Low CPU utilization & Low FPS

[jumpinghubert 49]

windies, you completely missed my point. My only concern to you is that you don´t realize that forcing the problem in redundant walls of texts with or without good arguments in the bis forum is pointless after such a long time. Look at the tickets, look at the lack of benchmarks, look a the performance stagnation. You waste lifetime. Sadly my english isn´t good enough..

[icehollowpoint 10]

I think you misunderstood. Jackal326 and other SP sandboxer's claimed he/they lack experience in any of the "common" Arma3 problems. Because the complaints I witness equal at least a 100:1 ratio to his--or the other youths FPS praises, I made the assumption he hasn't yet tried MP in Arma3. Out of sight/Out of mind.

Well, there you have it. It must be everyone else because you and a dozen or so friends have no problems.

I see, apologies if that came across as an attack.

[Jackal326 1181]

I think you misunderstood. Jackal326 and other SP sandboxer's claimed he/they lack experience in any of the "common" Arma3 problems. Because the complaints I witness equal at least a 100:1 ratio to his--or the other youths FPS praises, I made the assumption he hasn't yet tried MP in Arma3. Out of sight/Out of mind.

Assumption is the mother of all fuck-ups.

As much as I don't want to play the "Blame the mission/mods" card, there is some credence to it. Script intensive missions (such as those I mentioned previously, which are apparently the most-played missions on the MP 'scene', or at least the most "common" to use your description) are bound to have an impact in MP games. Less script-heavy missions (i.e. "stock" missions as an example) run a lot smoother with the same number of players on the same island using the same addons than their script-heavy counterparts, and can be just as enjoyable if approached in the correct way. That is just common-sense. As to whether you attribute this to BI's game being at fault, or the fault of the mission maker is entirely up to you. However, you don't buy a microwave to make toast, as such, complaining that a script-heavy mission doesn't perform as well as a script-light mission seems rather short-sighted, or at least to direct the blame for this at BI certainly is.

I'm not going to try and argue that ArmA's performance doesn't need to be improved - of course it does. However, a part of the responsibility for the outcome should be levelled at mission (and addon) makers to ensure their releases are sensibly coded to eliminate any unwarranted load on CPU and/or network traffic.

[icehollowpoint 10]

Assumption is the mother of all fuck-ups.

As much as I don't want to play the "Blame the mission/mods" card, there is some credence to it. Script intensive missions (such as those I mentioned previously, which are apparently the most-played missions on the MP 'scene', or at least the most "common" to use your description) are bound to have an impact in MP games. Less script-heavy missions (i.e. "stock" missions as an example) run a lot smoother with the same number of players on the same island using the same addons than their script-heavy counterparts, and can be just as enjoyable if approached in the correct way. That is just common-sense. As to whether you attribute this to BI's game being at fault, or the fault of the mission maker is entirely up to you. However, you don't buy a microwave to make toast, as such, complaining that a script-heavy mission doesn't perform as well as a script-light mission seems rather short-sighted, or at least to direct the blame for this at BI certainly is.

I'm not going to try and argue that ArmA's performance doesn't need to be improved - of course it does. However, a part of the responsibility for the outcome should be levelled at mission (and addon) makers to ensure their releases are sensibly coded to eliminate any unwarranted load on CPU and/or network traffic.

user created content is beyond the point

Ive watched my performance get worse on EMPTY missions with the last two patches.

and FWIW, we used to play DICE, a very script, mod and AI heavy mission on sangin, an island that is far more dense with custom objects and probably more "unoptimized" than altis or stratis, with 40-50+ fps. Now? The mission is unplayable as every other mission is. Take all the mods out and put nothing but the player down on stratis. Oh yipee, 45 fps, oh wait hello bohemia, now we're down to 35 fps and nothing is happening AT ALL.

When the only thing that has changed has been the patches, i KNOW its not the mods or the bloody scripts.

[windies 11]

windies, you completely missed my point. My only concern to you is that you don´t realize that forcing the problem in redundant walls of texts with or without good arguments in the bis forum is pointless after such a long time. Look at the tickets, look at the lack of benchmarks, look a the performance stagnation. You waste lifetime. Sadly my english isn´t good enough..

I don't waste lifetimes, most of my posts took me maybe 10-20 minutes to write at most. I barely even post anymore anyways.

---------- Post added at 02:58 ---------- Previous post was at 02:49 ----------

Assumption is the mother of all fuck-ups.

As much as I don't want to play the "Blame the mission/mods" card, there is some credence to it. Script intensive missions (such as those I mentioned previously, which are apparently the most-played missions on the MP 'scene', or at least the most "common" to use your description) are bound to have an impact in MP games. Less script-heavy missions (i.e. "stock" missions as an example) run a lot smoother with the same number of players on the same island using the same addons than their script-heavy counterparts, and can be just as enjoyable if approached in the correct way. That is just common-sense. As to whether you attribute this to BI's game being at fault, or the fault of the mission maker is entirely up to you. However, you don't buy a microwave to make toast, as such, complaining that a script-heavy mission doesn't perform as well as a script-light mission seems rather short-sighted, or at least to direct the blame for this at BI certainly is.

I'm not going to try and argue that ArmA's performance doesn't need to be improved - of course it does. However, a part of the responsibility for the outcome should be levelled at mission (and addon) makers to ensure their releases are sensibly coded to eliminate any unwarranted load on CPU and/or network traffic.

Most of what I speak of comes from experience playing across a multitude of server environments and missions. I'm not expecting 100fps in a 100 player domination server or the like, but frankly 20 fps is very underwhelming and disappointing to say the least. I've also been in small closed coop group missions with very little actively running scripts and have seen performance drop down the same as if I was in a 50 player CTI mission because of location, object density and AI counts and just plain multiplayer being much slower than single player.

If we want to start waving the stick at modders and scripters and missions makers then BI needs to both give the tools to be able to profile performance which I know there are but they also need to provide a good stable running platform on which to mod and script and design missions. The latter is where RV fails for the most part and you can't really deny that and honestly that's kind of the whole issue. I really don't think anyone is trying to say that missions and scripts and mods can't negatively affect performance, I think what we are trying to say is that classifying that as the primary reason for performance problems in RV is basically just a scapegoat.

[TSAndrey 1]

Is it? Because I haven't noticed I've taken that much of an FPS-hit playing MP. That said, I don't play 100 player missions or any of that 'Life'/Epoch/Wasteland/KoTH business, its just old-school co-op with a dozen or so friends (yes, believe it or not I have those) on missions of varying size and complexity.

What's the point of Multiplayer if we're FPS-restricted to small scale coop missions then? You can't blame the mission makers for BI's broken game! Even in BI's official mission End Game the FPS is still horrible.

[teilx 4]

Yo,sadly true^^

[nikiforos 450]

Lol, it was long time ago I complained about FPS but with the latest update it seems I get 4 FPS lower. I will investigate this and report back!

[opendome 91]

My main complaint is it, being a very intensive game, has terrible hardware utilization. This is a problem thats been around since the first arma at least and its never been fixed or addressed. You shouldn't have to buy an intel to play one game because it doesnt utilize the hardware in order to get an even 30 fps. It shouldnt cost $500 to play Arma and even that doesnt help a tonne

[icehollowpoint 10]

what i want to know is what is BI doing that they make the performance WORSE and is it really necessary?

I hope I'm starting to sound like a broken record because this is unacceptable. Deathlyrage over at breaking point said something like they have lost 42% performance with the latest stable, leading them to drop 100 player servers down to 75 player servers.

In a game that could be at best described as "struggling" before intervention, it is really unacceptable to make the performance worse, especially when there is no tangible change for it. I could understand if some new graphical feature was added, but theres not. I could understand if all the models and textures in the game suddenly got a HQ makeover, but they aren't.

So what is it then? The new sound system? Holy shit it aint worth it.

[bigsyke 10]

what i want to know is what is BI doing that they make the performance WORSE and is it really necessary?

Played with the new patch yesterday. On the KOTH servers I play, my FPS was half, with HALF the players. Once it got full, I had to quit. Tried a different server, same thing.

The changelog looked the same as every other changelog. Tweaked muzzleflash, tweaked sounds, added additional textures for fish. Optimized texture for underwater rock 20km out to sea. Network optimizations. Starting to feel they throw the network optimizations statements in the changelogs just to keep users satisfied, while they work things they really want, like textures and animals.

Seriously, how can performance keep getting worse? Probably the most liberal development roadmap I have ever seen. Everything is emotion based and thus everything suffers for the love of bunnie rabit textures. #makearmanotwar.

Edited May 6, 2015 by bigsyke

[bigsyke 10]

what i want to know is what is BI doing that they make the performance WORSE and is it really necessary?

I hope I'm starting to sound like a broken record because this is unacceptable. Deathlyrage over at breaking point said something like they have lost 42% performance with the latest stable, leading them to drop 100 player servers down to 75 player servers.

In a game that could be at best described as "struggling" before intervention, it is really unacceptable to make the performance worse, especially when there is no tangible change for it. I could understand if some new graphical feature was added, but theres not. I could understand if all the models and textures in the game suddenly got a HQ makeover, but they aren't.

So what is it then? The new sound system? Holy shit it aint worth it.

Essentially what they've done, and to put it relative to motorsports; Is attempt to build a Time attack/Drift car, with the primary intent to beat 7:00 mins at the "Ring". So they took a 1995 Ford F-150 and swapped in an excessively high milage (40,000 miles) 1997 forrest green VW Jetta 4-cylinder engine. Over 300lbs of stickers and vynal were applied over the rino-liner paint. They filled the tires with lead to keep them planted because they used blown Monroe shocks that were spec'ed for a buick and clearanced out from the local Pepboys. The neon lighting systems hapened to be on sales as well, so they picked up a few kilograms to impress the spectators. The body kit had to be custom made out of 3in castiron because it had to compensate for the large ice-cream dispensers on each side of the bed. Because ice cream can be considered offensive to some, they put an entire mobile McDonalds that has enough room for 4 employees which actually turns into a movie theater at night. For that, over 2-tons of auto equipement was placed in the bed of the truck. A custom made sub encloser houses the 25 subwoofers, with 8 flatscreen TV's mated to Sega Genesis'. They also purchased a Panasonic 3DO onsale for $500,000 and placed it in a lake, by accident. The profits were instantly regenerated when they launched an anti-racing campaign titled "Racing is bad, so go fook yourselves".

After about 15 engines, they finished a record nurburing lap with a time of 5,256,000 minutes.

[s3xmachinegun 10]

Just posting my specs here to see if anyone have exact the same setup and can provide me with their general multiplayer FPS on high pop servers.

I'm usually at 20 FPS in big cities while on servers with more than 80 people, sometimes lower. Regular KoTH servers is close to impossible for me to play on (Kavala...), so I usually play infantry only to get more FPS.

Tweaking and settings: followed and tried out pretty much every single guide there is on the web, BIOS tweaking, O.C'ing, so unless there is a completely new tweak/guide out that changes the FPS up by 20, theres no point in giving me advice on what to tweak.

BUT, I would like to know the settings of people with really close to or similiar setups. Your NVIDIA settings, in game settings, what malloc (if you use that) and other startup parameters.

Specs:

MSI GeForce GTX 660 Gaming 2GB PhysX - (small O.C. of ram with 200 increase and core with 90 increase)

Crucial DDR3 BallistiX Sport 1600MHz 8GB (O.C at 1730 stable)

Gigabyte GA-970A-DS3P

AMD FX-8320 Black Edition (O.C to 4.7 Ghz and stable)

Latest updated Nvidia drivers 7th of may 2015 and Windows 7 SP1 64 bit

Software running while in game:

Symantec Endpoint, Process Lasso, Msi Afterburner, Steam (with no ingame overlay)

[KeyCat 131]

Because it's a direct response to optimization or improving their engine. It's not reading too much into it it's simply what he says. Maybe it's more about what you read into it?

It could be me reading into it but it could also be you behaving like the first two monkeys when reading or listening to what they say while at the same time singing "lalalala lalaaallalal" while muffling it with your hands - or play on the harmonica ;)

They have numerous times written and verbally expressed - as late as last nights Live stream - that they are aware of the performance issues and are continoulsy working to improve things. Again, read thru the OPREP'S/TECHREP's/change logs etc. if you somehow missed it.

What do you mean? Because I say arguing about our viewpoints when we both want the same thing ultimately is a bit redundant?

No, because you are contradicting yourself when saying "I'm not trying to fix the problem with my words or my posts but at least trying to create some pressure on the devs letting them know it's not OK..." Aren't you trying to get them fix the problems then? Or maybe you mean that you aren't going to fix the problems?

They improve it generally for mods/modders and things they can script or add on, it seems like very few low level changes are honestly done. I think they are afraid of breaking things, but honestly that's not really an excuse.

I think the concern for breaking things is one part of their equation. What do you think the scripters/modders would say if they didn't care at all about changing/breaking things that currently work?

So they can't afford to upkeep their engine properly in your eyes but they can afford to shell out 500,000 euro's to modders? Riiiiiiiight....... too young to understand the logic there......... Maybe just not naive or biased enough?

You come across like you are being somewhat envy on the modders who made some bucks from the competition. As I said above, I have no clue if it's good or bad from a marketing standpoint but you seems to know?

Seriously most of your post is borne out of your viewpoint of " It's hard to be a developer/programmer". Hard to objectively discuss with bias.

It's not about them being perfect, just about priorities.

More from "it's quite hard to be a smaller/medium company and keep afloat" viewpoint. In the real world not every company have millions and millions of $ backing them up. I do agree with you that it's about priorities and we all wan't them to keep going so they can fix and improve A3 don't we?

I'm not sure how I'm biased more than that I like the product and BIS support compared to other game/sim developers. And FYI - It's equally hard to discuss with someone that can't see the forest for the trees.

/KC

---------- Post added at 10:23 ---------- Previous post was at 09:08 ----------

I am not a game developer, but I do develop mobile/web apps for a large "for profit" company. If one of our products is broken or we receive a customer complaint, you better believe I am not leaving the office until that is fixed. I have pulled several all nighters fixing code.

Part of providing a service to our clients is making sure they get what they paid for. I've been forced to roll out a new framework if we find the current one is lacking or exposes security issues. I cannot take years to deploy something like that--it needs to be done in hours.

So you don't think that A3 developers have burned the midnight oil as well - more than once? My guess is that they have!

Also, to be a valid comparsion I think you need to tell us what your customers pay for your companies products/service as well and I'm pretty sure they pay more than $50 bucks!

What I mean is... how much free support can your really ask for a $50 product? A agree that no products should be broken when sold but unfortunately in RL and with consumer (not mil spec'ed) high tech products it seldom happens they are 100% perfect and with code it almost never happens, you that work in the industry knows that.

For me personally I can accept some issues knowing that the game/sim company is trying to figure out how it can be fixed and I also have patience enough to wait for it to eventually happen, after all it's a game/sim I payed <$50 for and not a $10K life critical system - however YMMW!

Arma3 is not a free service, and their netcode/code is broken. Even if they hold 100% of the niche market currently, the second something similar comes along, they're done. They're customer base has been eroding because of their business mentality.

I agree that there are issues but it's not completely broken, else I and many other wouldn't be able to play at all. Regarding the last part - only time will tell but it haven't been released a worthy competitor in the past 15 years, I've tested them all but also learned to never say never so it may still happen of course and competition is a good thing.

I'm going to disagree, fully. They appreciate the feedback on the extra "features" that they worked so hard on. I'm not sure how long you have been playing the franchise, but gathering data from the start, this is extremely apparent.

You are free to disagree with me any time, and so are others. To answer your question. I've been playing the OFP/ArmA franchise for ~15 years and knows for a fact they appreciate and listen to feedback on other things than the "extra features".

Various parts of the game are sickening. Since day one, a player will still glitch out and die inside a building. I can see this happening for a flight simulator, but it is unacceptable for an infantry combat sim.

Can't argue about the specific bug since it sucks when you do that but I think it would be worse falling out from the cockpit in a flight sim :)

If they are spending resources, they are spending quarters at the vending machine. Compiling all of the optimization change logs, what has really changed? MP still desyncs, frame rate has been fixed at 2X FPS on most populated PvP servers. Players jump across the screen at various times or locations. It is impossible to truly have a useable game unless you are playing with less than 20 players on a P. Most of the changes have been bug fixes from "features" they have implemented that have broken the game. Smoke, server crashes from players sitting inside a destroyed building, etc.

It never stroked your mind that this isn't a BAT-file and some issues is way harder to fix than others? First thing you needs as a programmer is to have a setup where you are able to replicate the problem then try to figure out why it happens and after that try to fix it and retest.

So setting up a 50+ MP game (sometimes needing the same OS/driver/HW combo that bug reporter had to be able to reproduce it) along with the devs debugging and fixing the code is nothing you do during a lunch break or two.

This is not BIS 101. This is sheep 101, and I will predict DayZ will be using the "Alpha stage is all about adding features, and Beta is fixing" until they have milked the market and the entire operation itself is closed. It's a form of Business 101 that various people fall for."

But more than few things in the business world are very close to perfect. The business world is harsh and will run stagnant if you aren't pretty close. Each change-log is a slew of tweaked/added textures, sounds and other crap. Nobody cares at this point.

First question, have you ever run your own small/mid size company? Second, how long does BIS generally support their products for free - without milking 1 cent from you? I know since I've been here since the stone age :)

And a reminder to anyone...feel free to enlight me about any other game/sim developer - current or historical - that gives/gave similar or better support on their $50 products. I'm pretty sure they can be counted on your left hand.

The part about the change log is just silly assumptions, a change log is first and mostly written for the dev's to remember/share the changes not for us customer as a marketing ploy. And what I meant by "perfect" in my previous post was that BIS as a company most likely aren't perfect in every sense and can work on improving them self like many many others can - me included.

I built a new i7/290x/32gb machine specifically for Arma. Not only does the ~20fps on low make it unplayable, I'm probably getting around 10fps due to network sync and then you stack on some constant desync. Investing thousands of hours into MP alone, I am constantly taunted by BI that performance "may" improve. We all have dreams I guess...

I do understand your frustration after getting a new machine and don't like the low FPS in MP myself but I'm running it on ~7 years old rig (believe it or not) except for the GPU that is quite new. Just out of curiosity, you know the one that killed the cat :cc:

Since you invested thousands of hours into MP alone there must be something that's working, right?

My final input on this topic and the end of my wall of text ;)

As I see you can either keep giving them feedback - i.e letting them know what we like/dislike in a civil manner - and submit useful bug reports via the tracker or maybe participate in the officials MP server test runs posted by Dwarden and hope for the best.... or keep moaning in childish ways (not directed at you specifically) with the likely hood that your opinion will be ignored even if you have a point.

If your blood pressure rises or you are starting to see red when reading the above I suggest you take a long break from A3 and try it again someday in the future or just forget about it but eventually it's gotten better just as OFP/A1/A2 did!

/KC

Edited May 8, 2015 by KeyCat
Damn typos!

[windies 11]

Ever notice how if you have something negative or criticism, you're moaning like a child? Even though said person tells you to keep giving feedback. So what is it KeyCat, you want people to give feedback or just shut up and say nothing if you don't agree with it? :rolleyes: Also why is it that when people don't have any facts to their arguments, only opinions, they have to go ad hominem to get their point across? Ever notice that? So I'm a monkey covering his ears now because I don't submit to your logic?

Actions speak louder than words. What action has been done insofar as performance and stability is concerned? That's really all that needs to be said. They can say what they want, but if they aren't actually doing it then it's utterly pointless what they say. They've been saying it for years, here we are.

Also for me being a hypocrite or contradicting... I can't fix the problems with posts or words, the only people who can fix the problem are the developers. I still want to let them know that the performance is not, provide feedback just like you say to in a civil manner. Reading comprehension FTW! Seriously, how is that contradicting or hypocritical? It's almost like you just want to argue for the sake of arguing. How "Childish" to label you using your own label.

You say give feedback in a civil manner and oppose that by labeling everyone childish whiners basically. Yet you can't even pose an argument without ad hominem attacks like saying I'm a monkey or calling people childish because their views differ from yours. You call people childish but you're basically the one who is childish because you apparently can't tolerate others with differing opinions. It's sad really but the saddest thing is how common it is on this forum.

[b0s 18]

Just reporting back after 1 year and nothing has changed. Cores 1,3,6,7 are utilized 20-60% while fps is only 20 and yes it is CPU caused lag. The other cores are not used.

And the last 3 patches took 30% of SP performance from me that was badly needed. Wish I hadn't updated

Edited May 10, 2015 by b0s

[KeyCat 131]

Ever notice how if you have something negative or criticism, you're moaning like a child? Even though said person tells you to keep giving feedback. So what is it KeyCat, you want people to give feedback or just shut up and say nothing if you don't agree with it? :rolleyes:

Windie, please read my posts again! If you don't have the energy I will summarize my opinions here especially for you. Remember you and everyone else are free to have your own - I'm totally OK with that.

1st - Feedback is a good thing, both good and bad - we both agree on that.

2nd - For some, A3 have performance issues, mainly in MP and I'm affected by that as well - we both agree on that.

3rd - BIS knows about it and have acknowledged it so the constant complaining/whining are pointless and not a productive way to move tings forward - we disagree on that.

A much more productive approach is to try to help them by reporting as much info as possible in appropriate threads and/or to their Bug Tracker and I'm pretty sure the dev's appreciate even more if it's done in a civil manner (not directed to you specifically).

Also why is it that when people don't have any facts to their arguments, only opinions, they have to go ad hominem to get their point across? Ever notice that? So I'm a monkey covering his ears now because I don't submit to your logic?

You are a touchy guy aren't you? Did you notice the smiley? Regarding opinions, I repeat....everyone are free to have one and everyone's opinion is equally "worth".

Actions speak louder than words. What action has been done insofar as performance and stability is concerned? That's really all that needs to be said. They can say what they want, but if they aren't actually doing it then it's utterly pointless what they say. They've been saying it for years, here we are.

I think you should read all info they posted including all Dev build logs and you will see that they working on trying to fix/improve it. They can't just pick up the magic wand and sprinkle some magic dust over the code and have the issue/s fixed. We don't know how hard/easy it is to fix/improve or even if it's doable at all with current engine and available resources it - only BIS does.

To me (and again I get that you have another opinion and that's fine with me) it's enough they are trying and provide any improvements in free patches just as they done for the past ~15 years!

Also for me being a hypocrite or contradicting... I can't fix the problems with posts or words, the only people who can fix the problem are the developers. I still want to let them know that the performance is not, provide feedback just like you say to in a civil manner. Reading comprehension FTW! Seriously, how is that contradicting or hypocritical?

There is a possibility that it's because I don't understand what you are trying to convey since English it's not my native language. But no matter how many times you complain/whines about it they don't gonna fix it any faster - only way to move things forward is help them in their work trying to fix/improve things is to provide them as much bug reports/data as possible - not constant complaints - you seems to have problem getting that, but keep going if it makes you happy!

It's almost like you just want to argue for the sake of arguing. How "Childish" to label you using your own label.

If you search for my past postings over the years you will see that I very seldom argue with anyone so your assumption about me is wrong. Aren't we here to discuss things? If you can't take the heat I suggest you don't participate in the threads.

This will be my final reply on the performance issue - I don't like it either and hope they someday find the culprit and sort it out.

You say give feedback in a civil manner and oppose that by labeling everyone childish whiners basically. Yet you can't even pose an argument without ad hominem attacks like saying I'm a monkey or calling people childish because their views differ from yours. You call people childish but you're basically the one who is childish because you apparently can't tolerate others with differing opinions. It's sad really but the saddest thing is how common it is on this forum.

Regarding the monkeys see my explanation as well as my view on users having different views than I do - my ego is small enough to do that without any hard feelings.

I'm out

/KC

Edited June 17, 2015 by KeyCat
Damn typos - part II

[TSAndrey 1]

I think you should read all info they posted including all Dev build logs and you will see that they working on trying to fix/improve it. They can't just pick up the magic wand and sprinkle some magic dust over the code and have the issue/s fixed. We don't know how hard/easy it is to fix/improve or even if it's doable at all with current engine and available resources it - only BIS does.

At one point, promises and words become meaningless and there need to be actual improvements to performance

[ratszo 17]

At one point, promises and words become meaningless and there need to be actual improvements to performance

Still got that ol'rig? It wasn't good then, and age ain't making it better now.

It ain't a bottle of wine....

[TSAndrey 1]

Still got that ol'rig? It wasn't good then, and age ain't making it better now.

It ain't a bottle of wine....

I had that oilrig, until a worker screwed up and caused an explosion. Oil prices have seriously increased since then...

[bigsyke 10]

I think you should read all info they posted including all Dev build logs and you will see that they working on trying to fix/improve it. They can't just pick up the magic wand and sprinkle some magic dust over the code and have the issue/s fixed. We don't know how hard/easy it is to fix/improve or even if it's doable at all with current engine and available resources it - only BIS does.

Those have been in the Dev logs from the start. We can apply some logic here and see exactly where 99.9% of their focus is placed--misc items. The performance in MP has gotten worse.

Then they charge for DLCs? Lol

[icehollowpoint 10]

If I had known there was going to be a 6 month period where my game was unplayable simply from regular patches I literally wouldn't have bought ArmA.

I won't be buying any future BI titles including dlc or expansions unless this shit show gets turned around and soon.

Its one thing to not know how to extract more performance out of a flawed engine, understandable that would be if they just honestly said "we can't", its another thing entirely to have the performance get WORSE at the hands of the devs and then come onto the forums only for the sycophants to tell you its mods/missions/your computer and couldn't possibly be BI mistakes.

[windies 11]

Windie, please read my posts again! If you don't have the energy I will summarize my opinions here especially for you. Remember you and everyone else are free to have your own - I'm totally OK with that.

1st - Feedback is a good thing, both good and bad - we both agree on that.

2nd - For some, A3 have performance issues, mainly in MP and I'm affected by that as well - we both agree on that.

3rd - BIS knows about it and have acknowledged it so the constant complaining/whining are pointless and not a productive way to move tings forward - we disagree on that.

A much more productive approach is to try to help them by reporting as much info as possible in appropriate threads and/or to their Bug Tracker and I'm pretty sure the dev's appreciate even more if it's done in a civil manner (not directed to you specifically).

You are a touchy guy aren't you? Did you notice the smiley? Regarding opinions, I repeat....everyone are free to have one and everyone's opinion is equally "worth".

I think you should read all info they posted including all Dev build logs and you will see that they working on trying to fix/improve it. They can't just pick up the magic wand and sprinkle some magic dust over the code and have the issue/s fixed. We don't know how hard/easy it is to fix/improve or even if it's doable at all with current engine and available resources it - only BIS does.

To me (and again I get that you have another opinion and that's fine with me) it's enough they are trying and provide any improvements in free patches just as they done for the past ~15 years!

There is a possibility that it's because I don't understand what you are trying to convey since English it's not my native language. But no matter how many times you complain/whines about it they don't gonna fix it any faster - only way to move things forward is help them in their work trying to fix/improve things is to provide them as much bug reports/data as possible - not constant complaints - you seems to have problem getting that, but keep going if it makes you happy!

If you search for my past postings over the years you will see that I very seldom argue with anyone so your assumption about me is wrong. Aren't we here to discuss things? If you can't take the heat I suggest you don't participate in the threads.

This will be my final reply on the performance issue - I don't like it either and hope they someday find the culprit and sort it out - in this thread.

Regarding the monkeys see my explanation as well as my view on users having different views than I do - my ego is small enough to do that without any hard feelings.

I'm out

/KC

The beginning of ArmA 3 I spent time profiling memory and cpu usage in certain scenarios, it fell on deaf ears or was basically told it would never get better. According to Maruk I believe it was, the only way to improve usage would be to run endless calculation loops to spike usage higher and usage was a terrible metric to use for performance. That's utter BS and a cop-out if I've ever seen one. I spent time showing typical memory usage in most multiplayer scenario's, how it easily goes above 4gb and can easily approach 9-10gb over a short period of time and how rewriting data allocation from streaming based to preload based or at least a better hybrid system with less hard limitation would be beneficial, but again it really didn't matter and was given more spin on why it wouldn't be done or didn't need to be done and the current system was fine. They don't want help fixing it. They just want people to accept it how it is and keep buying their games. Something you and others seem to be excellent at which is probably why you're their target demographic and why they're successful. You're naive and you believe everything they say even though everything in front of you points to the opposite.

They don't want to fix it, they don't need to fix it because there are too many people in this community and sadly this world like you who are, and forgive me for saying it, basically nothing more than sheep. You'll believe any spin they put out, like now you're arguing how they support their products so great but we're sitting here arguing back and forth about performance and it's the same argument that's been going on since ArmA and you even agree it's bad, yet they "support" their products right? Seriously, at some point words are nothing more than words and promises are broken.

At least for me, it's not constant complaining or whining, I barely even post anymore. I don't even have 1 post a day for the most part.

I'm also not offended by your posts, more amused and amazed by the naivety as well as the sheer hypocrisy. You seem to read this anger or malice in my posts for some reason. It's amusing. Your monkey comment is simply typical though. It's the typical ad hominem that has become common around these forums when someone has a disagreeing viewpoint and they can't dispell or disprove it with any tangible facts, kind of like how you can't and your whole viewpoint can basically be summed up as "I believe". I hate to inform you but you believing is not a fact in and of itself. You believe BI are working towards performance without tangible proof, when I have all the tangible proof in the world as performance has done nothing but gotten worse over time. The only proof you have is their word, which honestly means little compared to their work. Again your "belief" is based on naivety, it's based on the word of others rather than the hard proof/facts in front of you.

I have no hard feelings towards you and it's certainly hard to feel threatened in any way by such a lack of free thought or intelligence.

[bigsyke 10]

They don't want to fix it, they don't need to fix it because there are too many people in this community and sadly this world like you who are, and forgive me for saying it, basically nothing more than sheep. You'll believe any spin they put out, like now you're arguing how they support their products so great but we're sitting here arguing back and forth about performance and it's the same argument that's been going on since ArmA and you even agree it's bad, yet they "support" their products right? Seriously, at some point words are nothing more than words and promises are broken.

^^^ This.

The bottom line is this. Look at how many posts and pages are in this topic. If the important parts of the game had acceptable performance, this thread would be significantly smaller or non-existent. For anyone to deny this is a significant deal breaker, is spitting on the hundreds of posters helping BI get their shit together. It isn't the engine, it's the direction BI is taking it's products. Arma is supposed to be the best well-rounded game on the market. That has mutated into an extremely linear SP or Sandbox with nothing more than showcases. If you disagree, look at the performance of where Arma3 should really shine -- dynamic MP missions. Look at their own End Game. If the bloat is causing performance (which I'm pretty sure it highly contributes to it), why don't they start snipping useless things to make the main selling points of the game usable. This is pure bait and switch, and can be compared to SalesForce's business tactics. They advertise their key selling features, but in the fine print those exact selling features are actually items simply placed on a road-map and promised years down the road--until the implementations are usually closed due to limitations. You suddenly are paying thousands a month for a product that does, not much.

If someone were to purchase a fresh copy today and play BI's mission, they are getting pre-alpha performance and pre-alpha game play. If you cant effectively stand inside a house without dying from gravity sucking you through the floor, then this game should have remained in Alpha before fixing this WTF bug.

Look at Dayz. A complete joke, still. I'm waiting for it to reach the usability of a MOD. Speaking of Mods, look at how many community mods for Arma3 that fix aspects of the game. Why can't they just implement fluid movement really quick? I think they think it's cool that accidentally pressing the V key during a firefight will lock your player up for a few seconds. Their focus isn't just in the wrong places, I think their just bored and are messing around on stupid things they have interests in. I doubt they actually use the product they sell. If they did, major game breaking bugs would have been the first to get fixed--nope, you need to use non-MP supported mods.

[LSD_Timewarp82 21]

I completly agree to that what Windies has written there.

dropping my 2 cents:

For me personal the Performance in this Game is a joke... As i runned the Game with my older System (i7 870 @ 5Ghz - cooled by MachII GT Compressorcooling,8Gb DDR3 Ram @ 2200Mhz, 770GTX) i was very often frustrated due low fps in the Mission i play (WholeLottaAltis) using moderate Settings, not even Ultra. Then at a time i totaly lost my motivation to play this game...

Then Games like GTA 5 and now Project Cars were released so i´ve decided to build a new PC for this and upcoming great Games. Now i have an i5- 4690K @ 4,7Ghz, 2x970GTX SLI and my good Ram with 2200Mhz. So i thought just for fun to Install Arma3 again. Back to the Game and "suprise suprise" it changes nothing :rolleyes: Frames are still sucking as hard as they can.

I know that Arma didnt profit of have running SLI (ohhhh, how suprising ^^)

Users can have the best Hardware, doesnt matter. You cant force the broken engine to have a solid framerate, it wont allow it.