Why the fascination with Evolution?

[wolfsblut_ 0]

Since the release at nov 2006 there is a wall-hack-bug in Arma that let you look through walls, buildings etc. :

get a pistole, go prone, zoom and crouch near to a building... thats it. Then you have a free look through everything.  

So with this bug why everybody is babbling around human vs. human is so exicting?

[NeMeSiS 11]

Don't fool yourself, it's not coop anymore if there are two opposing teams with human players on them, no matter how many AI. Admit it, you are a lowly PvP gamer!  

PvP COOP cannot be compared to any PvP game i played, the scale is so much larger that it can radically change your strategy.

Personally im not a big fan of Evolution, its just played too much, there is a ranking system thingy, good teamplay is hard to find and i generally prefer (large) 'scenario's' with just a few objectives.

[neswrossi 0]

I have to agree. The limited number of servers for game are saturated with Evolution. While its good, joining mid game means you have to travel miles across the map just to play and its hard to get a chopper lift from uncooperative players. So I prefer to look for Berzerk servers instead.

Berzerk with the ranking system in place would be great.

[BloodOmen 0]

I just want to see other maps rather than Evolution 24/7.

Last night i entered a game to play a CTF, pretty sure it was Hexenkessel. I had alot more fun than i did on Evolution.

Thats not to say id have lots of fun playing Coops with friends and the community.

So my statement is : Evolution is overplayed and some people should wake up to all the other great maps out there. Server owners please try and vary it

[dmitri 0]

There are plenty of other good PvP and coop missions, the problem is just that people don't bother to try them.

Lets face it, many of the players who love Evo and play it over and over are newer players who enjoy the BF2 style of play. Must get higher score, must get chopper. "Real" coop doesn't suite them.

[celery 8]

Since the release at nov 2006 there is a wall-hack-bug in Arma that let you look through walls, buildings etc. :

get a pistole, go prone, zoom and crouch near to a building... thats it. Then you have a free look through everything.

So with this bug why everybody is babbling around human vs. human is so exicting?

Wow, and do you think that even a fraction of players even bother to do that? From your post one might get the idea that every player out there is pistol proning, looking to the other side of one building. I've never seen one person doing something like that, it's already rare enough to have anyone using pistols because they are so crappy. But if it justifies your superiority compared to PvP folks, that's fine.

[Maciver 0]

Quote[/b] ]I see the small maps as a complete waste of ArmA potential. I play Arma for the huge environments and the mixture of vehicle and infantry combat. The maps being hosted are a reflection of the OFP/ArmA player base. The majority like co-op and CTI. Where the whole map is being used with multiple objectives. Evolution provides a unique RPG style of play and people are playing it alot due to the constant updates and honeymoon period.

I agree. I play alot of evolution because its the whole map. Using all of the vehicles. Lots of teamwork usually. Try joining the servers TS, you'll find even more teamwork. RPG aspect is pretty neat aswell.

It gives you that huge battlefield, on going war feeling. To be honest thats why i like ArmA. When i first bought it i was leary about all the coops. I'm used to PvP gaming. Now i love it.

The other great thing about it is the fact that you dont have a bunch of idots using the choopers, tanks ect. Those griefers are to lazy to get the points so they just TK you at spawn then leave

Someone makes a mod on evolutions scale with teams instead of AI, noobs like me will play it. CTF on a large scale i would love to see. I'm still new so i dont think im ready to delve into making maps yet.

Just my 2 cents.

[whisper 0]

CTF on a large scale i would love to see. I'm still new so i dont think im ready to delve into making maps yet.

Just my 2 cents.

That's my current ("current" like.... I'm on it since January 2007 :P ) plan, well, something like that.

I don't dare ask for help because I find my current work, for the amount of time passed on it, pretty poor, otoh it's really time to get something done

Not enough time, no internet @ home, not easy for me

[acog99 0]

but I also agree that eVolution has to go.

Good thing you're not in charge then huh.

[Espectro (DayZ) 0]

I would like to see a two-sided Evolution. Sort of like everything CTI should have been.

[wamingo 1]

You're trying to talk to a giant. It won't hear you.

Many coop maps are no good for public and populated servers.

No respawn can end you up with unbearable wait times.

Too much time wasted in the lobby with short missions.

Fast respawns and short travel time makes people into rambo's and it quickly gets silly.

Too many design flaws or bugs.

Not flexible enough.

Too linear.

Poor briefings. Or in german...

If you've completed them once you know exactly where everything is even if it's wildly randomized and they'll end up more like chores.

So far I haven't played a pvp mission in ofp or arma that hasn't been incredibly monotonous. If pvp's your thing you might as well play something colorfull like unreal or something.

Either way, if you want to make a mission that will be decently popular you need you make up for all the issues above. Not just some of them.

There are a couple of missions that are a lot like evolution, Aircavalry and that other one whose name slipped my mind. They almost could've been as popular and for a while they were and side by side. But something was missing obviously, I don't remember though.

[celery 8]

If pvp's your thing you might as well play something colorfull like unreal or something.

Why is this brought up in every topic where PvP is discussed? All co-oppers might as well play Ghost Recon or Joint Ops. Isn't that ridiculous? We are all playing ArmA for various reasons and that's the end of the story.

[OldGeezer 0]

No respawn can end you up with unbearable wait times.

Heh heh! That was the biggest complaint on my GR servers...at least with some types of players. I hate respawns and never enabled them. And I always had one response: "Dying is supposed to suck"

When you're playing against humans, and you only get one life, you'd be surprised how careful everyone gets...becomes an entirely different kind of game. I don't care if I have to wait a half an hour or more for the next round. It's like playing poker with real money vs a pile of free plastic chips. Your heart pounds more when you know there's something at stake.

I think respawns are as hoakey as coop is. Not that there's anything wrong with playing coop...it just sucks to some player types and rocks for others.

[MistaCreepy 0]

Ive pretty much only played coop since I bought the game... played a hold game... that was cool but it just felt like every other FPS, except it was harder to shoot people.

Coop gives me that teamwork, the helo inserts/extracts, the fireteam movement, tactics! Now some days the people on the servers wont feel like working together... oh well, I can always find one or two guys that want tp play it right and have fun with them, but some days everyone is on the same page, and man its an experience.

[OldGeezer 0]

Ive pretty much only played coop since I bought the game... played a hold game... that was cool but it just felt like every other FPS, except it was harder to shoot people.

Coop gives me that teamwork, the helo inserts/extracts, the fireteam movement, tactics! Now some days the people on the servers wont feel like working together... oh well, I can always find one or two guys that want tp play it right and have fun with them, but some days everyone is on the same page, and man its an experience.

Your reply makes me wonder if everyone's on the same page as to what "coop" means.

Coop, to me, has always meant a human team vs an AI team. How does playing against humans instead of dumb-as-a-post AI remove the possibility of "helo inserts/extracts, the fireteam movement, tactics"?

[Kwato 0]

Really that's what happens when you got a whole generation of gamers who has only played BF2 and WoW.

And the fact that there are so few players online is pretty sad. I think it is funny how some people say, just wait it will get better. Erm no, it won't.

[Mabes 0]

Maybe kiljoy should add a few SLA slots on the next release of Evolution, I think that would make it a hell of a lot more interesting. I agree about too much evolution though, I'm starting to get sick of it.

Some of my favorite other CoOp maps are: OOPS_City_Take_Ortego_(co10) & OOPS_City_Take_Paraiso_(co14)

On a side note, Celery, we at the 31st MEU have gotten A LOT of laughs (and fun) from your DM map pack, thank you and keep up the good work.

[Maddmatt 1]

There are plenty of other good PvP and coop missions, the problem is just that people don't bother to try them.

Lets face it, many of the players who love Evo and play it over and over are newer players who enjoy the BF2 style of play. Must get higher score, must get chopper. "Real" coop doesn't suite them.

Yes, that is true sadly. But last night on the SGS server we finally played some other coops besides Evo. It was nice to play some other maps, and we enjoyed it. The newer players need to get used to playing something else, if they can't then they will just get sick of the game.

The point system in Evo is one thing I really hate. Guess it prevents morons destroying everything at the start in public games, but for more organised games it's just a pain. It's one thing that's made me sick of Evo.

[MistaCreepy 0]

Ive pretty much only played coop since I bought the game... played a hold game... that was cool but it just felt like every other FPS, except it was harder to shoot people.

Coop gives me that teamwork, the helo inserts/extracts, the fireteam movement, tactics! Now some days the people on the servers wont feel like working together... oh well, I can always find one or two guys that want tp play it right and have fun with them, but some days everyone is on the same page, and man its an experience.

Your reply makes me wonder if everyone's on the same page as to what "coop" means.

Coop, to me, has always meant a human team vs an AI team. How does playing against humans instead of dumb-as-a-post AI remove the possibility of "helo inserts/extracts, the fireteam movement, tactics"?

Im sure it doesnt, but I didnt feel like "Wow this is great!" until I played coop. And to be honest I could care less what you guys play, If you dont want to play evolution, no one is forcing you.

And for the record, Ill play ANY map that comes up... its just that there isnt much coop choice besides evolution and Im not complaining... yet.

[Maddmatt 1]

...its just that there isnt much coop choice besides evolution and Im not complaining... yet.

There are plenty of other good coop missions to play. Sure most are not as long and as big as Evo, but so what? They are still fun and are different to Evo. How can you say there is not much choice? There is plenty, it's just that some people don't bother to look.

I guess some people want to have points and unlocks like BF2. Personally I hate that stuff. I'm sure the real army doesn't give you points for kills and let you unlock new weapons and vehicles to do what you please with.

The way many people play Evo, it may as well be an SP mission anyway.

[wamingo 1]

If pvp's your thing you might as well play something colorfull like unreal or something.

Why is this brought up in every topic where PvP is discussed? All co-oppers might as well play Ghost Recon or Joint Ops. Isn't that ridiculous? We are all playing ArmA for various reasons and that's the end of the story.

I need to revise my statement a little, CTI was good - oddly enough it utilizes AI... Suprise suprise.

And I only brought it up because you said "the AI is such a dull opponent", you sodding hypocrite!

[Bunkers 0]

The simple reason why evolution is totally dominant atm is that it's the map most ppl want to play. I've been annoyed myself from time to time when MY type of missions isnt common on the servers. That changes and varies through time. However, I must say I've never seen a mission take the scene so completely as evo does. It's kinda strange.

Lucky for me though, I find it entertaining. If a DM ever gets this popular I'll go totally  

[Kwato 0]

You should start bare foot too and get points to unlock boots, laces and stuff.

[Maciver 0]

Maybe kiljoy should add a few SLA slots on the next release of Evolution, I think that would make it a hell of a lot more interesting. I agree about too much evolution though, I'm starting to get sick of it.

Some of my favorite other CoOp maps are: OOPS_City_Take_Ortego_(co10) & OOPS_City_Take_Paraiso_(co14)

On a side note, Celery, we at the 31st MEU have gotten A LOT of laughs (and fun) from your DM map pack, thank you and keep up the good work.

Yes to the above!  ^^^   SLA slots on Evo would be really really good.  

We should really put some idea's together for that, and if he's up to it, we could have a really goood map.

Quote[/b] ]The point system in Evo is one thing I really hate. Guess it prevents morons destroying everything at the start in public games, but for more organised games it's just a pain. It's one thing that's made me sick of Evo.

It might be a pain, but its needed.  You guys are not looking at it correctly.  Your not being rewarded for kills.  Your getting rewarded for putting in your time.  No nublets flying around with the cobra and blackhawks are good!

Also, if your playing an organized game, its REALLY easy to get your rank up there with your buddies.   It's harder without teamwork, and im glad it promotes this.

Maps like this are needed for public servers.  You can't have a good time for a little while to jump into a custom coop map and be a seagul for a freaking half hour.  You want real large variety of coop maps?  Squad play will do that for you.

Public servers need largescale coop or PvP CTI style maps running to ecourage the growth of this community.

[celery 8]

If pvp's your thing you might as well play something colorfull like unreal or something.

Why is this brought up in every topic where PvP is discussed? All co-oppers might as well play Ghost Recon or Joint Ops. Isn't that ridiculous? We are all playing ArmA for various reasons and that's the end of the story.

I need to revise my statement a little, CTI was good - oddly enough it utilizes AI... Suprise suprise.

And I only brought it up because you said "the AI is such a dull opponent", you sodding hypocrite!

I brought this up on a grander scale, people really think that PvP gamers are better off forgetting about ArmA and "go back" to Unreal/CS/BF2. I'd be a hypocrite if I seriously said the same "go play this and that" thing I mentioned in the first post.

On a side note, Celery, we at the 31st MEU have gotten A LOT of laughs (and fun) from your DM map pack, thank you and keep up the good work.

I will!