.

I agree. I do think it was somewhat odd that the thread mentioning dyslexi's video was closed. I had been considering posting to that thread, not to rant about Arma, but to rant about that video! :rolleyes:

[infiltrator_2k 29]

I agree. I do think it was somewhat odd that the thread mentioning dyslexi's video was closed. I had been considering posting to that thread, not to rant about Arma, but to rant about that video! :rolleyes:

The very reason what prompted me to create this thread. I saw absolutely no reason to why that thread was closed. I think Dyslexi had a point, but I also think those who had a reason to think differently had a right to express their views, opinions and put forward their argument(s).

[OMAC 254]

The very reason what prompted me to create this thread. I saw absolutely no reason to why that thread was closed. I think Dyslexi had a point, but I also think those who had a reason to think differently had a right to express their views, opinions and put forward their argument(s).

Yep. Perhaps there were some nasty posts in there that the mod deleted before sensing trouble and closing the thread? Useless speculating, however. BI mods usually have good reasons to close threads. I have rarely disagreed with their decisions in that regard.

Frankly, I wish they would delete that whole thread. It stinks.

Edited January 25, 2015 by OMAC

[Jona33 51]

When you attempt to suppress a person's opinions with rules all is lost.

No, when you break the forum rules you agree to your thread gets locked (General "You" there). That's literally all that's happening, it's not part of some big conspiracy to suppress freedom of speech.

[infiltrator_2k 29]

No, when you break the forum rules you agree to your thread gets locked (General "You" there). That's literally all that's happening, it's not part of some big conspiracy to suppress freedom of speech.

No rules broken. Just expressing an opinion which I believe North Korea and China permits from time to time.

[jshock 512]

No rules broken. Just expressing an opinion which I believe North Korea and China permits from time to time.

And your opinion has now started discussion on how these forums are moderated, which does break the rule I posted.

[dayglow 2]

The very reason what prompted me to create this thread. I saw absolutely no reason to why that thread was closed. I think Dyslexi had a point, but I also think those who had a reason to think differently had a right to express their views, opinions and put forward their argument(s).

but this isn't Dyslexi's website or forum. You can express your opinion on his YouTube channel and his website. I can see BI's want of not having it turn into the inevitable pissing match on their forum.

[jakerod 254]

I agree. I do think it was somewhat odd that the thread mentioning dyslexi's video was closed. I had been considering posting to that thread, not to rant about Arma, but to rant about that video! :rolleyes:

I liked that video. I didn't really watch all of it but I did realize that I was being a bit childish in my hating of A3 and I actually am starting to enjoy it a little bit. The discussion I was having in that "lack of content rant" thread also helped sway me too.

[OMAC 254]

I don't think the mods would appreciate us talking about the video here, as I assume they closed that thread to prevent such discussions. I can see their point.

And I don't think you were at all childish in expressing your opinions in that other thread. :) But you should try and finish East Wind, as there are some good Arma times to be had. And you should try RHS Escalation, as it includes a HUGE AMOUNT of high quality Cold War and modern era assets that you and I crave. If you don't believe me, ask Stagler! ;)

[chrisb 196]

From the front page of this topic ‘general discussion’. I see three threads that could be included as having a rant’ish type title. One, I would class as sycophantic (video, just my view) and the rest seem fairly normal.

So out of a little over 20 I see on the front page, only three have rant’ish titles.

Look, just like the content contained within the video in the now locked thread, its naïve nonsense to think that most players whine, moan or complain. That is unless BI receive hundreds if not thousands of complaint emails per day (can’t see that to be honest). Also that most players don't appreciate how good this series is and that there is nothing else like it, well come on, duh.. :rolleyes:

The vast majority of players that play this series don’t even bother coming here to the BI community forums to write at all. If there were that many complaining, as is thought by some. The forum would be full to the rafters with complaint threads. But that just isn’t the case, is it….

Stop believing most players complain, they don’t. How many copies have they sold of A3 ! A million, maybe two.. Perhaps more..

If there were that many players upset with the game, then the first place they would make for is here (probably), why! because its public, it’s the official BI community forum and a good place to attack the devs.

But it is by no means anything like that, is it.

The odd rant, moan or complaint doesn’t hurt anyone, provided it has some sort of substance behind it.

The vast majority of the player community, must be reasonably happy with the game. It’s the very small minority that are not happy. Some of those have genuine reasons and should express their concerns.

Others won’t have good reason to complain because their problems will be home grown i.e. their own systems or lack of knowledge regards game-play, mod/addons, mission design, bad servers etc.

Then there's the players/groups that simply don't want to move over to A3 (yet), for other reasons, me included. No issues with the game as in performance or anything else. Just personal preference.

May change at some stage, but certainly not yet.;)

Let each have their say, its a forum.

As for that video, well.. enough said.:rolleyes:. Its got to have been aimed at his own group, can't see it being anything else..

[Arma3goodCPUlowFPS 12]

There's no if or buts, there's a 'lot' of disgruntled Arma players on this forum right now given the current FPS issue and who are openly airing their frustration and 'rants' on this forum. With that said, I couldn't help but notice that many threads that openly criticise BIS are being locked by mods for no other good reason other than they're either irritated or disagree with the poster's criticisms, opinions, accusations or claims; supressing the freedom of speech and expression by locking threads can be counterproductive and only serve to validate and propagate further criticism towards BIS.

Debate needs to breath and should never be stifled. Regardless of that side of the fence a person sits on, democracy and the freedom of speech should be left unabated.

i agree 100%.

(WARNING: a bit offtopic, but fits to the case of OP) not only when it comes to arma / BI criticism, but when you go to the offtopic section and post your own political views which are the opposite of our media´s or criticism western leaders & media, they also lock your topic or delete your posts fully or even ban you. one guy got banned by maddox because of this and there was really no reason, maddox used as excuse for his ban that the guy was "trolling".

(NOW BACK ONTOPIC)

some moderators (not all) needs to be removed and/or replaced. i said some because there are good moderators here. some moderators cant stand criticism nor cant some members here (aka fanboys).

[OMAC 254]

One, I would class as sycophantic (video, just my view) and the rest seem fairly normal.

As for that video, well.. enough said.:rolleyes:. Its got to have been aimed at his own group, can't see it being anything else..

Three cheers. Sycophantic is the word. :rolleyes:

Full Definition of SYCOPHANT

: a servile self-seeking flatterer

Edited January 26, 2015 by OMAC

[Nicholas 5]

There's no if or buts, there's a 'lot' of disgruntled Arma players on this forum right now given the current FPS issue and who are openly airing their frustration and 'rants' on this forum. With that said, I couldn't help but notice that many threads that openly criticise BIS are being locked by mods for no other good reason other than they're either irritated or disagree with the poster's criticisms, opinions, accusations or claims; supressing the freedom of speech and expression by locking threads can be counterproductive and only serve to validate and propagate further criticism towards BIS.

Debate needs to breath and should never be stifled. Regardless of that side of the fence a person sits on, democracy and the freedom of speech should be left unabated.

Ranting on the forums will not get you anywhere, sure a dev might notice your post, but there is a dedicated feedback tracker for reporting issues. If they want a particular issue fixed, they need to be reporting such issues and up-voting them on the feedback tracker.

There is no "freedom of speech" on a privately-run/owned forum. Bohemia Interactive can censor and/or close whatever threads/posts they so please.

Clogging up the forums with useless threads about ranting just make it a mess. I think the more that people rant, I feel that it will be less likely that a company (Bohemia Interactive) will even bother reading their rants/suggestions. Then it will go the way of EA and they won't give a shit about their userbase since all they do is complain. At least show some appreciation for their hard work.

In fact, you're breaking a forum rule right now.

§18) No public discussion on how the forum is moderated

If you have questions/complaints/comments about the forum or moderators please Private Message them to a moderator, we will do our utmost to reply to any that we receive. If you have an issue that you feel cannot be solved by another moderator then please Private Message the Bohemia Interactive Forum Moderation Team Leader (Matt), he will be happy to look into the matter. You may also ask your questions in the "Ask a mod" thread; however that thread is not to be used to attack/rant against specific moderators or about specific rules but more for questions/answers.

Edited January 26, 2015 by Nicholas