[SP] Flashpoint: - Instant Action - Dynamic Missions - Release Thread

[solusseraph 10]

Just wanted to give my thanks to you thomsonb for your continuing work on this map and sorting through all of the requests being made of you! I also wanted to say that my mates and I are eagerly awaiting a stable release of your co-op version. If we can help you test the map, we'd be glad to help!

[TonyMarony 0]

Hola,

for all who want to have some fun in Fallujah, you can add a line to the init.sqf:

case "fallujah": {WORLD_STRING = "Fallujah"; SPAWN_LIMITS = [3000,7000,2000,6000]};

and rename the mission file as .fallujah. A bit quick and dirty i guess, but it works as long as thompson is not adding fallujah officially.

Thx to thomsonb for this mission, its great fun!

Greets

Tony

[rtka1234 10]

Hi thomsonb! I really like your mod new version i think its get even better all the time. However i want to play in Lingor and Isla Duala too, so do you include these maps for the future releases?

Oh keep up the good work!

[thomsonb 3]

Hi guys

Just a quick one to release a new MP coop testing version, this time its Takistan

Please download from here

changes

v0.3

Vehicles

Aircraft

Parked Cars

New weather engine

Fixed time sync problems

have fun, please report any bugs, thanks for testing

B

[orcinus 121]

Hola,

for all who want to have some fun in Fallujah, you can add a line to the init.sqf:

case "fallujah": {WORLD_STRING = "Fallujah"; SPAWN_LIMITS = [3000,7000,2000,6000]};

If you reduce those to

3180,7030,3180,7030

you avoid spawning in most of the bare desert (plenty of that elsewhere :) & also avoid losing troops/vehicles.equipment as groups try to move across the rivers. Action is focussed in the city & near environs.

EDIT: oops, posted the wrong co-ordinates initially - now corrected. Actually not really much different to Tony's. Note to self: Duh, check file versions more carefully.

So that my post isn't a total waste of space, here is a coordinate string for Lingor (v1.4):

	case "lingor": {WORLD_STRING = "Lingor"; SPAWN_LIMITS = [1275,7960,1060,7150]};

Edited July 23, 2012 by Orcinus
Error correction

[TonyMarony 0]

Thx for the correction, Orcinus. I have to admit, that i am not fully aware f the syntax. First i thought, that the coordinates are given: First point x, first point y, second point x, second point y. But that dont fit right for the given worlds. I now think its first point x, second point x, first point y, second point y. Is that correct?

Cheers

Tony

[pd3 25]

If you reduce those to

3180,7030,3180,7030

you avoid spawning in most of the bare desert (plenty of that elsewhere :) & also avoid losing troops/vehicles.equipment as groups try to move across the rivers. Action is focussed in the city & near environs.

EDIT: oops, posted the wrong co-ordinates initially - now corrected. Actually not really much different to Tony's. Note to self: Duh, check file versions more carefully.

So that my post isn't a total waste of space, here is a coordinate string for Lingor (v1.4):

	case "lingor": {WORLD_STRING = "Lingor"; SPAWN_LIMITS = [1275,7960,1060,7150]};

There was this old game in the arcades when I was a kid called: Caliber 50.

It was a vietnam/southeast asia themed top down shooter, and I pretty much figure that importing this into Lingor would pretty much be as close to a modern realization of that as possible.

[JetlinerX 1]

Thomson, my buddy and I are about to go test multiplayer extensively. I can video it for you if you would like, or just provide a full review once we are done.

[pd3 25]

I fired up the multiplayer test on my LAN.

Everything seemed to work pretty well, although it seems as if there's a fair number of features missing, this was to be expected of course.

One thing I will say though is I wasn't a big fan of the close spawn proximity of the AI in general, when I play the SP version its minimum 500-900.

Everything seemed a LOT more condensed, that is to say, it didn't really feel as expansive, it felt like there was a giant trigger surrounding me creating AI within it and nowhere else. This gave an impression that diverged greatly from the SP scenario.

It was actually pretty easy to escape whatever was happening, and find yourself way out in the middle of nowhere, all alone.

I also noticed bodies disappear a lot more quickly, which is kind of frustrating when you're trying to re-kit yourself after playing for a little bit.

That aside I saw no technical issues arise.

[thomsonb 3]

Thanks for the feedback Pd3,

The spawn is set to 400m - 1000m, same as SP i think, but il check it of course, lots of bugs crop up :)

I will set the bodies removal to 100, i think its only at 50 right now.

I wonder if you found a bug, when the spawns were not "following" you... il have a look at that too

Cheers

B

[old_painless 182]

In SP on Takistan, I have noticed after some time that the spawning of OPFOR "dry out", after we have overcome the first waves. Not sure what would happen if I waited a bit longer though. I'll try waiting longer and relocating - ff there is an issue, what would be helpful for debugging (the RPT, a savegame or something else)?

[pd3 25]

Thanks for the feedback Pd3,

The spawn is set to 400m - 1000m, same as SP i think, but il check it of course, lots of bugs crop up :)

I will set the bodies removal to 100, i think its only at 50 right now.

I wonder if you found a bug, when the spawns were not "following" you... il have a look at that too

Cheers

B

I just found generally that I could also pretty much anticipate where and at what interval AI would spawn.

This was something I hadn't experienced with the singleplayer version.

And I guess the best way to describe being able to "escape" the AI generated soldiers, is as Old_Painless had mentioned, they seem to "dry out", the further I got away from a particular area.

[anelaidlives 10]

In SP on Takistan, I have noticed after some time that the spawning of OPFOR "dry out", after we have overcome the first waves. Not sure what would happen if I waited a bit longer though. I'll try waiting longer and relocating - ff there is an issue, what would be helpful for debugging (the RPT, a savegame or something else)?

I've had this issue pop in zargabad, it happened after I saved when I was in the mansion right next to the main city. I reloaded it a couple of weeks later, and all the op-for stopped spawning.

[orcinus 121]

I think there are at least two things going on that might relate to the 'slowdown' (which I have also noticed, in both of versions 1.20 & 1.21).

Firstly, by design some groups now reach a waypoint & stay there. Unless wiped out by enemies, or the player moves sufficiently far away that the group is deleted & respawned, they won't play much of a role, especially in combination with the second issue.

Secondly, AIUI a group is not re-spawned unless all members are killed off (or, ofc, the player-distance parameter comes into effect). What I've noticed - for both BLUFOR & OPFOR - is that after a while there are a lot of wounded lying around. Even with COSLX this happens, but it does tend to make the trend to slowdown less pronounced. Messing in the editor & adding more medics also a seems to help a bit.

Maybe if there is only one unit left in a group & damage >0.5, have a script delete it after, say, 10 minutes (e.g., to give you or an AI time to rescue the sole team-mate)? - the group should then respawn.

@PD3 - parts of Panthera are also great for jungle warfare scenarios (e.g., SW 'corner'). NAM isn't so good, the jungle is so dense that AI spend most of their time getting stuck. However I play mostly on Podagorsk & Lingor; I like the mix of populated & largely-deserted areas. Lingor has more enterable buildings, nice for CQB with the appropriate mods. The large city in the mid-North of Namalsk is also fun for urban warfare scenarios.

[thomsonb 3]

Hi orcinus

I still cannot not reproduce the slowdowns that have been reported. Sometimes on Zargabad my FPS drops below a steady 50 - 60, but that is due to the map, not the mission. My CPU never goes above around 40% usage....

Im fairly sure that its only other mods that are causing problems for players.

I recommend to everyone to not use other mods with my missions (don't forget, the default Arma2 AI is actually pretty damn realistic and challenging, compared to most games!), or at least use as few mods as possible. I can't test and tweak the mission for everyones mod setup as there are too many variables :)

...some groups now reach a waypoint & stay there...they won't play much of a role...

The groups who stay are either on patrols, or on guard waypoints. When on guard they can move anywhere to engage known enemies.

Right now 50% of groups have this behaviour. I will reduce this in the next update. Currently in the MP version im using 25%, seems to work quite well.

... a group is not re-spawned unless all members are killed off... after a while there are a lot of wounded lying around. ...

This is true, a group will not respawn unless its units are dead, or out of range of player.

However I can't see your point about this causing slow performance, because having wounded units around actually improves performance, because it reduces the unit count!?

On the subject of medics and wounded soldiers and healing..

I hate the default wounding and healing system in Arma2. It is not well implemented(animations crap, sounds crap, no blood, injuries don't slow down squads as they should). It is not realistic recovery from serious wounds. It takes away rather than adding to the gameplay and immersion.

The alternative wounding modules are also bad... Hard to implement on all units in a mission. Units animations when hit and made unconscious are messed up. Unrealistic recovery from serious wounds.

The dragging and carying looks good in youTube videos, but all the other aspects are not good enough to go with it!

I just try and ignore the healing systems in the game!

For me the ideal wounding system in Arma2 would be bloody and realistic, with very low chance of surviving a critical hit from any caliber. And traumatic injuries from other hits. It would be too graphic for a "game" I guess (for example I know in VBS units can have legs and arms blown off or shot off)

Wounded units should need urgent attention from there squad mates, followed by immediate mdevac to a field hospital.

It is beyond my abilities and the performance of the engine to develop a realistic system, and all other systems I have tried seem "gamey" and unrealistic, and allways reduce the immersion factor.

Thats why I have not included many medics in my missions, and just a basic "Apply field dressing" action for the player (if they choose to use it)

What are all your opinions on this?

[kiberkiller 10]

I wish ARMA 3 would feature a realistic injury system, that would be great. Though I'm pretty sure it won't.

I personally like COSLX injury system. At least it's slightly more realistic than the standard system.

[Alpha-Kilo 36]

I also don't like the stock wounding system. When playing Flashpoint I apply field dressings when I have to. This is a way to continue playing, not a simulation of medical treatment. By the way, I often play with COWarMod and SupportCall enabled. COWarMod changes just about everything about the game and SupportCall is a cheat module which can generate vehicles, weapons and much more.

I have tried several wounding systems but I find them all lacking in important aspects. A logistics system for medical care and wounded troops should also be in place. A simplistic approach would be:

- Every soldier can apply bandages to slow bleeding.

- Medics can do a bit more, perhaps stop bleeding, kill the pain and stabilise the aim of the patient.

- Only a field hospital will restore the patient's health completely.

I believe that this is a way to change gameplay and avoid the magic healing we have now but it does not require a lot of extra addons. Does this make any sense?

[JetlinerX 1]

I also don't like the stock wounding system. When playing Flashpoint I apply field dressings when I have to. This is a way to continue playing, not a simulation of medical treatment. By the way, I often play with COWarMod and SupportCall enabled. COWarMod changes just about everything about the game and SupportCall is a cheat module which can generate vehicles, weapons and much more.

I have tried several wounding systems but I find them all lacking in important aspects. A logistics system for medical care and wounded troops should also be in place. A simplistic approach would be:

- Every soldier can apply bandages to slow bleeding.

- Medics can do a bit more, perhaps stop bleeding, kill the pain and stabilise the aim of the patient.

- Only a field hospital will restore the patient's health completely.

I believe that this is a way to change gameplay and avoid the magic healing we have now but it does not require a lot of extra addons. Does this make any sense?

How are you playing with COWarMod without performance loss? I played Flashpoint Cherno with COWarMod, and I go to about 9 FPS. And I definitely have a capable computer... :/

[Fenrisulven 1]

Brilliant mission thomsonb! I like the instant "random" battlefield concept. It works really well on both small and big maps and the AI is fighting you all the way to the objective. :pc:

Do new units spawn close to you along the way or is the number of units fixed?

[JetlinerX 1]

New units spawn when others are killed. ;)

[orcinus 121]

Sorry mate, didn't realise the ambiguity with using "slowdown". I was not referring to FPS at all (which I find good) but to the level of action/encounters. Every group reduced to one ore more wounded with damage>0.5 is one less group in the action, more-or-less irrevocably. If all surviving units in a group have damage >0.5, maybe delete & respawn it after 10 minutes?

Another alternative - rather than leaving a unit if it's the only one of a group left alive (wounded or not), perhaps the group respawn threshold could be changed from 0 to 1 unit?

[kiberkiller 10]

Maybe even check if all units in the group are incapacitated or not? Though I'm not sure if it would conflict with other wounding systems.

[thomsonb 3]

Sorry mate, didn't realise the ambiguity with using "slowdown". I was not referring to FPS at all (which I find good) but to the level of action/encounters. Every group reduced to one ore more wounded with damage>0.5 is one less group in the action, more-or-less irrevocably. If all surviving units in a group have damage >0.5, maybe delete & respawn it after 10 minutes?

Another alternative - rather than leaving a unit if it's the only one of a group left alive (wounded or not), perhaps the group respawn threshold could be changed from 0 to 1 unit?

Hi orc, yeah sorry, I was having my own mental slowdown there, of course it makes sense :)

Thats a good idea to set the threshold to 1 instead of 0. Originally I set it to 0 just to avoid too many groups and fps slowdowns. But seems it takes allot more to slow down the latest multicore cpus

Il test it out in my work in progress version...

[Alpha-Kilo 36]

How are you playing with COWarMod without performance loss? I played Flashpoint Cherno with COWarMod, and I go to about 9 FPS. And I definitely have a capable computer... :/

I don't claim that I can play without a performance loss. I just don't notice it while playing. And I haven't tried Chernarus with COWarMod, yet. On the weekend I'll make a few experiments with Fraps aktivated and then I can give you the result.

[pd3 25]

I wish ARMA 3 would feature a realistic injury system, that would be great. Though I'm pretty sure it won't.

I personally like COSLX injury system. At least it's slightly more realistic than the standard system.

Well, compared to pretty much any milsim out there, its leagues better.

Give it time, hopefully BI doesn't get bogged down trying to appeal to mass markets, and instead realizes that as time and technology progresses, we'll want to see more elaborate simulations represented in games such as this.

---------- Post added at 01:54 ---------- Previous post was at 01:50 ----------

Hi orcinus

I still cannot not reproduce the slowdowns that have been reported. Sometimes on Zargabad my FPS drops below a steady 50 - 60, but that is due to the map, not the mission. My CPU never goes above around 40% usage....

Im fairly sure that its only other mods that are causing problems for players.

I recommend to everyone to not use other mods with my missions (don't forget, the default Arma2 AI is actually pretty damn realistic and challenging, compared to most games!), or at least use as few mods as possible. I can't test and tweak the mission for everyones mod setup as there are too many variables :)

The groups who stay are either on patrols, or on guard waypoints. When on guard they can move anywhere to engage known enemies.

Right now 50% of groups have this behaviour. I will reduce this in the next update. Currently in the MP version im using 25%, seems to work quite well.

This is true, a group will not respawn unless its units are dead, or out of range of player.

However I can't see your point about this causing slow performance, because having wounded units around actually improves performance, because it reduces the unit count!?

On the subject of medics and wounded soldiers and healing..

I hate the default wounding and healing system in Arma2. It is not well implemented(animations crap, sounds crap, no blood, injuries don't slow down squads as they should). It is not realistic recovery from serious wounds. It takes away rather than adding to the gameplay and immersion.

The alternative wounding modules are also bad... Hard to implement on all units in a mission. Units animations when hit and made unconscious are messed up. Unrealistic recovery from serious wounds.

The dragging and carying looks good in youTube videos, but all the other aspects are not good enough to go with it!

I just try and ignore the healing systems in the game!

For me the ideal wounding system in Arma2 would be bloody and realistic, with very low chance of surviving a critical hit from any caliber. And traumatic injuries from other hits. It would be too graphic for a "game" I guess (for example I know in VBS units can have legs and arms blown off or shot off)

Wounded units should need urgent attention from there squad mates, followed by immediate mdevac to a field hospital.

It is beyond my abilities and the performance of the engine to develop a realistic system, and all other systems I have tried seem "gamey" and unrealistic, and allways reduce the immersion factor.

Thats why I have not included many medics in my missions, and just a basic "Apply field dressing" action for the player (if they choose to use it)

What are all your opinions on this?

I actually like the apply field dressing option, in spite of it not being necessarily realistic, the scope and time-scale of the game is such that you will become hampered quite quickly if you take errant gunfire or spash damage from an explosion.

And in the context of co-op, it really sucks being killed and or injured and left out of the game.

I've been playing since OFP, and long gone are the days of me sitting around waiting for the game to end as a seagull/crow/rabbit, etc.

Revive/respawn has got to be my first choice for all Co-op missions I make, as it adds a strategic element to helping wounded comrades, as well as maintaining the flow of gameplay as smoothly as possible.