Islamic State (ISIS/ISIL/Daesh) Discussion

[3lockad3 11]

0.o with a response like that you deserve no response, besides, my kids are using the crayons at the moment.

Just so you know, I got a sentence in till I notice you were not even worth the time, and stopped reading, next time learn how to address people so you at least get the time and maybe your point across, but this is an adult discussion.

Edited May 6, 2015 by 3lockad3

[vilas 477]

"because god told so" is argument of many religions - which means - they do not have argument and they live according to dogma (never trying to find true, cause dogma says "believe , obey" not THINK)

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm

this is something which you simply cannot deny, you can play moderate but this is fake, in fact you simply obey what priest say, not asking any question, even about dinosaurs , evolution, cosmic space and etc.

i just hope one day sharia-law tries will be banned in EU like it is nowadays in some US states, cause in XXI c. we should not allow argument "because god told it" untill god existance is not proven by science (along with "why children die because of cancer" question)

discussion with person who blindly believe in god and priests or things that books from 1 thousand years say is impossible,

i believe in science not in book written 1000 years ago in era where people didn't know that Earth is round and turns around Sun in space,

there is no god, and when you say about adult discussion i wonder what level of technical education do you have and do you deny dinosaurs existance as well , or homo neandertalensis:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neanderthal

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinosaur

those are facts, not blindly repeated lines from book

this is science , not mythology

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Greek_mythological_figures

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Turtle

in middleages Holy Inqusition was burning alive scientists who were proving astronomical theories which were against Catholic Church teaching,

a lot of people died burned alive because they were saying that earth is round, that earth turns around the sun,

everyone should move forward and not stay in beliefs that 5000 years ago suddenly human race appeared and there was no dinosaurs or neanderthal human race,

we had in Europe burning people alive for science 500 years ago, but we moved forward and throw away such dogmas

priests in all religion have only one goal - to rule over people , to make people obey, money, power,

this is reason they are priests and tell others what to do

i understand people asking question "who created dinosaurs or first DNA", but i will NEVER understand people saying "there is a book written hundreds years ago, it tells what you must do and what is banned, it tells what to do in Friday, Saturday, Monday, if you call that book insane you have to die" and i will never ACCEPT such people telling others "but you should obey what someone wrote on that book" and i will rather fight such people

-----------

http://www.tvn24.pl/wiadomosci-ze-swiata,2/turcy-sprzedaja-islamistom-nawozy-do-produkcji-bomb,539765.html

Turkey sells chemical stuff used later to produce bombs by ISIS , lol :O and they wanted to join EU

---------

http://img8.demotywatoryfb.pl//uploads/201505/1430667914_xvrzbr_600.jpg

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/tomatoes-are-christian-egyptian-salafi-group-warns--.aspx?pageID=238&nid=23713

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2012/06/muslim-group-in-egypt-eating-tomatoes-is-forbidden-because-they-are-christian

http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/commentandblogs/2012/08/29/a-muslim-group-forbids-tomatoes-because-they-are-christian-will-dialogue-with-muslims-ever-be-possible-perhaps-but-it-wont-be-easy/

islam against tomatoes

Edited May 7, 2015 by vilas

[3lockad3 11]

"because god told so" is argument of many religions - which means - they do not have argument and they live according to dogma (never trying to find true, cause dogma says "believe , obey" not THINK)

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm

this is something which you simply cannot deny, you can play moderate but this is fake, in fact you simply obey what priest say, not asking any question, even about dinosaurs , evolution, cosmic space and etc.

i just hope one day sharia-law tries will be banned in EU like it is nowadays in some US states, cause in XXI c. we should not allow argument "because god told it" untill god existance is not proven by science (along with "why children die because of cancer" question)

discussion with person who blindly believe in god and priests or things that books from 1 thousand years say is impossible,

i believe in science not in book written 1000 years ago in era where people didn't know that Earth is round and turns around Sun in space,

there is no god, and when you say about adult discussion i wonder what level of technical education do you have and do you deny dinosaurs existance as well , or homo neandertalensis:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neanderthal

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinosaur

those are facts, not blindly repeated lines from book

this is science , not mythology

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Greek_mythological_figures

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Turtle

in middleages Holy Inqusition was burning alive scientists who were proving astronomical theories which were against Catholic Church teaching,

a lot of people died burned alive because they were saying that earth is round, that earth turns around the sun,

everyone should move forward and not stay in beliefs that 5000 years ago suddenly human race appeared and there was no dinosaurs or neanderthal human race,

we had in Europe burning people alive for science 500 years ago, but we moved forward and throw away such dogmas

priests in all religion have only one goal - to rule over people , to make people obey, money, power,

this is reason they are priests and tell others what to do

i understand people asking question "who created dinosaurs or first DNA", but i will NEVER understand people saying "there is a book written hundreds years ago, it tells what you must do and what is banned, it tells what to do in Friday, Saturday, Monday, if you call that book insane you have to die" and i will never ACCEPT such people telling others "but you should obey what someone wrote on that book" and i will rather fight such people

-----------

http://www.tvn24.pl/wiadomosci-ze-swiata,2/turcy-sprzedaja-islamistom-nawozy-do-produkcji-bomb,539765.html

Turkey sells chemical stuff used later to produce bombs by ISIS , lol :O and they wanted to join EU

---------

http://img8.demotywatoryfb.pl//uploads/201505/1430667914_xvrzbr_600.jpg

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/tomatoes-are-christian-egyptian-salafi-group-warns--.aspx?pageID=238&nid=23713

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2012/06/muslim-group-in-egypt-eating-tomatoes-is-forbidden-because-they-are-christian

http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/commentandblogs/2012/08/29/a-muslim-group-forbids-tomatoes-because-they-are-christian-will-dialogue-with-muslims-ever-be-possible-perhaps-but-it-wont-be-easy/

islam against tomatoes

Actually there is a ton of twisted facts on the internet that are not exactly the representation to the Qu'ran nor Islam, in fact, if you want to talk about ISIS we would have to step out of the religion just to do so because they break so much moral code and pillars of Islamic war.

Just from reading I can tell you get your sources from anywhere that suits your narrative, and trust me, there is A LOT of misinformation on the net.

I very much follow science and I am very aware and could hold a topic on a molecular level, I'm also an observer of our heliosphere all the way to our core and beyond further into the cosmos. You saying I cant is even but yet another reason you have no clue what you are talking about and have taken up trendy hate against it. You have no clue who you are even talking too ;)

I very much study other religions as well. And no, we do not follow what men says, and we do not have priests, there is only one worth of worship, so no, we do not even pray to the prophets (pbuta)

I myself hope for the banning of Sharia law, in fact, the only reason it is something to bring up is because you see it being forced on the news. However, I assure you no one is forced, nor are they stoned in civilized areas. I believe God gave us thinking minds for a reason, and I think he would even be upset to know that his people are forced and or killed for mistakes in the name of him. I truly believe he wants people to live free in mind and spirit, so as he knows who is worthy, and who is to be destroyed in the hell-fire. It is more the organizations that have twisted the word for political agenda. You have some seriously twisted facts, just as I did one time. I used to used scripture just to attack Muslims with just like you in fact, my wife still hates Muslims as I'm the one who taught her her hate. So maybe you are on a path of enlightenment yourself just as I was. I never believed in God, in fact, I have been a dj for well over 10 years and I have played in clubs and drank booze and did copious amounts of drugs (actually dying from a weak heart from that) and I still spin I just choose my music to be more appropriate so as not to be the one who makes other sever ties with God.However, I know your confusion.

I very much believe in all that we have unearthed, I very much believe as are some other scientists, that science is not denying the fact of God, it could actually be proving all his mysterious works. Some scholars believe some outlandish things, yes I can agree on that, but I'm much more secular then your ideal would want to fathom. I believe there is still more to know about evolution and the works. Jesus (pbuh) did say that in the end times we must search for the truth, because it will not find us easy. I believe no book to be a 100% as it was not God himself that wrote the book, so it is also subject to error, thus we must remain humble to facts outside of each books that could point to truths. For instance, we can very much prove Moses did not build an arch, and there was no great flood, we can tell by the oxidation on mountains, it is but a story to help bring power to the commandments he brought, and the laws he brought. I could go deep into this topic, but I really care not to get into the origins of the King James at this time, and Constantine's motives in rewriting the bible. Maybe that will be a topic for another time. I would rather keep to the outlines you have drawn up.

Oh my, in the next sentence you ask it, so let me see if I can find a reply to a Christian I made a short time ago.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------(posted to a Christian in debate, so do note, that it was a retort to someone else.)

I'm coming to the realization the Roman Emperor Constantine is the reason why Christianity was formed. He never wrote the bible by any means, nor was he the author to any scripture, but he was so sick of the fighting that he was desperate for the bible to become a unitized entity, and it was very possible he did it to save lives. What does this mean today ? That the bible has been tampered with a great deal as a political means to unite the Roman empire, and if I'm looking for the truth, it will not come from the book burning Romans. Not to mention, Christianity very closely resembles about 30 other religions from that time period from which it arose from, as Constantine let many religions come together on one book, he even publicly stated he did not care if it was true to wit, he was just sick of the divide that was bringing the empire to ruin..

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Another great point to make there is why would the Romans execute Jesus and then relay his word if he was so blasphemous ? They killed him nd twisted the word to suit their agenda, and even lied that Jesus appointed some of them to take his position.

That is all I'll elaborate there but yes, the Romans did some crazy things to those who spoke against the empire you are right, but it was not the word of God, what you have brought up is the Greeks and Rome's Ideals that they interjected into the religion.

You are right, it is 6000, not 5000, but yes, humans back then believed some outlandish things that disprove their religion from being a 100%, and yes, even Islam believes some things I do not agree with, but they were but men. The prophets actually had to have healing powers and the right tongue in order to be considered prophets, there as been many false prophets as well, but we know of 25 that God sent to us (pbuta) And there could have been more that never made it to our books because they were so sought after and killed out of which hunts and blasphemy to the church and empire. However, God only sent us one religion, and many religions are actually from the same text just a difference of, emphasis, perception, motive.

And yes you are right, in some cases religion is used to oppress its people, thus so much reform to some books. However, the Qu'ran is not open to interpretation or reform, it is still in its full from the day Muhammad whisked his pen across paper.

Another thing is God only sent one religion (as stated above) He sent different prophets for different times for different afflictions, and in some cases to even reform his own word, so just because there are many religions does not mean that there are many Gods, in some cases God sent the different religions and they were bettered. Some where also just to condition a state of time and mind, and as time changed, so did the prophets. It is not that there is a 100 religions or a 1000, it is that we perceive it to be that way, and what has actually happened, is that God sent different prophets for the changing of time and affliction. And eve Muhammad (pbuh) said he was not coming to change the laws of Moses, or the teachings of Jesus (pbutb) he was merely sent to enforce them and add to them because men were straying from God and the Word of Jesus. I truly believe that Jesus (pbuh) was meant to be the last but because of the Roman reform to his word, and book burning the old culture, he was forced to send another to give man one last chance at the word, because the world was more openly accepting what was blasphemous at one time, thus none after him Muhammad (pbuh)

Just because you do not believe doesn't mean there is none, and I'm sure when you die you will find God, but by then it will be to late, as he asks that you serve him in good health, for if you do not, he will not be at the side of your deathbed no matter how much you repent. That is why it is important to not squander your gift while life nourishes your body and bones. You need to move others to the light, as you also need to do deeds in order to serve our creator. I'm not converting you. I do not really believe in organized religion, as I follow many of the prophets not just a religion. I am searching for the truth and the light, and that is all that drives my heart and soul. Yes I am Muslim, yes I am Catholic, and yes I follow the teaching of other prophets. Even smiling to others is a good dead.

I'm going to conclude with saying show others the tolerance you want to be afforded with for when you stand tall before the man. And know there is a creator, and you can take refuge in him through many religions as God sees your hearts true intent.

If you are respectful as any question you like, and I will take the time to answer you if I can. Take care, and God bless.

[vilas 477]

and I'm sure when you die you will find God, but by then it will be to late, as he asks that you serve him in good health, for if you do not, he will not be at the side of your deathbed no matter how much you repent. That is why it is important to not squander your gift while life nourishes your body and bones.

many catholics also believe that it is not important if man is decent , but if he pay to priest every sunday,

so one can be bandit , but if he pray, and pays to church - he is okay - this is for me sick,

and btw.

why children die on cancer if god exist,

why in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan etc. people are killed for apostasy and in Egypt afair according to teaching of immams which order it strictly according to quotes from told book ?

and christianity was developed because emperors needed slaves that will not riot,

christianity teaches to obey ruler and be shy and not demand more , because if one is poor he will reach heaven,

so christianity was developed to prepare feudal era, because in roman or paganic religions there was bountiny , religion is best system for those who rule, i even knew case one bishop who was atheist himself, simply for him it was easy job and he had money from morons that served him and paid him,

he laughed at them, had lovers and taught them to not have sex before marriage,

i know people who believe that someone created big-bang and dinosaurs, they however do not go to church cause they DO NOT NEED administration,

Islam, Christianity - is simply administration forcing people to obey, cause it contains temples, priests earning money from followers, soldiers following leaders,

i am not against people believing that something created dinosaurs, i am against organized enforcement agencies called religions and i always will be because main thing they do is forcing others,

is was visible in middle ages, it is visible in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan (they demanded deportation of apostates from other countries to murder them), it is visible in Egypt when last time they executed woman for sunbathing in bikini, it is visible in Sharia Patrols on European streets when bearded men want to make native Europeans to obey sill rules about food, clothes and etc. there were even some murders in Europe , also hate to dogs, pigs etc.

it is because religion organized is kind of "law" enforcement agency but basing on dogmas , i am against dogmas and i will be against dogmas , especially when someone say that one day in callendar is so special and one cannot do/eat something because of day in callendar,

internet is full of quotes from Quoran, so are those quotes fake or ... you just use one part of that book and not look at other part of book ?

i know Catholics who say that they obey only half of commandments - but for me they are not real Catholics if they follow only half ,

majority of Catholics break many commandments and break church teaching - but it doesn't change fact that they are Catholics, as ISIS is Muslim ,as Taliban , as Al-queda is Muslim, because it is contained from people who take special quotes from Quoran which many websites wrote - do you deny those quotes ? those quotes say that Muslims should kill Jews, should kill infidels, that woman is animal-property etc. there are Immams saying that man can have sex with goat,

are Immams teaching is not Islam ?

Sharia gangs acting in Europe are also not fake, those people attack others for example because someone eat ham (in France)

-----------

edit:

http://img.wiocha.pl/images/6/5/65f48b775078431ee4e0bca6c84c9ba6.jpg

new signs in UK photographed by Polish immigrants

Edited May 8, 2015 by vilas

[vilas 477]

http://wiadomosci.wp.pl/kat,1342,title,Trzy-osoby-zatrzymane-pod-zarzutami-zwiazanymi-z-terroryzmem,wid,17538814,wiadomosc.html?ticaid=114dd1

3 Chechen immigrants who lived in Poland for few years arrested in Poland for connection with ISIS

[3lockad3 11]

many catholics also believe that it is not important if man is decent , but if he pay to priest every sunday,

so one can be bandit , but if he pray, and pays to church - he is okay - this is for me sick,

and btw.

why children die on cancer if god exist,

why in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan etc. people are killed for apostasy and in Egypt afair according to teaching of immams which order it strictly according to quotes from told book ?

and christianity was developed because emperors needed slaves that will not riot,

christianity teaches to obey ruler and be shy and not demand more , because if one is poor he will reach heaven,

so christianity was developed to prepare feudal era, because in roman or paganic religions there was bountiny , religion is best system for those who rule, i even knew case one bishop who was atheist himself, simply for him it was easy job and he had money from morons that served him and paid him,

he laughed at them, had lovers and taught them to not have sex before marriage,

i know people who believe that someone created big-bang and dinosaurs, they however do not go to church cause they DO NOT NEED administration,

Islam, Christianity - is simply administration forcing people to obey, cause it contains temples, priests earning money from followers, soldiers following leaders,

i am not against people believing that something created dinosaurs, i am against organized enforcement agencies called religions and i always will be because main thing they do is forcing others,

is was visible in middle ages, it is visible in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan (they demanded deportation of apostates from other countries to murder them), it is visible in Egypt when last time they executed woman for sunbathing in bikini, it is visible in Sharia Patrols on European streets when bearded men want to make native Europeans to obey sill rules about food, clothes and etc. there were even some murders in Europe , also hate to dogs, pigs etc.

it is because religion organized is kind of "law" enforcement agency but basing on dogmas , i am against dogmas and i will be against dogmas , especially when someone say that one day in callendar is so special and one cannot do/eat something because of day in callendar,

internet is full of quotes from Quoran, so are those quotes fake or ... you just use one part of that book and not look at other part of book ?

i know Catholics who say that they obey only half of commandments - but for me they are not real Catholics if they follow only half ,

majority of Catholics break many commandments and break church teaching - but it doesn't change fact that they are Catholics, as ISIS is Muslim ,as Taliban , as Al-queda is Muslim, because it is contained from people who take special quotes from Quoran which many websites wrote - do you deny those quotes ? those quotes say that Muslims should kill Jews, should kill infidels, that woman is animal-property etc. there are Immams saying that man can have sex with goat,

are Immams teaching is not Islam ?

Sharia gangs acting in Europe are also not fake, those people attack others for example because someone eat ham (in France)

-----------

edit:

http://img.wiocha.pl/images/6/5/65f48b775078431ee4e0bca6c84c9ba6.jpg

new signs in UK photographed by Polish immigrants

Sorry, can't continue this conversation.. A lot has happened in my life... Wife died and she was only 27 years old.. So I just going to start fresh. Take care tho man, sure someone will answer you out.

[mistyronin 1181]

IS took Palmyra, which is an extremely important town due to its ancient Roman ruins.

(BBC) Islamic State 'in control' of Syria's Palmyra

(Al Jazeera) Syria's heritage in peril as ISIL captures Palmyra

Fighters from the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) have taken full control of Syria's ancient city of Palmyra, according to activists and a monitoring group.

The Syrian army has collapsed and ISIL has taken over the city, the UK-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights reported.

The city has been listed as a World Heritage site because of its architecture, and is also known as The Pearl of the Desert.

[Tonci87 163]

Well, guess they will destroy that one next.....Barbarians

What is going n there, Government troops were on the offensive but now ISIS is taking several key cities.

[13islucky 10]

Strange how quickly they took it, seeing as the news just a few days ago was that they were taking a beating around it. Situations like this are dynamic, I know, but it kind of makes you wonder if government forces are intentionally pulling back to force the coalition's hand and cause it to increase its efforts.

[mistyronin 1181]

Strange how quickly they took it, seeing as the news just a few days ago was that they were taking a beating around it. Situations like this are dynamic, I know, but it kind of makes you wonder if government forces are intentionally pulling back to force the coalition's hand and cause it to increase its efforts.

I fear the same Lucky, letting them destroy the ancient ruins of a city like Palmyra would probably force an international reaction.

Specially having in mind that IS also conducted a huge advance in Iraq (they took Ramadi).

(The Atlantic) The Painful Loss of Ramadi

Islamic State control over the capital of Iraq’s largest province is a symbolic and strategic blow to the United States.

On that:

(Al Jazeera) US says coalition targeting Iraq's Ramadi

The US-led coalition has carried out air strikes on the Iraqi city of Ramadi, which fell to the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) group this week, according to US administration sources.

(BBC) Islamic State crisis: US sends Iraq missiles for Ramadi battle

The US military says it is sending 1,000 anti-tank missiles to the Iraqi government following the fall of Ramadi to Islamic State (IS) forces.

[Dixit 10]

The Islamic State has no future and is bound to fail. But more importantly, it is a lost opportunity for a genuine change in the countries of the Middle East.

Let's examine the situation:

The Islamic State declared "war" and expressed the desire to conquer the World. It called Muslims all over the world to fight the "non believers" in their country. This communication strategy is extremely stupid and short sighted as it completely ignores how our societies and governments function. Public opinion can be swayed to either explicitly or implicitly support a controversial government decision by the information it is being fed. Just like the massive communication and media coverage of the Pearl Harbor incident swayed public opinion to give in and support war against Japan, so too, media coverage of the horrors of the Vietnam war swayed public opinion to pressure the government to end war in Vietnam. The Islamic State's communication strategy and the actions it is carrying out across the world will inevitably fuel the success of extreme right wing parties and governments. The violence and racism against Muslims all around the world is already increasing steadily and it is only a matter of time, should the Islamic State persevere in its current strategy, before neo-fascist or neo-Nazi governments take power in key countries around the world.

Examples of the stupidity of their actions can be exemplified by the recent terrorist attacks against the journalists and cartoonists at Charlie Hebdo. The Islamic State openly supported the attacks and encouraged others to do the same. But let's look at the actual impact of the attacks. Charlie Hebdo was a dying journal. Before the attacks it had about 8000 subscribers and was printed at between 25.000 and 50.000 copies. It was in a very tight financial situation and was ignored by the majority of people, many actually criticizing it for being racist. Perhaps a few more years, and the journal would have died out, just like its predecessor, Hara-Kiri. After the attacks, the number of subscribers was multiplied by 25 and the journal printed following the attacks was sold by the millions, securing it's financial revenues. The attacks also severely increased racism and violence against Muslim communities and contributed to the ever increasing popularity of the "Front National" (the french extreme right party).

Another blatant example of the stupidity of the Islamic State is the videos published showing the decapitation of kidnapped tourists or the training of women and children to become warriors of the Islamic State. How many videos showing women and children training to kill and how many newspaper articles and reports about women and children committing terrorist attacks will it require before the entire population living in Islamic State controlled territory will not be seen as "victims" and potential "collateral damage" by the wider public but simply cold blooded terrorists that deserve to die?

An interesting question to ask is why are our countries relatively "passive" in the wake of an enemy that openly declares its wish to take over the world. Some would say that our own governments are busy with other more pressing issues such as restoring our broken economies and secure economic growth which is indispensable to the survival of our economic system. In my opinion, the Islamic State is allowed to exist because it serves the interests of many governments across the world.

First, it is a source of revenue for the weapon industry, selling weapons to those fighting against the Islamic State, and perhaps even indirectly selling weapons to the Islamic State.

Second, for some governments, it is the perfect way to get rid of troublesome minorities in their own countries. Turkey for instance, would probably wouldn't mind if the Kurds and the Islamic State slaughtered each other.

Third, the strategy of the Islamic State is not a major threat to the continued existence of our economic and political system. Osama Ben Laden and the September 11th attacks targeted the World Trade Center, which represented the heart of our financial and economic system. "Smart" terrorism that chooses highly sensitive targets that can shake the economic and financial system is extremely dangerous and our governments will go out of their way to ensure that it is eliminated. The Islamic State, on the other hand, encourages "petty" terrorism, choosing civilian targets which do absolutely zero effect to the stability of the economic and financial system. Growth in France will certainly not suffer from the death of a dozen cartoonists, but on the other hand, such attacks give governments more political leverage to progressively put in place a less democratic and more authoritarian political system.

Finally, the Islamic State solves an enduring problem of our societies: capitalism cannot secure the happiness of everyone. Some people in our society are unhappy, depressed, unemployed, poor, uneducated,... They usually are more of a "cost" than a benefit to our economic system because of their increased delinquency rates and the need to fund police and prisons to keep the delinquent elements locked away, and because of direct subsidies such as unemployment benefits or social security they receive since our modern societies would not accept that they were simply left to die.

Some of these people will be seduced by the Islamic States' rhetoric and rally it's cause, buying a ticket to fight by its side in Syria, Iraq or Libya. It's the first time in history that people willingly buy a ticket to go to a massive concentration and extermination camp. For our governments, rather than feeding a part of its population with anti-depressants, shelling out government money to keep them living in barely acceptable social conditions through social security and locking up the inevitable violent elements that can no longer bear their degraded situation, they can simply be left to fight and die in the Middle East for the mere cost of an airplane ticket, paid with their own money.

If by chance, they manage to return, they are branded like livestock as terrorists and can be legitimately monitored and spied on by the government without fear of breaching any kind of laws protection individuals. Should they plan any terrorist attack, they can be shot on sight as was already the case in the Netherlands and Belgium, governments capitalizing on the news of such failed attacks by pushing even more controversial policies heading towards the direction of totalitarian states.

But it goes even further. Should the Islamic State endure in its current strategy, in a couple of years, public opinion will be ripe to give it's governments total freedom to annihilate them entirely. Since women and children are being trained as soldiers fighting for the Islamic State, anyone living inside the territory controlled by the Islamic State can be considered an enemy. Moreover, the impact on the world economy of a total destruction of the territories controlled by the Islamic State is negligible if at all existent. It could even spur a much needed rebound in the currently low oil prices for the oil industry. Once public opinion is ripe to the idea and extreme right governments took root in key countries, nothing will prevent them from dropping a dozen nuclear weapons on the Islamic State or use more traditional massive bombing campaigns to eradicate them. Thus the Islamic State is the first massive concentration and extermination camp where people disenfranchised with our societies go to die.

To finish, I would say it is quite sad to see how the situation develops. European States, followed by the United States, have meddled in the internal affairs of the Middle East for nearly a millennium. First with the crusades to take back "Christian" holy land, then with colonization and finally through economic and political control over their governments' heads, supported by our governments so long as they did not go against our interests. Progressive revolutions were quashed such as the Iranian revolution in the 1950s, replaced by a ruthless dictatorship supported by our governments. The Middle East region deserves a true independence, and a government that works in the interest of its populations that have seen an endless alternation between war, poverty and violent dictatorships. A government that will defend their interests at the international level, strive to diversify and support its local economy without falling prey to multinational companies only willing to suck out natural resources at an advantageous price. Instead, they have fallen into chaos and obscurantism, blinded by hate and shortsightedness.

If history tells us anything, it's that the most successful revolutions of all time came about by highly educated and visionary personalities: Ghandi, Mandela, San Martin, Bolivar... Even Martin Luther King brought about more change in the United States by a few thousand words than could have been possible with a million guns. Knowledge is power and so far, the Islamic State has showed only signs of blatant ignorance and stupidity. It opened a window of opportunity for a genuine change in the Middle East, and slammed it shut right in its own face.

[sudayev 27]

Norwegian vet sided with Peshmerga and fighting against the ISIS

http://www.reddit.com/r/Norway/comments/36v2rb/norwegian_afghanistan_veteran_and_former/

Check out his insta, where he shares details behind harsh reality

https://instagram.com/peshmerganor/

[vilas 477]

Well, guess they will destroy that one next.....Barbarians

.

every religion destroys something, every religion is barbaric , read what Jewish religion says about non-Jews,

https://www.radioislam.org/islam/english/toread/jewras.htm

http://www.answering-christianity.com/nonjews_in_talmud.htm

http://rense.com/general86/talmd.htm

, Catholic Holy Inqusition was burning Ancient Rome architecture too, destroying temples and postuments from Ancient Rome, from South America ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_sacrifice_in_Aztec_culture ), Incas religion in Ancient America was ripping human hearths in temples etc. etc. etc.

[mistyronin 1181]

every religion destroys something, every religion is barbaric

I agree that all the main religions have destroyed a lot of important cultural stuff along history, specially because all of them try to be the one, so they are not compatible with the others and tried to eliminate all possible competition.

The Christian church destroyed a lot of important Roman and Greek ancient documents during the first centuries of the first millennium. After all how can you convince that the Earth is flat and other texts in the Bible if you have Ptolemy's studies.

Tho nowadays in a big part of the World we have evolved, most people are educated so there's no need to destroy stuff. But in countries where access to education is limited like A-Stan or in rural areas in Iraq or Syria, it still plays a role.

[ProfTournesol 956]

As a secular guy, I tend to agree too, but Nazis and communists destroyed a great bunch of things too, with no connection to religions.

[mistyronin 1181]

As a secular guy, I tend to agree too, but Nazis and communists destroyed a great bunch of things too, with no connection to religions.

Well you can consider Communism and Fascism as religions in this case.

Authoritarian regimes are meant to be "believes" that are considered better than anyone else without any possibility of doubt. And if you dare to say otherwise you ended dead.

In fact religion in Prehistory was invented as a way to gather people under the command of a certain person. The first rulers in Egypt or Mesopotamia were priests.

That was extended through Ancient and Medieval times (the Emperors or the Kings were Gods or God messengers), you can still that method of control nowadays in certain regimes.

[vilas 477]

As a secular guy, I tend to agree too, but Nazis and communists destroyed a great bunch of things too, with no connection to religions.

cult of leader - Stalin was god, Lenin was god for them,

Nazism ? please study ocultism in Third Reich, SS was sect, they were occult sect opposite to Wehrmacht which was army,

SS had their Waveslberg, Ahnenerbe, Lebensborn, their own marriage ceremony, they were neo-pagans too , read about black camelot cult , black sun cult

problem is that in Isreal syionistic views as a posted links are still present and their priests even nowadays say that non-Jews should be slaves

banksters - also religion, Baphomet sect , Free Masons, Bildeberg group and big owl monument (if you not know, please look on YT to see how businesmen pray to big owl monument in USA) etc.

many "gods", but every religion want to force others to obey "their god"

Edited May 22, 2015 by vilas

[vilas 477]

http://wiadomosci.wp.pl/kat,1356,title,Dzihadysci-zabili-400-osob-w-Palmirze-Wsrod-ofiar-glownie-kobiety-i-dzieci,wid,17564464,wiadomosc.html?ticaid=114ec0

our beloved allah akbars killed 400 women and children last week in Palmira (Syrian city taken by allahuakbars last week)

http://news.newsdirectory1.com/isis-400-civilians-killed-in-palmira/ in ENglish

[gammadust 12]

US official admission as early as August 2012 of support of Salafists (Al-Qaida in Iraq - later ISIL) by the "The West, Gulf Countries and Turkey" sharing common strategic goals, against the "Syrian Regime".

(click image for full declassified report under FOIA)

Source US Department of Defense

[mistyronin 1181]

US official admission as early as August 2012 of support of Salafists (Al-Qaida in Iraq - later ISIL) by the "The West, Gulf Countries and Turkey" sharing common strategic goals, against the "Syrian Regime".

You are mixing different points.

When they talk about powers that support the opposition they mean the Gulf Countries, who are the ones interested in the creation of a Salafist principality.

In fact it even states in point D, that the deterioration of that situation has dire consequences for the US (and then list them).

[gammadust 12]

Read the document with care where it states:

The general situation:

A. Internally, events are taking a clear sectarian direction.

B. The Salafist, the Muslim Brotherhood, and AQI are the major forces driving the insurgency in Syria. [so much for the FSA moderates right?]

C. The West, Gulf countries, and Turkey support the opposition; while Russia, China, and Iran support the Regime.

(...)

full capitalization removed for reading confort, emphasis and note added

(...) In fact it even states in point D, that the deterioration of that situation has dire consequences for the US (and then list them).

"has dire consequences" for who? of course you can interpret it as you want, but what is literaly stated is "has dire consequences on the iraqi situation".

[mistyronin 1181]

full capitalization removed for reading confort, emphasis and note added

Yeah it states that in parts A, B and C of the 2nd Point, and then you linked it to the 8th Point of the document. :rolleyes:

Read the document as a whole, not cutting the parts you want and linking them at pleasure. Besides it misses the obvious censored parts.

BTW I assume you also missed the part:

"Information report, not finally evaluated intelligence"

---------- Post added at 18:58 ---------- Previous post was at 18:36 ----------

(Al Jazeera) 'Hundreds killed' in Palmyra after ISIL takeover

The Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) group have reportedly killed hundreds after seizing the ancient town of Palmyra last week.

Syrian state TV has reported that about 400 civilians were killed by the group since Wednesday, while activists in Palmyra said that ISIL fighters hunted down President Bashar al-Assad's troops and loyalists, killing up to 300 of them.

Nasser, of the Palmyra Media Centre - a monitoring group on the ground - told Al Jazeera that most of those killed were government troops captured by the fighters after taking over the town.

Edited May 24, 2015 by MistyRonin
orthography

[gammadust 12]

So your argument is that the subject of the verb "support" as defined in the phrase "C. The West, Gulf countries, and Turkey support the opposition" is somehow different of the subject in the expression "(...) and this is exacly what the supporting powers to the opposition want."

ok... As i said, of course you can interpret it as you want if it makes you feel more confortable. The document was presented "as is" with minimal introduction and no intention whatsoever to hide my own bias.

[mistyronin 1181]

So your argument is that the subject of the verb "support" as defined in the phrase "C. The West, Gulf countries, and Turkey support the opposition" is somehow different of the subject in the expression "(...) and this is exacly what the supporting powers to the opposition want."

Yeah... in the point 2nd, C says: "The West, Gulf countries, and Turkey support the opposition"

And in the 3rd point says: "AQI Supported the Syrian Opposition from the beginning, both ideologically and through the media"

And until the 8th point, after talking about different supporters, powers etc. it comments the "supporting powers to the opposition".

If you interpret the documents mixing its contents and then present it as proof of US admission of the Salafist, then it's called false accusation.

[vilas 477]

US official admission as early as August 2012 of support of Salafists

the worst is that our civilisation puts fingers there, we should care about our civilisation and not make any interventions there unless they attack us, all current mess in that region is effect of removing Saddam, Quadafi and supporting removal of Assad, we are 2 different civilisations and we should never mix but let each civilisation live like each civilisation wants,

of course US and some EU countries stick fingers there before all this mess started :( drone raids on Pakistan also do not make friends there