Detailed component-driven damage modeling.

[NeMeSiS 11]

I think you cant even kill the crew in a light apc with .50.

You can kill the crew of a BRDM, but i have never managed to kill the crew of a bmp2. Which is odd, because i am pretty sure you can kill people on the other side of a bmp2 with one of those anti material rifles.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

No, it doesn't lack the functionality. Go to the editor, give yourself a thermal .50 cal and shoot at the bright spot in a running vehicle.

The problem right now in ArmA 2 is that destruction of the engine results in catastrophic explosion. IMO it's impossible to destroy the engine and keep the rest intact.

[dmarkwick 261]

You can kill the crew of a BRDM, but i have never managed to kill the crew of a bmp2. Which is odd, because i am pretty sure you can kill people on the other side of a bmp2 with one of those anti material rifles.

Isn't it the case though that the bodies of the occupants disappear from the game for the duration of their travel? On enclosed armoured vehicles certainly. I've often clipmapped into armoured vehicles using a spectator cam and found no-one.

[NeMeSiS 11]

Isn't it the case though that the bodies of the occupants disappear from the game for the duration of their travel? On enclosed armoured vehicles certainly. I've often clipmapped into armoured vehicles using a spectator cam and found no-one.

I thought that didnt happen in vehicles with interiors, which afaik would allow you to kill the crew of both the brdm and bmp2.

It should also work on cars, but i dont think i ever had to shoot through the cardoor to actually kill the occupants so i am not sure about that. :p

[Big Dawg KS 6]

You can kill the crew of a BRDM, but i have never managed to kill the crew of a bmp2. Which is odd, because i am pretty sure you can kill people on the other side of a bmp2 with one of those anti material rifles.

BMP crew proxies are hidden when turned in. While they're turned out you can kill them through the vehicle's armor. I hope in ArmA 3 (or maybe even ArmA 2 beta) BIS allows at least the fire geo of turned in crew proxies to be present so you can still hit them with penetrating rounds.

I think even without that though addon makers can configure their tanks to have visible crew proxies while turned in.

Edited June 17, 2011 by Big Dawg KS

[dmarkwick 261]

I thought that didnt happen in vehicles with interiors, which afaik would allow you to kill the crew of both the brdm and bmp2.

It should also work on cars, but i dont think i ever had to shoot through the cardoor to actually kill the occupants so i am not sure about that. :p

Well a car you can see into, so the bodies exist. When I peek into a tank or something - no driver, no gunner, no commander.

---------- Post added at 05:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:30 PM ----------

BMP crew proxies are hidden when turned in. While they're turned out you can kill them through the vehicle's armor. I hope BIS allows at least the fire geo of turned in crew proxies to be present so you can still hit them with penetrating rounds.

Well that would explain it :) and you're right about exposing the fire geo for component-driven damage :)

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Well actually I just realized that enabling the fire geo for turned-in crew proxies isn't good enough, since it will still be in the place of where they sit turned-out (meaning you could still hit them with small arms fire).

BIS should just go with adding new crew proxies for turned-in positions.

Edit: Or maybe it's not necessary. I forget how it works but in 1st person in tanks with interiors you can see crew that are both turned-in and turned-out. It might just be a single crew proxy with their animation changing their positions.

Edited June 17, 2011 by Big Dawg KS

[NeMeSiS 11]

BMP crew proxies are hidden when turned in. While they're turned out you can kill them through the vehicle's armor. I hope in ArmA 3 (or maybe even ArmA 2 beta) BIS allows at least the fire geo of turned in crew proxies to be present so you can still hit them with penetrating rounds.

That explains it then, i thought that only happened on vehicles without interiors.

[dmarkwick 261]

Well actually I just realized that enabling the fire geo for turned-in crew proxies isn't good enough, since it will still be in the place of where they sit turned-out (meaning you could still hit them with small arms fire).

BIS should just go with adding new crew proxies for turned-in positions.

They would certainly need to for any kind of component-driven damage system.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

They would certainly need to for any kind of component-driven damage system.

IMO they could take it one step further and have seperate fire geos for internal vehicle components. Right now the engine uses an estimate to determine which components were hit and it doesn't apply penetration.

[160thSOAR 10]

I don't think we need a system that detailed, but just a basic skeleton of it would be nice.

The hitpoints system is way out of its league in a game like ArmA2, and more realistic damage to vehicles is something that should be implemented in future titles.

Right now, half the time when you put a satchel charge under a tank and detonate it, it doesn't work like it should. It should blow the guts out from the vulnerable underside, but instead the entire tank turns greyish and then explodes a few seconds later. A satchel charge should be able to track tanks and kill people in the hull, but the turret might still work in certain cases.

In any case, NO MORE HITPOINTS!

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Hopefully with PhsX BIS can also implement better destruction of vehicles (like parts breaking off).

Edited June 17, 2011 by Big Dawg KS

[AlphaKiller 19]

Very good idea! But question is: Will BI know make that! I agree with it idea 100%, but all is on BI!

[max power 21]

BMP crew proxies are hidden when turned in. While they're turned out you can kill them through the vehicle's armor. I hope in ArmA 3 (or maybe even ArmA 2 beta) BIS allows at least the fire geo of turned in crew proxies to be present so you can still hit them with penetrating rounds.

I think even without that though addon makers can configure their tanks to have visible crew proxies while turned in.

That's weird because Team Razor will be killed when turned in in a bmp2.

[maturin 12]

That's weird because Team Razor will be killed when turned in in a bmp2.

I think it matters what part of the hull is hit. I can't kill people through the rear of many APCs no matter how hard I try.

[2nd ranger 282]

Hopefully with PhsX BIS can also implement better destruction of vehicles (like parts breaking off).

Yeah, that's the first thing I thought when they ran that little boat over in the water demo. Should have ploughed straight through that thing. Same with driving the APC into the jeep, I wished it would crumple.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

That's weird because Team Razor will be killed when turned in in a bmp2.

Crew still takes damage when the vehicle does (another annoyance with the simplified damage model), but in terms of penetrating rounds hitting them it only works when the proxy is visible (thus turned out). Perhaps they were wounded and your BMP took a slight amount of damage (thus transfering the damage to the crew).

[SPC.Spets 21]

a system like that video would be crazy awesome, I made some test in Arma2 and we dont have even body bullet penetration, I mean, I shot 2 AIs aligned one behind another one with a barret, and nothing happen with the man behind, that sucks!

But, then, I made another test, a man behind a civilian car, the man got hit, the bullet pass throw the car and de AI dies. wtf then?

[nodunit 397]

Yeah, that's the first thing I thought when they ran that little boat over in the water demo. Should have ploughed straight through that thing. Same with driving the APC into the jeep, I wished it would crumple.

If it was a civilian vehicle sure but military not likely, remember they don't dent if so much as press the door in with your finger.

[2nd ranger 282]

Facts have very little to do with my wishes.

[max power 21]

Crew still takes damage when the vehicle does (another annoyance with the simplified damage model), but in terms of penetrating rounds hitting them it only works when the proxy is visible (thus turned out). Perhaps they were wounded and your BMP took a slight amount of damage (thus transfering the damage to the crew).

This was during the warfare like missions. I would buy a bmp2 because they were the best Chernarussian vehicle that could fit the whole squad in. We would be undamaged when we got in, and I'm a fairly careful driver, it's possible but unlikely that we were injured flying down hills or something. We would assault enemy towns and there would be the usual defending BRDM 2. Sometimes within one burst from the front, whoever was in the gunner's seat would die.

It's possible it's damage transference but it seems unlikely. If it is like you say, and the proxies are not made invisible but for all intents and purposes deleted, then the behaviour I experience is surely not from 14.5mm penetration. However, the behaviour correlates well with real world performance. The 14.5mm cannon is an armour piercing weapon. In the NTW-20 sniper rifle, it performs better than the "MK 151" 20mm payload rifle variant. Although I think you can have minengeschoss ammunition in the 20mm variant so it's all good :p

Edited June 17, 2011 by Max Power

[Big Dawg KS 6]

This was during the warfare like missions. I would buy a bmp2 because they were the best Chernarussian vehicle that could fit the whole squad in. We would be undamaged when we got in, and I'm a fairly careful driver, it's possible but unlikely that we were injured flying down hills or something. We would assault enemy towns and there would be the usual defending BRDM 2. Sometimes within one burst from the front, whoever was in the gunner's seat would die.

Well if this was pre-OA it definately wasn't penetration; that wasn't implemented on vehicles until OA.

[Uberduderofdoomer 10]

I hope they also implement effectual ERA and RPG cages. After they do this of course.

[Alienfreak 0]

This and some actual missile guidance system would make ArmA like .... 5000000% more awesome in multiplayer maps like Warfare!

Look at Mandos how freaking awesome it is flying an AH-64 or an F-35...

+9000 internets to BIS if they do it!

[Flash Thunder 10]

You can already destroy tanks with a few .50 rounds if you hit them in the right spot.

Lol also with .45 M1911

I would say Component damage modeling for vehicles and infantry and gore shall be the Top features of an Arma 3 expansion.

then after that

walking inside of cargo planes and shooting out of vehicle passenger positions.