A2/A2:OA beta CorePatch 01.03.2016

[pcc 14]

On 3/13/2017 at 0:22 AM, samatra said:

So I did few tests with unguided-guided bombs, I set trackLead to 0 so bombs no longer lead moving targets and decreased maneuvrability from 20 to 5 for FAB-250 and Mk.82, so they change their trajectory much less. I did some tests with AV8B, Su-25 and Mi-24P, you still have to mostly rely on your vehicle's speed and orientation to succesfully drop bombs but locking can sometimes help you with that. GBU-12 still has huge maneuvrability value of 20 so it is very effective when bombing laser targets.

Can the locking indicator be adjusted?  The bomb always fall short when the locking is circled plus square.  Have to aim beyond the circle zone. 

 

Also, the secops missions sometimes doesn't fully complete and delete after the recent updates.  The structure will delete but the mission task is still there and completion message with HQ is missing. 

Furthermore ACM module stops working randomly and can't be restarted.  I have the intensity set to 1. 

[samatra 85]

8 hours ago, pcc said:

Can the locking indicator be adjusted?  The bomb always fall short when the locking is circled plus square.  Have to aim beyond the circle zone. 

No, we can only control 2 config values of maneuvrability and trackOversteer and that's it.

[opusfmspol 280]

12 hours ago, pcc said:

Also, the secops missions sometimes doesn't fully complete and delete after the recent updates.  The structure will delete but the mission task is still there and completion message with HQ is missing. 

Furthermore ACM module stops working randomly and can't be restarted.  I have the intensity set to 1. 

 

I suspect the GC trashit calls.  Both modules have very similar clean dynamic functions which calls GC trashit function.

 

In SOM the clean dynamic call occurs in phase 9.  If objects clean up, but you still see the abort option for the secop and it's not working and not clearing, the clean dynamic call has hung up.  The secop's not moving to either debrief (phase 10) or abort (phase 11).  It would be why messages don't come across, phase 10 and 11 have the messages.  The abort menu clears after all phases are done.

 

Clean dynamic call getting hung up would also stop the ACM, its clean dynamic call is in the fsm that loops to create patrols.  If the call hangs the fsm loop stops.

[OMAC 254]

20 hours ago, pcc said:

Can the locking indicator be adjusted?  The bomb always fall short when the locking is circled plus square.  Have to aim beyond the circle zone. 

 

 

This makes me wonder if the iron bomb characteristics should either be returned to original state (with locking, for gameplay purposes), or be reverted to first fixed state (all locking removed) as per the kju ticket.  I think I would prefer the latter.  I have not tried the iron bomb lately myself.

[samatra 85]

Just now, OMAC said:

 

This makes me wonder if the iron bomb characteristics should either be returned to original state (with locking, for gameplay purposes), or be reverted to first fixed state (all locking removed) as per the kju ticket.  I have not tried the iron bomb lately myself.

Beta should have locking enabled but with much less flight trajectory change.

[OMAC 254]

5 minutes ago, samatra said:

Beta should have locking enabled but with much less flight trajectory change.

 

Yes, I assumed that.  But if bombs always miss when locked as pcc wrote, then the current tech is misleading and will lead to gameplay frustrations.  Perhaps either complete locking (unrealistic but original BI design), or no locking at all as per kju ticket seem to be best. 

 

But I guess it would be important to consider the miss distance.  If current beta tech allows bombs to hit within <=~300m of locked target, then that would be great.  But if locked iron bombs miss by more than that, then maneuverability could be increased....

[pcc 14]

I prefer some sort of cross hair just to know where the bomb will hit due to lack of good AI laser designators.  I'm fine with the bomb not able to change its flight trajectory at all, but I need to know where it will hit to aim.

 

Is the acceleration variable of the bomb in all direction or can it be limited with exception to forward?

Perhaps make the value random for compromise. 

[opusfmspol 280]

Does the pipper not indicate where a dumb bomb (non-laser) is supposed to hit?  I thought as long as one is in param limitations (altitude, angle of approach, speed) that the pipper was the aim / impact point, or is that not correct?  Though I have to admit I was never able to figure out what I needed for those three.....

 

But I thought the pipper tracked the impact point?

[pcc 14]

I didn't realized it had it since the circle is faint so I went to test and its calculations are off too like the tab lock.

 

[samatra 85]

3 hours ago, pcc said:

I didn't realized it had it since the circle is faint so I went to test and its calculations are off too like the tab lock.

 

If you dropped the bomb at time of first screenshot then no wonder you missed. You first have to aim with the plane\helicopter and use locking to correct small errors. But yes, circle in square can be a bit misleading now.

[pcc 14]

Isn't the tiny circle, not the locking circle, the indicator of where the bomb should hit? Its little bit above and left of the target buts its very close and within locking circle and square, so wouldn't that mean it should've hit a little bit ahead and left of target and not behind even without locking?

 

Also, wouldn't the AI always miss because they aim based on the locking circle?

 

[samatra 85]

5 hours ago, pcc said:

Also, wouldn't the AI always miss because they aim based on the locking circle?

 

Test it?

[pcc 14]

You or someone would have to because I opted out of beta due to garbage collector issues hanging up modules.

[OMAC 254]

I tried the Mk82 bombs on a AV-8B Harrier using current beta, and they worked perfectly with "locking" on Veteran.  They were very accurate for me, but not too accurate.  I nailed 3 tanks in just a few runs.  Great fun!  Excellent job, samatra!

[pcc 14]

1 hour ago, OMAC said:

I tried the Mk82 bombs on a AV-8B Harrier using current beta, and they worked perfectly with "locking" on Veteran.  They were very accurate for me, but not too accurate.  I nailed 3 tanks in just a few runs.  Great fun!  Excellent job, samatra!

Do you aim inside the locking circle?  When I did, bombs never hit the target.  I'm confused here.

[OMAC 254]

17 minutes ago, pcc said:

Do you aim inside the locking circle?  When I did, bombs never hit the target.  I'm confused here.

 

Moving toward target zone, I tab lock on a target.  Green square appears on target.  Moving closer, green circle appears in square, indicating lock.  I wait a second or so, and then drop bomb.  Several times the bombs hit so close to tank that it was destroyed.  You can't be moving too fast, or bombs will overshoot target.  Stay under ~350 kph.  I was flying at around ~400-500m alt.   A few times the bombs missed, but only by 100-200m, as I wasn't flying flat enough, or too fast, or I veered off of vector toward target to avoid ground fire.

[pcc 14]

1 hour ago, OMAC said:

 

Moving toward target zone, I tab lock on a target.  Green square appears on target.  Moving closer, green circle appears in square, indicating lock.  I wait a second or so, and then drop bomb.  Several times the bombs hit so close to tank that it was destroyed.  You can't be moving too fast, or bombs will overshoot target.  Stay under ~350 kph.  I was flying at around ~400-500m alt.   A few times the bombs missed, but only by 100-200m, as I wasn't flying flat enough, or too fast, or I veered off of vector toward target to avoid ground fire.

That sounds like how its aimed in my screenshots shots but slower speed and higher altitude.  I'd have to try again when garbage collection is fixed.

Do you mind testing if AI can hit the targets?

[OMAC 254]

I'll test AI now. 

 

I should have stated in my last post that I really didn't "aim" before dropping bomb other than trying to keep within a few degrees of vector to target (i.e. flying nice and flat directly towards target), and not going too fast.

 

Edit:  Harrier with AI pilot appears to be missing stationary targets quite badly using Mk82 bombs.  Don't know the cause or if it is worse than before. Oddly, the Harrier keeps crashing into ground most of the time even though allowDamage is set to false.  ???

[samatra 85]

3 hours ago, OMAC said:

Oddly, the Harrier keeps crashing into ground most of the time even though allowDamage is set to false.  ???

allowDamage doesnt save from crashes in A2\OA

[OMAC 254]

10 minutes ago, samatra said:

allowDamage doesnt save from crashes in A2\OA

 

Yes I know, but why the crashes when the plane receives no damage from ground fire?  The Harrier was crashing more than 75% of the time, apparently for no reason.  I wonder if the crashes would occur if the enemy tanks it was targeting had no ammo...

[samatra 85]

8 minutes ago, OMAC said:

 

Yes I know, but why the crashes when the plane receives no damage from ground fire?  The Harrier was crashing more than 75% of the time, apparently for no reason.  I wonder if the crashes would occur if the enemy tanks it was targeting had no ammo...

Compare to non-beta OA?

[opusfmspol 280]

2 hours ago, OMAC said:

 

Yes I know, but why the crashes when the plane receives no damage from ground fire?  The Harrier was crashing more than 75% of the time, apparently for no reason.  I wonder if the crashes would occur if the enemy tanks it was targeting had no ammo...

setCombatMode "BLUE", and they should become a live fire static target.

[OMAC 254]

Using current betas, AV-8B Harrier with AI pilot will never hit a stationary ground target using Mk82 bomb.  The bombs always hit short of target (miss distance depends on speed and altitude of plane).

 

If setCombatMode "BLUE" is set for opfor ground targets, Harrier Mk82 bombs will not lock onto them at all.  They are seen as non-hostile or otherwise invisible to targeting.

 

Edit:  Using A2CO with A2 beta and OA stable (1.63 pre-corepatch), first Mk82 bomb dropped by AI-piloted Harrier scored direct hit on stationary tank target.  

 

Is there a way to have AI pilots use full locking with iron bombs, but human pilots only get the locking with reduced maneuverability (as in current OA beta)?

 

[pcc 14]

9 hours ago, OMAC said:

Oddly, the Harrier keeps crashing into ground most of the time even though allowDamage is set to false.  ???

It's probably because the pilot was hit.  this allowDamage false; only protects vehicle but not the crew.

 

If possible, make the bomb accelerate value random.  Then bombs will hit targets but not all the time.

[pcc 14]

On 3/1/2017 at 11:57 AM, pcc said:

Some APCs manned by AI like tunguska and Shilka for some reason will not fire at enemy ground units but only maintain visual lock with clear line of sight doesn't matter how far or close.  They only fire after I've board the vehicle once.   I've tried issuing engage at will and told them attack specific targets but its only after I board the vehicle once then the AI will fire. 

I've only noticed this in warfare and tested with clean setup.

If I only add the units in editor without modules they fire on their own at enemy ground units no problem.

I discovered that this problems seems to be related with AI commander not giving the fire order.  When tunguska and shilka AI gunners fails to open fire at targets despite looking at their targets, I ordered the commander to disembark and the gunners started to fire.   The test was in non beta, but it should be the same in beta.

This could be fixed by making main gunner top command via cfgvehicles commanding. 

Edited March 21, 2017 by pcc
Occurred in non beta.