Snipers

[Genesis 0]

Ok, everyone post good sniper stories here. Who is the best sniper of all times? Do you know the answer? I surely do, but I want to see if people in the world know about him

C'mon, let the stories flow into the topic

[Aculaud 0]

oh, come on!!! Everyone knows it was Carlos Hathcock, the Viet Nam marine sniper! lol

Anyway, this may not be the BEST story out there, but it is a contender. Senor Hathcock's first kill:

"South Viet Nam, 1966. A flash of movement caught the eye of a young Marine Military Policeman who was keeping watch for possible enemy action. As he observed, he could make out a figure crouched in the distance, working busily with something he couldn't quite see. The man was in civilian clothes... but... there was the rifle slung over his back - the telltale mark of a Viet Cong guerrilla. The enemy soldier continued about his task, oblivious to his danger as Sgt. Carlos Hathcock brought his M-14 to bear. The range appeared to be between 300 and 400 yards - child's play for Hathcock, who had won the 1000 yard Wimbledon Cup Match at Camp Perry only the year before. The rackgrade weapon he now held was a far cry from the finely-fitted National Match M-1 he had used in competition, but it was certainly capable of making this shot. With his M-14 rested comfortably, Hathcock verified his target - yes, definitely armed - and adjusted his position slightly. He let the front sight settle naturally, centered on the crouching soldier, who appeared to be placing a booby trap.

Hathcock felt his chest tighten and his heartbeat increase; although already Distinguished and a world-class competitive rifleman, he was still new to combat and the killing of men. As he silently eased the safety forward, his right hand settled firmly into place on the small of the stock. He was in his "bubble" now a zone of total concentration. He exhaled, and there was the front sight: on target, crisp, in razor-sharp focus. and centered in the rear sight aperture. The rifle was absolutely still as he took up the slack in the two-stage trigger, and then applied the final pressure. Such was the depth of his concentration that he was only vaguely aware of the rifles' report as it jolted against his shoulder. As the bolt cycled, the empty case skittered brightly across the ground to his right, and the M-14 settled back into Position, cocked and ready for a second shot. None was needed, however. The enemy guerrilla lay sprawled, no longer a threat. Sgt. Carlos Hathcock II had made his first kill. Officially, it was unconfirmed - one of fourteen unconfirmed kills he was to make before his assignment as a Marine sniper. However, that didn't concern him. It was simply a job that had to be done. By his actions, Carlos Hathcock had certainly saved the lives of several brother Marines scheduled to patrol the area being mined that day."

[FallenPaladin 0]

Watch Enemy at the gates!

But I don´t want to tell the whole movie`s story

[USSoldier11B 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">"South Viet Nam, 1966. A flash of movement caught the eye of a young Marine Military Policeman who was keeping watch for possible enemy action. As he observed, he could make out a figure crouched in the distance, working busily with something he couldn't quite see. The man was in civilian clothes... but... there was the rifle slung over his back - the telltale mark of a Viet Cong guerrilla. The enemy soldier continued about his task, oblivious to his danger as Sgt. Carlos Hathcock brought his M-14 to bear. The range appeared to be between 300 and 400 yards - child's play for Hathcock, who had won the 1000 yard Wimbledon Cup Match at Camp Perry only the year before. The rackgrade weapon he now held was a far cry from the finely-fitted National Match M-1 he had used in competition, but it was certainly capable of making this shot. With his M-14 rested comfortably, Hathcock verified his target - yes, definitely armed - and adjusted his position slightly. He let the front sight settle naturally, centered on the crouching soldier, who appeared to be placing a booby trap.

Hathcock felt his chest tighten and his heartbeat increase; although already Distinguished and a world-class competitive rifleman, he was still new to combat and the killing of men. As he silently eased the safety forward, his right hand settled firmly into place on the small of the stock. He was in his "bubble" now a zone of total concentration. He exhaled, and there was the front sight: on target, crisp, in razor-sharp focus. and centered in the rear sight aperture. The rifle was absolutely still as he took up the slack in the two-stage trigger, and then applied the final pressure. Such was the depth of his concentration that he was only vaguely aware of the rifles' report as it jolted against his shoulder. As the bolt cycled, the empty case skittered brightly across the ground to his right, and the M-14 settled back into Position, cocked and ready for a second shot. None was needed, however. The enemy guerrilla lay sprawled, no longer a threat. Sgt. Carlos Hathcock II had made his first kill. Officially, it was unconfirmed - one of fourteen unconfirmed kills he was to make before his assignment as a Marine sniper. However, that didn't concern him. It was simply a job that had to be done. By his actions, Carlos Hathcock had certainly saved the lives of several brother Marines scheduled to patrol the area being mined that day." <span id='postcolor'>

Amen, and end of story.

[Aculaud 0]

Heh. That one was for you, USsoldier11B, the Hathcock fan himself

[Genesis 0]

During Vietnam, Carlos Hathcock had 93 confirmed and Chuck Mawhinney had 103 confirmed.

So it definitely was not Carlos Hathcock or even Chuck Mawhinney. There are snipers with far more confirmed kills.

As for Vasili Zaitsev, he had at the end of the war about 400 confirmed kills, but even that isn't enough. Vasili credited 142-242 confirmed kills at Stalingrad(Varies).

source:

http://www.snipersparadise.com/History/confirmed.htm

http://www.snipersparadise.com/History/vasili.htm

[Aculaud 0]

Yeah, but we really have to define the word "Best" here. Who had more skill? Both snipers, Zaitsev and Hathcock engaged in and won duals with other snipers, so i'v heard, And i was hearing from USsoldier11B that Hathcock was making shots from nearly a mile away at times.

[WKK Gimbal 0]

140 kills on 140 bullets is better than 400 kills on 50000 bullets

[Genesis 0]

You can find many statistics about snipers over the internet. They differ from each other, depending on the creator of these statistics, but one man is always the number one. The sharpshooter with most confirmed kills is still after over 60 years, Simo Häyhä, a Finnish sharpshooter with over 500 confirmed kills. The most interesting thing about this sharpshooter is that he never used scoped rifle. He preferred to use Mosin Nagant M28 with iron sights, yet he still used to shoot his targets at a range over 400 yards. The officers in the Finnish army tried to offer him a scoped Swedish Mauser

but he said that he didn't like it and kept his Mosin Nagant M28. Read the link below, it's quite amazing story about a amazing man. Interesting to read. Simo was shot in the face with what turned out to be an exploding bullet and he was still able to take off the man who shot him.t He was taken out of action due to these wounds.

Here's somekind of a link:

http://www.mosin-nagant.net/Meeting-Legend.html

[Genesis 0]

The second man is almost always Nikolay Ilyin (496) and then Erwin König (400+). The first seven have fought in WW2. Some sources say that Simo Häyhä has a confirmed kills of 542.

[LauryThorn 0]

Simo Häyhä died a little while ago, BTW.

R.I.P.

(although I couldn't rest in peace with over 500 confirmed kills )

[Longinius 1]

Not all of Simo Häyhä's kills were sniper kills though. He took out quite a lot of people with SMG's aswell.

[Genesis 0]

Yeah, I read about it a few days ago. That's how I kind of started this topic. BTW. On some sites on the internet there has been an enormous debate about whether the Vasili Zaitsev and Erwin König truly dueled. Some say it's only Soviet propaganda, but some say that a german pow taken prisoner in Stalingrad had indeed told how Vasili is going to die because some german hotshot sniper is going to get him. It would be most interesting to know if it truly happened...

[Genesis 0]

Yeah, Simo killed 200+ soviets with suomi SMG. That was a good point. Still, it's one helluva bodycount. I'm interested to know more about the vietnam era snipers. Does anyone know good links?

[cam0flage 0]

Häyhä once told in an interview that he preferred to use iron sight instead of a scope, because it made his profile a lot lower. I'm a military police sniper in the finnish army, when i got my training they used Häyhä as a prime example; he spent most of his spare time practising and fixing his rifle's sights.

We were shown a field manual of russian snipers during our training; #1 in their target hierarchy are of course snipers, but it also said especially finnish ones.

// cam0flage

[USSoldier11B 0]

I'm not saying that Hathcock was the best because he had the most confirmed kills. Besides, he had at least 200 more that were unconfirmed. Remember, Vietnam was a more modern war, and the country had much more difficult terrain. Considering that the conflict in Vietnam didn't invlove even nearly so many troops, there wasn't as many to kill. I think Hathcock was the best because of his attitude and tactics. He truly refined the art of modern sniping. The guy just wouldn't quit. He didn't have any grandious ideas about being a hero, he just did his job to keep his fellow troops safe. Also remember that he suffered from the early stages of Multple Sclerosis during his entire stint in Vietnam pretty amazing, not to mention that he was severly burned after pulling some Marine out of burning armor that had ran over a mine. His CO had to confine him to quarters to keep him out of the field because he would become so emaciated from not eating or sleeping while on missions. The Viet Cong really feared this guy. I believe he had a bounty as high as $20,000 U.S. dollars on his head. That was a hell of alot of money for the Vietnamese. Those who feared him nicknamed him "La' Trang" or "White Feather" because of the feather that he wore on his boonie hat.

Some of his most famous exploits.

-Made a 2,500 yard kill with a scoped M2 machine gun. The longest ever recorded.

- Crawled for 3 days with 1 canteen of water to make a sucessful assassination of an NVA general.

Read more here: Brief Biography

He died in 1999 of MS. R.I.P.

[R. Gerschwarzenge 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Genesis @ May 16 2002,12:34)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Yeah, Simo killed 200+ soviets with suomi SMG. That was a good point. Still, it's one helluva bodycount. I'm interested to know more about the vietnam era snipers. Does anyone know good links?<span id='postcolor'>

I read from somewhere that he killed 500+ with a sniper rifle and 250+ with Suomi SMG. I'm not sure though.

[168GRN HPBT 0]

The Australian legend

FORM http://www.lighthorse.org.au/Pershist/billsing.htm

pix their as well

Also due to bad records (and Billys own talying system) Historian have put his totall's any where from 200- 300, as oficaly they only kept score on Gallipoli.

I have had story that put it even higher but they are just Legends

-----------------------------------------------------------

Billy Sing was a cold-blooded killer. This ace Australian sniper cut down 150 Turks. To the Anzacs in the trenches he was "The Assassin"... On Wednesday, May 19, 1943, William Edward Sing died alone in his room at the house where he boarded in West End, Brisbane... with five shillings... a man whose name was once known to an army and a nation.

by Brian Tate  

  As the northern summer intensified in June 1915, the Australian Fifth Light Horse Regiment was allocated as its area of responsibility, the ground around what was soon to be called Chatham's Post.

  It was a Queensland unit and its officers and men were primarily from the country areas.

Private William Edward Sing, like most of his fellow members of the Regiment, had grown up and worked with horses in the Australian bush. Part of their cumulative stock-in-trade was an ability to ride well, estimate distance carefully, track strayed stock and animal pests, and to fire both rifle and shotgun accurately.

 

Billy Sing with spotter

File Size:40k

  Sing's considerable skills with a rifle were well-known in his central Queensland home district, even before the outbreak of World War One. He was a member of the Proserpine Rifle Club and a leading kangaroo shooter around his home town of Clermont (about 250 km south-west of Proserpine).

  Sing signed his enlistment papers at Proserpine on October 24, 1914, two months after the outbreak of World War One. He became a member of the First AIF.

Another recruit from North Queensland was Ion "Jack" Idriess (the author of "Desert Column", "Cattle King", "Lassetter's Last Ride" and many other books on Australian history), who later became his spotter in the Gallipoli trenches.

  Billy Sing travelled by ship to Brisbane. After a brief period of training, during which he was allocated to A Squadron of the regiment, the ship set sail for Egypt. It was five days before Christmas 1914.

  The men of the Fifth Light Horse chaffed at the bit during April, 1915. They cooled their spurred heels on the Egyptian desert, while a few hundred kilometers away their infantry colleagues were creating Australian history at Gallipoli.

  Finally, the rising casualty toll on the peninsula saw Sing and his mates embark for the Dardenelles on May 16.

For the first month, the Lighthorse men were scattered through the Infantry Battalions to gain some experience. But, by mid-June, the men from the Fifth Light Horse had farewelled their foot-slogger comrades and rejoined their Regiment, when it moved to the seaward side of Bolton's Ridge.

  In honour of a young English-born Lighthorse Officer, the new position was called Chatham's Post. It was here that Billy Sing began in earnest his lethal occupation.

  The sniper's daily modus operandi began with his taking up his 'possie' in the pre-dawn darkness. This, and the fact that he rarely left the area until well after dusk, ensured that usually there was no tell-tale movement near him during the daylight hours.

  Once Billy and his spotter were in position and had settled in, the true discipline of rigidly maintaining a quiet and motionless patience began. This was not a job for fidgeters. It demanded infinite resolution, an almost unconscious yet alert tranquillity. And the steady pursuit of professional perfection - snipers rarely get a second shot at a specific target.

  The equipment available to the Australian snipers at Gallipoli was basic and, in some cases, nothing more than the standard-issue Short Magazine Lee Enfield (SMLE) No. 1 Mark III .303 calibre rifle.

  However, there is evidence that some former rifle club members were allowed to take their own privately purchased weapons with them when they left Australia.

  Similarly, some of these same sporting shooters used rifles which had been fitted with various target and peep sights, primarily the "Lattey optical sight". But, in the end, the fundamental qualifications were, and still are, an above-average eyesight and a cold-blooded resolve.

  Billy Sing, a methodical man, encompassed, exemplified and expanded upon all of these characteristics. His uncompromising commitment and business-like approach impressed the British commander, General (later Lord) W.R. Birdwood and other senior officers.

  Major (later Lieutenant-Colonel) S. Midgely of the Fifth Light Horse, once candidly asked Billy how he really felt about killing men in cold blood. Sing replied that shooting "the illegitimates" had not caused him to lose any sleep. It was steely comments like these - and prominent personalities such as Billy Sing - that gave Australian commanders on Gallipoli opportunities to boost the morale of battle-weary troops.

  It was probably with official blessing that word of Billy's steadily mounting macabre tally was passed mouth-to-mouth like a cricket score, along the Allied trench-lines. Each day, Sing's persistence, resolve and unerring accuracy brought a bereft wailing to households and families throughout Turkey during the campaign of 1915.

  It was careless soldiers, as well as raw Turkish reinforcements, who presented easy targets of opportunity for the Anzac snipers. The nervous curiosity of these new-comers compelled them to snatch quick and often fatal glances over the parapet toward the Australian trenches. The actual area presented by their momentarily exposed bodies was minimal from the front. But it was the view from the flanks of the zigzagging trenches that gave a chance to the waiting Allied marksmen.

  The world of the sniper of Gallipoli was appropriately described by Idriess as being like a cat watching a wall with many mouse holes. Behind the holes worked the cautious mice, with ever-watchful felines waiting for just one mistake.

  As the campaign moved on and Sing's persistence and accuracy took their toll, it was inevitable that a response would come from the Turks.

  At first, orthodox military methodology was applied to put an end to the Australian who had taken out as many as nine of the enemy in a single day. One such Turkish reaction saw Sing's growing confidence shaken by a very near miss, one quiet morning in late August at Chatham's.

  Billy and his observer, on this occasion, Trooper Tom Sheehan, sat silently surveying the enemy trenches, waiting for an unthinking mouse to appear. Their eyes and telescope swept the ground to the front, seeking the almost imperceptible giveaway signs. A quick hazy puff of vapour from a weapon discharge, the unguarded tell-tale movement of an arm or a body.

  A Turkish marksman with a similar intent seized upon a sudden and inadvertent movement in the Australian sniping team and fired on them. His shot passed through Sheehan's telescope, end to end, wounding the    Australian in both hands, before entering his mouth and coming out his left cheek. The almost-spent bullet travelled on, completing its pernicious run by striking Sing in the right shoulder.

  Begrudgingly, the famed sniper would have been impressed by the Turk's skill or freakish luck. Tom Sheehan was evacuated to Australia to reflect on his own mortality. It was another week before Billy Sing was physically and psychologically able to climb back up to his elevated "possie" - and face the newly respected Turkish snipers once more.

  The next attempt by the Turks to clear their left flank of the unrelenting Australian sniper was more formidable.

Reports of these efforts came to light later, from accounts by Turkish prisoners, as well as translated extracts from diaries removed from the bodies of their dead.

  The Turks sent for their own champion near the centre of the front line.

  Already decorated by the sultan for his proficiency, the Turkish sniper -whom the Australians called "Abdul the Terrible" - probably relished the challenge.

  Abdul brought with him a determination which matched Billy Sing's. The Turk's hunt to locate his Anzac counterpart's position took on the professional vigour of a forensic scientist. Each fresh description of yet another sniping victim would see Abdul quickly sent to the spot. Here he would thoughtfully examine the crime scene.

There was an inexplicable ability by the Turks to separate the indiscriminate good fortune of some of the Anzac shooters from the true craftsmanship of the sniper Sing. Accordingly, the only reports passed on to Abdul were those confidently assessed as having been the work of the deadly and unseen Australian rifleman.

  Reconstructing each fatal shot, the Turk determined the bullet's angle of trajectory from the entry and exit wounds. And he studied the exact position and stance of the latest victim at the moment of impact, as recounted by those who stood nearby.

  With each calculation, the Turkish sniper drew with his eye a line which ended at an area of the Australian trenches on Harris Ridge. Eventually a pattern began to emerge.

His gaze consistently returned to fix on one specific location, a small rise on the heights at Chatham,s Post. At last he had found the lair of the too-efficient Australian killer.

  Mirroring Billy Sing's pre-sniping preparations, the Turk selected a suitable sight. In the darkness of each night, he built his own position. When it was finished, Abdul - like his Australian adversary - took up his post each morning well before dawn. Many days were spent simply watching and waiting.

  Despite tempting targets which appeared from time to time, the Turkish sniper held his fire. He knew that his quarry would not be among these unwise Australians. An opportunist shot might give him away.

  Eventually, however, his persistence paid off. He returned to the Turkish trenches late one evening, certain that he had found his rival and that the new day would see him finally end Sing,s winning streak.

  The next morning, Billy and his spotter took up their position. As Sing settled himself in, the observer began his day's first semi-alert yawning frontal sweep with the telescope.

  Almost immediately the man,s movement abruptly ceased and he whispered to his sniper that he already had a target. Sing took the telescope and, glancing towards a point indicated by his spotter, he stared ahead - in the face and rifle-muzzle of Abdul the Terrible.

  Carefully taking up his rifle, Sing made a final check that nothing would betray their position; then gently eased the loophole cover back and cautiously pushed the weapon forward.

  The Turk also saw Sing and began his own firing sequence. As he settled the rifle into his shoulder, Abdul drew in a breath and steadily sighted it on Sing.

  At that moment, a bullet struck the Turk between the eyes.

  It was probably a short time after this extraordinary duel that the Turks once more discovered Billy. This time they were not prepared to waste their own men and instead opted for impersonal, but effective, heavy artillery.    The first round was ranged with almost pin-point accuracy.

  It landed close to Billy's position. Sing and his colleague took their leave. Seconds later another shell landed on the emplacement, completely destroying it.

  Along with occasional mercilessness shown by Sing, there was often a macabre sense of dry humour surrounding his daily pursuit. This surfaced on one occasion when the Australian had as his observer, General Birdwood.

  It was a windy day, not one conducive to long-range rifle accuracy. As Sing fired on a recklessly exposed Turkish head, his first shot missed, its path deflected by a fleeting gust. Billy waited for the wind to drop before sighting once more.

  The second bullet spun a Turkish soldier out of the trench; a satisfactory effort given the blustery conditions.

With a hint of virtue, mixed perhaps with unintentional irony, the poker-faced sniper told the general that he would not add the latest kill to his score - he had been aiming at another Turk.

  Billy's comment underlined the latent and seemingly ambiguous integrity that was part of his professional make-up. The way his Turkish casualties were recorded bears this out.

  It has been suggested that the official tally was only updated if a Turk was seen to drop by either a Sergeant or an Officer. If the umpire raised his finger to signal the fall of another Turkish wicket, the score-keeper-clerk back at Fifth Light Horse headquarters adjusted the authorized score-sheet accordingly.

  However, this seems to have been impractical, given the requirement that there be as little movement as possible near Sing's sniping post. In addition, neither Billy nor his observer, were in a position to call for a suitably-ranked member of the regiment every time they were ready to fire on another target. It was more reasonable that someone apart from Sing himself actually confirmed the hit. In most cases this would have been the man working with Billy at the time.

  Eventually, official recognition of Billy's exceptional sniping skills began to appear.

  On October 23, 1915, General Birdwood issued an order announcing his compliments on Billy's performance in accounting for 201 Turks. The general was obviously happier in accepting the higher, but less official score.

But what compulsion drove Billy Sing on, as he recorded more and yet more kills at Anzac, during summer and autumn of 1915? Certainly the support of the Australian High Command placed no official obstruction in Billy's way. Sing's accuracy received almost exalted sanctioning.

  This was, of course, at a time when young Australia sought its own heroes as it came to world attention. Billy Sing slid comfortably into the national role his rifle had created for him.

  There is clear evidence that the international press knew of the Queensland marksman. Reports of his Gallipoli successes appeared in London and American newspapers.

  By the time 1916 arrived, the last of the Anzac troops were regrouping on the sands of Egypt, following the evacuation of Gallipoli. In February, Sing was also mentioned in the despatches of the Commander of the Allied forces, Sir Ian Hamilton.

  On March 10, Sing was awarded the Distinguished Conduct Medal for conspicuous gallantry as a sniper at Anzac. By June, the AIF, apart from the bulk of Lighthorse Regiments, had either gone from Egypt, or were in the process of leaving, bound for the big league on the distant battlefields of France and Belgium.

Sing joined the 31st Infantry Battalion and in August, sailed for England. After further training, he was sent to France.

  Over the next 19 months, wounds caused Sing to be frequently in and out of the line. He also suffered the recurring effects of old illnesses and injuries from Gallipoli.

  During his recuperation, he travelled to Scotland where he met waitress Elizabeth Stewart, 21-year-old daughter of a naval cook. They married in Edinburgh on June 29, 1917.

  It is not clear if Sing continued to carry out sniping duties with the Battalion in France. Snipers did operate there - but the heavy use of artillery meant snipers were used only on a limited scale. But Sing's army file provides occasional hints that whatever he was doing, he was often involved in hazardous activities against the Germans.

  Once again, his worth as a soldier was recognized by the Allied High Command. In October 1917, the Army Corps Commander expressed his appreciation for Sing's ". . . gallant service during recent operations".

This may have taken place at Polygon Wood in late September 1917, when Billy led a fighting patrol which succeeded in eliminating German snipers who were causing casualties among the Australians.

Sing was recommended for the Military Medal - for his work in identifying and dealing with German marksmen. But this was never approved.

  However, early in 1918, he was awarded the Belgian Croix de Guerre, which may have been the result of the Polygon Wood action.

  In July, Sing was posted to a submarine guard on an Australian-bound troopship. It had been almost four years since he had left Clermont for his grand adventure.

  When Billy and Elizabeth Sing arrived in Proserpine in late 1918 or early 1919, the town's residents turned out in force. A large procession, led by a local band, accompanied the couple from the railway station to the town hall, local dignitaries made welcoming speeches.

The transition from the green hills and ancient culture of Edinburgh to the dust and rough life of the mining district around Clermont must have been traumatic for Elizabeth Sing. This might account for her disappearance from the scene only a few years after she and Billy had arrived in the area.

As the post-war exuberance waned, Billy returned to Clermont. He moved on to a mining claim on the Miclere goldfield.

In 1942, he left the district for Brisbane. He told his sister Beatrice that it might be cheaper to live in the city.

In December, Sing was living in Brisbane and took on a labouring job. It did little to help his poor health. A workmate, Joe Taylor, who had also mined with him on the Miclere goldfield, later recalled that Sing was stubborn and would never see a doctor.

Billy's Gallipoli reputation faded from memory with the increasing number of Anzacs who passed away each year.

On Wednesday, May 19, 1943, William Edward Sing's aorta ruptured and he died alone in his room at the house where he boarded in 304 Montague Road, West End. He was 57.

Apart from five shillings, which were found in his room, and six pounds ten shillings and eight pence, owed to him in wages, the only thing of value left by Billy was a hut, probably on the Miclere claim, worth twenty pounds. It was a pathetic postscript to the life of a man whose name was once known to an army and a nation.

by Brian Tate

From the Courier Mail Weekend, Saturday, April 24, 1993.

[Genesis 0]

No, I believe Simo's total confirmed kills are those 542. Surely, he too has some unconfirmed kills. Don't know the count though. Häyhä, Hatchcock and all the others, they must be mentally truly amazing guys...

Again about Simo Häyhä, during the Winter War, Simo was assigned to take care of enemy sniper that had been killing squad leaders. The soviet sniper had already taken down 4. So, Simo took his Mosin Nagant (without scope, although there were many good soviet sniper rifles available) and carefully moved into good position where he could back away fast when the enemy cannons and mg's should begin to fire. He stood still for 14 hours, waiting for the enemy sniper to do a critical mistake. Suddenly, a sunburst hit the scope of the soviet sniper. Simo carefully aimed and took a shot from 450 metres, and hit. Then, he started to back away from the position, and soon shells from the enemy cannon started to hit the spot he had been. The soviets used to call him "the white death".

[Genesis 0]

It was interesting to read about William Sing. I have read about Gallipolli, but rarely seen any stories about WW1 snipers.

It's been a nice working day reading these stories. OK, tomorrow it's going to be about tank aces of all time

[Guest Scooby]

Those 500+ kills Simo Häyhä made do not include kills he did with SMG.

Not related to snipers but still interesting story.

"Examples of individual bravery during the Winter War are the things of which true heroes are made. In one accounting, 32 Finn soldiers held off 4000 Russian infantrymen. By the end of the failed communist attack, 400 Soviets lay dead and the rest in retreat. Only 4 Finns survived, but they held the line. You cannot help but be amazed by this kind of sacrifice and bravery."

[Genesis 0]

Yeah, Scooby that story is from Kollaa, Finland. Did you know that Kollaa was the place Simo Häyhä was sniping? It's amazing that even under enormous pressure, the Kollaa was still occupied by finnish troops when the peace was signed. I'm not sure, but the soviets attacked with some 120000 soldiers towards Kollaa. Finland had much less men there, can't remember the count, could someone tell the exact numbers?

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Yeah, Finland, the country of the tales ...

[cam0flage 0]

Genesis,

I called to my grandfather (a WWII veteran), he told there was one finnish division defending Kollaa.

// cam0flage

[Aculaud 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (WKK Gimbal @ May 16 2002,01:01)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">140 kills on 140 bullets is better than 400 kills on 50000 bullets  <span id='postcolor'>

I rest my case