Tank speed

[frederf 0]

A fair bit of climb performance is that ArmA models the transmission and gearing. Often times a HMMWV will struggle to climb a hill until the speed drops to a point that the transmission decides to go down a gear and all of a sudden you have power.

It's a good thing you don't take damage from downhill overspeed... the AI could never cope with that.

[SPC.Spets 21]

This makes me crazy when I was on a domination server with a tank in the middle of nowhere, there was no lift chopper, so I had to drive like 10Km to reach the objective at 10km/h then.... when I was like 1Km of the objective, after... who knows? 15-20 min....maybe more... the server crashes

[Beagle 684]

Thats the point in it...tanks support will always be the slowest one you can oder. South airport to Falar is 30min exactly when A.I. is driving on roads.

[shataan 1]

I don`t mind the tank speeds. lol What I DO mind is that when I am in the Commanders seat, my tank A.I. Drivers can`t seem to do the job adequately as of yet. But I know the bug fixes are coming, so no big deal.

[Pulverizer 1]

I don`t mind the tank speeds. lol What I DO mind is that when I am in the Commanders seat, my tank A.I. Drivers can`t seem to do the job adequately as of yet. But I know the bug fixes are coming, so no big deal.

Fixing the AI tank driving is already 9 years over-due so don't hold your breath.

[frederf 0]

Slightly off-topic question but when reversing tanks in ArmA the controls are not reversed like they would be for a car. Is this right? My gut screams that when actually driving the vehicle (AI command another thing) that reversing with right turn input would cause the vehicle to back up to the left as it would in a car like a HMMWV.

[dm 9]

Slightly off-topic question but when reversing tanks in ArmA the controls are not reversed like they would be for a car. Is this right? My gut screams that when actually driving the vehicle (AI command another thing) that reversing with right turn input would cause the vehicle to back up to the left as it would in a car like a HMMWV.

Some vehicles are reversed, some arent. Its a bit odd, as it seems to be down to the manufacturer to choose.

[Bee8190 10]

While I do acknowlege the speeds might be reasonably accurate, it annoys the crap out of me and obviously many others.

IMHO increasing the climbing speed to, say 30-40km/Hr is accaptable under E+shift keys wouldn't hurt and would be perfectly tolerable for MP

(as well SP ) and is why I've created my first CIT ticket -

https://dev-heaven.net/issues/27916#change-124202

I would hugely apprechiate, if you can pass some votes on it :)

some reference -

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Edited January 18, 2012 by Bee8190

[Beagle 684]

I don't see any high uphill speed exeeding 10km/h in your reference, and nonem of the humps is a sustained slope of a few hundred meters.

[Bee8190 10]

I don't see any high uphill speed exeeding 10km/h in your reference, and nonem of the humps is a sustained slope of a few hundred meters.

Coulnt find any better examples but i think you can clearly see the torque is not really as much of an issue as the engine / gearbox? cooling.

Furthermore, game supposed to be fun and what I observed, players couln't care less if its hyper realistic or even close to real data, its still extremely annoying.

Absence of high rpm when doing so doesn't help either.

I just think that this is one of the hyper realistic features i could perfectly do without and as said, many MP players too :)

Edited January 18, 2012 by Bee8190

[Beagle 684]

Coulnt find any better examples but i think you can clearly see the torque is not really as much of an issue as the engine / gearbox? cooling.

Furthermore, game supposed to be fun and what I observed, players couln't care less if its hyper realistic or even close to real data, its still extremely annoying.

Absence of high rpm when doing so doesn't help either.

I just think that this is one of the hyper realistic features i could perfectly do without and as said, many MP players too :)

No it's not hyper realistic at all since terrain properties and trction are not modelled at all, but in fact somwething went wrogn when a tank is found in a combat situation in montain terrain,,,since it should not be abkle to operate there because of the fact that tanks cant go fast uphill on sustained slopes. Even the Leo II could not do and it is still know to be the most mobile MBT in it's weight class so far. Heavy armoured units and mountains are a no go and that perfectly reflected in ArmA II, You can do it, but is should always be a pain, off course.

[coopr 10]

Well there is still alot to improve as first start with proper implementation of gears and torque in arma2. That would already make an important difference. That would also open the option for mods to play with these values. And create a climbing gear for example because i believe thats difficult now. You should set up a cit for That.

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[Bee8190 10]

Beagle@ i completely agree, we were given nice map as takistan is but we don't get to transport our M1A2's to the objective the realistic way like with M1070 armor towing support vehicle, if anything.

As shown per this video, the tank speeds are also underestimated

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If you can see what I see, pls vote it up

[maturin 12]

I just think that this is one of the hyper realistic features i could perfectly do without and as said, many MP players too :)

Hyperrealism my ass. When I'm playing MP, I don't want my logically-chosen position on a hill to be compromised by a magical cliff-zooming tank. I want to have the advantage when I play as a Takistani insurgent on rough terrain, making the armored death-dispensing juggernauts stick to the roads or risk losing their maneuverability and being destroyed.

But while we're at it, the reverse of this complaint is indubitably true. You can practically break the sound barrier in a tank by driving full speed down a Takistani mountain.

Also, I saw some major slow-downs on the only extended climb in the first video. Sure, the T-90 can go off jumps, but jumps aren't a kilometer tall.

[dm 9]

IMHO increasing the climbing speed to, say 30-40km/Hr is accaptable under E+shift keys wouldn't hurt and would be perfectly tolerable for MP

As shown per this video, the tank speeds are also underestimated

If you can see what I see, pls vote it up

Videos are USELESS.

As CarlGustaffa already stated: I know for a FACT that an M1 (and pretty much all military vehicles) can cope with a 60% grade (31 degrees), but it will only go up it at 4 mph. Any steeper than that and it will not climb the slope. At 10% (5 degrees) it will do 17mph.

The Russian tanks will do slightly better with thier higher hp/ton ratio, but certainly not 30-40 km/h

Please see this thread where it was already discussed at length...

[Tonci87 163]

I like it the way it is.

It is somehow realistic.

Suggestion: The next time you are annoyed by your Tank going uphill at only 10km/h switch to 3rd person view or stick your Head out of the hatch and look to the side. Look for the nearest Tree and see for yourself how steep the road actually is!

What needs to be fixed is Tanks speeding downhill at +100 km/h

[Bee8190 10]

@DM, videos is pretty much the only thing I have to go by, becouse after ressearching all over the net for about a day now, there are no solid data to show.

The MBT on these vids is T80, its 40 tons and 700Hp engine with 21.9 Hp / ton.

M1A2 is 60 tons with ( possibly more than) 1600HP twin turbo.

Hard data are nice but its really extremely annoying to drive any armor over takistan, becouse it losses half its speed at much lesser slopes than 20deg.

I even though the brits as well the US pulled out their armor from afghanistan?

Tonci87@ and i like doing 150km/h downhill....I mean common mate :)

[dm 9]

I like it the way it is.

It is somehow realistic.

This

What needs to be fixed is Tanks speeding downhill at +100 km/h

And this.

Oh, and for reference, first-hand experience, I has it:

youtube videos != reference material!

---------- Post added at 15:42 ---------- Previous post was at 15:40 ----------

M1A2 is 60 tons with ( possibly more than) 1600HP twin turbo.

Hard to turbo-charge a gas-turbine :) The AGT-1500 in the M1 Abrams is rated at 1500hp, however the gearbox is wank, by the time you get to the drive-wheels you're really only looking at about 8-900 useable hp.

Hard data are nice but its really extremely annoying to drive any armor over takistan, becouse it losses half its speed at much lesser slopes than 20deg.

Annoying or not, its pretty realistic. (Not bad for a very generalised abstraction, I must say)

17mph is the top speed for an M1 going up a 5 degree slope...

[Bee8190 10]

@Dm according to this - https://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/m1.htm

as Suma posted, supposed to be the reference nubers that are projected ingame.

Now there are obviously two sides to this, those who think the data are realistic and exact and those, like me, who suspect the data are incomplete and not properly implemented, as per the videos above, that doesnt unfortunately show as the maximum speed while going up slopes but it clearly shows that the tracked vehicles are not loosing over half of their speed at roughly 10 deg slope.

Edited January 19, 2012 by Bee8190

[dm 9]

those who thing the data are realistic and exact and those, like me, who suspect the data are incomplete and not properly implemented, as per the videos above

first-hand experience, I has it

Like I said, the videos are terrible for reference. The specs are pretty close.

Climbing hills, even little ones, in tanks is slow business.

Everyone thinks that tanks are magical unstopable speed-demon killing machines, but in reality they're really rather fragile.

What you dont see from the promo videos (T-80/90 jumping, Leo2 going over the speed bumps at top speed) is the days and days of maintenance that are needed to get the vehicles back to working order after such stunts.

[Bee8190 10]

What you dont see from the promo videos (T-80/90 jumping, Leo2 going over the speed bumps at top speed) is the days and days of maintenance that are needed to get the vehicles back to working order after such stunts.

I'm sure some heavy maintence is involved after such testing.

What I'm after though, is that working gear is needed, especialy for tracked vehicles or some kind of towing vehicle, that can transport the abrams to the objective more efficiently than driving it all over those hills.

I figured BIS might not want to go the way to implement gearing mechanics and so I've suggested that the climbing speeds be reviewed and increased

as I still think the ingame feel of speed, even on low degree bumbs/ slopes is not projected to player as IIRL

[Tonci87 163]

Tonci87@ and i like doing 150km/h downhill....I mean common mate :)

Ah well I admit that its sometimes really funny to fully charge guns blazing into an enemy collum and just whack the S*** out of them with your momentum. Try hitting an UAZ at that speed, it will immediately burst in flames :D

[max power 21]

I figured BIS might not want to go the way to implement gearing mechanics and so I've suggested that the climbing speeds be reviewed and increased

as I still think the ingame feel of speed, even on low degree bumbs/ slopes is not projected to player as IIRL

Here's the situation. BIS based their behaviour on data, and that data is upheld by DM who has actual experience driving a tank.

You disagree and show youtube videos as evidence to the contrary.

I think there is quite a difference in strength between these two sides and it is not in your favour. I think you need some data or you are not going to convince anyone to review their driving simulation.

[Beagle 684]

The only thing wrong with tanks going uphill at 17km/is the sound of it, not the speed.

[Bee8190 10]

I understand that max power but it is clearly visible that the vehicle doesnt loose as much speed as currently implemented.

I just closed my editor and found out another odd behavior -

climbing sideways, slopes of roughly 15-20deg has the same effect as climbing in straight line, which by laws of physics is wrong and unaccaptable

I understand a hard evidence is prefered but its not gonna happend and we all know it, becouse theres non.

As said the videos uploaded are the best we can steer the decissions by