Jinef 2 Posted May 19, 2003 http://news.independent.co.uk/world/pacific_rim/story.jsp?story=407656 More than 1,000 elite soldiers landed in the province by sea and air in an operation to "destroy" the Acehnese rebels in what was expected to be Indonesia's biggest military operation since its invasion of East Timor in 1975. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jinef 2 Posted May 19, 2003 http://www.time.com/time....00.html It's annoying to see them wearing the same DPM jackets we get given and carrying Belgian FN and American Colt weapons. It's amazing how incredulous arms manufacturers are. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Necromancer- 0 Posted May 19, 2003 FN FAL's... M16A1's.. they're all gonna jam eventually. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CrunchyFrog 0 Posted May 19, 2003 Saw a picture in the paper today... He had a AK-74M Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Necromancer- 0 Posted May 19, 2003 </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Jinef @ 19 May 2003,18:08)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> http://www.time.com/time....00.html It's annoying to see them wearing the same DPM jackets we get given and carrying Belgian FN and American Colt weapons. It's amazing how incredulous arms manufacturers are.<span id='postcolor'> Dutch and UK schemes... Prolly fake. Indonesia is known to produce counterfeit clothing like Armani, Mexx and stuff. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jinef 2 Posted May 19, 2003 The civilian casualties could be quite high, i wonder if this is another development in the war on terror. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Necromancer- 0 Posted May 19, 2003 </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Jinef @ 19 May 2003,20:05)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">i wonder if this is another development in the war on terror.<span id='postcolor'> This war has nothing to do with the war on terror. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr. Duck 0 Posted May 19, 2003 </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Jinef @ 19 May 2003,18:08)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> http://www.time.com/time....00.html It's annoying to see them wearing the same DPM jackets we get given and carrying Belgian FN and American Colt weapons. It's amazing how incredulous arms manufacturers are.<span id='postcolor'> The most annoying part for me is those flags on the barrels. It somehow makes me feel that they have something to do with the laskar jihad. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hneel 0 Posted May 19, 2003 </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (mr. Duck @ 19 May 2003,20:27)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The most annoying part for me is those flags on the barrels. It somehow makes me feel that they have something to do with the laskar jihad. Â <span id='postcolor'> Very unlikely. These rebels fight the indonesian army. Laskar Jihad only operates in areas controlled by the same indonesian army. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Harnu 0 Posted May 19, 2003 </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The most annoying part for me is those flags on the barrels. It somehow makes me feel that they have something to do with the laskar jihad. <span id='postcolor'> When I first saw the pic they reminded me of the kid's guns with the stick and the "BANG" flag Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jinef 2 Posted May 19, 2003 I thought all hostile actions against unconventional forces is now okay because it comes under the 'war on terror'. Like those mass graves in Chechnya, and war crime charges that were dropped as soon as the Chechnyans were called 'terrorists'. Are you sure that this war would have happened if the terrorists on 11/9 missed their flights? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr. Duck 0 Posted May 19, 2003 </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Jinef @ 19 May 2003,22:29)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I thought all hostile actions against unconventional forces is now okay because it comes under the 'war on terror'. Like those mass graves in Chechnya, and war crime charges that were dropped as soon as the Chechnyans were called 'terrorists'. Are you sure that this war would have happened if the terrorists on 11/9 missed their flights?<span id='postcolor'> Yup, this would be an independance war, nothing to do with the US vs. terrorism stuff, they (Aceh) want independence, but we (RI) don't want them to have that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
-WKK--SkyQuake 0 Posted May 20, 2003 Still many people wuld love if they culd tie this war to US and Bush Please dont involve the US in this war. Its people who have wanted independance for many years (1970's) and the conflict have worsened alot since 1998. The Aceh have become more and better equiped and make a bigger treath to Indonisia. Maybe the timing is bad and the indonisians use "the war on terror" as excuse, i dunno. What wonders me, is that I never heard about this conflict before. What do the majority of the population in that area want? Do they want independance or is it just some rich "Aceh"-religious-dudes playing generals/liberators?? SQ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
killagee 0 Posted May 20, 2003 This situation is the jagged edge of what has happened in the past and will happen again. As the Japanese were cleansed from the Pacific at the end of WWII, the allied powers claimed areas taken by the japanese, which before the axis invasion were independent, such as Aceh, Timor and many others. When Indonsia gained its independance from portugal and the allies, Aceh and Timor ( and other provinces) were included. Neither wanted to be part of indonesia, they wanted to be free again. In the mid 1970's indonesia launched an offensive against Aceh and Timor and put down the independence movements (very brutally). Did I get this right? Historical corrections welcome... I believe the first half of this century will be dominated by a movement to return Nation-State boundaries to geographical, Demographic, Religious and Ethnic borders, instead of the "paper" borders created by the victorious allies for their own interests. Sound familiar? think Yugoslavia, Mid East, Southeast Asia / Korea, the Pacific.... Indonesia has much to lose in Aceh ( ie Oil, and a precedence for the other provinces in indonesia who were mostly created by the same foreign politicians.) Aceh has much to gain in being independant. Lets hope the situation doesnt slide into a Timor like War. The UN has to act now, and all over the world, to settle these religious, ethnic and economic disputes ( by force if necessary). "May your Borders be Porous..." Fugazi Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr. Duck 0 Posted May 20, 2003 As far as I know Aceh is not a religious war, that one in Ambon and another in sulawesi (not everywhere in sulawesi) is. Now, to me, laskar jihad are terrorist and I would be happy if the US/UN/Anybody else would terminate them. By the way, Indonesia was a dutch colony, not a Portugese. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Supah 0 Posted May 20, 2003 </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Jinef @ 18 May 2003,19:08)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><span id='postcolor'> IFF for Dummies! Atleast this time they cant say this is a war on islam seeing how most of the soldiers are islamic too, wasnt Idonesia the largest (or second largest) predominatly muslim state? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
-TU--33ker 0 Posted May 20, 2003 </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote ([WKK]-SkyQuake @ 20 May 2003,04:36)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Still many people wuld love if they culd tie this war to US and Bush  Please dont involve the US in this war. Its people who have wanted independance for many years (1970's) and the conflict have worsened alot since 1998. The Aceh have become more and better equiped and make a bigger treath to Indonisia. Maybe the timing is bad and the indonisians use "the war on terror" as excuse, i dunno. What wonders me, is that I never heard about this conflict before. What do the majority of the population in that area want? Do they want independance or is it just some rich "Aceh"-religious-dudes playing generals/liberators?? SQ<span id='postcolor'> "war on terror" isn't just a US thing. as already posted, after 9/11 other countries (Russia, the Phillipines) just take the chance to clean out their backyards from all kinds of opposing groups. real terrorists or just people who want independence. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jinef 2 Posted May 20, 2003 That's the point i was getting at. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr. Duck 0 Posted May 20, 2003 As far as I know (correct me if I'm wrong here) Indonesia never called the Aceh rebels terrorists. Besides, you don't negotiate with terrorists right? Besides, not all "terrorist" are independence fighters, Al-Qaeda don't want independence, right? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jinef 2 Posted May 20, 2003 </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (mr. Duck @ 20 May 2003,17:23)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Besides, you don't negotiate with terrorists right?<span id='postcolor'> America does. And i think one of the aims of AQ is to obliterate Israel, thus giving way for a peaceful Arabic mid east. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
