Islamic State (ISIS/ISIL/Daesh) Discussion

[654wak654 25]

..besides, the extremist was only jibbering about allah in the video... as they always do.

That's the voiceover, I'm pretty sure they weren't talking about Allah when they were pointing at the English writing and stuff on it.

[Sgt.Spoetnik 10]

yeah most likely a tomahawk, you can see the engine at the back in the beginning of that film,and the warhead at the front(the cilinder the guy have his feet on) and its indeed crashed without exploding so most likely malfunctioned.

then when you see the names of the company's and numbers and stuff you can reseach it easly- like this one "conax Florida corp" at 1.50 they into a lot of stuff but work with the US navy to mention one -http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/private/snapshot.asp?privcapId=26895 they make parts for stuff not the complete tomahawks i presume

[mistyronin 1181]

( The Guardian ) Kobani could be another Srebrenica, UN warns

Turkey is under new pressure to help defend the Syrian town of Kobani from Islamic State (Isis) fighters, with a warning from the UN that its fall risks another Srebrenica – the 1995 massacre that symbolised the failure of international efforts to stop Bosnia’s war.

Staffan de Mistura, the UN special envoy for Syria, spoke after Isis overran the headquarters of the Kurdish militia defending Kobani. “Everybody should do whatever they can to stop this,†the Italian-Swedish diplomat told reporters in Geneva. “I hope we will not see people beheaded.†Thousands could die if Kobani were taken, he said.

[ProfTournesol 956]

If Kobane falls, it will be very hard for Turkey to keep civil peace with the Kurdish minority.

[mistyronin 1181]

If Kobane falls, it will be very hard for Turkey to keep civil peace with the Kurdish minority.

If Kobane falls, Turkey will have problems with the Kurdish that live in Turkey; if it intervene, Turkey will have problems with the Syrian regime ( Al Assad ) and Iran...

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

[oxmox 73]

If Kobane falls, Turkey will have problems with the Kurdish that live in Turkey; if it intervene, Turkey will have problems with the Syrian regime ( Al Assad ) and Iran...

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

It depends how this intervention looks like, if they are going to attack IS solely this can all be discussed with the Assad regime. But if they are going against the Syrian Regime, they disregard the UN resolution.

One of the main problem is that the Turkey has an 800km+ long boarder with Syria, which needs to be protected against IS forces and a possible threat against IS terror cells.

Kubane is an enclave in the IS territory - guys, check out this interactive map.

Awesome Interactive map with faction areas:

http://umap.openstreetmap.fr/fr/map/desyracuse-syria-civil-war-8-october-2014_18856#8/35.637/39.199

Edited October 11, 2014 by oxmox

[ProfTournesol 956]

It depends how this intervention looks like, if they are going to attack IS solely this can all be discussed with the Assad regime. But if they are going against the Syrian Regime, they disregard the UN resolution.

From what i've understood, Turkey will intervene on the ground if other countries do, and probably if the intervention is included in a global solution for Syria.

[oxmox 73]

From what i've understood, Turkey will intervene on the ground if other countries do, and probably if the intervention is included in a global solution for Syria.

A global solution against Syria would be illegal and against the previous UN resolution and this would lead for sure to international disputes i.e. Russia/China.

[ProfTournesol 956]

A global solution against Syria would be illegal and against the previous UN resolution and this would lead for sure to international disputes i.e. Russia/China.

UN resolution doesn't mean anything anymore, as long as Russia behaves the way it does actually. Assad is responsible for 200 000 casualties, a global solution for Syria is very much needed.

[mistyronin 1181]

A global solution against Syria would be illegal and against the previous UN resolution and this would lead for sure to international disputes i.e. Russia/China.

That's what Turkey's Gov are asking for.

As I mentioned before in this thread, Turkey's expansionist dreams could become true. And even better if they get all NATO and coalition support to achieve them.

Do to the weakening of the US, now all the expansionist powers are trying to expand ( Russia, China, Turkey, etc. ).

[oxmox 73]

UN resolution doesn't mean anything anymore, as long as Russia behaves the way it does actually. Assad is responsible for 200 000 casualties, a global solution for Syria is very much needed.

.....look how many countries are responsible for the current mess with their "strategies".

By the way, this comment by a contributor was printed in the DailyMail recently. It really descbribes the overall chaos in the middle east.

[ProfTournesol 956]

.....look how many countries are responsible for the current mess with their "strategies".

Indeed. But you won't get rid of IS if you don't find a solution for Syria as a whole. With or without Assad.

[mistyronin 1181]

.....look how many countries are responsible for the current mess with their "strategies".

The problem is that all the countries in the region want a piece of the cake ( Iran, Syria backed by Russia, Turkey, Israel, etc. ).

What obviously can't or shouldn't be done is to support Al Assad dictatorship, because that would mean fuel future problems ( what happened with Al Qaeda and other monsters that were funded by US or USSR/Russia ).

[oxmox 73]

The problem is that all the countries in the region want a piece of the cake ( Iran, Syria backed by Russia, Turkey, Israel, etc. ).

What obviously can't or shouldn't be done is to support Al Assad dictatorship, because that would mean fuel future problems ( what happened with Al Qaeda and other monsters that were funded by US or USSR/Russia ).

Well, Iran-Syria-Lebanon is the Shia Axis which want sunni states, Israel and the US/west weakened. Sunnis want more influence with their religion and influence in the region, Israel sees a threat in Iran and Iran itself is a geostrategical aim interesting for the US/West.

Russia has a leased military harbour in Syria and Syria is a businees partner, the harbour is tiny and not that important like the only ice free harbour on the crimea but neverless.

Originally the US did force islamic extremism during the time the USSR invaded Afghanistan and they did breed (fund & train) radical fighters to battle them (Jihad & Co), Al Qaeda is the result of it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA%E2%80%93al-Qaeda_controversy

Edited October 11, 2014 by oxmox

[mistyronin 1181]

Russia has a leased military harbour in Syria and Syria is a businees partner, the harbour is tiny and not that important like the only ice free harbour on the crimea but neverless.

Russia has more than Tartus... And as far as I know Russians are not Shia...

( The Times of Israel ) Rebels find joint Russian-Syrian spy site near Golan Heights

Rebel fighters from the Free Syrian Army apparently captured a secret joint Russian-Syrian spy station only kilometers from the Israeli side of the Golan Heights over the weekend.

( The Interpreter ) Russian Military Intelligence Coordinating Syrian-Iranian Attacks on Rebels, Spying on Israel

Edited October 11, 2014 by MistyRonin

[oxmox 73]

Russia has more than Tartus... And as far as I know Russians are not Shia...

Well, the 20 million muslime in russia are devided into Sunni, Shia, Sufi and whatever. Russia is a multiethnic state. No idea what do you mean with russia has more than Tartus, it is like it is, like other countries have their bases or territories.

Edited October 11, 2014 by oxmox

[mistyronin 1181]

Well, the 20 million muslime in russia are devided into Sunni, Shia, Sufi and whatever. No idea what do you mean with russia has more than Tartus, it is like it is, like other countries have their bases or territories.

I meant that in Russia Shia muslims are not a majority, nor they have any effect in the Kremlin's gov. So the idea of the Shia Axis is quite weak, because Russia is also one of the main allies of both countries ( Syria and Iran ).

About Tartus I meant that it's not the only military installation that they have there.

[oxmox 73]

I meant that in Russia Shia muslims are not a majority, nor they have any effect in the Kremlin's gov. So the idea of the Shia Axis is quite weak, because Russia is also one of the main allies of both countries ( Syria and Iran ).

About Tartus I meant that it's not the only military installation that they have there.

The Shia-Axis is well known, not only by experts and reported about in books but in the meanwhile discussed in the media aswell (i.e. TV discussions and whatever) Wonder that you have not heard from it, very interesting read and the struggle between the Shia and Sunnis/Wahabis. As far I know Tartus is the only small military harbour outside of the territory of the former Sovjetunion.

As far I can tell Russia has no allies outside of the former GUS states, they have interests and are into economical organisations with other countries, but I dont know about any alliance with the countries you did mention.

Edited October 11, 2014 by oxmox

[mistyronin 1181]

The Shia-Axis is well known, not only by experts and reported about in books but in the meanwhile discussed in the media aswell (i.e. TV discussions and whatever)

I have not said that I didn't know the alleged Shia-Axis. I just said that is a weak idea, as Russia is also deeply involved and it's clearly a non Muslim country.

Same can be said in the Sunni side with the US and other countries...

As far I know Tartus is the only small military harbour outside of the territory of the former Sovjetunion.

I've already gave you proof of at least another Russian military facility in Syria.

[oxmox 73]

I have not said that I didn't know the alleged Shia-Axis. I just said that is a weak idea, as Russia is also deeply involved and it's clearly a non Muslim country.

Same can be said in the Sunni side with the US and other countries...

I've already gave you proof of at least another Russian military facility in Syria.

Ronin, this thread is about the Islamic State. We are going quiete offtopic now. We could open a thread about Russia and discuss about such general things about Syria in the Syria Thread, dont you think so :)

What other harbour are you talking about or facility, when it comes to military harbours Tartus which is in Syria is the only one abroad outside of the former Sovjetunion as far I know at least. Iam open for new infos. The Shia-Axis definition is especially used in the struggle between Sunnis and Shias, there are maps where you see the regions of influence. The Shia-Axis is also often used when it comes about the Iran in general i.e. weaken the axis to hit Iran etc.

[mistyronin 1181]

I didn't talk about another harbor, but about other facilities, like the join Syrian-Russian military intelligence site that I mentioned above.

What I was trying to explain before, is that is not as simple as Turkey vs ISIS. There is a whole net of interests in the region, which is probably why Turkey's gov don't want to take action in Kobane if there is no coalition plan for the whole Syria.

That's why I said that the Syria-Iran-Russia connection is one major point they consider. It's not much about religion but groups of interests ( even if that may not be clear at first sight due to the religious excuses some use ).

[oxmox 73]

I didn't talk about another harbor, but about other facilities, like the join Syrian-Russian military intelligence site that I mentioned above.

What I was trying to explain before, is that is not as simple as Turkey vs ISIS. There is a whole net of interests in the region, which is probably why Turkey's gov don't want to take action in Kobane if there is no coalition plan for the whole Syria.

That's why I said that the Syria-Iran-Russia connection is one major point they consider. It's not much about religion but groups of interests ( even if that may not be clear at first sight due to the religious excuses some use ).

They are talking about a "Spy Station", Iam not sure if this can be called a military facility and compared with a military naval harbour. Of course secret intelligence are working abroad, there will be intelligence from major countries in the Ukraine, in Syria, in Iraq. Iam not surprised since they need to find out whats going on on the ground or working as adviser like the article says.

The article says:

"The Daily Beast said that the presence of Russian posters and insignia does not necessarily mean Russia’s military was running the site, and could instead indicate the presence of Russian advisers."

[mistyronin 1181]

They are talking about a "Spy Station", Iam not sure if this can be called a military facility and compared with a military naval harbour.

They talk about a GRU installation ( which is the foreign military intelligence main directorate of the General Staff of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation ). You may know that organization because it's the one that leads most of the Spetsnaz operations.

The article says:

"The Daily Beast said that the presence of Russian posters and insignia does not necessarily mean Russia’s military was running the site, and could instead indicate the presence of Russian advisers."

In fact no. One of the articles say:

US defense officials who spoke with The Daily Beast said that the presence of Russian posters and insignia does not necessarily mean Russia’s military was running the site, and could instead indicate the presence of Russian advisers.

While it also says:

FSA’s spokesman said that around 15 Russian soldiers were evacuated from the site by the Syrian government two weeks ago.

Which makes a lot of sense watching the video, with a good bunch of photos of Russian soldiers in that installation and Russian documentation ( like a map of the base ).

---------- Post added at 03:21 ---------- Previous post was at 02:55 ----------

Well, it seems that Putin himself has decided to support my theories:

( RIA Novosti ) Putin, Erdogan Discuss Threats Posed by Islamic State: Kremlin

What I was trying to explain before, is that is not as simple as Turkey vs ISIS. There is a whole net of interests in the region, which is probably why Turkey's gov don't want to take action in Kobane if there is no coalition plan for the whole Syria.

That's why I said that the Syria-Iran-Russia connection is one major point they consider. It's not much about religion but groups of interests ( even if that may not be clear at first sight due to the religious excuses some use ).

[oxmox 73]

I did post an answer about your thread in the general Syria toppic.

[Xalteva 10]

I think there should be one thread about the whole middle east ,instead of separate ones! Everything is linked together and highly contextual.