Ww1 minimod

[diggin.robat 0]

Hello ProfTournesol and all,

this is my first post in this forum, but I had much fun from all the modders work since the beginning of OFP. In the past I was modding the Close Combat Series, working in teams making WWI mods for CC2, 3 and 5. (See here:

Close Combat Online WWI Forum The Dugout ).

After watching this thread since end of last year, I have much hope on this enterprise on WWI in OFP-terms as some other untertakings fall into sleep.

By now many subjects of this mod seem to be solved and so I´m looking forward to see this mod in action. I will try to help in any way, if time permits.

Right now, I have a question: Will there be any 1914 Cavalry Unit in the mod or planned for future releases?

And yes, OFP is far from dead!

diggin

[ProfTournesol 956]

Thanks to AtSt Walker and the FSJ team, we're allowed to use their flamethrower  

Quote[/b] ]Right now, I have a question: Will there be any 1914 Cavalry Unit in the mod or planned for future releases?

Cavalry may be planned for further releases, not for this one.

Quote[/b] ]Prof Tournesol, what russian canone you like to see in the your mod?

Next artillery in the pipe : Austrian 8 cm FK M5 and Russian Putilov 76,2 mm. I'll only include field artillery in this release. Biger ones will have to wait. Big artillery attacks are simulated thanks to Reyhard artillery barrage script.

[emperor77 0]

Quote[/b] ]And yes, OFP is far from dead!

Amen!

Nice work ProfT! Really nice.

[diggin.robat 0]

Some rough ideas:

- The mod seems to cover mainly 1916-18 period of war. Which makes things more interesting and brings new pioneering weaponry.

Covering 1914 could be worth a submod, but maybe would need some scripting, since warfare and tactics were different. The problems of displaying trenches isn´t that great, as shallow riflepits and improvised breastworks were the norm. Cavalry was used in recce missions (with small Cav. vs. cav clashes) or as mounted infantry. Largly "unspoiled" landscape with almost intact settlements in the first few weeks. Interesting fortress sieges in Belgium and northern France.

- 1916-1918 weaponry should include some models of handgrenades with all their pros and cons (Mills Bomb as a defensive, Stielhandgrante as offensive weapon - different ranges). First improvised "grenade lobbers" to sophicatd models like the Stokes trench mortar, "Toffee apple thrower", french 58mm Spigot and 240mm, german Minenwerfer (lMW 7,6cm, mMW 17cm, sMW 25cm).

Rifle grenade launchers of "cup type" like french Vivien-Bessiers or "rod type" as used by the UK/US-Forces.

Indirect fire weapons and launchers were dominant in trench warfare for obvious reasons and a multitude of them were in use.

- Poison gas. Already some very promising effect were made! Gas warfare was mainly for interdiction. Either attacking enemy positions like frontlines, artillery positions and assembly areas with short time effect gas like chlorine prior to an major offensive or to prevent the enemy of using important areas in the rear by using long time effect like mustard gas, which also effected human skin and corroded bare metal.

- Infantry organisation

German "Gruppe" consisted of 8 men with a NCO. Most were trained in multi roles as grenade thrower, on the rifle grenade launcher or LMG. In best cases all infantry weapons were carried in one Gruppe. Sometimes on Platoon Level specially taked Gruppen were organized for instance with one mainly consisting of rifle grenade armed men and one with a LMG or even only with assault equipment. The german infantry was more flexible on that level as most of the allies.

From 1916 the british and Commonwealth infantry platoons was devided into sections or squads of more or less 9 men. One squad was using the Lewis LMG, another the rifle grenade lauchers and one was armed with rifles and grenades while the last one was the bomber section, equipped with at least 10 grenades a man. US forces followed suit, but with more men in the teams. Of course this lineout of sections was thought to support each other in the assault and trench sweeping.

The French organisation changed several times during the war to meet the evolving demands of trench fighting and some confusion among higher staff. Basically they prefered the same layout of their allies but gave the roles historical names: Voltigeurs were the rifle armed, grenadiers were handgrenadethrower and fusiliers were armed with the Chauchat LMG.

-Speaking of trench sweeping: Both sides used adhoc teams with close combat weapons (clubs, knuckle dusters, trench knifes) and what automatic or rapid fire weapons were available (P08 with 32 rnds magazine, automatic pistols, pump action shotguns and later the only trench broom of the war the Bergmann MP 18). In this way trench raiding was mainly for identification of the enemy units in front. German assault units, the famous Stoßtrupps, were solely formed for major attacks using infiltration tactics.

- Sniping was an important element of controlling no mans land. So special unit with improvised and prototype camoflage suits would be nice. Scopes were basic, but suitable. Even civil hunting rifles were used.

- Mancarried flamethrowers had their debut in this war. The first were of german origin, quickly copied by the allies and mostly used for attacking bunkers. The germans used a single shot "Flammrohr" for some time at Verdun.

- Concrete bunkers were an important element of the "Hindenburg (Siegfried) - Line", but also on other frontlines like Ypres sector. Ranging from huge dugouts for entire companies over MG-bristling resistance points to observation block houses.

-The Tanks and armoured cars look superb and I can´t wait riding them. Main tanks for the given period are the already finished ones and those: British Mark V, Mark V* (fe/male) and the Whippet. French Char Schneider I, uparmoured, II, St Charmand I, II, Renault FT 17 (37mm, MG, 75mm, Radio) Renault, Peugeot armoured car. German AC were not present on the western front.

- Antitank measures were mainly a problem for the germans. Normally a single fieldgun could take on the slow creepers but the infantry was had to find solutions. They came in form of the "SmK"- Munition for rifles and MGs and had an amourpiercing core. Grenade bundles also helped but in 1918 the "Tankgewehr" (tank rifle) was introduced which was a single loader with 13mm and surely the grandfather of all anti tank rifles. Distribution was reasonable before the end of the war, but shooting it was a literally a bonebraking affair...

I guess with my non present OFP editing experience, some of my thoughts are maybe impossible to make. But by now the work which went into the mod is surely already enormous and the picture are really nice and make a dream come true. Thanks for that, Prof Tournesol and all involved!

[diggin.robat 0]

Thanks to AtSt Walker and the FSJ team, we're allowed to use their flamethrower

Quote[/b] ]Right now, I have a question: Will there be any 1914 Cavalry Unit in the mod or planned for future releases?

Cavalry may be planned for further releases, not for this one.

Quote[/b] ]Prof Tournesol, what russian canone you like to see in the your mod?

Next artillery in the pipe : Austrian 8 cm FK M5 and Russian Putilov 76,2 mm. I'll only include field artillery in this release. Biger ones will have to wait. Big artillery attacks are simulated thanks to Reyhard artillery barrage script.

Looks good, much like the first model of the flamethrower. The more common model was the "Kleiner Flammenwerfer" or "Kleif" which looked more like rubber wheel.

At the already mentioned landship page you´ll find excellent plans of the Putilow.

Putilow m/02

In a cut down version it was used as a "Infantriebegleitgeschütz" or "Sturmkanone" for direct fire support.

Scripted artillery sounds good!

diggin

[Inman 0]

ProfTournesol, this link from diggin.robot

Putilow m/02

- is full informate for 76,2 mm russian field canon!

[sudayev 27]

This whole thread and mod should be named "WW1 MOD" now

Flamethrower addon is absolutely hot!

[HxCxFxL 0]

Quote[/b] ]Cavalry may be planned for further releases, not for this one

[diggin.robat 0]

About german flametrowers (on which I have to corrct myself):

There were exactly three types in use:

The "Grossflamenwerfer" (Grof)

Grof

The "Kleinflammenwefer" (Kleif)

Kleif

and the "Wex-type", which was seemingly most common after 1917.

Wex1

Wex2

The Grof was positioned in frontlines, while only Kleif and Wex were were to be man carried. A 2 men team, sometime three, were needed, but the Wex may also be used by one man only. The Wex was the first one with automatic ignition.

Just look for yourself, what I humbly put together:

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=72652

One thing of little less importance was the smoke emitting when firing the projector, which was huge and a welcome smoke cover. flamethrower were also used in dealing with tanks, at least some 1917 training photos suggest it.

Wex in action

Real combat or just Sedan training stormtroops ground is not clear.

diggin

[ProfTournesol 956]

Well first of all thanks for the ANZAC pictures, here's an Australian soldier (helmet variants can be seen behind) :

Quote[/b] ]- Sniping was an important element of controlling no mans land. So special unit with improvised and prototype camoflage suits would be nice. Scopes were basic, but suitable. Even civil hunting rifles were used.

Done, added scoped weapons + snipers.

Quote[/b] ]There were exactly three types in use:

The "Grossflamenwerfer" (Grof)

Grof

The "Kleinflammenwefer" (Kleif)

Kleif

and the "Wex-type", which was seemingly most common after 1917.

Wex1

Wex2

I've seen WW1 pictures of the type of flamethrower i've added (thanks to AtSt Walker), on allied or German side. The "wex" type could be a nice german addition, i've seen one in the WW2EC British pack, maybe should i ask Fab for it...as I'm already indebted for so many models / textures for this mod  

@ diggin.robat : thanks for the ideas / comments, it's very interesting even if i won't be able to implement every thing, mainly due to a lack of time.

Quote[/b] ]Nice work there profT.

although i could be wrong, i reckon you should tilt the helmets backward a little bit, that would make it fit better with the anims, as most of them seem to have the head leaning forward (like that guy lying on the ground dont seem like he can see much with his helmet lining perfectly horizontal to his head if you see what i mean)

keep it up

Fab.

Thanks for the remark, it's done.

[bennie1983nl 0]

OOW AAWH Nice work profT!

[Turkeys 0]

they look so good !

I cant wait to play this mod.

[HxCxFxL 0]

The Anzac pictures are looking really good ProfTournesol.... can't wait to play

[tankieboy 0]

The Anzac pictures are looking really good ProfTournesol.... can't wait to play

What he said!

Love the lip-fluff.

Action; Place another Shrimp on BBQ...

[Bociek78 0]

Nice screenshots and really great work as always.

Polish players are waiting for Your mod, too

[Flashpointman 0]

And czech player too.

Nice work.

[tankieboy 0]

Are you using a Bayonet Script?

Are you doing any Jocks in <s>Skirts</s> Kilts?

I know of a good Mod that did some

Wouldn't take much to convert.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Thanks guys.

Quote[/b] ]Are you using a Bayonet Script?

No, not that time. I'm disappointed with Bayoneting, scripted or not.

Quote[/b] ]Are you doing any Jocks in Skirts Kilts?

I know of a good Mod that did some  

Wouldn't take much to convert.

Yep, some scots have been done, but they look far better than my "old" napoleonic ones : look here :

Firt page of the topic

[tankieboy 0]

Opps. didn't see them! Any Pipes?

Shame about no bayonets.

[TheJackle 0]

No bayonet's!

Can't you copy the excellent bayonet script from the lib mod?

Hand to hand combat was one of the defining features of the trench war, leaving it out of the mod would be unrealistic.

Or could you possibly implement the excellent hand-to-hand combat from the SLX mod?  

Other than that, the mod looks good so-far, exept for the 'mini'. Mybe calling the mod "After the first flashpoint" or "Operation WW1" .

Anyway, keep up the good work!

N.B, you should at least model bayonets onto the ends of the rifles, even if they don't work. Seeing the Tommie go across the barbed wire with there rifles having bayonets fitted ready for the hun is one of the most iconic images of the Great war.

[TheJackle 0]

Sorry to double post.

But does anyone have design drawings, the plans, of a vickers MG? Preferably the aerial version. Thanks. Its for a little addition I'm planning.

[diggin.robat 0]

Hi,

not sure if that will help you:

Better have a look for a suitable wartime manual here:

Vickersmachinegun

What is it going to be? Bristol Fighter?

hope that helps

diggin

PS: For the case someone gets bored...

http://www.enfieldcollector.com/w_at_arms/VickersMG.html

[TheJackle 0]

Thank you        

Those images are perfect.

I looked on Google for  (cough) hours and found nothing. The best that I could come up with was a few pictures from different guns, all different marks .

Thank you again,

Jackle

N.B, the Vickers in the last link (the P.S) is a 1950 addition, which has features not commonly found on WW1 MG's( the belt system, muzzle flaring, sites) ; But thanks anyway.

P.S

The thing that I want to do with the Vickers in flashpoint is to make a few missions. There are several stories from the great war of RFC pilots crashing in no-mans land, or behind enemy lines, to then use there Aircraft's MG to fire upon the foe. In most cases, these pilots where quickly killed.

However, during the first day of the 1916 Somme offensive, a Sopwith Camel crashed behind the German lines-near the German front. The Pilot used his Vickers MG, which he literally ripped from his aircraft, to fire upon approaching German troops; before he was rescued by the advancing French forces. I believe the pilots experience would make quite a nice little mission, after some modification (eg, he had to run to the friendly lines, avoiding the German troops.)

On another note, If no-one is making a Bristol Fighter; I will happily make the plane. . I am surprised that this 'mini' mod hasn't already got one.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Ok, i spent several hours to add weapons with bayonets :

- each riffle is available in two versions : with and without bayonet ;

- most of the units (and groups) are available in two versions : with and without bayonet ;

- bayonet (ie close combat) works the same way as my Napoleonic mod, based on enhanced Ofp strokegun ability without any script (with specific anim, better efficiency and greater priority for AI). Everyone having tried my old mod knows that it works well for the player but that AI doesn't like to use it as long as it has ammuntions left.

@ TheJackle : nice idea. Don't be surprised that all WW1 stuff aren't available in my mod...as i'm working alone    , with GREAT help of some of you (particularly Spad and lot's of guys allowing me to modify their work). So feel free to add everything you want.

@ diggin.robat : thanks for the infos.

[emperor77 0]

ProfT, I love that you have added bayonets!

Is there a way to make the animation of hitting with the dagger a bit faster? Coz in Napoleonic it took quite a while and enemies ran away while i was stabbing them.