theavonlady 2 Posted July 24, 2004 Right on, Toadlife! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pathy 0 Posted July 24, 2004 Knock the buggers out! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bikecop 0 Posted July 25, 2004 I am going to host a mission called 'Operation:Preperation H' and then 'Operation:Hewlet packard' and use all copirighted music and then another mission called 'Honda kicked yo a**'. I dont care what will happen and I hate canoeing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tim Pink 0 Posted July 25, 2004 Good on ya toadlife. As for this: Quote[/b] ]I think its another case of the craps. Thats just like people griping about not making children units. They should have waited till they received an actual notice from the lojack company. I bet they didn't, i just know they crapped out early. I got that feeling Hubba's ISP did recieve an official notice from the LoJack corporation and its lawyers which was then passed to Hubba, Lets put you in the same shoes and see how you'd react, i beleive you'd be experiencing a case of brown pants syndrome. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pathy 0 Posted July 25, 2004 What i want to know is how they stumbled across it.....is it someones job to browse the net all day looking for use of the word "Lojack".....do they do a google search till they find something? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tim Pink 0 Posted July 25, 2004 From what ive learned about copyright law, there are actually people whos job it is to search for trademark infringements and copyright violations on the net by typing select words into search engines. Some guy who works for L**ack just probably typed L**ack into Google and *poof* Toadies mission appeared. Tim Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theavonlady 2 Posted July 25, 2004 What i want to know is how they stumbled across it.....is it someones job to browse the net all day looking for use of the word "Lojack".....do they do a google search till they find something? Yes. Lawyers or subcontracted firms scan the Internet for potential infrigements. How many sites have I seen where the webmaster has posted his aggravated regrets at being threatened with financial execution for the most harmless of pic posting or referencing a trademark. I have a sincere belief that Toadlife is right in that in many instances, this one included, their case would not stand up in court. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpecOp9 0 Posted July 26, 2004 Go get em toad! Shut those picky bastards up Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ozanzac 0 Posted July 26, 2004 *Sighs* Words can't politely explain what I'm feeling after reading of this. Unfortunatly, the law is the law, no matter how stupid it seems. I'd like to see the credibility of the finger pointer. Probably the same as that of an 'Official Wallet Inspector' Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pathy 0 Posted July 26, 2004 From what ive learned about copyright law, there are actually people whos job it is to search for trademark infringements and copyright violations on the net by typing select words into search engines.Some guy who works for L**ack just probably typed L**ack into Google and *poof* Toadies mission appeared. Tim Boy oh boy what a job...... Wonder what qualifications you need.......A degree in google searching? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tim Pink 0 Posted July 26, 2004 Lol @ Pathy Aswell as the degree you need alot of spare time and no family commitments. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedyDonkey 0 Posted July 26, 2004 Searching on google for random shit and then sending nasty letters to people. Sound like a fun part-time job, for the right amount money that is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Winters 1 Posted July 26, 2004 I have a sincere belief that Toadlife is right in that in many instances, this one included, their case would not stand up in court. I stated that already, having filed several copyrights for music i recorded with several bands i do have some familiarity with the laws involved. One thing i want to point out is that you cannot copyright a "words". Thats why you have dozens of songs that have the same title but the "Content" of said song is entirely different. As long as the content of Toadies mission differs from the content of the LoJack product (which is not really true as they both are used for tracking purposes) it can be used. Also, Toadlife makes no money from his mission and that would ultimately be the basis of a trademark infringement lawsuit. So, does it violate the Lojack trademark, kinda. But, would they be able to file legal suit and win a case against him, doubtful. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toadlife 3 Posted July 27, 2004 Out of simple curiousity, I have placed a new poll item on the front page of my site that has to do with Operation LoJack and this situation. Feel free to cast a vote.... http://ofp.toadlife.net/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sergeantslaughter 0 Posted July 28, 2004 [One thing i want to point out is that you cannot copyright a "words". I'm a lawyer focusing on IT and hence copyright and trademarks, albeit in Australia (though these laws are largely international). As a thank you to Toadlife for doing the mission, I offer this gratis advice: 1. primary question is whether it's worth a fight. Of course, they need to ask the same question, making a case unlikely. 2. Winters is absolutely right. The trademark and the word in the trademark are two different things. You don't breach a trademark simply by using the word in the mark. 3. the other thing to avoid is implying an association with or endorsement by the holder of the mark. That invokes a number of laws and thats why a lot of other factors you've been discussing are relevant. Personally, I thinks it's ridiculous to suggest the mission does that. 4. a thing is not the law just because someone says it is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tim Pink 0 Posted July 28, 2004 Quote[/b] ]One thing i want to point out is that you cannot copyright a "words". yes very true, but in this instance it is not words they copyrighting, its a trademark, and as Noon416 explained these companys have to pursue these claims or they lose the ownership of the trademark. Tim Btw, there is a link to Toadlifes official response here Very well put together toadlife, i think that will make them think twice Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pathy 0 Posted July 28, 2004 And now we know where you live Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Winters 1 Posted July 28, 2004 Quote[/b] ]One thing i want to point out is that you cannot copyright a "words". yes very true, but in this instance it is not words they copyrighting, its a trademark, and as Noon416 explained these companys have to pursue these claims or they lose the ownership of the trademark. Tim Btw, there is a link to Toadlifes official response here Very well put together toadlife, i think that will make them think twice  You cannot claim a word as a trademark, it does not work that way. You need to create a logo and then copyright the logo as a trademark. Yes they have to pursue this even if it is frivilous, but if you read through the entire post of what i wrote rather than one line i did point out that the similarity between the content of the mission and what the LoJack system does is a violation of the trademark laws. In the mission you use a tracking device to find someone. In the LoJack system, you use it to track vehicles in case they get stolen. Even without making any money it is a violation albeit a very small one and prolly not worth the effort to aggressively pursue a lawsuit over it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sim 0 Posted July 28, 2004 hey Go get 'em toad!!! Whats the difference between a supermarket trolley and a lawyer? A supermarket trolley had a mind of its own... sim Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sergeantslaughter 0 Posted July 29, 2004 I'm in two minds how to approach this as I use OFP as an escape and would rather not not deal with copyright in an OFP context. On the other hand, I've never made a mission or addon and have enjoyed those wonderful contributions by Toadlife, Winters and others and see a chance to contribute something to the community. The issue here is stupid, but perhaps this is useful. Winters basically understands the issue, but is not quite right. Copyright and trademarks are two different albeit related things. You also need to consider passing off and analagous statutory provisions. Copyright is the exclusive right (in countries which recognise those rights) to do certain things like reproduce, distribute, etc. It is not ownership in the sense you own your car. It relates to an original work, but that has evolved beyond books and musicto cover things like software. You cannot copyright a word, let alone own it. I don't think copyright has anything to do with this. A trademark is just that. It's a mark distinguishing goods or services. It may or may not contain a word, but the mark and the word are two different things. The BitLaw paper someone linked deals with this well. I don't see the breach, let alone a practical means to pursue Toadlife over it. Passing off I referred to in my last post. It would be ridiculous to claim Toadlife implied an association with whoever holds the mark. It's plainly a joke. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Albert Schweitzer 10 Posted July 29, 2004 Cant find it on your Site Avon. Is there still a downloadable link to this LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACKLOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK sue me if you want .. but I want to download it now! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theavonlady 2 Posted July 29, 2004 Cant find it on your Site Avon. Is there still a downloadable link to this LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACKLOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK LOWJACK sue me if you want .. but I want to download it now! Â In The FAQ's M.O.M. section. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
