AH-64D Tweaks and Features (OA)

[ESheppard 10]

I'll list a few here. I urge the community to vote on whether they like any of these ideas in the poll I'll include, and if so, to specify which. Remember, you'll be able to choose more than one option! And if you dislike all thes ideas, please tell us why.

1. AH-64D Laser Designator (Same type as ULB)

I was rather pleased when I found out that Operation Arrowhead was to feature a UAV equipped with a laser to guide hellfire strikes onto any target. It greatly widened the range of targets that the Apache could engage with that weapon, and naturally, I was excited.

However, upon buying Operation Arrowhead, I was very disappointed to discover that the Apache itself did not come equipped with such a laser. While I realise that the Longbow Hellfire is designed to be able to establish a radar lock on radar contacts, I do believe it is still possible to use lasers to guide them, and it would be, I think, a very welcome game mechanic in ArmA 2: OA. Allow me to recommend using the "L" key in the gunner seat to toggle the laser on and off.

2. Pilot M230 Chain Gun Control

I'd like the pilot to be able to use the alt-look feature to direct the 30mm cannon in Manual Fire mode. An even better option would be to allow the pilot access to the FLIR TV when in auto-hover mode.

3. Various visual model tweaks and fixes

Requesting AH-64D Radar Dome model fix for ArmA 2 and ArmA 2: OA

The Apache Longbow is my favorite attack chopper, and its addition to the game was one of the reasons I finally decided to buy Arma 2 and Arma 2: Operation Arrowhead. However, something strikes me as a little off about the model - the Longbow radar dome. It is admittedly a small discrepancy, and not one that would trouble most people at all, but such things tend to grow in my mind and irritate me in the long run.

Here are a few reference photos of Longbow radar domes:

http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/7764946/2/istockphoto_7764946-longbow-radar-apache-helicopter.jpg

http://www.ivanirlamphotography.co.uk/images/Main%20Images/IIP-Apache-Fairford-600dpi.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Apache_Longbow_Gesamtansicht.JPG

http://media.defenseindustrydaily.com/images/AIR_AH-64D_Over_Water_Frontal_lg.jpg

http://www.es.northropgrumman.com/solutions/longbowradar/assets/longbow1.jpg

As you can see, the radar dome is rounded - flat on top and distinctly curved on its sides. Compare that to the picture of the Apache in ArmA 2, shown below.

http://www.pcgamersworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/ARMA2-Arrowhead-vehicles-Apache.jpg

The radar dome on BIS's version of the chopper is much more flat on the sides, and it doesn't look right at all. Is it possible for a little model editing to be done to fix this?

AH-64D Matte Finish

The BIS apache is rather shiny. Compared to the pictures linked above of the real deal, it does tend to stand out quite a bit. Can that shine be toned down a little more at all?

Edited August 14, 2010 by The Coyote

[Daniel 0]

Not bad, good call on the radome. I'm sure RKSL can be more specific on the model inaccuracies if you ask him. :P

Some other features to consider.

- Front and back seats both have access to both TADS and PNVS (or just gunner TADS and just pilot PNVS if limited by the game engine).

- Co-operative rocket firing.

- 10 and 20 round burst modes for the 30mm cannon.

Can someone confirm that Longbow Hellfires can indeed be guided by laser? I was under the impression that was only possibly with the AGM-114K missiles. Eitherway, the AGM-144K should (IMO) come with the BAF DLC since it's focused on counter insurgency warfare rather than massed tank battles in Cold War Europe...

[arthur666 10]

I especially like the idea of accessing FLIR and TV from the pilot seat.

[tyler4171 10]

I like All of them, especially the Matte finish, I know its an issue with the engine though were everything glows...

[Daniel 0]

I like All of them, especially the Matte finish, I know its an issue with the engine though were everything glows...

It's more of a design choice, BIS could easily adjust the values to give it less shine. I agree it should have less shine, and the textures on the Hellfires actually need fixing (lighting error).

Some dust would be very nice too.

[RAIDER32 0]

I was very disappointed to discover that the Apache itself did not come equipped with such a laser. While I realise that the Longbow Hellfire is designed to be able to establish a radar lock on radar contacts, I do believe it is still possible to use lasers to guide them, and it would be, I think, a very welcome game mechanic in ArmA 2: OA. Allow me to recommend using the "L" key in the gunner seat to toggle the laser on and off.

I agree 100%,

The conflict in Takistan may have more armour in it than todays Afghanistan conflict,

but looking at real videos of Apache contacts (patroling or supporting troops) the Hellfire is used alot on groups of enemy, sniper positions, suspect cars or small buildings at longer ranges.

The ability to put a Hellfire wherever you want (from the Apache) would be awesome.

[max power 21]

I don't think that Hellfire II L missiles can be laser guided. I think they are only mmw radar / inertia guided.

[Inkompetent 0]

Eitherway, the AGM-144K should (IMO) come with the BAF DLC since it's focused on counter insurgency warfare rather than massed tank battles in Cold War Europe...

This I totally agree on. Would be neat to get different Hellfire-armaments in the default versions to niche them a bit.

[vasmkd 12]

No point bringing in any of these features unless ur prepared to give other heli's and factions the features or similar features where applicable.

Only then am i all for it

Edited August 14, 2010 by vasmkd

[That guy 10]

No point bringing in any of these features unless ur prepared to give other heli's and factions the features or similar features where applicable.

Only then am i all for it

this. i would be for a technological upgrade only if it spans all aircraft. it would be F'ed up if one chopper was on DCS level wile all the others remained as they are now.

consistency!

[max power 21]

this. i would be for a technological upgrade only if it spans all aircraft. it would be F'ed up if one chopper was on DCS level wile all the others remained as they are now.

consistency!

Why would it be f'ed up? You paid like 10-20 dollars (let's say) for a realistic helicopter and got it. The rest of the helicopters in the game individually cost a matter of cents.

Edited August 14, 2010 by Max Power

[ESheppard 10]

Let other helicopters in the game have tech features based on their real life capability.

[tyler4171 10]

No point bringing in any of these features unless ur prepared to give other heli's and factions the features or similar features where applicable.

Only then am i all for it

Let other helicopters in the game have tech features based on their real life capability

No shine, problem solved if that be the case! :D

[T.S.C.Plage 0]

Concerning...

1. Yes, many more aerials should have designators by default. I think ACE fixes this issue.

2. Is the pilot in reality able to control the gun or even the hellfires? If not I don't see the need for it. Yes, I know for MP but...get a gunner damnit.

3. Actually it's not only the dome but everything above the rotor head. In fact many of the models aren't 100%ly accurate. I guess one reason is to save some polygones. The other is that the 3D artist don't have or get the best reference material (blueprints etc.) for their work nor do they run around the originals with a 3D-scanner. Therefore you'll always have some "anomalies" in the models.

About the shiny look. It's not an "engine limitation" or what ever. You can make them less shining by reworking the "_smdi" textures a bit. Works wonders! I never was a fan of this new "shine" feature introduced with ArmA.

Btw, somethings wrong with the specular of the hellfires. They're nearly looking like chromed if the light comes from the wrong direction.

[Inkompetent 0]

2. Is the pilot in reality able to control the gun or even the hellfires? If not I don't see the need for it. Yes, I know for MP but...get a gunner damnit.

Yes, the pilot can (at least if equipped with helmet-mounted display as in OA) slave the gun to where he looks, and he can take command of all weapons. It is a backup feature for if the gunner would not be able to fire (dead, wounded, or controls damaged). I even think it can be used to help the pilot guide the gunner onto a target (i.e. the pilot can look somewhere, spot something, and 'hint' the gunner with the press of a button to let him accept the cannon to get slewed to the point the pilot saw something at), just like tank commanders can do for the gunner in tanks like the Leopard 2, and I believe Abrams and Challenger as well. Generally all two-seat aerial vehicles have reduntant controls, so that the remaining guy can take over the job of the other one. Usually not with as detailed and good avionics, but it can be done well enough for emergencies.

Edited August 16, 2010 by Inkompetent

[NoRailgunner 0]

The Apache and other helicopters can be controlled from pilot and gunner's position. Guess in most games its wrong by design - to avoid flying Rambo's (and to avoid AI taking over players controls/order).

[Daniel 0]

Think of it like this:

The back seat is more suited to flying the aircraft, while the front seat is better equipped for fighting the aircraft.

At the same time, either station can fly the aircraft, either station can action most of the weaponry (both stations usually work together when firing rockets), and either station can act as the aircraft captain for the mission.

For example, if the pilot spots a muzzle flash that the gunner didn't see, it might be quicker for him to say "My gun", action the cannon and quickly squeeze off a burst on that location, than it would be to talk the gunner onto it.

Likewise, if for whatever reason the pilot has to attend to something, say a system goes down (or if this were possible in game, say his dinner was ready :p), he could say "You have the control" and hand the flying over to the front-seater.

Edited August 21, 2010 by Daniel

[l mandrake 9]

The pilot should to be able to slave the M230 cannon to his TADS eyepiece - this is one of the Apache's most deadly features and is sorely lacking in game IMO. By selecting manual fire, the pilot should be able to take control of the cannon away from the gunner and aim it himself.

(In the British Apache, when taking control of the TADS the pilot should say 'My Gun' instead of 'Manual Fire' - I don't know what the US radio protocol is).

In reality both pilot and gunner in an Apache have full control of all the aircraft's weapons systems (and flight controls incidentally, so the gunner can fly the thing too).

Please add this to the 'to do list' BIS :)

EDIT: Didn't see the post above so sorry for repetition.