Why do you enjoy playing military wargames?

[Frostburg 10]

Interesting point Jakerod.

I don't mean to go off topic. As a fellow psych major, what

do you recommend for a psychology student? I mean in terms

of being looked favorably upon by grad schools?

I understand from studies that one would want to choose a grad

school that has a strong emphasis in the specific program one

wants to go into. Personally I am thinking either clinical psych counseling

or conducting neurological research, more likely counseling as a clinical

psychologist.

Like I said, I don't want to go off-topic from my thread, so just PM

me if you want.

[Beagle 684]

C'mon psycho boys, Freud is dead... the new God in behaviorism is Professor Harald Euler ;). But unfortunately even he resigned in 2009 from active academic work.

[Herbal Influence 10]

I would like to add aspects of sure many from a bundle that exist for me.

First there is the aspect of fantasy and creativity and the technical aspects (creating small missions, e.g. scenarios) - BIS games allow a lot of this, easy and fast.

Second there is the aspect of gaming like robber and policeman, seek and hide. The tactial, the 'chess aspect'. Unlike many I don't mind joining a game when my side is already quite crapped, in a bad state ... like a cti with a half run down base. I like, like someone else above said, to 'make the best of a situation', and it's even often more exciting, if the situation is already extremely difficult.

I am still fascinated that a cti (especially I must say in old OFP and there especially crcti's around 2005) fascinates me increasing tension / excitement until the very end, often after 2 or 3 hours. No crime movie, whatever, is able to create that escalating excitement for me - I remember to hear my heart beating, when I managed to place a repair truck in a forest next to the enemy base, building up some stationary weapons and attacking the enemy base from there. In 2002 we were often so excited by just one 3-4 hrs game that we went to a pub later and and gave reports to each other upon the different situations we were in and to calm down with a beer ... ;-)

For that very reason I often thought: Wow, what a cheap entertainment compared to going to a cinema or watching a DVD ... if I divide the money I payed for the BIS games from 2001 on (15 + 50 + 50 Euros?) with the hours of entertainment ... ;-)

Third, after a day of reading about the real cruelties and wars around the world, it gives me the illusion (for some time) not to be a just a victim, reader i.e. spectator, but to be able to fight against "the badness of the world". It seems to help to balance the bad input which puts you in a passive role only. In other words it seems to help me to decrease my frustration on how badly the world works and you can't do anything against it. (Sure you can, in an idealistic point of view, but after a long day of work, you need an easy way ... that brings 'success' even if it's only a virtual one.)

And I liked a lot the intellectual or even philosophical (or just: realistic?) approach of BIS in original and first OFP giving the quotations of famous politicians when you started the game .... it showed that it's not just another shiny thoughtless cheap Hollywood-like recruiting shit, like "TOP GUN" or "Americas Army" - blonde woman and mindless, but handsome guy, Tom-Cruise-style ...

I always looked on BIS games like being a game for quite a thougthful audience.

I would very much appreciate if they would again introduce the game like in that times with these quotations ... it created a serious atmosphere, far away from being just another first-person-shooter.

And I like another serious approach: BIS doesn't care so much for (unrealistic) bombastic effects (gore, realism of movements, graphics, sounds etc.) for it always seems to have in mind to be a serious simulation.

Though I enjoy the better graphics of Arma2 and OA I still have had the most exciting games in the old OFP for it is more on tactics ... a phenomenon I cannot really explain. As if the better graphics would hinder my immersion .... I know thats strange. I said I have no explanation for that effect.

[joogrr 10]

War is fascinating business for those who never experienced it IRL. The popularity of war games is probably due to a general curiosity and a subconscious desire to understand what people experience during the heat of battle. Personally I prefer Arma for the problem solving aspect of it. I tend to enjoy strategy and tactical war games simply because they help me relax and stop thinking about work :p

I don't consider Arma to be a "violent game" like for example the GTA series. It's more down to earth and realistic. In Arma you suffer the consequences for lacking tactics and common sense. In that regard I consider BIS to be a more mature and responsible developer then most. I also admire BIS integrity for keeping the Flashpoint formula intact (despite Codemasters attempt to destroy it). BIS experience in the field from working with military and armed forces, developing training tools (VBS) parallel to Arma puts them in a unique situation where they can keep developing detailed and rich military simulations such as Arma, that is appreciated by both military and civilians from all over the world.

[*LK1* 10]

I would say that as far as ArmA II goes it is the creativity and problem-solving aspect of it that I like as well as the freedom that the game offers.

ye. sure. but i guess that we cant understimate the virtual militaristic violence inside arma 2. it's a factor that brings a lot of people to play this game.

---------- Post added at 04:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:22 PM ----------

War is fascinating business for those who never experienced it IRL. The popularity of war games is probably due to a general curiosity and a subconscious desire to understand what people experience during the heat of battle.

* couldn't say better.

[dmarkwick 261]

I'm a big fan of emergent behaviour. Playing the same scenario that goes wildly different each time is endlessly fascinating to me. Even slight initial condition differences can produce completely different situations, extending any mission you make's replayability almost endlessly.

[JdB 151]

War is fascinating business for those who never experienced it IRL. The popularity of war games is probably due to a general curiosity and a subconscious desire to understand what people experience during the heat of battle.

Throughout the years since 2001, I have talked to people that have been in combat, and I have since concluded that no one will ever know what it feels like to be in combat unless they experience it for themselves. That hasn't changed the way I play the game though, and it also hasn't changed the way I see BIS games, or violence in video games and movies in general, with the exception of pointless (imo) movies like Saw, featuring pointless depictions of pointless violence, torture-porn. Meant to (sell by) shock (factor), not thrill, excite or frighten as a good horror movie does. If ArmA have body parts flying off just like that on every hit just to sell the game to teens that like to see gore, I wouldn't like the game anymore either.

I don't consider Arma to be a "violent game" like for example the GTA series. It's more down to earth and realistic. In Arma you suffer the consequences for lacking tactics and common sense.

For me there are three types of violence in ArmA. Necessary violence - surviving contact with the enemy or completing an objective. Optional violence - secondary objectives and targets of opportunity. And finally stupid (psychopathic) violence -shooting unarmed civilians which hurts you later on in the storyline or score, shooting without positive identification thereby revealing your position etc.

If an enemy posses no threat to friendly forces I tend to leave them be, also because it saves ammunition for when it's really needed, and provides safety and concealment. In GTA you might get a slightly higher warning level, but ultimately it doesn't matter that much. You can kill hundreds of pedestrians in a matter of a few hours and it won't make much of a difference to the way the game plays out (story wise). That's what I like about ArmA games, virtually every action has a consequence.

[HyperU2 11]

I think I left out my favorite part, I play them to piss off people who think they should be banned.

[froggyluv 2136]

Did a report in 5th grade on Julius Caesar and loved learning about tactical fighting especially using terrain.

Back then neighborhood kids only a few "rich" ones had toy guns where we had sticks as rifles. Hours long games of tactical ambush using the honor system of "hit" was all we had but I was addicted.

[celery 8]

Why does a bear shit in the woods?

[katipo66 94]

It's gameplay, it's a game, they are all just games, Every game has an objective and different ways of acheiving that objective, some are arena type games, some are a lot larger in scale and some are just about right in size.

Some are more immersive with gore/blood or death animations, but it's not the violence that drives the game, it's the gameplay.. some games have it close too perfect for their game style, some dont.

Edited September 5, 2011 by Katipo66

[Darkhorse 1-6 16]

I have attended UFO cult seminars, interviewed members of fetish or BDSM clubs, white supremacy groups, animal rights organizations such as ALF, and zoosexuals.

I am interested in all aspects of western society.

So that's western society. I now understand why several Muslim nations want us wiped off the face of the earth. :p

As for your question, I play it because it's enjoyable. You rarely get cussed out by an 8 year old who you just shot, (Halo. I've experienced this, even a 6 year old once) it's got good graphics, semi-tolerable AI, and so far has been well worth the money I paid for it.

It has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that when I was 8 I apparently reworked the strategy used by the Confederacy at Gettysburg. Nor the fact that I was born on, and spent most of my life on/around, a military post. I highly doubt it's because I enjoy creating/playing missions that are done on more of a strategic level, instead of the normal tactical. Nope, those things are completely unrelated.

[HyperU2 11]

hWCtfUgBtNw

[Frostburg 10]

So that's western society. I now understand why several Muslim nations want us wiped off the face of the earth. :p

As for your question, I play it because it's enjoyable. You rarely get cussed out by an 8 year old who you just shot, (Halo. I've experienced this, even a 6 year old once) it's got good graphics, semi-tolerable AI, and so far has been well worth the money I paid for it.

It has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that when I was 8 I apparently reworked the strategy used by the Confederacy at Gettysburg. Nor the fact that I was born on, and spent most of my life on/around, a military post. I highly doubt it's because I enjoy creating/playing missions that are done on more of a strategic level, instead of the normal tactical. Nope, those things are completely unrelated.

Well for the most part, those things I mentioned are on the outskirts of American society. As a psychology student I enjoy investigating the unusual, not the normal.

However, a few of those things I mentioned are far more prolific in western society than many people realize. Take for example the fetish/BDSM clubs.

They are extremely secretive and hidden, but they are virtually everywhere.

Take your typical mid-western town in the middle of nowhere that doesn't even have a shopping mall. There is a good chance that they might have an organization like the one mentioned above.

As I said, the organizations are very secretive about their existence and membership due to the social, professional, and legal consequences of being identified as a member of such an organization.

The interesting thing is the members often do not appear to be anything that one would normally expect. Most look like and are infact regular church going aunts, uncles, and grand parents. Many prominent people have been members of such organizations including past presidents, politicians, judges, law enforcement officials, doctors, pretty much anyone. The average age of members I have seen seems to be around 40 and above. Most are caucasian.

I believe that human sexuality is the most powerful driving force and motivations behind what people do in life. It is interesting to see the sexual interests of normal people in their private lives. Many of these people do things that most people would consider extreme or crazy. It is noteworthy

that so many people do things that are very counter to the conventions promoted by friends, family, and community.

I find such practices and beliefs to be fascinating. I enjoy psychology and learning about the human psyche and those of other species.

Anyways, I really hate to digress, but you made an interesting remark which I wanted to explain.

Let's get back to the topic of video games.

[Frostburg 10]

Err, now thinking back on my previous post.

Perhaps it would be best if it got deleted. It is very offtopic

from my thread as well as the forum, and I don't think it is appropriate

for this website.

If any administrative person on this site can delete my last post, please do so

if you think that would be an appropriate action to take.

Apologies to anyone who was offended. I tend to get very

talkative and conversational about my various ideas, opinions, and

experiences which then leads me to digress.

Such a post is wholly inappropriate for the general population of this

forum.

[joogrr 10]

Err, now thinking back on my previous post.

Perhaps it would be best if it got deleted. It is very offtopic

from my thread as well as the forum, and I don't think it is appropriate

for this website.

If any administrative person on this site can delete my last post, please do so

if you think that would be an appropriate action to take.

Apologies to anyone who was offended. I tend to get very

talkative and conversational about my various ideas, opinions, and

experiences which then leads me to digress.

Such a post is wholly inappropriate for the general population of this

forum.

No worries you did an interesting analysis. I disagree however. I don't think that sexuality is the primary driving force behind peoples actions in life. What would the world look like if that was true :D I think prestige and possibly subconscious ideals is the main motivation behind what most people do in life. For example women tend to pursue their childhood dreams of a big marriage no matter the consequences. The desire to make a successful career is also a very strong motivational force. Power, wealth and influence.. the usual stuff. Luckily we also have people who simply strive to become better human beings and who don't value materialistic things as much. What most people seem to forget however is that none of these things are really important. These goals are rarely key to happiness. It's the journey that is really important. We all have dreams and hopes about what we would like to do and experience before we die. What if you suddenly realize you have wasted all your life to pursue those goals and never really lived? What a sinister awakening that would be.

John Lennon was right. "Life is a ride".

[froggyluv 2136]

No worries you did an interesting analysis. I disagree however. I don't think For example women tend to pursue their childhood dreams of a big marriage no matter the consequences. The desire to make a successful career is also a very strong motivational force. Power, wealth and influence.. the usual stuff.

One could argue that one seeks power, wealth etc.. to attract the best mate. The big wedding also includes a "prince" which is also sexual in a sense.

Luckily we also have people who simply strive to become better human beings and who don't value materialistic things as much.

Perhaps but even in the altruistic, "hippy" circles -positioning oneself for hottest hippy chick runs strong. Witnessed this firsthand :p

Theres really nothing funnier then watching Beta males battle it via congo drum, guitar, poetry and extended listening bouts.

Edited September 7, 2011 by froggyluv

[joogrr 10]

One could argue that one seeks power, wealth etc.. to attract the best mate. The big wedding also includes a "prince" which is also sexual in a sense.

Perhaps but even in the altruistic, "hippy" circles -positioning oneself for hottest hippy chick runs strong. Witnessed this firsthand :p

Theres really nothing funnier then watching Beta males battle it via congo drum, guitar, poetry and extended listening bouts.

You have a point. Most of us however are not constantly on the hunt for a new mate :rolleyes: People spend a lot of time pursuing various passions and interests. May it be playing war games, fishing, hunting, climbing or racing. Where is the sexual connection in that I wonder. Sure a bachelors perception of reality is a little different from someone who have been married for 30 years (not referring to me).

[froggyluv 2136]

People spend a lot of time pursuing various passions and interests. May it be playing war games, fishing, hunting, climbing or racing. Where is the sexual connection in that I wonder.

Well I think sexuality can be the primary drive but a person can still have secondary interests and hobbies. I'm sure you're right that there are some people whose sexual drive is secondary or even rarer, non-existent. Others are perhaps frustrated in their ability to indulge their sexual drive, and out of frustration, channel their energies out elsewhere.

[Frostburg 10]

Froggyluv,

Your observations about male courtship behavior are similar to mine.

I know what you are talking about in some hippie circles. It is kindof

amusing. However, your observations are generalizations but there

is much truth to them.

I have personally observed and taken part in many different groups

or "cliques" just to feel them out. I find this very interesting.

Guys almost always are out "looking" if they are single.

Like for example, I started attending church several years ago just to find some new

people to hang out with when I moved to a new city.

One thing I noticed is that many many many young people who go to churches that have a strong population of young people are sortof on the lookout for their girl or guy.

I mean holy cow, CHURCH! Not the first place I thought people would

go to find a significant other. But it is probably one of the most or second most popular reason young people early 20s to early 30s go to church.

Many people also go to find a good supporting network of friends to hang out with. And ofcourse nearly all have an interest in the religion themselves.

But it is obvious that one of the side reasons many young christian singles go is to meet new people of the opposite sex.

Match.com and eHarmony.com has got NOTHING on church. I have seen

sooo many different people meet up and within a few weeks start hanging out and dating people they met in church.

I actually considered it because I saw soooo many nice looking girls take some interest in

me and I could tell they were feeling me out. But that's not why I go there. I went there years ago to help myself deal with war related issues.

Anyways, sexual attraction and whatnot is a very interesting topic.

Feel free to post your opinion on this if you would like, however, remember I started

this thread to get an understanding of the video game playing community and such.

[metalcraze 290]

I enjoy a war that doesn't involve me risking my life and killing people.

Thus I enjoy ArmA.

[Daniel 0]

I'm tipping that most ARMA fans have been fascinated with military units and weapons for as long as they can remember. I can't put my finger on exactly what sparked my attraction to wargames and the military in general but I can still remember playing with those little green army figurines in my bedroom when I was a little kid. Instinctive behavior? Possibly.

This is it for me. My Dad bought me and my brother a tub of Army Men when we were old enough to know not to eat them. It kind of took flight from there. I also love the application of tactics in games like Arma, seeing stuff work, and the odd adrenaline rush when things go really good or really bad. Same goes for airsoft I suppose, running around with sticks and toy guns in fields as a kid.

[Frostburg 10]

Most of us however are not constantly on the hunt for a new mate

Speak for youself bud, speak for yourself. Haha.

Sorry, but I am a hard charging former Marine who is now in a college environment.

There are gorgeous girls EVERYWHERE here. And they are almost all interested

in meeting some new guy. Sorry man, but I have a weakness for a new

beautiful girl.

It's kind of funny. Spending years training and going on deployment without

really even seeing a living female, I now am in the position where I need to

choose between several good looking women. It's not a bad problem to

have, but it strangely IS a problem. Haha.

MAN, if only I knew back then what I know now...

[JdB 151]

Spending years training and going on deployment without really even seeing a living female

Isn't it true what they say? That after 6 months in the AO every female POG, no matter how ugly, starts to look like a supermodel? ;)

[Beagle 684]

Isn't it true what they say? That after 6 months in the AO every female POG, no matter how ugly, starts to look like a supermodel? ;)

Yes, it did for me and it took only 3 months (boot camp) ;)