Ukraine General

[aleksadragutin 9]

There won't be much of Russia if Putin is that stupid to attack a NATO country.So yes,NATO countries could become targets but in this case we're talking WW3 or do you think Russia can strike without its own destruction?

Also right now the only one who escalates this conflict is Russia,Putin's cease-fire means "you guys fuck off from eastern Ukraine and shut up while we send crapload of military gear(and troops) over the border".

Putin probably won't attack anything. More possible is NATO attacking Russia for whatever reason.

[sudayev 27]

Are you by any chance a conspiracy theorist?

Poland delivered 280 tons of humanitarian aid

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwRVaNhCEAAX63K.jpg

And unlike the russian "aid" there is actually something inside the trucks.

This maybe came from civilian organization like Polish Humanitarian Mission.

Today more trucks have headed out to Lvow with supplies for Ukrainian soldiers in the front. Convoy has been organized by Polish Army and consists of 17 trucks with total payload of 320 tonnes (food rations, bread, sleepers etc).

http://fakty.interia.pl/raport-zamieszki-na-ukrainie/galerie/pomoc-z-polski-dla-ukrainskich-zolnierzy-zdjecie,iId,1551809,iAId,124496

Edited August 30, 2014 by Sudayev

[beastcat 14]

More possible is NATO attacking Russia for whatever reason.

lol, thats the least likely thing ever.

Also as a kind of addition to the picture I posted:

Edited August 30, 2014 by beastcat

[vilas 477]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwRy2G5IcAA8_ef.jpg

So Ukraine captured this thing. This is supposedly a T-72-B3, which is made in Russia since 2013.

And Mariupol is now in combat alert, the people are ordered to get the fuck out or hide as fast as possible.

and this tank is painted in Ukrainian white stripes

[beastcat 14]

and this tank is painted in Ukrainian white stripes

Yeah, because it was captured and is now used by Ukraine. (At least thats my theory)

So apparently Russia made a plan to invade Romania

[vilas 477]

or it was playing Ukrainian one ? (false flag) ?

[beastcat 14]

or it was playing Ukrainian one ? (false flag) ?

I think thats unlikely. They would have used a tank Ukraine also has.

[vilas 477]

from long distance who will spot difference if he is not specialist or if camera is not giving good quality image

[beastcat 14]

from long distance who will spot difference if he is not specialist or if camera is not giving good quality image

I give up, but I still think its unlikely.

[spooky lynx 73]

That's a nice story, but very far from reality. Pro Russian separatists were about to be wiped out (despite being heavily supplied by Moscow) before Russia directly intervened to support them with Russian paratroopers and other troops. You cannot deny the obvious.

Sure thing, I am, being in half-a-day of travelling from that places by car and having relatives who live there, telling stories far from reality;) Europeans know better for sure... It reminds me moans about hordes of Russian paratroopers attacking brave Georgian army in Abhasia during 08.08.08:) I've tried to do my best but hadn't find any horde there, although pics of it would be very nice addition to my collection. So comparison of TV and internet news and the reality outside the flat I've hired there made me laugh. The same things I see now. Hordes of Russian paratroopers intervening and other stuff. At least western media outlets hadn't repeated their errors and hadn't shown UA advancing T-64s as Russian ones...

Skip to 23 seconds on this video,

It shows a T-72BM and the Saint Andrews flag, ensign of the russian navy

If you watch it precisely you'll spot the black bat at the flag (may be unofficial sign of some kind of naval special forces), and ole good T-72B with first gen Kontakt-1 ERA, which are in large numbers at Ukrainian warestocks and were widely sold from there.

Edit: single T-72B with K-5 goes later, @1:52. IMHO they were among other stuff left by Soviet army just like T-80s.

Edited August 30, 2014 by Spooky Lynx

[Tonci87 163]

@aleksadragutin Short history lesson on why suddenly all of east Europe went into Nato as fast as they bloody could after the USSR collapsed.

Read up on history and check just how often those countries were invaded by Russia and what Russia has done to them over the centuries. It has basically raped them again and again and again. As soon as those countries saw a chance to protect themselves from any future invasions they took it, and NATO welcomed them with open arms. That is really the whole story behind the NATO east expansion. Now that Russia is going full crazy again even more countries will join NATO as fast as they can.

[vilas 477]

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2014/03/04/285653335/putin-says-those-arent-russian-forces-in-crimea

vs later

http://rt.com/news/crimea-defense-russian-soldiers-108/

i wonder what brainwashing or subliminal technic is using Russia in their TV or what, so Russian do not see clear proofs, call proofs lies, on photos showing T72 see T64 and etc.

how they believe that "miners" with AK in hand teleported 30 miles and suddenly destroy tanks with AK (but all bought newest Russian equipment in shops )

Russian vice-MoD said that separatists use only equipment taken from Ukrainian warehouses (and there is no any support from Russia even in amunition), i suppose Ukrainian army has in storage only newest Russian uniforms, Russian variants of AK74M and etc., AS-VAL, VSS, Russian tanks, Russian MTLB variants, and all it was stored by Ukrainian army in their warehouse accodring to words of vice Minister of Defence of Russia (Anatoli Antonov) said today,

level of lies and denials can be only compared to Goebbels, soon Anatoly Antonov will say that those captured Russian soldier or destroyed vehicles are fake and they are not Russian citizens etc.

and all those wounded and burials in Russia are "due to accident in training"

btw. Antonov said "there will be next humanitarian convoy in 10 days"

Edited August 30, 2014 by vilas

[beastcat 14]

[spooky lynx 73]

i wonder what brainwashing or subliminal technic is using Russia in their TV or what, so Russian do not see clear proofs, call proofs lies, on photos showing T72 see T64 and etc.

how they believe that "miners" with AK in hand teleported 30 miles and suddenly destroy tanks with AK (but all bought newest Russian equipment in shops )

Russian vice-MoD said that separatists use only equipment taken from Ukrainian warehouses (and there is no any support from Russia even in amunition), i suppose Ukrainian army has in storage only newest Russian uniforms, Russian variants of AK74M and etc., AS-VAL, VSS, Russian tanks, Russian MTLB variants, and all it was stored by Ukrainian army in their warehouse accodring to words of vice Minister of Defence of Russia (Anatoli Antonov) said today,

level of lies and denials can be only compared to Goebbels, soon Anatoly Antonov will say that those captured Russian soldier or destroyed vehicles are fake and they are not Russian citizens etc.

and all those wounded and burials in Russia are "due to accident in training"

btw. Antonov said "there will be next humanitarian convoy in 10 days"

You see, Vilas, Ukraine was granted with giant weapon stocks of Soviet army and armed with mostly up-to-date detachments. So yes, there are plenty of different T-72s (and T-80s) there. And other stuff as RPG-26, Metis ATGM, Konkurs ATGM, Igla MANPADS. The only thing I've noticed from really Russian-made stuff is MTLB with BTR-80 turret and BTR-82M. Other weapons are of Soviet origin so you can't say for sure what place had they come from.

BTW, newest Russian uniform:

[vilas 477]

VSS too ? cause there were shown VSS burned

plus there was shown T72 with T90-like ERA

you not deny words of Anatoli Antonov ?

Edited August 30, 2014 by vilas

[ProfTournesol 956]

You see, Vilas, Ukraine was granted with giant weapon stocks of Soviet army and armed with mostly up-to-date detachments. So yes, there are plenty of different T-72s (and T-80s) there. And other stuff as RPG-26, Metis ATGM, Konkurs ATGM, Igla MANPADS. The only thing I've noticed from really Russian-made stuff is MTLB with BTR-80 turret and BTR-82M. Other weapons are of Soviet origin so you can't say for sure what place had they come from.

BTW, newest Russian uniform:

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/150x100q90/742/pU6VIF.jpg

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-28961080

[mistyronin 1181]

Oh please. If you seriously believe that then I feel sorry for you. Do you really think that they are not trying to expand? Small countries have no control over their actions, it's the big guys who decide their faith. The sooner you realize this the better for you.

That doesn't make any sense. Specially related to joining NATO.

For example, now Sweden and Finland are now thinking seriously of joining NATO, the support for it has skyrocket.

Is it because someone else interest? Nope. It's because of the Russian imperialist behaviour in Ukraine.

If Russia hadn't been bullying it's neighbours and invading them, Finns and Swedes wouldn't be interested in joining NATO.

If a lot of Eastern countries joined NATO after the fall of the Soviet Union it's because in the past they precisely invaded by the USSR/Russia, and are scared of that happening again.

Russian Gov. has to learn that the best way to protect it's interests is to befriend and keep its neighbours happy instead of bullying, threatening and invading them.

Edited August 30, 2014 by MistyRonin

[ProfTournesol 956]

And actually it is happening again.

[beastcat 14]

BTW, newest Russian uniform:

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/150x100q90/742/pU6VIF.jpg

First of all try getting the full gear, especially the body armor and helmet.

Like here:

Second of all, where did you get that? I kinda like the camo pattern.

[spooky lynx 73]

VSS too ? cause there were shown VSS burned

plus there was shown T72 with T90-like ERA

you not deny words of Anatoli Antonov ?

VSS was produced since 1987 as weapon for special forces. It was fielded in a number of detachments before USSR collapse.

And 'T-90' like ERA Kontakt-5 is fitted since late 80's on T-72B and T-80U/UD. T-72Bs with such ERA took first battles in Karabakh (Azeris had some left by Soviet army) and were used in first Chechen war. And Kontakt-5'style kits are produced... in Ukraine. Here's a pic of T-72 modified by Kiev armor repairment facility.

You may clearly see the same look of ERA bricks as on 'captured Russian' tank. So it may be one of those made for export customers but requisitioned for UA army (as some of UA-made BTRs).

Oh and I'd recommend to you a good analysis of that video by one tank specialist, Meng models consultant Alexey Khlopotov aka Gur Khan. According to his words that tank has simple TPN-3-49 gunner's scope and V-84 engine, so this may be ole good T-72B1 that was produced widely since 80's and slightly modified with K-5 ERA and DVE-BS wind sensor (which was fitted on T-72s approx. since 1991).

I know why UA crew tries to show Russian agression so desperately. It's much more honorable to be defeated by much more mighty enemy that admit defeat from the local insurgents, yesterday miners, workers and other average Ivans.

Edited August 30, 2014 by Spooky Lynx

[beastcat 14]

VSS was produced since 1987 as weapon for special forces. It was fielded in a number of detachments before USSR collapse.

And 'T-90' like ERA Kontakt-5 is fitted since late 80's on T-72B and T-80U/UD. T-72Bs with such ERA took first battles in Karabakh (Azeris had some left by Soviet army) and were used in first Chechen war. And Kontakt-5'style kits are produced... in Ukraine. Here's a pic of T-72 modified by Kiev armor repairment facility.

http://www.vestnik-rm.ru/userfiles/t_72kiev_33.jpg

http://www.vestnik-rm.ru/userfiles/t_72_kiev_34(1).jpg

You may clearly see the same look of ERA bricks as on 'captured Russian' tank. So it may be one of those made for export customers but requisitioned for UA army (as some of UA-made BTRs).

Oh and I'd recommend to you a good analysis of that video by one tank specialist, Meng models consultant Alexey Khlopotov aka Gur Khan. According to his words that tank has simple TPN-3-49 gunner's scope and V-84 engine, so this may be ole good T-72B1 that was produced widely since 80's and slightly modified with K-5 ERA and DVE-BS wind sensor (which was fitted on T-72s approx. since 1991).

The tanks look nothing like the russian ones.

[spooky lynx 73]

First of all try getting the full gear, especially the body armor and helmet.

Second of all, where did you get that? I kinda like the camo pattern.

Modern RA gear isn't in my priority, but if I'll get some extra money - I'll get it.

Where did I get it? At local shop.

[mistyronin 1181]

Modern RA gear isn't in my priority, but if I'll get some extra money - I'll get it.

Where did I get it? At local shop.

But they don't have that problem, the pro-Russians already said that there are hundreds of actual Russian soldiers fighting in their side. So they just use the issued equipment.

BTW in any Army of the world, it's illegal to fight in another country's war without your HQ permit.

So Russian soldiers are fighting inside Ukraine in the pro-Russian side, with the Russian Army HQ assent.

( the Telegraph ) Serving Russian soldiers on leave fighting Ukrainian troops alongside rebels, pro-Russian separatist leader says

[aleksadragutin 9]

The tanks look nothing like the russian ones.

Yes it does. The only difference are those thin plates hanging of the ERA.

[carlostex 38]

Yes it does. The only difference are those thin plates hanging of the ERA.

Serbia and Russia sitting on a tree, K-i-s-s-i-n-g...