Iraq (current news/events)

[mistyronin 1181]

Basically this thread is to publish and comment the recent news about the situation in Iraq, where ISIL is taking a lot of ground to the Iraqi Army, and their forces are right now at less than 90km from Baghdad.

( Al Jazeera ) Iran vows to combat 'terrorism' in Iraq

( BBC ) Iraq delays vote on emergency as crisis spreads

( The Guardian ) Iraqi Kurdish forces take Kirkuk as Isis sets its sights on Baghdad

( ITAR-TASS ) Moscow confirms strong condemnation of terrorists plans to settle in Iraq, Syria

Remember to be polite in your comments, stick to the subject and always link the sources of your argumentations.

I'll ask that all further argumentations in your comments to be founded in some sources that we all can check[/b]. To avoid any kind of phantasy like "I think that is all an alien conspiracy, that they secretly fund ISIS " ( unless you have proof, then you are encourage to publish it, I'd like to be the first to know about aliens ).

Edited June 13, 2014 by MistyRonin
adding additional lines

[spooky lynx 73]

Looks like those jihadists have now some fancy things in their inventory:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2BrRkScaBs

[mistyronin 1181]

Looks like those jihadists have now some fancy things in their inventory

Youp, it seems that they overrun the Iraqi Army and took their weapons and vehicles. Not a nice situation.

[Sgt.Spoetnik 10]

oh excuse me ronin:rolleyes:, yep they even have blackhawks now,they realy moving up in the world!https://twitter.com/AymanM/status/476829542309695488/photo/1

[Tonci87 163]

Four Questions:

Where did they suddenly come from?

How many are there?

Wasn´t the Iraqui army supposed to be better trained by now?

Where are the US Drones when you need them?

[mistyronin 1181]

Four Questions:

Where did they suddenly come from?

How many are there?

Wasn´t the Iraqui army supposed to be better trained by now?

Where are the US Drones when you need them?

1st Question:

They didn't suddenly come from anywhere. They were founded in 2003, and have been fighting in Iraq first under the rule of Al-Qaeda, and later in Syria under they own rule ( because Al-Qaeda forbid them to act in Syria, so they just abandoned Al-Qaeda ) . The coalition fought them for years ( for instance the Battle of Baqubah between USA and Iraq vs them ).

When the coalition decided to go from Iraq. They grow stronger and started to be more bold.

2nd question: No idea.

3rd question:

Theoretically yeah. The coalition has been training and providing them armament. Also Russia did these last years. So they have the "better training" and equipment from the "East" and the "West".

4th question:

The US drones can/should only entry in one country if the country's Gov. ask for them. The Iraqi Gov. is now thinking if to ask assistance to the US or what.

President Obama has said "I don't rule anything out" for US responses to the crisis in Iraq, Reuters reports. He said he is " looking at all options in helping the Iraqi government face the growing insurgency".

The presdient was asked whether the US would consider drone strikes or any other direct or indirect action to counter Isis and jihadist groups. Reuters continues:

[Tonci87 163]

1st Question:

They didn't suddenly come from anywhere. They were founded in 2003, and have been fighting in Iraq first under the rule of Al-Qaeda, and later in Syria under they own rule ( because Al-Qaeda forbid them to act in Syria, so they just abandoned Al-Qaeda ) . The coalition fought them for years ( for instance the Battle of Baqubah between USA and Iraq vs them ).

When the coalition decided to go from Iraq. They grow stronger and started to be more bold.

2nd question: No idea.

3rd question:

Theoretically yeah. The coalition has been training and providing them armament. Also Russia did these last years. So they have the "better training" and equipment from the "East" and the "West".

4th question:

The US drones can/should only entry in one country if the country's Gov. ask for them. The Iraqi Gov. is now thinking if to ask assistance to the US or what.

No I mean how could they all of a sudden start such a massive offensive? It is kind of crazy.

[Sgt.Spoetnik 10]

A:they came from syria supported by the west to overtrow al-assad,but it didn work out that whell,aka non lethal aid

B:i did hear something like 6000 off them but to pull off something like this it needs to be more,

C; iraqi army isnt like it whas in saddams time,they where destroyed and then the us build them up again,mostly with factions that where agains saddam (sunni shiate wathever,they never stood a chance agains the al-qaida,criminal what you call them groups.

D;the US UK already said they wont get envolved in a new war in irak, we might see some bombings but thats it.prob kill more civies then fighters like they still do in pakistan, afghanistan.

btw their not that close to al-qaida because they are to ruthless for al-qaida, same guys that where shown eating their enemy's in syria.

also:you know their goal? they want to create a khalifad thats control the middle east,north off africa and even a piece off spain,thats their main goal,all under sharia law.

Edited June 12, 2014 by Sgt.Spoetnik

[mistyronin 1181]

A:they came from syria supported by the west to overtrow al-assad,but it didn work out that whell,aka non lethal aid

Wrong. They origin is Iraq in 2003 to fight the coalition. Even Lavrov says it ;)

( Al Manar ) Lavrov: Iraq Unrest Shows Total Failure of US Invasion

C; iraqi army isnt like it whas in saddams time,they where destroyed and then the us build them up again,mostly with factions that where agains saddam (sunni shiate wathever,they never stood a chance agains the al-qaida,criminal what you call them groups.

Wrong, they have better training and equipment from both East and West:

( Defense News ) Iraq Receiving Russian Arms Under $4.3B Deal

( Al Manar ) Lavrov: Russia to Speed up Arms Delivery to Iraq

( Voice of Russia ) 13 Russian Mi-28NE helicopters arrive in Iraq

D;the US UK already said they wont get envolved in a new war in irak.

Wrong.

( BBC ) All options open to fight insurgents, says Obama

( RT ) Obama: 'I don't rule out anything' on Iraq

btw their not that close to al-qaida because they are to ruthless for al-qaida, same guys that where shown eating their enemy's in syria.

Wrong. In fact, they were part of Al-Qaeda... But they separate themselves when ISIS start acting in Syria in 2013 ( Al-Qaeda leadership didn't wanted them to be so strong, and forbid them to act in Syria ) .

( Al khbar ) Al-Qaeda and ISIS: The Renunciation of Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi

( The Independent ) Battle to establish Islamic state across Iraq and Syria

Edited June 12, 2014 by MistyRonin

[katipo66 94]

I heard on "the Internet" they are sponsored by someones good friend Saudi Arabia (and co) - they also rockin some serious weaponry in Syria, which Assad had won an election and made his detractors look completely stupid and now they turn face and have acknowledged Hezbollah as a key player in any movement toward peace, its going to turn around and bite them in the arse soon, you cant talk about Iraq without including Syria, Saudi Arabia, Israel Iran... Its all connected, strange and bullshit world we live in.

[Sgt.Spoetnik 10]

Ronin,where you think they got the supplies,money and support to pull this off?,who benifits from it?

[Tonci87 163]

who benifits from it?

That is a very interesting question! Who would benefit if a islamic group founds the new Khalifat of Baghdad?

[mistyronin 1181]

Ronin,where you think they got the supplies,money and support to pull this off?,who benifits from it?

Saudi Arabia mainly.

But hopefully they are not gonna last longer. The Syrian Free Army sponsored by the US is fighting them. Iran may join the game to get stronger links. Iraq is one of the few Russian friends and companions, I guess Putin will support them. The US are against them too... The EU same.

So basically is almost all the world vs the crazy Islamic Sunni extremists.

BTW they already in 2006 declared their own state in Iraq:

The Mujahideen Shura Council in Iraq Declares the Establishment of a Sunni Islamic State of Iraq, carved from six provinces, however further divisions within al Qaeda in Iraq are expose

Edited June 12, 2014 by MistyRonin

[Sgt.Spoetnik 10]

True, saudi's and gulf states support them,also they got a lot off hardware from the west but i know you wont believe that,aka non lethal aid! saw this mornig a nice piece on bbc or cnn showing a isis fighter with a m16 with acog, he prob found it on the street i guess.

also this free syrian army is on the retreath there is a lot off fighting going on between these guys and al-nusra and isis,they fighting each other for power and control.

[mistyronin 1181]

True, saudi's and gulf states support them,also they got a lot off hardware from the west but i know you wont believe that,aka non lethal aid! saw this mornig a nice piece on bbc or cnn showing a isis fighter with a m16 with acog, he prob found it on the street i guess.

For one side. The ISIS fighters have been fighting against the US and coalition since 2003. I guess that had enough opportunities to take their weapons. Also have been fighting and capturing the Iraqi Army equipment ( that's why the Abrams tanks and so on ).

About the "non lethal aid". The US have send from offroad vehicles, to Russian made light weapons to the Free Syrian Army ( AKs, PKM and RPGs ), they also trained them in their use, so they could fight better both Al-Assad and ISIS.

Check in Google for this YouTube video: Syria's Unending Rebel Conflict: Wolves of the Valley ( I can't add it here due to the forum regulations ).

[nodunit 397]

True, saudi's and gulf states support them,also they got a lot off hardware from the west but i know you wont believe that,aka non lethal aid! saw this mornig a nice piece on bbc or cnn showing a isis fighter with a m16 with acog, he prob found it on the street i guess.

also this free syrian army is on the retreath there is a lot off fighting going on between these guys and al-nusra and isis,they fighting each other for power and control.

Why would no one believe that? It's not as though our government isn't always playing its own black market arms race, hail hydra.

[ProfTournesol 956]

What's ironic in this sad story is that Iran and the USA are now virtually allied.

[Xalteva 10]

So basically is almost all the world vs the crazy Islamic Sunni extremists.

That easy ? no ,i don't think so ! you are trying to create sides,it's good but it's more complicated than that ... i think that someone is playing double agent here :how can you explain that US first ally (which is saudi arabia) is supporting ISIS guys !! well the answer is easy ... Saudi Arabia is Iran first ennemy , the Iraqi governement is under Iran's control ... this is reflected on what's happening on Syria too (ISIS are also there)! US governement is doing some dirty job in the background ! on one side Obama says that ISIS should be stopped (without actually doing anything ,talking is easier ...),and on the other one, having some suspicious friendship with Iran ...

I think there is also a 3rd side ! which is the Iraqi sunni tribes coalition against Maliki's forces ... and those have a good reason to take him down and his governement ! It's much more complicated than what it looks like on TV !

Edited June 12, 2014 by Xalteva

[mistyronin 1181]

That easy ? no ,i don't think so ! you are trying to create sides,it's good but it's more complicated than that ... i think that someone is playing double agent here : if you suppose that Saudi Arabia is supporting the ISIS then you discard the FACT that Saudi Arabia is the first ally of US here !! maybe US is supporting both sides then :D

Point one. Of course its a simplification, that's why the basically in front.

Point two. Yeah in the same way Al Qaeda is mainly financed by Saudi Arabia and no one doubts that is the US main enemy.

And by Saudi Arabia I don't mean the gov, that is allied with the US, but their rotten in money sheiks and princes, like Osama Bin Laden was.

In Wikipedia you have the sources:

Other sources of income in 2001 included the heroin trade and donations from supporters in Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and other Islamic countries. A WikiLeaks released memo from the United States Secretary of State sent in 2009 asserted that the primary source of funding of Sunni terrorist groups worldwide was Saudi Arab

[Xalteva 10]

And by Saudi Arabia I don't mean the gov, that is allied with the US, but their rotten in money sheiks and princes, like Osama Bin Laden was.

Funny, a part from the ruling family ,no one in that country has the power or the money to finance such wars ! Saudi Arabia has its iron hand on what's happening in the gulf ... they even sent their forces to stop Baharain's Chiite revolution ! and most likely helped Yemeni governement to fight the Houtis in the south of the country ;)

no one doubts that is the US main enemy.

I would be careful with that, especially that it was created by an ex CIA member who suddenly came to the surface and his bunch of AK fanatics ... Al Qaeda played the role of trojan horse since 9/11,this is the way i see it for now !

I edited my previous post !

Edited June 12, 2014 by Xalteva

[mistyronin 1181]

Funny, a part from the ruling family ,no one in that country has the power or the money to finance such wars ! Saudi Arabia has its iron hand on what's happening in the gulf ...

Of course, only the ruling family...

So this pals that Forbes say that are the top billionaires in Saudi Arabia, are from the ruling family?

BTW what are your sources? Because I have even linked the Wikileaks released memo. And even Russia seems to be in love with Wiki Leaks...

A classified memo sent by Mrs. Clinton last December made it clear that residents of Saudi Arabia and its neighbors, all allies of the United States, are the chief financial supporters of many extremist activities. “It has been an ongoing challenge to persuade Saudi officials to treat terrorist financing emanating from Saudi Arabia as a strategic priority,†the cable said, concluding that “donors in Saudi Arabia constitute the most significant source of funding to Sunni terrorist groups worldwide.

The dispatch and others offered similarly grim views about the United Arab Emirates (“a strategic gap†that terrorists can exploit), Qatar (“the worst in the region†on counterterrorism) and Kuwait (“a key transit pointâ€). The cable stressed the need to “generate the political will necessary†to block money to terrorist networks — groups that she said were “threatening stability in Pakistan and Afghanistan and targeting coalition soldiers.â€w

Al Qaeda played the role of trojan horse since 9/11,this is the way i see it for now !

The conspiranoias are offlimits in this forum, the moderators have close precisely one thread about the 9/11 conspiracy theories.

Edited June 12, 2014 by MistyRonin

[Xalteva 10]

But ,you seriously think that those guys are financing Al Qaeda and still doing their business in the country without any problems ? and yeah,most of those in the list are linked to the ruling family ! starting by al-waleed bin talal!

[mistyronin 1181]

But ,you seriously think that those guys are financing Al Qaeda and still doing their business in the country without any problems ? and yeah,most of those in the list are linked to the ruling family ! starting by al-waleed bin talal!

And since when having links mean forming part of? Again this thread is not about conspiracy theories. It's about publishing news about Iraq real situation and commenting them with funded arguments ( and with links ).

Keep out conspiracy theories and similar BS or I'll have to ask the moderators intervention.

[Xalteva 10]

The conspiranoias are offlimits in this forum, the moderators have close precisely one thread about the 9/11 conspiracy theories.

No conspiracy here,it's a different way to see things ! actually it's a more realistic way to do so : in politics ,there are no good and bad boys, everyone can be good or bad ... you really think that US deployed their forces in all mideast to fight the evil ? no sorry ! you need to look for interests ;) there are many terrorist organizations all over the world ! but no one is fighting them,because there is no interest right now ! it has always been like this !

---------- Post added at 23:36 ---------- Previous post was at 23:21 ----------

Keep out conspiracy theories and similar BS or I'll have to ask the moderators intervention.

So we just have to sit here and listen to your majesty :D ? where is your proof for people from inside Saudi Arabia financing Al Qaeda and not the governement (what a joke) ? do you know how evil is saudi arabian gov ? do you that they allow public executions there in Al Qaeda style !

I was just pointing out some contradictory facts based on what is said on the media ! alternate thoughts are not necessarely conspiracy theories !

Nevermind,you took the easy exit instead of trying to break my resoning :) i'm a bit disappointed :P

[mistyronin 1181]

No conspiracy here,it's a different way to see things !

It's a different way of see things that you are unable to support with reliable sources ( well in fact not even with not reliable ).

I'm sorry but this thread is not about what you think about Iraq, and what imaginary connections you see there. You can create your own thread for that.

This one is about talking about the actual events adding news and sources, and commenting them. As you are not following that requirements I have already asked for moderation.