Will Bohemia finally improve ARMA's PVP to attract New Players?

[batto 17]

yeah, the point i am trying to make: A3 is NOT gonna be designed around PVP MP, no matter how hard you crybaby. get used to it

You should already understand that it's not what I (we) want.

1. you don't know me, and have no idea what types of games i play. One thing for sure, i've took part in most if not all PvP tournaments available and some ladders as well since 206-2007. I have even tried some in OFP days, but my internet connection was really limited back then.

One thing for certain, I haven't seen you in any of those.

I wasn't there. I played OFP on LAN in past and I got A2 recently. Your point? I'm not interested in size of your e-penis and I'm not gonna tell you mine.

2. you can keep all the rest of your boring opinions for yourself.

No problem if you do the same with your stupid/illogic opinions about PvP modes that many people like.

3. I am aware CTF is being played in ArmA too, still the pace of the game is nowhere near UT or Quake.

Yeah, it's more like a tiny little bit slower Counter-Strike phase. I don't remember suggesting that A3 should be faster and have rocket jumps.

Not but it is obvious you don't really think much either.

I didn't mention obvious thing. I expected that smart people will get it. Eg. click middle mouse to get the equipment.

straw argument much

Ignoring the point much?

if you can't grasp the fact that there won't be any fucking UT gamemodes in arma (and unlike you i can put money on it since i know i can't loose any), why don't you go back to playing quake live or whatever other game out there. If any, you can compare Arma PvP MP with AA2/3 raven shield etc.

It seems you don't know much about those modes I mentioned. You should be silent if you don't know what are you talking about. Read something about Onslaught, you'll like it. It's as realistic as current Domination or CTI (the mode, not the underlying game).

maybe you should go bark at a different tree

I'm not scared. Try harder next time.

Edited May 20, 2012 by batto

[Minoza 11]

Because Arma3 isn't a console game.

Nice way to reply, you have pretty much ignored everything I said and took this out of context. So a good PvP support is only for consoles I guess, is that it?

BECAUSE:

1. both BF3 and COD are games designed AROUND PVP Multiplayer (battlelog browser, achievements, unlocks, perfectly symmetric speced weapons and balanced to the micron multiplayer etc etc).

Arma is designed around the sandbox - do your own thing as you please - concept, which is right at the other end of the scale.

2. Both COD and BF3 target platform is XBOX and PS3, and NOT the PC. Yes, it runs on PC just as well, but everything from the control schemes to the features (or lack of such as lean) are designed with consoles in mind.

I said it before, and i am gonna say it again: i am certain celery will make a wonderful job designed out of the box pvp missions.

That said, some of you would expect this game to have certain features you are able to find in your generic public PVP oriented shooter. Don't have your bubble burst when that is NOT gonna happen.

I'm pretty confident BIS is aware of how important PvP is by now. I never claimed it should be built around PvP, nor it should be in order to compete with the mentioned titles in that manner.

Edited May 20, 2012 by Minoza

[LeeManatee 4]

I come from BF franchise.. while BF2, BF2142, BF1942 where really great game which were a mix between arma and COD, now BF has "evolved" in a bad copy of COD.

Don't let Arma fall in that tunnel!

erm.. you don't even played arma yet.

the point is to add replayable good quality pvp missions into vanilla. noone is talking about changing arma formula, because there should not be any changes. just improvements? adding new features and polishing the game over and over again.

[NielsS 10]

The point is to add replayable good quality pvp missions into vanilla.

I'm sorry but isn't this impossible? PVP maps/missions are always the same no matter how much you play them. It's no suprise that CODMW3 is getting 20 DLC's, because they don't expect people to keep playing the same maps/missions over and over again.

[LeeManatee 4]

I'm sorry but isn't this impossible? PVP maps/missions are always the same no matter how much you play them.

emm cti is pretty much pvp and pretty much replayable, so i guess this is possible, but in case of cti it was a bit complicated to get hang of.

[crazyjake56 10]

I'm sorry but isn't this impossible? PVP maps/missions are always the same no matter how much you play them. It's no suprise that CODMW3 is getting 20 DLC's, because they don't expect people to keep playing the same maps/missions over and over again.

Or it's getting 20 DLC's because activision they can get away with that.

[batto 17]

I'm sorry but isn't this impossible? PVP maps/missions are always the same no matter how much you play them. It's no suprise that CODMW3 is getting 20 DLC's, because they don't expect people to keep playing the same maps/missions over and over again.

I don't agree. Look at Counter-Strike maps, especially de_dust2. It's almost 10 more than 10 years old game and still there are 24/7 de_dust2 servers filled with players. It's similar with other classic maps like de_aztec, de_train, de_nuke, ... IMO CoD:MW3 DLCs are mostly for causals, the run & shoot ones, the way of getting more money, especially on consoles.

Btw, CoD is actually the worst example of PvP. It does everything wrong. Instead of buying or picking up equipment they came up with 5 classses which you can't change without disconnect. Guns are accurate like lasers. They copied bomb defusal (Search & Destroy) but changed it to worse (you know where is bomb planted). No other great team PvP mode. And of course most retarded MP thing that should've stayed in Diablo, WoW & other RPG crap: TEH UNLOCKS (there's a workaround to unlock all on older MWs).

Edited May 20, 2012 by batto

[LeeManatee 4]

I don't agree. Look at Counter-Strike maps, especially de_dust2. It's almost 10 years old game and still there are 24/7 de_dust2 servers filled with players. It's similar with other classic maps like de_aztec, de_train, de_nuke, ...

cs is phenomenon. it doesn't apply to any other games case, tho you can say that domination/evolution is arma-like "dust2"

IMO CoD:MW3 DLCs are mostly for causals, the run & shoot ones,

CoD is actually the worst example of PvP. It does everything wrong. Instead of blablablabla details...

thanks g-d i don't play any other games then arma, il-2 and dcs series.

[batto 17]

cs is phenomenon. it doesn't apply to any other games case, tho you can say that domination/evolution is arma-like "dust2"

People doesn't play CS because it's a phenomen but because it's fun. It applies to other games as well. Since initial release CoD:MW1 public servers has same maps.

[Dragonshot 1]

The thread title should have been "How to improve Arma's PVP MP to attract more players".

[max power 21]

If lockdown wishes the thread title to be changed, he may request it :)

[zoog 18]

yeah, the point i am trying to make: A3 is NOT gonna be designed around PVP MP, no matter how hard you crybaby. get used to it

Nobody is asking for this. We're just looking for ways how the PvP element in Arma can get some attention as well.

cs is phenomenon. it doesn't apply to any other games case, tho you can say that domination/evolution is arma-like "dust2". thanks g-d i don't play any other games then arma, il-2 and dcs series.

Not true. I have played Raven Shield PvP on the same maps for years. Every match was good or even better as the previous one. The same match over and over again never got old. And I'm not even talking about gamemodes with objectives. Add objectives to the mix and you might play it till next Arma installment comes out.

Besides, how would you even know its impossible if you only play arma, il-2 and dcs series ;) :p hehe

[jonneymendoza 10]

You do realize that CoD and BF are popular in MP simply because anyone can play it at random servers due to their extremely primitive gameplay and a complete lack of teamwork?

ArmA at its core can't be played like that. Besides why would you want to play ArmA like that? This game is about teamwork and tactics.

So explain to me how DayZ a game which flourish teaming up with people has made BI a HUGE chunk of cash due to that mod?

My point is that teamplay has nothing to do with popularity of a game. if a game is good and unique, people will buy it regardless if its team orientated or not.

DayZ mod still uses the same mechanics of Arma 2. its just that it has zombies to contest with and persistant online saving of your character. thats it.

the realism and physics are still there.

---------- Post added at 12:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:29 PM ----------

What i would love from Arma 3 is more of a PvPvPvE type game where you have multiple factions either fighting eachother or teaming up together to take down the AI.

Why does a game have to be either PVe or PVP? why cant a game have multiple factions/sides?

[rye1 21]

If lockdown wishes the thread title to be changed, he may request it :)

He, and we all, wish you kill it with fire.

[LeeManatee 4]

Besides, how would you even know its impossible if you only play arma, il-2 and dcs series ;) :p hehe

hehe, you are probably right, tho i try out some new games from time to time ; ) but still stuck with these ^

So explain to me how DayZ a game which flourish teaming up with people has made BI a HUGE chunk of cash due to that mod?

hell if i know, most likely when people read/hear the word "ArmA" they imagine overcomplicated extremely hardcore military simulator which can run only on NASA supercomputers, while the game is plain simple and not that scary when you get hang of it.

and when they read/hear "mod" "Zombies" they imagine stuff like garrys mod/day of defeat/left4dead, and after all these youtube videos/whatever they come up with straight idea that dayz is a new "stalker", thinking like this mod is very distant from original ArmA, while... VVV

DayZ mod still uses the same mechanics of Arma 2. its just that it has zombies to contest with and persistant online saving of your character. thats it.

but how many people know that?

What i would love from Arma 3 is more of a PvPvPvE type game where you have multiple factions either fighting eachother or teaming up together to take down the AI.

Why does a game have to be either PVe or PVP? why cant a game have multiple factions/sides?

ever played warfare? this is exacly pvpvpve you are talking about

aaaaanyway

ArmA always needed (and still need) more promotion of it's benefits and showcase gamemodes and mods on youtube, so casuals will see that game is awesome, but not their average cod/bf. when you see a massive assault with 5-7 helicopters over your head, tanks entering the town, lavs, cars, planes shooting rockets while you and your squad mates rushing into town with chaos all around and commander yell on radio to move, this is not what you can see/experience in any other games. the point is to show it right, to make it obvious that arma is huge scaled and epic

Edited May 21, 2012 by n7snk

[jonneymendoza 10]

hehe, you are probably right, tho i try out some new games from time to time ; ) but still stuck with these ^

hell if i know, most likely when people read/hear the word "ArmA" they imagine overcomplicated extremely hardcore military simulator which can run only on NASA supercomputers, while the game is plain simple and not that scary when you get hang of it.

and when they read/hear "mod" "Zombies" they imagine stuff like garrys mod/day of defeat/left4dead, and after all these youtube videos/whatever they come up with straight idea that dayz is a new "stalker", thinking like this mod is very distant from original ArmA, while... VVV

but how many people know that?

ever played warfare? this is exacly pvpvpve you are talking about

aaaaanyway

ArmA always needed (and still need) more promotion of it's benefits and showcase gamemodes and mods on youtube, so casuals will see that game is awesome, but not their average cod/bf. when you see a massive assault with 5-7 helicopters over your head, tanks entering the town, lavs, cars, planes shooting rockets while you and your squad mates rushing into town with chaos all around and commander yell on radio to move, this is not what you can see/experience in any other games. the point is to show it right, to make it obvious that arma is huge scaled and epic

so you agree with my point then :)

Anyways yea i tried warfare at launch but it died down quite fast. they need to work on the CQC in this game in order for PvP to be more appealing.

[LockDOwn 0]

I think this thread should end. Because nobody seems to understand what the OP meant with 'compete', and all ensuing responses are totally irrelevant and sometimes even hateful for no reason. It's a sad state of affairs that the Arma community takes any (even misunderstood) chance to say immature things about other games and their players just because they are not their cup of tea. How many times have BF players actively hated on the Arma series?

Going to change title of this thread.

Edited May 22, 2012 by LockDOwn

[pathetic_berserker 4]

Going to change title of this thread.

That would be a wise move.

and I will agree with Dragonshot on this much,

The thread title should have been "How to improve Arma's PVP MP to attract more players".

[max power 21]

Going to change title of this thread.

You can contact me or any moderator with your new title and we'll change it.

[njmatrix 2]

Day Z is kinda an abortion for ArmA2. actually I am sure it was one Devs love for Zombies but truly it isnt gonna compete with L4D or Killing Floor. Zombie games are hot right now and I like the idea and look of DayZ but I don't see DayZ having staying power like the 2 games named. ArmA just doesn't have near the people playing to ever break into the PVP market. Your talking comparing ArmA series .. a used 74 VW Beetle to COD/BF3... a 2012 Ferrari. One is sluggish,clunky,leaks oil bad and always needs work definitely made for a nitch crowd and a Ferrari is a slick ,fast high profile, high dollar machine that everybody wants to be.. well except that Beetle owner that is... I see it being a fad like Sahrani Life.

[Dragonshot 1]

Day Z is kinda an abortion for ArmA2. actually I am sure it was one Devs love for Zombies but truly it isnt gonna compete with L4D or Killing Floor.

Arma2 is currently steams top seller

http://www.giantbomb.com/forums/general-discussion/30/arma-2-is-the-top-seller-on-steam/547787/

Marek and Lord Buchta will now be able to afford private jets to fly them to Limnos again for more sun tanning.

[pathetic_berserker 4]

ArmA just doesn't have near the people playing to ever break into the PVP market. Your talking comparing ArmA series .. a used 74 VW Beetle to COD/BF3... a 2012 Ferrari. One is sluggish,clunky,leaks oil bad and always needs work definitely made for a nitch crowd and a Ferrari is a slick ,fast high profile, high dollar machine that everybody wants to be.. well except that Beetle owner that is....

lol yet another who has not only missed the point but got the comparison wrong. Beatle is every day object for the masses. Ferrari is for those can handle it.:p

[metalcraze 290]

More like ArmA series is like an experimental supercar from Le Mans 24. Requires a lot of money for parts (PC) to run and skills (learning to play) to win the race. It has an engine with so many horses it can give the power to the driver (modder & player) 95% of other cars can't. Even a decade later older version still pushes out a lot of power (OFP).

CoD and BF are Ford Focus and Chevrolet Lacetti. Very simple and accessible cars that millions can drive - they have nothing special and you will switch them whenever another newer one comes out forgetting about them forever.

[SexParty 1]

I understand the point perfectly, what you need to accept is that Arma simply cannot compete with those games because the fact is that the people who play those games desire fast and furious house to house and room to foom firefights. We all know that Arma is far too clunky for fighting fluidly indoors.

No, you're still missing the point. If done right it can be made accessable and fluid enough to bring in those players. Most battlefield players hate battlefield, they only don't play ARMA because it's too clunky. Make ARMA a fluid streamlined expereince but retain the highly skill based learning curve and keep teamplay necessary to stand a chance against an enemy force and they will ditch battlefield in seconds to play this because it's all what they want. And in reality it's what ARMA fans should want to. A more fluid and realistic expereince indoors and out so the game can progress. Not fast paced bullshit like battlefield but fluid and realistic.

I've said it before the game already has the expereince and the satisfaction when using team work and tactics to take down enemy forces and objectives, it just needs to be more accessable. And if done right it would be the number one selling PC FPS with no equal. But in all honesty I don't see it happening. It has the potential with MODs to maybe showcase this but who knows until Alpha.

America's Army was slower than battlefield and other casual shooters but still more fast paced than milsims like ARMA and it is one of the top 5 most played online PC games of all time. So don't tell me gamers don't want a slower, higher skill and tactical shooter because they do, thats your proof. They just want it accessable and fun. Something that ARMA just lacks in a lot of the time due to the way the game is structured.

I'm not saying lower the threshold but make it more accessable and improve the game so it's more fluid (gameplay, controlls, connectivity etc).

[Nicholas 5]

America's Army was slower than battlefield and other casual shooters but still more fast paced than milsims like ARMA and it is one of the top 5 most played online PC games of all time. So don't tell me gamers don't want a slower, higher skill and tactical shooter because they do, thats your proof. They just want it accessable and fun. Something that ARMA just lacks in a lot of the time due to the way the game is structured.

It seems that most of the players play America's Army like it's Call of Duty or Battlefield though. The only cool thing that I liked about America's Army was the training, especially the medical stuff.