Tanks with TROPHY?!

[tsb247 0]

With all of these pictures of tanks (mostly of Israeli design or influenced by them), I am surprised NOBODY has noticed this yet! Those goofy little trapezoidal structures on the outside of some of the MBTs in the screenshots appear to be Trophy modules!

Here's a link to another screenshot:

http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l202/tsb247/A3_Tank_Trophy-2-Circle.jpg

For those not familiar with the Trophy system, here is a little video that explains it all.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2IqZhonKzU&NR=1

Imagine how terrifying tanks would become if the rockets you were carrying were utterly useless (to an extent anyway). The days of the one-hit javelin would be long gone, and to be honest, I think it's about time. Tanks in Arma2 are great, but a single javelin, a well-placed AT-4, and a good hit from a SMAW can cripple the MBTs very quickly (as it should be). However, if a system like Trophy was simulated in Arma 3... Tanks would be damn near unstoppable. Such a system could force the player to get creative; putting together larger AT teams for ambushes or even resorting to IEDs.

What do you all think? This looks promising, but it's anyone's guess as to whether BI will impliment this. I, for one, am hoping they do!

Edited June 8, 2011 by tsb247
Better video

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Way to early to tell.

[That guy 10]

it was discussed at first reveal, and the CGI trailer does indicate that these tanks have some sort of counter measure system

i really hope that system works :p

[tsb247 0]

If you are referring to the trailer here:

http://www.facebook.com/#!/video/video.php?v=2003660142328&oid=192181357495269&comments

Then yes, that was what got me thinking. :D

[Brute Force 10]

We have already noticed that. That's why in this thread the tanks are listed as the Merkava 4M (4M versions have Trophy).

The real mystery is why the Namer doesn't have the Iron Fist system outfitted on it in-game.

[teegee 10]

well if trophy makes an appearance then the rpg-30 will need to make one too.

[5LEvEN 11]

Just saying but NATO tanks should have this in the game, the US is already trying to implement this system on their current vehicles (in real life)...

[MoS 0]

Just saying but NATO tanks should have this in the game, the US is already trying to implement this system on their current vehicles (in real life)...

I´m very interested in that technology. I thought this has already been implemented in the newer tanks but I might be wrong...

That vid about the TROPHY system stated that they were the first and only cooperation that has developed such a system yet, but I´m pretty sure I have seen this a cuple of times elsewhere :confused:

[Big-Rooney 5]

The real mystery is why the Namer doesn't have the Iron Fist system outfitted on it in-game.

Could be that this is very early stage and stuff is still being considered and added, and with that the models could easily be vastly improved so BIS is saving that for when the model is 100% complete.

[Kieran 11]

Its actually an Ipod touch the driver forgot to pickup

[tsb247 0]

I´m very interested in that technology. I thought this has already been implemented in the newer tanks but I might be wrong...

That vid about the TROPHY system stated that they were the first and only cooperation that has developed such a system yet, but I´m pretty sure I have seen this a cuple of times elsewhere :confused:

The U.S. is/was developing a similar system, but when they tested Trophy, the Army didn't seem to like it for some reason. There are many who speculate that the Army had already invested too much in their own system and didn't want to give the money to a foreign company - despite the success of Trophy.

To the best of my knowledge, Trophy is the only active defensive system of this type that has been widely fielded.

[CarlGustaffa 4]

Tanks would be damn near unstoppable.

I fail to see the good gameplay of this. Imagine large dynamic missions like Domination. There is a ton of tanks as the load on the server is easier than using regular men/squads. Currently (sadly) just about every player carries AT of some sort. And now we have to carry even more AT?

Or it becomes just machines against machines, leaving the infantry with boredom as they know they don't stand a chance. If it's in (which I doubt), I sure hope some thought to gameplay balance is considered.

Now I'm not a big fan of balance - as long as reasonable alternatives exists. Having to use mines (especially hand placed ones) and IEDs I don't consider a reasonable alternative. All things considered, it's still a game, and there needs to be flow if you want to entertain the players.

[tsb247 0]

The system is likely not fool-proof. I'm sure there will be a way around it, and from the video, it looks like Trophy may very well make an appearance. I'm sure you have seen the trailer I am referring to.

[hailstorm 4]

Just keep in mind that when ArmA1 first released it brought a harrier that couldn't hover, and it couldn't designate it's own lazer-guided bombs even though one of it's hard points had a lazer designator bolted to it. ArmA2 brought an F-35 that can't attack ground without external help.

It's sad, but just because it's modeled, don't assume it'll be functional.

[Trauma.au 10]

With all of these pictures of tanks (mostly of Israeli design or influenced by them), I am surprised NOBODY has noticed this yet!!

lol a simple search for Trophy returns 5 threads, I pointed this out when the game was 1st announced.

[Brute Force 10]

well if trophy makes an appearance then the rpg-30 will need to make one too.

RPG-30 is still useless against Trophy and Iron Fist. The designers of the APS systems already thought of this; the systems identify the type of round incoming (it can focus on several threats) and prioritize them for destruction. That way an incoming RPG-7 will be ignored an a Kornet will be destroyed if both are launched at the same time. Not to mention that the engagement rate is under ~500ms.

Just saying but NATO tanks should have this in the game, the US is already trying to implement this system on their current vehicles (in real life)...

The U.S. is/was developing a similar system, but when they tested Trophy, the Army didn't seem to like it for some reason. There are many who speculate that the Army had already invested too much in their own system and didn't want to give the money to a foreign company - despite the success of Trophy.

To the best of my knowledge, Trophy is the only active defensive system of this type that has been widely fielded.

Trophy was originally tested several years ago by the U.S. which found that it had over a 97% kill rate, even higher than the 95% claimed by Rafael at the time. However, politics intervened and the U.S. opted to wait for Raytheon's "Quick Kill" that never showed up in a fielded form (surprise, surprise :rolleyes2:).

That's why the U.S. retested Trophy recently on a STRIKER and found it passed with flying colors. They are considering fielding TROPHY on the STRIKERS.

[Trauma.au 10]

Also assuming the trophy system is in it would likely be a part of the vehicle that can be damaged/destroyed independently like the gun, turret, tracks etc.

[MoS 0]

Wait a second... just when I thought about implementation I realized that this wouldn´t have been too hard to script?

You´d need a script which keeps track of objects around a certain radious of your vehicle and check if any of them is an rpg type warhead (or any other AT warhead in the game), then delete it and create a dummy explosion at that place.

Knowing how unreliable scripts work when used with high cycle time, it would even leave space for fails so that the tank/vehicle wouldn´t be invincible...

[max power 21]

The toughness of a tank in the game can be expressed in terms of the mean shots on target per tanks destroyed. If this makes the Merkava go up from two to four, or four to eight, or whatever, it's still quite significant. However, it would be very nice to have this present gameplay opportunities. Instead of soaking up ammo slots, it would be really great to have this system cause the player to out think it.

According to wikipedia, this system currently doesn't do so well vs. KE weapons.

[tsb247 0]

So if Trophy has trouble stopping klinetic energy weapons, then we can speculate that a tank sabot will likely be near 100% effective if they system is implimented. However, that leave us with another small issue... I don't know of any man-portable KE anti-tank weapon.

I could however see the 76mm High-Impulse weapon system with a KE round be useful or possible a Metal Storm type of system.

High-Impulse Weapon System:

This system with a KE round (which would likely have to be 'dreamed up' by BI unless it already supports such a round. I don't know) could be the answer to the possible, "Invincible tank," counter to Trophy if it is added to the game.

[maturin 12]

Is the video above an EFP system? EFPs act like short range KE weapons, although you probably can't get enough punch out of them to menace frontal armor like the late-model RPGs can/

[dysta 10]

It was just an anti-optic laser device used by PLA Type-99 tanks. Works for jamming the vehicle optics in case to hardly aim or lock at the target.

[wolfbite 8]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Haha I made a funny....

[tsb247 0]

Is the video above an EFP system? EFPs act like short range KE weapons, although you probably can't get enough punch out of them to menace frontal armor like the late-model RPGs can/

To be honest, I'm not sure. I haven't been able to find much data on the weapon. From what I could find however, the entire system seems to be more of a proof-of-concept than anything else. It exists to demonstrate a recoil dampening system.

It could be argued that a Javelin would fill the same role, and it would do so more accurately, but Trophy would likely squash one if it got too close.

[Brute Force 10]

The toughness of a tank in the game can be expressed in terms of the mean shots on target per tanks destroyed. If this makes the Merkava go up from two to four, or four to eight, or whatever, it's still quite significant. However, it would be very nice to have this present gameplay opportunities. Instead of soaking up ammo slots, it would be really great to have this system cause the player to out think it.

According to wikipedia, this system currently doesn't do so well vs. KE weapons.

TROPHY was not designed, nor needs, to stop kinetic energy weapons (SABOT, etc) as it has the tanks thick armor for that purpose. However, the Iron Fist system can intercept KE weapons.