Ukraine General

[spooky lynx 73]

Meanwhile Putin's authoritarian propaganda says about a number of mass-graves with the bodies of civilians found by DPR troops near former Ukrainian positions.

[ProfTournesol 956]

P.P.S. I'm still waiting the photos or videos containing Russian troops with clear markings on Ukrainian land from one monsieur who stated that our army entered Ukraine;)

If you're talking about me, you should re read my posts ("shelling Ukraine from within Russian soil"). Anyway, you won't see any picture of Russians with Russian badges in Ukraine (even if several Ukrainian soldiers have reported this fact), cause they don't / may not wear those badges. As in Crimea. Even if Putin then acknowledged that those guys without markings in Crimea were Russian soldiers.

Moscow is arming, supplying and training those Pro Russian / Russian guys and send them / let them go into Ukraine, together with Russian soldiers spending their holidays... Then it protects them when they retreat into Russian soil. That should be more than enough for you. If you don't get the point...

And :

(RIA NOVOSTI) Donetsk Self-Defense Forces Joined by French Volunteers - Interview

That wonderful news agency only forgot to precise one thing : those guys are far right extremists.

[spooky lynx 73]

If you're talking about me, you should re read my posts ("shelling Ukraine from within Russian soil"). Anyway, you won't see any picture of Russians with Russian badges in Ukraine (even if several Ukrainian soldiers have reported this fact), cause they don't / may not wear those badges. As in Crimea. Even if Putin then acknowledged that those guys without markings in Crimea were Russian soldiers.

I suppose it's not because they don't wear badges but because they are the result of the UA servicemen' wet fantasies who have to explain somehow their epic fails. And most suitable explaination is almighty Russian army that fights against them. Otherwise they would be totally ashamed if they admit the fact that glorious UA army and various batallions are being defeated by their compatriots from nearby towns.

BTW don't forget about Black sea fleet Naval infantry that was stationed in Crimea:) So yes, some of that 'polite men' were from 810th regiment possibly.

P.S. Anyway, I hadn't seen any more or less good proof of shelling Ukrainian troops from Russian territory. Only plain text of their brave soldiers.

[beastcat 14]

I suppose it's not because they don't wear badges but because they are the result of the UA servicemen' wet fantasies who have to explain somehow their epic fails. And most suitable explaination is almighty Russian army that fights against them. Otherwise they would be totally ashamed if they admit the fact that glorious UA army and various batallions are being defeated by their compatriots from nearby towns.

BTW don't forget about Black sea fleet Naval infantry that was stationed in Crimea:) So yes, some of that 'polite men' were from 810th regiment possibly.

P.S. Anyway, I hadn't seen any more or less good proof of shelling Ukrainian troops from Russian territory. Only plain text of their brave soldiers.

You are a really strange person. When one shows proof to you, no matter how often, you just go quite for a while and then pretend it never happened, repeating the same things over and over again.

---

RT - Russia tests 100,000 troops in ‘Vostok 2014’, biggest-ever post-Soviet drills

The drills, dubbed “Vostok-2014,†are the largest since the Soviet era. About 100,000 servicemen, up to 1,500 tanks, 120 aircraft, 5,000 pieces of weaponry, military and special hardware, and up to 70 ships took part in the exercises.

Military observers from up to 30 countries were closely monitoring the exercises. Military attachés from Angola, China, Malaysia, North Korea, Peru, Venezuela, Zimbabwe and various other countries attended the ultimate stage of the drills at Skalisty Cape in Kamchatka, with Russia’s Defense Minister Sergey Shoigu joining them. The supply units were to move 10,000 tons of munitions, fuel, food supplies and other materials over long distances, sometimes as far as thousands of kilometers.

Detachments operating S-300 missile defense systems conducted successful tests, hitting targets from the most difficult tail-chase guidance position. The time needed to carry out all preparations to eliminate the target is only 15 seconds.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ByOVRnlIEAAnWL9.png:small (102 kB)

The "attachés from Angola, China, Malaysia, North Korea, Peru, Venezuela, Zimbabwe" part shows the state of russian international relations quite well.

And here is how well the cease-fire with the buffer-zone is going:

Donetsk Airport

Oh yeah and about the whole foreign fighters stuff:

And freedom of press:

Edited September 24, 2014 by beastcat

[spooky lynx 73]

You are a really strange person. When one shows proof to you, no matter how often, you just go quite for a while and then pretend it never happened, repeating the same things over and over again.

Watch it, compare with google maps presented in that post and you'll see that the rockets are fired along the border. If the geolocation was proper (I don't believe only in one evidence by pro-Western twitter account, where are 'several people' mentioned in the post?).

[beastcat 14]

Watch it, compare with google maps presented in that post and you'll see that the rockets are fired along the border. If the geolocation was proper (I don't believe only in one evidence by pro-Western twitter account, where are 'several people' mentioned in the post?).

You are trying to tell me that Russia is firing grads at itself? Really? I mean... like... Really? ... ... ... Well anyway, if you would look at least a little bit more at the video you would notice it is firing to the left of the camera, the direction is given in the article, not towards the camera.

But no, it must have been the russians bombing themselves, because rockets being fired from one place into the direction of another and landing there doesn't make any sense. I mean Russia shooting at Russia is the only thing that makes sense! Russia has so many rockets that they are using them for duck hunting now.

Oh and if you think that the geolocation is evil jewmerican propaganda, take a look yourself: 48.0746683 39.9275391

Theres streetview, so you can see the exact location.

Edited September 24, 2014 by beastcat

[blu3sman 11]

I suppose it's not because they don't wear badges but because they are the result of the UA servicemen' wet fantasies who have to explain somehow their epic fails. And most suitable explaination is almighty Russian army that fights against them. Otherwise they would be totally ashamed if they admit the fact that glorious UA army and various batallions are being defeated by their compatriots from nearby towns.

Umm.. okay, UA army fights unarmed miners and grannys. So it means that glorious unbeatable russian soldiers die on exercises of heartstrokes, blowing up - not holding munitions strong enough, etc. Or they get heartstrokes because of carrying heavy munitions? Die in hundreds, mind you. Thats very... proffesional.

[Tonci87 163]

Umm.. okay, UA army fights unarmed miners and grannys. So it means that glorious unbeatable russian soldiers die on exercises of heartstrokes, blowing up - not holding munitions strong enough, etc. Or they get heartstrokes because of carrying heavy munitions? Die in hundreds, mind you. Thats very... proffesional.

Tough training. Oh and don´t forget reports from Russian service men that they thought they are going to excercises and then ended up in Ukraine actually fighting.

You are a really strange person. When one shows proof to you, no matter how often, you just go quite for a while and then pretend it never happened, repeating the same things over and over again.

That is exactly what he is doing.

[Rydygier 1309]

http://fakty.interia.pl/raport-zamieszki-na-ukrainie/aktualnosci/news-krym-brutalny-atak-na-tatarskiego-dzialacza,nId,1504354?utm_source=Fakty&utm_medium=RSS&utm_campaign=RSS

Unknown perpetrators attacked the Crimean Tatars activist Nadir Bekirov, preventing him from traveling to a conference of the United Nations in New York. When Nadir Bekirov rode in the direction of Simferopol railway station Dzhankoj the Crimea, attacked him four masked men.

Truck stopped his taxi, the attackers pulled Bekirov of the car, beat him, they took the passport and mobile phone. Activist says there is no doubt that this was a politically motivated attack, which had locked its activities on behalf of the Tatar minority, constituting the indigenous people of Crimea.

Since March, when Russia took peninsula, men of Tatars are persecuted, the new authorities restrict their rights, including freedom of movement. Many of their leaders, a prohibition of entry into the so-called Autonomous Republic of Crimea. The Russian authorities have drawn up a list of 344 Tartars, whose presence in the Crimea "not desirable".

After the occupation of the peninsula annexation by Moscow, many representatives of this ethnic group fled from there, for fear of persecution.

This year marks the 70th anniversary of the mass displacement of the Crimean Tatars, carried out by Stalin. Army Red allowed for them to mass murder, murders, rapes and robberies. Displaced from the Crimea a total of about 200,000 Tatars. They started to return to their lands in the 90 twentieth century., After the collapse of the Soviet Union.

Russian people pointed their moral authorities

Sociologists note that up to 60 percent of respondents believed that around them are people who enjoy widespread respect and you can call them "moral authorities". At the top of the list with the support of over 36 proc. is President Vladimir Putin.

The following places are: Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov and Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu. Name them with this honorable name 6 and 5 percent of Russians.

[beastcat 14]

Here's something interesting:

Ukraine@War - Berkut officers killing on Maidan were Russian Soldiers

[ProfTournesol 956]

(BBC) Ukraine crisis: Nato sees 'significant' Russian troop pullback from eastern Ukraine

You'll notice that Russian troops aren't in Ukraine, but they are still pulling back from there.

[surpher 1]

Here's something interesting:

Ukraine@War - Berkut officers killing on Maidan were Russian Soldiers

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwrfRU1IAAAmSNI.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bw2CoYZIgAA9X9h.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bw2CocxIQAE8Qea.jpg

Here is some more Russians soldiers in berkut uniforms.

(euromaidanpress) How Russian professional military in Ukraine disguise themselves as separatists

(ITAR-TASS) Waning immunity to radical ideologies in OSCE states major challenge — envoy

“The strengthening of dangerous tendencies, such as rewriting history and glorifying the Nazis and their accomplices, are very alarming,â€

Russian mission to the UN in Geneva tweeted this on saturday, later claiming their account was hacked.

Here is the source of the image taken from a 2011 film set.

[krycek 349]

It's really no wonder,Putin and his propaganda media invented this idea that they're fighting some screwed-up Great Patriot War Ep.2 revision 2014.

Of course not fighting it physically in Ukraine because they aren't there(probably they fight the Space Nazis with psi attacks).Meanwhile their greatest threat and vicious enemy,the uber Ukraine army are struggling to use some duct tape to patch up their 20-30 tanks they have left.

Edited September 24, 2014 by Krycek

[spooky lynx 73]

You are trying to tell me that Russia is firing grads at itself? Really? I mean... like... Really? ... ... ... Well anyway, if you would look at least a little bit more at the video you would notice it is firing to the left of the camera, the direction is given in the article, not towards the camera.

I've looked this video for several times and also looked all the map screenshots with notes in that post. So, as a geographer, I may say that depicted Grads fire along the border, if the place was really the same as in given coordinates (look at what you have given to me and tell me where are the electric grids shown in the video and why the trees are so near to the lake and why there aren't any on the video?).

But no, it must have been the russians bombing themselves, because rockets being fired from one place into the direction of another and landing there doesn't make any sense. I mean Russia shooting at Russia is the only thing that makes sense! Russia has so many rockets that they are using them for duck hunting now.

You know, dude, the home of my parents stands just opposite to the training area of MIA troops, so during my lifetime there I often woke up because of explosions and gunfire (yeah they used mortars and AGS there) in the morning. Oh and another training area for armored vehicles and heavy artillery about 20 km far from this one. So I've perfectly heard large explosions of arty shells. So... yes, Russia is shooting at Russia.

Oh and if you think that the geolocation is evil jewmerican propaganda, take a look yourself: 48.0746683 39.9275391

Theres streetview, so you can see the exact location.

I see electric grids and no trees at the video and some trees and no grids on the photo from that place. So?

---------- Post added at 00:03 ---------- Previous post was at 23:43 ----------

Here's something interesting:

Ukraine@War - Berkut officers killing on Maidan were Russian Soldiers

According to the fact that many of former UA servicemen, both from army and MVD, joined Russian military and MVD... That pics don't surprise at all:D And seems they may be twisted a bit.

P.S. Good portion of humor by Germans:

Edited September 24, 2014 by Spooky Lynx

[beastcat 14]

I've looked this video for several times and also looked all the map screenshots with notes in that post. So, as a geographer, I may say that depicted Grads fire along the border, if the place was really the same as in given coordinates (look at what you have given to me and tell me where are the electric grids shown in the video and why the trees are so near to the lake and why there aren't any on the video?).

You know, dude, the home of my parents stands just opposite to the training area of MIA troops, so during my lifetime there I often woke up because of explosions and gunfire (yeah they used mortars and AGS there) in the morning. Oh and another training area for armored vehicles and heavy artillery about 20 km far from this one. So I've perfectly heard large explosions of arty shells. So... yes, Russia is shooting at Russia.

I see electric grids and no trees at the video and some trees and no grids on the photo from that place. So?

Either my coordinates were crappy, you are crappy at looking or you are using some other application, but heres the location with the link you provided:

https://www.google.ru/maps/@48.0749761,39.9278806,3a,26.4y,293.63h,88t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sfXFLTeywV0NLPLSFprV7tw!2e0?hl=ru

Power lines, the rock formation, the bush, the water, everything you may want.

Oh and about the training thing, do you really think that they will be training pretty much right on the border and not in some training facility, but on some field and not only that, they are also not training with small arms, explosives, mortars or anything like that, no, they are training with MRLS'?

And I don't know what video you are watching, but the Grads are definitely not on the exact other side of the lake, they are to the north-west of the cameraman. If they would be shooting along the border, they would have to shoot at the cameraman, over a town and in the direction of another town.

[spooky lynx 73]

Either my coordinates were crappy, you are crappy at looking or you are using some other application

... or that video was recorded much earlier before the whole Ukrainian mess. Or maybe it is the place similar to that on the video. But sure you will say that it's evil Russkies firing Grads on poor Ukraine. Sure.

Oh and about the training thing, do you really think that they will be training pretty much right on the border and not in some training facility, but on some field and not only that, they are also not training with small arms, explosives, mortars or anything like that, no, they are training with MRLS'?

Dude, some helicopter crews from the base nearby practice in low-level flight just upon the roads and fly so near to the houses that I was able to recognise whether they have FFAR pods loaded or they carry empty ones. Then, training facility I've shown is not totally surrounded with the fence. Then, if you don't see the area from which suspected Grads fired directly how can you say it's just a field but not some guarded area with the fences just not visible from the point of recording?

And I don't know what video you are watching, but the Grads are definitely not on the exact other side of the lake, they are to the north-west of the cameraman. If they would be shooting along the border, they would have to shoot at the cameraman, over a town and in the direction of another town.

Do you need the debunking of this video by me with the screenshots, notes and arrows? I may do.

Edited September 24, 2014 by Spooky Lynx

[beastcat 14]

... or that video was recorded much earlier before the whole Ukrainian mess. Or maybe it is the place similar to that on the video. But sure you will say that it's evil Russkies firing Grads on poor Ukraine. Sure.

Yeah, thats the reason why the videos all appeared on the same day at the same location, were never seen before and for some reason the rockets landed on the other side at the same time as well. And I am seriously concerned with your eyesight. A place similiar to the one in the video? How much more similiar can you get than being the exact same thing?

Dude, some helicopter crews from the base nearby practice in low-level flight just upon the roads and fly so near to the houses that I was able to recognise whether they have FFAR pods loaded or they carry empty ones. Then, training facility I've shown is not totally surrounded with the fence. Then, if you don't see the area from which suspected Grads fired directly how can you say it's just a field but not some guarded area with the fences just not visible from the point of recording?

(I'll try to keep your structure so you will know what is meant for what)

So? Then, so? Then, you can use Google Earth and see everything. Its the year 2014, we have the internet.

Do you need the debunking of this video by me with the screenshots, notes and arrows? I may do.

Yes, please.

On a bit more unrelated note, this whole conversation reminds me of creationism vs evolution arguments. You know, the "Well, yeah, we can observe the cause, we can observe the effect, we have fossils, we have transitional fossils, we have all you may want, but I have never seen a cat just suddenly turn into a whale, therefore evolution is false" kind of arguments.

[oxmox 73]

P.S. Good portion of humor by Germans:

Actually I saw the full broadcast and it is a political satire show called "Die Anstalt" ( The Mental Hospital ). This show gets broadcasted on the 2nd german state TV channel and is really awesome. They are doing political satire but with investigative facts. The second last edition showed how journalists of the main media is involved with international lobby organisatons and not so independent like you think.

In other words this is not just a political satire show, its some kind of "whistleblower" show which reveals political backgrounder, reveals manipulations in the politics and media, and so on.....they got for one of their show a decleration to cease and desist because they did step on someones toe.

In the last show from Tuesday 23th September 2014, and parts of it is actually shown in the video posted, they revealed the "aberrations" of the media and manipulations about parts of the conflict in the Ukraine. The show was superbe and if you are more informed about the ukrainian conflict and followed the press releases you had to start giggling. Of course it is only factoid due to the time restriction and the form of a satire.

First I wanted to post the full video about this show and was thinking about to translate some parts from german into english, but since you did post it already with russian subtitels maybe it is available with english subs aswell.

This video is definately worth to watch it.

Here is the full length video and the main part about the Ukraine starts at 41:00 - exellent show and a good laugh.

Like I said, hopefully someone can post it with english subtitles if not maybe I translate some parts into english. When you understand german and you have never heard about it definately look for more parts of this satire show.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbb3HinQqVU

Edited September 24, 2014 by oxmox

[batto 17]

I suppose it's not because they don't wear badges but because they are the result of the UA servicemen' wet fantasies who have to explain somehow their epic fails. And most suitable explaination is almighty Russian army that fights against them.

How do you explain mothers in Russia missing their sons?

[beastcat 14]

How do you explain mothers in Russia missing their sons?

Spontaneous heart attacks, as it says in the papers.

[aleksadragutin 9]

Here is some more Russians soldiers in berkut uniforms.

I was in Vienna 2 days ago, and I saw a guy wearing the same uniform. You're saying this like it is impossible to buy that kind of a uniform.

[surpher 1]

I was in Vienna 2 days ago, and I saw a guy wearing the same uniform. You're saying this like it is impossible to buy that kind of a uniform.

Most likely a russian soldier on vacation :)

[ProfTournesol 956]

Most likely a russian soldier on vacation :)

Yup, swim suits and shorts are SO outdated...

[aleksadragutin 9]

Yup, swim suits and shorts are SO outdated...

This guy wasn't really a soldier type (short, skinny and pale), but he was Russian. Anyway the point is that he could have, and had purchased the uniform, same as anyone in Ukraine could have done.

Edited September 25, 2014 by aleksadragutin

[beastcat 14]

Amazing what a few miners with their grandfather's WW2 Mosin rifles can do.