Us presidential election 2004

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Hoh Hoh Hoh. This is america Denoir, where politicians are tacticans.

Kerry voted pro invasion  in order not to screw up his upcoming candidature. He didnt want to swim against the stream so early and in such an important decision.

Dean voted against the war. Furthermore it doesn't explain why Kerry voted against providing funding for the war and the rebuilding.

Quote[/b] ]This does in no way reflect his behaviour once he is president.

It reflects that he's a populist.

Quote[/b] ]And this vote took place BEFORE the final UN hearing and therefore you cannot say that he was PRO Unilateral-WAR and AGAINST a different alternative solution from the UN.

That's true, but isn't that even more irresponsible? Give the authority to go to war without hearing the whole story first? And mind you that it was pretty obvious when they voted that the war was a Bush obsession and not a necessity. Check the Iraq thread that was active at the time and you'll see what we wrote here at the time they voted.

He is a populist, that is for sure. Dean voted against but a guy like him is not mainstream enough to get enough votes.

About the rest of your post I must admit I dont realy know enough. Anyhow, I assumed one must be sure whether your have your country backing a war before you ask for a legitimation by the UN. Would you do it the other way around, first ask the UN to get the "go" and then find out that the senate dissaproves it?

[Schoeler 0]

Well, not caring what others think is reason enough to elect a guy to the run the world's only superpower. You're right, wars happen, shit happens, drafts happen, nuclear holocaust happens, economic depressions happen, getting rid of the Department of Education happens.

I can see the logic now, my vote has changed!

[Veovis 0]

Quote[/b] ]FERRELL: Well, President Bush is pretty funny, I have to say. But I don't know if he's funny for our country.

You know you're going to lose when Will Ferrell is against you.

[ralphwiggum 6]

Quote[/b] ]FERRELL: Well, President Bush is pretty funny, I have to say. But I don't know if he's funny for our country.

You know you're going to lose when Will Ferrell is against you.  

LOL i just read that too.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/07/08/bush.naacp.ap/index.html

Quote[/b] ]PHILADELPHIA, Pennsylvania (AP) -- President Bush declined an invitation to speak at the NAACP's annual convention, the group said.

The National Association for the Advancement of Colored People expects more than 8,000 people to attend the convention, which opens on Saturday.

Democratic challenger John Kerry accepted an invitation to speak next Thursday on the final day of the convention, the NAACP said.

Bush spoke at the 2000 NAACP convention in Baltimore when he was running for president.

NAACP spokesman John White said Wednesday that Bush has declined invitations in each year of his presidency -- becoming the first president since Herbert Hoover not to attend an NAACP convention.

The NAACP received a letter from the White House three weeks ago declining the invitation because of scheduling conflicts and thanking them for understanding.

The letter was signed by presidential scheduler Melissa Bennett.

White House spokesman Jim Morrell said Wednesday that the president has spoken about "equal opportunity and equal rights for all Americans" in many public places.

nice job. at least he showed some consistency by not showing up for last 3 yrs and suddenly trying to show up.

[Veovis 0]

Another comedian's comment on the president that I found amusing.

Quote[/b] ]I don’t even know how to make a joke out of the price of oil. The president and vice president used to be oil people, and we’re not supposed to see a connection. It’s beyond jokes. They’re in a place beyond irony.

Lewis Black is the greatest.

[billybob2002 0]

Quote[/b] ]nice job. at least he showed some consistency by not showing up for last 3 yrs and suddenly trying to show up.

Bush does not want to be booed because everybody knows NAACP (now) is a democrat bunker...

Quote[/b] ]

Right, he was (is?) a governor..

Yep, governor not senator or congressman...

Quote[/b] ]

Knowing you are most likely unfamilliar with the situation in Romania I shall explain it again.

As I said before a large part of the population is still struggling for ends meat,so unfortunatly internal issues as grave as the ones my country is passing through get the priority just as in other countries in similar circumstances.

Rest assured if there will be a UN mandate for a peace keaping operation in Sudan my country would immidiatly join( as it did before)and as wonderful as it might be we don`t have the final word on it.

Like I said before, US is trying to help in Sudan...its not like Powell did not go to Sudan to see the sadness...

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm....8174329

Quote[/b] ]

US warns Sudan over not honoring pledge of immediate action in Darfur

2 hours, 1 minute ago

WASHINGTON (AFP) - US Secretary of State Colin Powell (news - web sites) warned Sudan to honor its pledge of immediate action to stop the bloodshed in the troubled Darfur region or risk facing global action.

"We need immediate improvement in the situation, and if we don't see that, then the United States and the international community will have to consider further measures," Powell said at the release of a US Congress-commissioned report on Africa policy.

Powell said the United States had drafted a UN Security Council resolution seeking sanctions on militia leaders behind the violence and noted that it was being discussed with selected council members.

[walker 0]

Hi all

More Republicans are jumping on the dump Cheney bandwagon as the Republicans search for a suitable Candidate for Vice President.

The incumbant is seen as a vote looser with his ties to the troubled Haliburton the company that went bust already once and recieved questionable no bid contracts from TBA the links between the Vice presidents office and those contracts is now under investigation.

That he has been proven to be a Liar is also tarnishing the rest of the Republicans with questions like, "Are you going to lie like Dodgy Dick Cheney?" being asked of Republican candidates and representatives.

Republicans are loosing many more conservative christian votes due to the Foul Mouthed Dick Cheney swearing in the Senate this at a time when Republicans are attempting to reduce foul language in society and yet are seen to condone it in their vice president has lead the Republicans to called the party of the Foul Mouths.

Sources

http://www.nydailynews.com/07-08-2....2c.html

http://www.washingtontimes.com/commentary/20040706-083910-3362r.htm

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories....#Change

http://edition.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/07/08/thurs.hot/index.html

Kind Regards Walker

[BoweryBaker 0]

Alot of people depend on the he say she say to encourage others on who to vote for and getting into arguments instead of letting people think for themselves.

I think its time we stop shooting our mouths off for a second and start coming from our hearts and from what this country stands for and not just what the news says this guy or that guy did in his past.

In my honest and neutral opinion as an American Americas problem is that it went from being grateful for their freedom to being

proud of it. It was God who said that Pride is a sin. He's the one who runs the whole show, but

you got schools going over Gods head, states, propoganda, saying american pride this and that,

everything is about American pride these days. Our pride will only destroy us. In being thankful

for our freedom, its time we make people FIGHT so that they know to be thankful for theirs.

Otherwise they won't appreciate it. It's like a spoiled child who always gets money from dad.

He's come to expect it after awhile. There's too many children out there if you know what I'm saying.

Someone once mentioned that there are 35 dictatorships and I'm not sure if that number is true but if everyone comes to depend on America to gain their freedom we will be stretched too thin for our enemies to break us like a wet toilet tissue.

Can we really make the evildoers and dictators run when even our allies turn their back on us? (France, Germany, who we thought was our new ally Russia).

I don't know exactly who runs America these days but its not just the president, and its not the America it used to be.

I know you might say we need them to depend on us but we can do that economically.

It's like me and my friend Jesse. Life is hard on us so we depend on each other. Now that friend goes and gets his butt kicked cuz he stole some money.

I watched, and did not jump in because the guy beating up jesse was a gang member and i don't own a gun, have a clique or am in a gang but i know self defence martial arts, i could have helped but could i deal with the repurcussions as i walk these street daily?

This is GANG turf we're talking here. Peoria, Arizonas Varrio Brother Hood, VBH. Just one of several gangs operating in my city. If they retaliate im dead so i backed off. Now Jesse is America and I'm the people America just freed. Do you see what I mean? If we get socked up they wont help so why free them?

Some people need to listen to their heart before they make everyone listen to their mouth because its what the heart has to say that people want to hear.

Maybe one of you know what america is thinking and can talk to me.

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]I don't know exactly who runs America these days but its not just the president, and its not the America it used to be.

Some people need to listen to their heart before they make everyone listen to their mouth because its what the heart has to say that people want to hear.

Great !

Use your force, Luke´s.

Good thing.

[billybob2002 0]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm....ap_poll

Quote[/b] ]

AP Poll: Bush Gains Slight Lead Over Kerry

52 minutes ago

By RON FOURNIER, AP Political Writer

WASHINGTON - President Bush (news - web sites) has opened a slight lead over John Kerry (news - web sites) while regaining the confidence of some voters on the economy and other domestic issues, according to an Associated Press poll with a silver lining for Democrats.

The addition of Sen. John Edwards (news - web sites) to Kerry's ticket appears to have helped the Democrat in the South and among low-income voters — a result the Massachusetts senator had hoped for when he selected the North Carolina populist over more seasoned politicians.

"I'm more impressed with Kerry now that he chose Edwards," said Republican voter Robin Smith, 45, a teacher from Summerville, S.C. "I look at Kerry and I don't trust him, but he's got Edwards, who's more middle-of-the-road, a strong speaker, more able to reach the common man."

The AP-Ipsos poll found Bush slightly leading Kerry 49 percent to 45 percent with independent candidate Ralph Nader (news - web sites) at 3 percent. The poll had a margin of error of plus or minus 3.5 percentage points. A month ago, the Bush-Kerry matchup was tied and Nader had 6 percent.

The three-day survey began Monday, the day before Kerry tapped Edwards as his running mate, and asked registered voters about the newly minted ticket on Tuesday and Wednesday. Half supported the Republican tandem of Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney (news - web sites) while 46 percent backed the Kerry-Edwards ticket, just within that question's margin of error of 4.5 percentage points.

Voters said they were feeling better about the economy and no worse about Iraq (news - web sites), a sign that Bush may be regaining his political footing just as Democrats make a high-profile push toward their nominating convention in late July.

"I want Bush in there, because the other guy is like sending a boy to do a man's job," said Glenn Foldessy, 45, of Streetsboro, Ohio, outside Cleveland. Foldessy, who usually votes Republican, said Edwards made the Democratic ticket stronger, but not strong enough.

"We have somebody now who's established and has things on track and if we destabilize this government during the war on terror, that's playing right into the hands of the terrorists," he said.

Troubling signs for the incumbent remain, however, from the number of voters who believe the country is on the wrong track (56 percent) to his anemic, but improving, job approval numbers. Bush's overall approval rating hit 50 percent for the first time since January, according to the poll conducted by Ipsos-Public Affairs.

A month ago, the poll showed a hypothetical Kerry-Edwards ticket at 47 percent and Bush-Cheney at 44 percent, essentially a tie.

Since June, Kerry has increased his percentage of strong supporters — from 55 percent to 64 percent — a sign that he has rallied his base. He also strengthened his support in the South from 39 percent to 45 percent and among voters with incomes from $25,000 to $50,000 — 41 percent to 50 percent, the AP-Ipsos poll found.

It was unknown what, if any, credit should go to Edwards. The self-made millionaire and former trial lawyer has talked of "two Americas," one for the privileged and another for everybody else.

Republican voter Hal Pruett, a human resources director in McMinnville, Tenn., said Edwards will help the Democratic ticket in the GOP-leaning South. "Because he's from the South, people will give them a close look," said Pruett, 56.

Of the 804 registered voters surveyed, just 49 percent said they approve of Bush's handling of the economy, but that's up a few percentage points since May.

Mary Ann Hatton, 44, a Democrat who works in a Lexington, Ky., business office, said she's finding less reason to blame Bush for the economy. "I would fault him more on the war" in Iraq, she said.

Less than half, 46 percent, approve of his handling of domestic issues such as health care, education and the environment — a slight improvement over last month.

Bush gained ground among suburban women, a key constituency that increased its backing for Bush from 41 percent in June to 52 percent.

His ratings on handling foreign policy and the war in Iraq, while low, remained steady or slightly improved. The poll was taken shortly after Iraqis gained limited control of their new government.

Bush has been buoyed by a stream of economic data pointing to an economic recovery, including a plunge in unemployment insurance applications reported Thursday by the Labor Department (news - web sites).

"The conditions for a Bush victory are all there — a strong economy, an improving position in the global war on terror and a growing sense that there are sharp and clear differences in values between the two campaigns," said top Bush adviser Karl Rove.

The economy remains a potent issue for Democrats, said Mark Mellman, a pollster for Kerry.

"We're still seeing people squeezed between prices that are rising and incomes that aren't," he said.

[ralphwiggum 6]

again, with margin of error in consideration, it's a dead lock.

[billybob2002 0]

Quote[/b] ]again, with margin of error in consideration, it's a dead lock.

But, Bush's numbers has increased....

[billybob2002 0]

Hi all

It seems the democrats have been up to their usually tricks and might be in big trouble.....

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,125092,00.html

Quote[/b] ]

Nader Accuses Dems of 'Mini-Watergate'

Friday, July 09, 2004

WASHINGTON — Democrats could be participating in a "mini-Watergate" effort to get Ralph Nader (search) out of the presidential picture, the consumer advocate charged Thursday.

"They're hiring lawyers to go up to technicalities in places like Arizona, they infiltrated our political convention," Nader, an independent candidate for president, told FOX News on Thursday. "I spoke to John Kerry and said 'you'd better look into it because it could be a mini-Watergate, possibly."

Nader said he hasn't yet heard back from the Democratic senator from Massachusetts, who is hoping to oust President Bush from the White House in the November elections.

"This is pretty serious, when you try to lock the civil liberties of American just to get on the ballot so people can vote for the candidate of their choice," Nader continued.

Nader was denied a spot on the Arizona ballot and last Friday again accused the Democrats and Kerry of engaging in political "dirty tricks."

Just hours before the developments in Arizona, Nader complained that the Democratic Party has "stepped up its obstruction tendencies" in challenging his ballot access. The consumer advocate said he had called the Kerry campaign three times last Thursday, asking to chat with the candidate.

"We have to get a clarification if they're going to engage in dirty tricks," Nader told reporters at a news conference to criticize multinational corporations.

The Kerry campaign dismissed Nader's complaints, arguing that Democrats were following the rules when they legally challenged Nader's signatures to get on the ballot. "These are rules that have been on the books for years and they ought to be followed," said Chad Clanton, who added that the Massachusetts senator would be happy to talk to Nader.

In Arizona, supporters of Nader abandoned their effort to get the independent candidate on the presidential ballot after Democrats challenged the validity of thousands of signatures.

Nader's campaign had submitted more than 22,000 signatures to Arizona election officials June 9 -- far more than the 14,694 valid signatures required by state law to compete against President Bush and Kerry.

"They really erect all kinds of barriers blocking voices and choices," Nader told FOX News of such alleged Democratic acts.

Although he's no fan of Republicans, the GOP "don't whine and carp like the Democrats," Nader said, adding that 10 times more Democrats "deserted the party" and voted for Bush in 2000 than voted for him.

When asked if Republicans are working behind the scenes to get him on the ballot, Nader said he doesn't know much about that but "we've seen lots of examples of Democrats trying to obstruct us … this is a fight for all third parties and independent candidates."

And with a reported 42 percent of Americans wanting troops to return from Iraq; over half of whom think it was mistake to send them there, Nader said, "there's no candidacy except the Nader-Camejo ticket speaking for them," adding that he provides the only anti-war platform for voters this year.

Nader is scheduled to debate former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean in Washington on Friday. Dean was the front-runner in the Democratic primaries until his campaign seemed to internally combust; he later dropped out of the race.

"Dean really made his mark by being against the war now he's back into the fold so we'll have fun tomorrow," Nader said.

Nader told reporters last week that he expects to get on about as many state ballots as he did in 2000 when his name was listed in 43 states and the District of Columbia. So far, he has not gotten on any ballot independently.

Many Democrats blame Nader, the Green Party (search) candidate four years ago, for taking votes from Democrat Al Gore and helping ensure President Bush's election. He has been endorsed by the Reform Party (search), which has ballot lines in at least seven states.

I thought the democratic party represented "openess" and "democracy". Furthermore, the Congressional Black Caucus (democrats) tried to "scare" him out the elections when they had a highly charged meeting.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/06/22/nader.caucus/

Quote[/b] ]

Nader emerged from the confrontation appearing calm but slightly shaken. He described the meeting as "a robust exchange."

The democrats are trying to use strong-arm tactics to force a independent from running for the president of the united states. Shame on you, democrats...

Truly disturbed billybob2002

edit: love the walker model...4:13 AM....  

[Badgerboy 0]

Meh, please don't ever quote Fox News sources. Thats the equivelent of quoting the 'Sun' over here. (Oh, and incidently they are owned by the same chap!)

I saw Farenheit 9/11 last night, and the segments of Fox News shocked me. Crazy war film intro's, and pumping music, and then to top it off, the presenter who announces 'Your damn right I'm biased, go US!'

Errr, do they simply draft irate citizens off the street at random, or are all the presenters complete twats? Christ, its as bad as the Dail Mail!

[Balschoiw 0]

Nader...haha, want´s to play important guy and get a cheque from Bush eh ?

This had to be expected.

[billybob2002 0]

Quote[/b] ]Meh, please don't ever quote Fox News sources. Thats the equivelent of quoting the 'Sun' over here. (Oh, and incidently they are owned by the same chap!)

I saw Farenheit 9/11 last night, and the segments of Fox News shocked me. Crazy war film intro's, and pumping music, and then to top it off, the presenter who announces 'Your damn right I'm biased, go US!'

Errr, do they simply draft irate citizens off the street at random, or are all the presenters complete twats? Christ, its as bad as the Dail Mail!

Hi Badgerboy

Another person sucka by Moore. Let me quote, http://www.davekopel.com/Terror/Fiftysix-Deceits-in-Fahrenheit-911.htm, to point out the half-truth about fox news during election night. So, they cannot be pro-american to get ze ratings and hope US does not lose to Iraq?They got the highest ratings of any cable news channels for the Iraq War because of their style and reporting. Furthermore, the fox news link is from a INTERVIEW and from Nader's mouth. Also, the democratic party is trying to "force" Nader out.

Quote[/b] ]

Fahrenheit  9/11 begins on election night 2000. We are first shown the Al Gore rocking on stage with famous musicians and a high-spirited crowd. The conspicuous sign on stage reads “Florida Victory.†Moore creates the impression that Gore was celebrating his victory in Florida.

Actually, the rally took place in the early hours of election day, before polls had even opened. Gore did campaign in Florida on election day, but went home to Tennessee to await the results. The “Florida Victory†sign reflected Gore’s hopes, not any actual election results. (“Gore Campaigns Into Election Day,†Associated Press, Nov. 7, 2000.)

The film shows CBS and CNN calling Florida for Al Gore. According to the narrator, “Then something called the Fox News Channel called the election in favor of the other guy….All of a sudden the other networks said, ‘Hey, if Fox said it, it must be true.’â€

We then see NBC anchor Tom Brokaw stating, “All of us networks made a mistake and projected Florida in the Al Gore column. It was our mistake.â€

Moore thus creates the false impression that the networks withdrew their claim about Gore winning Florida when they heard that Fox said that Bush won Florida.

In fact, the networks which called Florida for Gore did so early in the evening—before polls had even closed in the Florida panhandle, which is part of the Central Time Zone. NBC called Florida for Gore at 7:49:40 p.m., Eastern Time. This was 10 minutes before polls closed in the Florida panhandle. Thirty seconds later, CBS called Florida for Gore. And at 7:52 p.m., Fox called Florida for Gore. Moore never lets the audience know that Fox was among the networks which made the error of calling Florida for Gore prematurely. Then at 8:02 p.m., ABC called Florida for Gore. Only ABC had waited until the Florida polls were closed.

About an hour before the polls closed in panhandle Florida, the networks called the U.S. Senate race in favor of the Democratic candidate/

The premature calls may have cost Bush thousands of votes from the conservative panhandle, as discouraged last-minute voters heard that their state had already been decided; some last-minute voters on their way to the polling place turned around and went home. Other voters who were waiting in line left the polling place. In Florida, as elsewhere, voters who have arrived at the polling place before closing time often end up voting after closing time, because of long lines. The conventional wisdom of politics is that supporters of the losing candidate are most likely to give up on voting when they hear that their side has already lost. Thus, on election night 1980, when incumbent President Jimmy Carter gave a concession speech while polls were still open on the west coast, the early concession was blamed for costing the Democrats several Congressional seats in the West, such as that of 20-year incumbent James Corman. The fact that all the networks had declared Reagan a landslide winner while west coast voting was still in progress was also blamed for Democratic losses in the West; Congress even held hearings about prohibiting the disclosure of exit polls before voting had ended in the any of the 48 contiguous states.

Even if the premature television calls affected all potential voters equally, the effect was to reduce Republican votes significantly, because the Florida panhandle is a Republican stronghold. Most of Central Time Zone Florida is in the 1st Congressional District, which is known as the "Redneck Riviera." In that district, Bob Dole beat Bill Clinton by 69,000 votes in 1996, even though Clinton won the state by 300,000 votes. So depress overall turnout in the panhandle, and you will necessarily depress more Republican than Democratic votes. A 2001 study by John Lott suggested that the early calls cost Bush at least 7,500 votes, and perhaps many more.

At 10:00 p.m., which network took the lead in retracting the premature Florida win for Gore? The first retracting network was CBS, not Fox.

Over four hours later, at 2:16 a.m., Fox projected Bush as the Florida winner, as did all the other networks by 2:20 a.m.

At 3:59 a.m., CBS took the lead in retracting the Florida call for Bush. All the other networks, including Fox, followed the CBS lead within eight minutes. That the networks arrived at similar conclusions within a short period of time is not surprising, since they were all using the same data from the Voter News Service. (Linda Mason, Kathleen Francovic & Kathleen Hall Jamieson, “CBS News Coverage of Election Night 2000: Investigation, Analysis, Recommendations†(CBS News, Jan. 2001), pp. 12-25.)

Moore’s editing technique of the election night segment is typical of his style: all the video clips are real clips, and nothing he says is, narrowly speaking, false. But notice how he says, “Then something called the Fox News Channel called the election in favor of the other guy…†The impression created is that the Fox call of Florida for Bush came soon after the CBS/CNN calls of Florida for Gore, and that Fox caused the other networks to change (“All of a sudden the other networks said, ‘Hey, if Fox said it, it must be true.’â€)

This is the essence of the Moore technique: cleverly blending half-truths to deceive the viewer

Bah Billybob2002

[quicksand 0]

Quote[/b] ]They got the highest ratings of any cable news channels for the Iraq War because of their style and reporting. Furthermore, the fox news link is from a INTERVIEW.

Of course, who doesn`t love a reporter turning into chearleader module screaming from the top of his lungs: GO US,GO US,GO US and showing an Iraqi batallion being wiped out  

[billybob2002 0]

Quote[/b] ]Of course, who doesn`t love a reporter turning into chearleader module screaming from the top of his lungs: GO US,GO US,GO US and showing an Iraqi batallion being wiped out

Worked during World War 2....

[denoir 0]

Billybob, have you noticed that nobody has found any major factual errors in F911. All the criticism is that Moore is "creating a false impression" or "implying things he can't prove"?

[billybob2002 0]

Quote[/b] ]Billybob, have you noticed that nobody has found any major factual errors in F911. All the criticism is that Moore is "creating a false impression" or "implying things he can't prove"?

I'm on crusade against people who believe F911 is the truth. I heard some shit at college that was...

[denoir 0]

Quote[/b] ]Billybob, have you noticed that nobody has found any major factual errors in F911. All the criticism is that Moore is "creating a false impression" or "implying things he can't prove"?

I'm on crusade against people who believe F911 is the truth. I heard some shit at college that was...  

Have you seen the movie? Or are you our resident Don Quixote de la Mancha?

[billybob2002 0]

Quote[/b] ]Have you seen the movie? Or are you our resident Don Quixote de la Mancha?

I cannot find it on the internet...I' not saying that F911 is just a big lie but I have talked to people and looked on internet (i.e. that link) that it is not the truth either.

[quicksand 0]

I cannot find it on the internet...I' not saying that F911 is just a big lie but I have talked to people and looked on internet (i.e. that link) that it is not the truth either.

Intresting,so you formed your opinon about the "truth" from Fox News and Bush hardcore peanut gallery rants on the internet.

[bn880 5]

I'm on crusade against people who believe F911 is the truth. I heard some shit at college that was...

I think that choice of words is a good reflection on your own behaviour. hehe

I've gotta stop posting, what's wrong with me today.

[billybob2002 0]

Quote[/b] ]Intresting,so you formed your opinon from Fox News and Bush hardcore peanut gallery rants on the internet.

The guy who wrote Fifty-nine Deceits in Fahrenheit 9/11 is not a hardcore bush-fan. He voted for Nader and in the article he wrote a example of an Bush lie.