hoak 0 Posted December 20, 2005 I notice that virtually none of the AA (and OFP·2) screenshots appear to have any Anti-Aliasing; is this because: · the game(s) don't support Anti-Aliasing? · render over-head is so incredible due to the large scale scenery rendered that Anti-Alias is impractical? · the Developers are so poorly paid by their publisher they can't afford decent hardware? · someone forgot to turn it on? · other? Just makes me wonder with these fantastic game art assets why we don't see this one render technology applied to promotional screen shots? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spoock 3 Posted December 20, 2005 I notice that virtually none of the AA (and OFP·2) screenshots appear to have any Anti-Aliasing; is this because:· the Developers are so poorly paid by their publisher they can't afford decent hardware? · the game(s) don't support Anti-Aliasing? · the game(s) render over-head is so incredible to to the large scale scenery Anti-Alias is impractical? · someone forgot? · other? Just makes me wonder with these fantastic game art assets why we don't see this one render technology applied to promotional screen shots? ArmA and Game2 will be very difficult software and Antialising is possible, but unneeded for me and stong machines Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeMeSiS 11 Posted December 20, 2005 the Developers are so poorly paid by their publisher they can't afford decent hardware? What publisher? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
berghoff 11 Posted December 20, 2005 · the game(s) don't support Anti-Aliasing? AFAIK you can just turn up AA & AF in your videocard control panel even without support and imo its only really needed in resolution like 1024x768. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heatseeker 0 Posted December 20, 2005 · the game(s) don't support Anti-Aliasing? AFAIK you can just turn up AA & AF in your videocard control panel  even without support and imo its only really needed in resolution like 1024x768. No its not, i ran OPFR in 1280x1024 and i always used atleast 2x antialiasing with little to no performance impact and 2x made a huge diference on the visuals/jaggies. I think BIS just chooses not to alter the pics or graphics . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gux 0 Posted December 20, 2005 I've heard(might be talking out of my ass here) that HDR and AA has trouble coexisting because the final image is composited together. Maybe that's the reason? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dwarden 1125 Posted December 20, 2005 i think you saw minimum of screenshots from games in developement ? i suggest You open google and find out some pre-release, beta and alpha screenshots of other games ... guess what... they don't have AA / AF enabled ... simple reason ... speed ... because early versions of game are unoptimized and thus using AA / AF is just huge performance sink .... OFP/OFPR supported AA ... and any game to date supports AA except "lame" HDR implementations on actual GPU hardware ... again there is exception thanks to Valve You can enjoy HDR in Source games with AA enabled w/o need to have next generation videocard like ATI X1xxx series and NVIDIA unreleased ones but back to ATI ... on X1xxx serie of card You will be able enjoy next generation of HDR with AA enabled ... (NVIDIA 7xxx owners can keep dreaming) .... in short ... i see no reason to not be able use AA at any resolution if You got enough video memory and processing power Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mogley 0 Posted December 20, 2005 That might be true Gux??? I never even use AA in ANY game because on my desktop I only play at 1600x1200. And on my new Dell XPS M170 laptop with 17" widescreen I only play at 1920X1200 and at those resolutions it is not need, you will never have jaggies when playing that high. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hoak 0 Posted December 20, 2005 Dwarden follow your own advice and you'll find for a fact that many Developers and Publishers render pre-release images of their work at very high settings, including maximum Anti-Alias of 8x or higher to show the game at it best, on the best hardware -- that's simply good marketing sense. Regardless of the reaction of some, it's a valid question; Armed Assault may have render issues with Anti-Alias and HDR, or performance issues with this render technology in general. In fact there are other render technologies on other engines that conflict with Anti-Alias being forced from the driver -- so the possibility it can not even be enbaled is certainly open to question and a valid concern. Regardless of your personal rigs maximum resolution, others may not be able to render that high... The screenshots that have been released thus far are at resolutions of 1024 x 768 -- show gross and clearly visible Alias distortion; which would be even more dramatic rendered in-game at this resolution and even considerably higher. Â Common sense would dictate the use of Anti-Alias at such low resolution promotional images, if it worked... The question remains valid and open for Developer comment, whether some like it or not... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
llauma 0 Posted December 21, 2005 Non of the CWC or resistance pics had AA enabled either. I think they have simply chosen not to have it enabled. It wouldn't suprise me if the pics are from a recommended gaming rig. As you said, not all have super computers so isn't it nice that they show some pics of the game being run on a normal computer? The pics are also not made for promotion. They are more of a progress report. OFP was highly over-dimensioned so if they had turned up the settings to max it would had looked great but no one would been able to play it at that level of detail with the hardware available at that point. Other games can be maxed out the day they are released if you have a fairly new computer. You call it good marketing sense, I call it hyping the game. I'd much rather get a positive surprise than the opposite. Of course you can be right, maybe they have some issues with it or they haven't even added it yet but making a conclusion that the game might not support AA based on a few pics isn't very credible, especially when they haven't used AA in the pics of games which we know supports AA. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stakex 0 Posted December 21, 2005 Dwarden follow your own advice and you'll find for a fact that many Developers and Publishers render pre-release images of their work at very high settings, including maximum Anti-Alias of 8x or higher to show the game at it best, on the best hardware -- that's simply good marketing sense. Yes, and many publishers also pre-render their screenshots and even touch them up in photo editing programs to make them look better then you can ever possibly achieve in the game. Mostly its to show what they hope will be possible in the end... however it very seldom turns out that way. As for ArmA and Game2 screenshots... Game2 was still very early in development when most of the Game2 shots were taken. They are true alpha/pre-alpha screenshots... and not over powered screenshots that offer unrealistic expectations of the game. As for ArmA its possible its just not turned on... not all developers make their trailers/screenshots to the absolute max. Doing this makes people think the game will be a lot better then it really is... and will actually bring lots of bad press when the game is actually released. Also don't forget... most people dont have really high end gameing PC's. And tho the game might be built to run great on high end PC's its also possible the devs are showing what its going to look like on a not so high PC... so a lot of people aren't dissapointed and some are very happy when the game is released. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hoak 0 Posted December 21, 2005 All those points were acknowledged in my topic/question post. Â The fact of the matter is Anti-Alias is a technology designed for low-end rigs that must run at lower screen resolutions where Alias distortion is at its ugliest. While I certainly agree with the sentiments about post processing game screenshots and videos being a below the basement approach to game marketing hype; that is not the topic of this thread... Anti-Alias is a render technology that works fine on many game that render the same or higher volume of geometry and LOD as Armed Assault, on a mid to low end PC -- at the lower resolutions these systems can only afford to run LSS games. If the render penalty of running Anti-Alias on Armed Assault is too high to be practical on most systems at most resolutions; I'd certainly like to know it irrespective of Fan Boy reaction to asking a valid, and as yet unanswered question. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dwarden 1125 Posted December 21, 2005 All those points were acknowledged in my topic/question post. Â The fact of the matter is Anti-Alias is a technology designed for low-end rigs that must run at lower screen resolutions where Alias distortion is at its ugliest.While I certainly agree with the sentiments about post processing game screenshots and videos being a below the basement approach to game marketing hype; that is not the topic of this thread... Anti-Alias is a render technology that works fine on many game that render the same or higher volume of geometry and LOD as Armed Assault, on a mid to low end PC -- at the lower resolutions these systems can only afford to run LSS games. If the render penalty of running Anti-Alias on Armed Assault is too high to be practical on most systems at most resolutions; I'd certainly like to know it irrespective of Fan Boy reaction to asking a valid, and as yet unanswered question. You completely wrong about that AA is only for "low" end rigs with low resolutions ... please take look e.g. at ATI's R52x GPU architecture ... with X18000XL/XT use of AntiAliasing results of minimal performance hit even on 1600x1200 and higher ... (we are speaking here about Adaptive AntiAliasing at least 4x + Temporal AntiAliasing 2x) ... not to mention that R52x GPU brings AnisoTropic filtering in all angles (so called HiQuality AF) ... maybe i'm mistaken (in that case sorry) but You seriously speak like NVIDIA fanboy (that will be explain comments like use of AA is power demanding and so on ... ) ... and like i said before CORRECT implementation of HDR or NEW types of HDR are capable to run with AntiAliasing enabled ... in short as example the incorrect way take FarCry so called 'HDR' patch (AA must be off) and as correct way take Source HDR (works both with and without AA) ... but again that's actual HDR ... not next GEN HDR (such support You can now find at market only in R52x GPU from ATI, for now ...) .... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hoak 0 Posted December 21, 2005 Dwarden, I take it English is not your first language?  I don't know where you're going with this but it's way off topic, totally the opposite of what I've said, and again; summarily has nothing to do with the questions this topic post poses... As far as the facts are concerned; I own an ATi 9800 video card -- though that has absolutely nothing to do with the topic of this thread. Since you clearly have either misunderstood, lost track of, or don't care about the topic of this thread; I'll repeat it here, for you, for clarity, and for continuity for those that do care: Quote[/b] ]I notice that virtually none of the AA (and OFP·2) screenshots appear to have any Anti-Aliasing; is this because:· the game(s) don't support Anti-Aliasing? · render over-head is so incredible due to the large scale scenery rendered that Anti-Alias is impractical? · the Developers are so poorly paid by their publisher they can't afford decent hardware? · someone forgot to turn it on? · other? Just makes me wonder with these fantastic game art assets why we don't see this one render technology applied to promotional screen shots? Your opinions about why Anti-Alias was not used in any of the screenshots of Armed Assault released so far does not constitute a factual or official answer to the question regarding why.  Neither is any opinionated supposition a revelation as I've posed literally every possibility in the original topic post. Please refrain from trolling... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Espectro (DayZ) 0 Posted December 21, 2005 the Developers are so poorly paid by their publisher they can't afford decent hardware? What publisher? lol exactly Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hoak 0 Posted December 21, 2005 Well, that was meant to be funny... I think the IDEA publishing arrangement is one of the coolest things to happen in game publishing... But back on topic... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dwarden 1125 Posted December 21, 2005 My answers were mainly related to your two points : Quote[/b] ]· the game(s) don't support Anti-Aliasing?· render over-head is so incredible due to the large scale scenery rendered that Anti-Alias is impractical? maybe You don't see that so feel free to blame my english ... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hoak 0 Posted December 21, 2005 No Dwarden I don't see it, in fact you're making the same point I am; i.e. using Anti-Alias with an ATi card does not cost you much in the way of render performance, so it's one of the things on lower cost ATi cards that can keep games looking great at lower resolutions. That being the case I think it's pretty valuable for some to be able to use Anti-Alias with Amed Assault; don't you agree? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
USSRsniper 0 Posted December 21, 2005 i think you saw minimum of screenshots from games in developement ? i suggest You open google and find out some pre-release, beta and alpha screenshots of other games ...guess what... they don't have AA / AF enabled ... simple reason ... speed ... because early versions of game are unoptimized and thus using AA / AF is just huge performance sink .... OFP/OFPR supported AA ... and any game to date supports AA except "lame" HDR implementations on actual GPU hardware ... again there is exception thanks to Valve You can enjoy HDR in Source games with AA enabled w/o need to have next generation videocard like ATI X1xxx series and NVIDIA unreleased ones but back to ATI ... on X1xxx serie of card You will be able enjoy next generation of HDR with AA enabled ... (NVIDIA 7xxx owners can keep dreaming) .... in short ... i see no reason to not be able use AA at any resolution if You got enough video memory and processing power No AA in not developed games games? This is just Lame, i saw many screenshots with AA and without AA. Even when you google game you can see it :P Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heatseeker 0 Posted December 22, 2005 It is one of the good things in OPF, antialising has low performance impact even at high resolutions, even with GF4 one could use 2x and it looked way smoother, compared to Unreal powered games (ex.) i can say that OPFR is very antialising friendly and i hope Aras will too . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dwarden 1125 Posted December 22, 2005 No AA in not developed games games?This is just Lame, i saw many screenshots with AA and without AA. Even when you google game you can see it :P i said You can find often screenshots from games under development w/o AA ... i never said there are none with AA ... ... anyway someone throw on this thread screenshot with AA enabled ... chance that there will be no AA in Armed Assault is close to null ... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dynamax 0 Posted December 22, 2005 um.. could it be that you dont see AA in the screen shots cause you need more then one frame to make AA work? when ever i take screen shots of OFP running at 4xAA, i dont see the AA at all in the capture Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hoak 0 Posted December 25, 2005 Could it be your drivers are bugged or installed improperly? I get fine Anti-Aliased screenshots from games on both my ATi and nVIDIA systems. My concern is that the game is rendereing such huge settings, and so much geometry, with so many large rez textures that it may be impractical to use Anti-Alias... But I'm patient and await a definitive answer from 'The Team'. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Homefry 0 Posted December 26, 2005 I've never run across a game that doesn't support AA... I don't see why Armed Assault will be any different. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeMeSiS 11 Posted December 26, 2005 I've never run across a game that doesn't support AA... I don't see why Armed Assault will be any different. HALO if i remember correctly, but its the only one i know. They just didnt turn AA on, stop talking about it... Â EDIT:AA as in Anti-Aliasing, not America's Army, Armed Assault or Anti-Air Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
