Why is this game not more popular?

[Pulverizer 1]

Ok, I knew I was going to get F over this replay but I will try to give PC boys some hard facts and proof. ACT 1

-copy pasted wall of BS which you didn't write, removed. anonymous forum posts aren't factual sources-

Of course PC games market isn't as big as console market. No one's denying that. It is big enough that great PC exclusive games can be made and porting console games to PC is profitable, that's all that matters to us as PC gamers.

But to claim PC gaming is dying is complete BS. PC gaming isn't going anywhere. As long as there are millions of PC gamers, PC games will be made. And it just so happens to be, a lot of PC games are being made:

http://adrianwerner.wordpress.com/games-of-2010/

The PC gaming market is shifting to digital distribution though, and sales figures from digital distribution done by privately owned companies isn't reported to NPD or anyone else, so don't add up to statistics.

However, the leading PC digital distribution platform is growing really fast according to Valve:

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/62158

Steam's unit sales increased by 205% in 2009 over 2008's figures, Valve has declared as part of an announcement detailing the digital distribution platform's growth last year.

According to the Half-Life and Left 4 Dead dev, this "extraordinary growth" marks "the fifth straight year the platform has realized over 100% year-over-year growth in unit sales.

In conclusion, it doesn't matter that we're not bigger, being a lot better is enough ;)

Edited January 30, 2010 by Pulverizer

[Frantic 0]

With Operation Arrowhead ArmAII will get more popular!

BIS is just a small company as we all know and i guess everybody will agree on that the release of ArmAII wasnt really good...i dont wanna say it was as bad as ArmedAssaults release, but still not good enough.

Now after some time ArmAII is really in good shape and if BIS manages to release Operation Arrowhead in the same quality like ArmAII is now after all the patches, then i think we will see great reviews and tests of it and so new players or old OFP veterans will find their way to the fun of ArmAII online gaming! ;)

@AVIBIRD1: sorry, but i really dont think that ArmAII will work on consoles, you just need a keyboard for all the functions available in ArmAII. I dont say its impossible but ArmAII is definitely made for PC and not like OFP2 made for consoles. :p

[Herbal Influence 10]

Yeah - I never could imagine doing BI games on a console - for there is no keyboard!

Simple as that.

I might be misinformed but consoles always have been something for kids to me.

And sure BI could increase sales including the kids or those adults that want to play sitting on the sofar .... but - as it is said already here - do we really want that ?

Even today:

Seeing (like in the video above) a mature man at a console I immediately think:

What the kids are doing while he uses their console. I can't help.

I like BI games to be more popular - but that wish is the same as wishing the world go better, people being more open for deeper things instead of junk-food-entertainment.

And again - I enjoy BI games quite independent from the number of cogamers.

It's the quality of cogamers that count.

Again: I have had thousands of hourslong cti since 2001 playing mostly, or at least very often, 1 vs 1.

Edited January 30, 2010 by Herbal Influence

[noubernou 77]

Operation Flashpoint: Elite was released for the XBox.

[Frantic 0]

Operation Flashpoint: Elite was released for the XBox.

Jo, thats true, but compare the complexity of controls in OFP to ArmAII now and then you will realise that ArmAII has a lot more functions and moves than OFP has.

A joypad is really too less for all the functions in ArmAII.

[zoog 18]

Ok, I knew I was going to get F over this replay but I will try to give PC boys some hard facts and proof. ACT 1

I don't know what world you live in, but copy/pasting a forum post from someone on Toms Hardware and claiming it to be a hard fact and proof is just hilarious. Anyway, I don't want to derail this thread with this nonsense argument, so I'll just say that you've really convinced me with those facts, numbers and scientific market analysis. Well done. Bye.

Edited January 30, 2010 by zoog

[december 0]

Why isn't this game more popular? Because it attracts the same people that played it from the start, OFP. There is nothing new in the game, nothing to attract people who are not interested in the style of game play that ArmA offers.

The expansion pack will not attract anyone who doesn't already know the game is out there.

ArmA has it's customer base and is limited to it.

[Zipper5 74]

Not really. Many new faces have turned up to these forums in the last year or so. Many more came after the failure of that "other game". Seems ArmA II has been the (second) most popular of BIS' games.

[minimalaco 30]

simply so that gamers that they estan customary to games kill-kills, 10 to 50 minutes cannot be playing without sticking a single shot, is but, they are ended up boring and they do not return but by the lack from " action" that it has the game, are newbies the majority.

[Leopoldo 10]

The game got very poor reviews, lots of bugs

only reason i picked it up was because i got it on sale for £8.00

I must say i am glad i did

Only thing that bothers e is a bug under Windows 7 that causes the game to close (goes to desktop but ARMA 2 still running in task Manager and using resources but i can not get back into the game as the taskbar icon is gone), if they could find a solution to that i may start recommending this game to others.

[noubernou 77]

Jo, thats true, but compare the complexity of controls in OFP to ArmAII now and then you will realise that ArmAII has a lot more functions and moves than OFP has.

A joypad is really too less for all the functions in ArmAII.

Yea. People were saying BIS would never do a console game... :p They did OFP and it looks like they tested the waters there with that. As far as we can tell they did not prefer it.

[Opticalsnare 12]

Wait till i release these mod's of mine, players will come from all over these lands to blow shit up and kill badguys.

[avibird 1 154]

What I don't understand is that AVIBIRD 1 has come on here, to a forum for games such as these, and expected to not find PC gamers. Not only that, but he also thinks that he'll garner some support for slagging us off and calling us fanbois in huge wall-of-text posts that always have the same "Keep the faith, community" titles.

You saw how that "other game" was screwed over to fit on to consoles. In fact, I saw you on their forums many times, and you were quite the advocate of the game. Now that it's disappointed you, you've come back here and are causing nothing but trouble with your constant "PCs are dead" and "consoles are the way of the future" rants. It would be nice if you stopped posting this stuff in general, but can you at least stop derailing threads with it?

First, you just say lies. If you look at any of my posts on the codemasters forum you will see I was one of the first members who was saying that CODEMASTERS was going to F up the game. I have always told that community BOHEMIA was the reason for OFP. Do I like the game. It's ok, is it ARMA no but it's the only thing we have right now on the console so we deal with it.

Now ACT 2 of the information bill for the PC boys.

2009 US game retail sales total $19.66 billion - NPDBy Tom Magrino, GameSpotPosted Jan 14, 2010 4:18 pm PT

Modern Warfare 2, Sims 3 top sellers as domestic physical game hardware, software, and accessory sales slip 8 percent; PC software slides 23 percent to $538 million; DS sells 11M, Wii hits 9.6M.

Last week, Famitsu publisher Enterbrain revealed that the Japan game industry contracted 6.9 percent in 2009, generating ¥542.6 billion ($5.91 billion) in revenue for the year. A day later, the Entertainment and Leisure Software Publishers Association said that UK industry figures experienced an even bigger slump in 2009, plummeting 18 percent from a year prior to £3.311 billion ($5.3 billion).

Modern Warfare 2 on the Xbox 360 was the best-selling non-PC game of the year…

Today, The NPD Group issued its 2009 report for US retail sales, and as with the other primary regions, the figures were substantially off from last year's mark. US non-PC hardware, software, and accessory sales came in at $19.66 billion for the year, down 8 percent from the $21.4 billion the industry brought in during 2008.

"When we started the last decade, video game industry sales, including PC games, totaled $7.98 billion in 2000," NPD analyst Anita Frazier said of the industry's performance. "In 10 years, the industry has changed dramatically in many ways, but most importantly it was grown over those years by more than 250 percent at retail alone. Considering there are many new sources of revenue including subscriptions and digital distribution, industry growth is even more impressive."

Portable hardware was the only segment to see growth in 2009, rising 6 percent from 2008 levels. Total console hardware sales slipped 13 percent during the year. According to NPD figures from the past 12 months, the DS topped hardware sales with 11,185,400 units in the US in 2009, while the Wii shifted 9,594,000 units. The Xbox 360 sold 4,770,700 units on the year, just edging out the PS3's 4,334,500 unit haul. The PSP followed with 2,495,900 units and Sony's workhorse PlayStation 2 sold 1,799,900 systems.

In sum, PC, console, and portable software earned $10.5 billion in 2009, down 11 percent from the $11.7 billion brought in during 2008. Both portable and console software sales slid 10 percent on the year. On its own, US PC software sales fell 23 percent to $538 million. Notably, the NPD Group does not track software distributed through non-brick-and-mortar retail channels such as digital distribution.

Though NPD did not provide specific sales figures for individual titles, the stat-tracking firm did list the top 10 PC and non-PC game performers during the year. Topping the non-PC game chart was the Xbox 360 edition of Activision's record-setting Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2, with the PlayStation 3 edition scoring an eighth-place finish. Combined, the console versions of the billion-dollar game sold 8.82 million units in the US at retail in November and December.

…while The Sims 3 took the PC charts.

The only other non-Nintendo title was Microsoft's Halo 3: ODST for the Xbox 360, which placed ninth. Otherwise, Wii software dominated the non-PC chart, as Wii Sports Resort, New Super Mario Bros. Wii, Wii Fit, and Wii Fit Plus rounded out the top five. (To date, New Super Mario Bros. Wii has sold 4.21 million units domestically.) Mario Kart Wii came in at sixth, with 2008 top-performer Wii Play finishing seventh. Pokemon Platinum for the DS rounded out the non-PC chart in 10th.

EA and Activision dominated the PC sales charts, with The Sims 3 passing World of Warcraft: Wrath of the Lich King to earn the top-seller spot in 2009. EA's The Sims 2 Double Deluxe placed third, with Activision Blizzard's World of Warcraft: Battle Chest, Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2, and the original World of Warcraft following. The Sims 3: World Adventures, Spore, and Dragon Age: Origins, all from EA, finished in the respective seventh, eighth, and ninth places, and Sega's Empire: Total War rounded out the chart in 10th.

Top-Selling Hardware - 2009

DS: 11,185,400

Wii: 9,594,000

Xbox 360: 4,770,700

PS3: 4,334,500

PSP: 2,495,900

PS2: 1,799,900

2009 Console and Portable Game Software

1) Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 (360) - Activision

2) Wii Sports Resort (Wii) - Nintendo

3) New Super Mario Bros. Wii (Wii) - Nintendo

4) Wii Fit with Balance Board (Wii) - Nintendo

5) Wii Fit Plus (Wii) - Nintendo

6) Mario Kart Wii (Wii) - Nintendo

7) Wii Play with Wii Remote (Wii) - Nintendo

8) Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 (PS3) - Activision

9) Halo 3: ODST (360) - Microsoft

10) Pokemon Platinum (DS) - Nintendo

2009 PC Game Software

1) The Sims 3 - Electronic Arts

2) World of Warcraft: Wrath of the Lich King - Blizzard

3) The Sims 2 Double Deluxe - Electronic Arts

4) World of Warcraft: Battle Chest - Blizzard

5) Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 - Activision

6) World of Warcraft - Blizzard

7) The Sims 3: World Adventures - Electronic Arts

8) Spore - Electronic Arts

9) Dragon Age: Origins - Electronic Arts

10) Empire: Total War - Sega

[mosh 0]

Notably, the NPD Group does not track software distributed through non-brick-and-mortar retail channels such as digital distribution.

Though NPD did not provide specific sales figures for individual titles, blah blah blah

Go away with your nonsense and misleading numbers.

[Zipper5 74]

Oh God... Wall of text posts... *Eyes bleed*

ArmA II hasn't actually had all that bad of reviews. At least, it hasn't in places that count. IGN gave it a pretty good review, and PC Gamer US (don't know about the UK one) did a huge 4 or so page review of it. I was quite impressed, and in the end got something like 85% or above. And more and more, PC Gamer is publishing stuff to do with ArmA II.

[zoog 18]

US non-PC hardware, software, and accessory sales came in at $19.66 billion for the year, down 8 percent from the $21.4 billion the industry brought in during 2008.

Total console hardware sales slipped 13 percent during the year.

In sum, PC, console, and portable software earned $10.5 billion in 2009, down 11 percent from the $11.7 billion brought in during 2008. Both portable and console software sales slid 10 percent on the year. On its own, US PC software sales fell 23 percent to $538 million. Notably, the NPD Group does not track software distributed through non-brick-and-mortar retail channels such as digital distribution.

So basically it says that all sales numbers are down, both for console and PC. PC has the biggest sales loss, but one major error is that they don't count digital stores for PC games like Steam, Direct2Drive, GasPowered Games, etc. So the actual number is lower than 23%. If you want any indication how much money goes to digital distribution, look for some yearly reports from companies like Steam.

On top of that, console equals many platforms (PS3, PS2, XBOX360, Wii, PSP, DS, DSLite, etc.) all taken together as "one" thing. So comparisons between "console" numbers and "PC" numbers are pretty useless because you're comparing a multitude of platforms (old and new) vs one single platform. Also, a sales loss of 23% of pc software vs a 11% loss in console software still doesn't say anything if you don't know the total number of software items sold. 11% loss of 1 million copies are a lot more copies than 23% loss on 250 thousand copies. Even those numbers are not present. And taking into account that "console software" is taken together from 7+ different consoles, you can assume that the numbers are a lot higher compared to pc, so the 11% has more impact than 23% respectively. And, the retail price of PC games is about 50% lower compared to retail price for console games (here anyway). So that's yet another problem when you only work with financial numbers.

And still, when you have the right numbers to work with, you need to interpret them and find out what the underlying mechanics are.

In short: It's just not that simple.

Take an introductory course or intermediate course in statistics, it opens up a whole new world ;)

Pff, this cost me too much time already... *must resist urge to click on this topic again*

Edited January 31, 2010 by zoog

[Frantic 0]

ArmAII will keep its popularity, because of the continual support by BIS and the community with patches and all the great addons, mods and custom missions.

OFP Elite was made because Codemasters wanted to have OFP for Xbox and as we all know had BIS a contract with them and so BIS had to do it...

Im sure BIS would like to bring out ArmAII on consoles too, but its definitely a lot of work to dumb down the PC version of ArmAII to make the console version playable with joypad, so im not sure if we will ever see a ArmAII XBox version in the stores...

And one major advantage of the PC is the community.

We can see nearly every day new addons and missions at armaholic and it wont stop!

Who cares about statistics if you wont have manipulated it by yourself. lol

OFP was in stores for years and i know enough people who bought it years after the release, because it was constantly improved by BIS and the community.

The same goes for ArmAII.

And i dont think that such a thing could be possible on consoles...as long as you cant mod games at consoles, ArmAII wont be the same on it as it is on PC!

The popuraity of ArmAII isnt as huge as some other FPS games, but who cares, it grows slowly but steady! ;)

[bangtail 0]

<snip> misleading bollocks <snip>

Go play in traffic guy, nobody here cares and you aren't getting a console version.

Leave us alone already or at least restrict your incoherent babbling to that nonsensical thread of your own creation.

I'll even point you in the right direction.

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=69893

[avibird 1 154]

Oh God... Wall of text posts... *Eyes bleed*

ArmA II hasn't actually had all that bad of reviews. At least, it hasn't in places that count. IGN gave it a pretty good review, and PC Gamer US (don't know about the UK one) did a huge 4 or so page review of it. I was quite impressed, and in the end got something like 85% or above. And more and more, PC Gamer is publishing stuff to do with ArmA II.

One of your boys ask me for facts and numbers!

Hey, you have me all wrong. I think BOHEMIA IS THE BOMB and what they can do with a small team is unreal. I don't play games like HALO or COD ie run and gun crap games. I have been playing OFP since 2001 and still play the ELITE right now. I have played ARMA1 and yes ARMA2 great games and no other games are in the same league. Yes, right now I mess around with OFPDR because it is the only game in town on the 360 that I will play. Yes, PC are better in many ways. The bottom line for me and a lot of other players we just like consoles better for whatever reasons. Nobody needs to explain why!

Yes, I will give you a lot more little kids running around on consoles. If you teach them the right way to play they get hooked like we all did with this type of gameplay. One of my main points is a lot of older PC players like me are turning towards consoles. this is a fact. I am not saying console players don't switch to PC but more players go from PC to consoles.

For all you guys who say there is not a console market for this game are just not being honest. OFPDR did very well in sales but CODEMASTERS dropped the ball with the game in so many ways But the market was there. If you really care about BOHEMIA as a game company why would you not want them to make more profit. The Console has more players that could buy the game and with DLC for units,objects,weapons,vehicles ect with little work.

I no what you guys don't want to happen. BOHEMIA will dumb down the game or just not make any more PC games. GENTLEMAN, this will never be the case. Just look at the history of support for there products.

You guys need to relax and give us a little break. We just want to play the same game as you on a different system. If the game needs to be a little different with the port as long as it does not change your game what is your deal. I am not asking to use your girlfriend for the night just to play the best game around.

Edited January 31, 2010 by AVIBIRD 1

[Frantic 0]

...

You guys need to relax and give us a little break. We just want to play the same game as you on a different system. If the game needs to be a little different with the port as long as it does not change your game what is your deal. I am not asking to use your girlfriend for the night just to play the best game around.

We all are calm and relaxed...The only thing which we dont wanna see is the lack of support from BIS and as you said, BIS is a small company and every man working on a console version or making dlc for the console is a missing man for improving ArmAII on PC!

I would really like to see ArmAII as the most popular game on the consoles, but one thing you dont see is what makes OFP, ArmedAssault and ArmAII great, its the community around it with all the support with addons and mods.

This great thing wont be possible on consoles, so BIS would have to do it by themself and that would mean more work for the consoles and less support and improvement for the PC and i guess its clear what PC users prefer, so its really a waste of time to discuss your point on and on and on with us here, because we have a different opinion on that as yours and we wont change ours, sorry for that! :p

And its definitely clear, that a console version wont increase the popularity of ArmAII on the PC, which is the topic here and not a console version of ArmAII!

So please give up and stay at your thread. You can discuss your opinion there and please stop raping other threads!

Thanks! :p

[jasonnoguchi 11]

Seriously, I tot Operation Failpoint had a worse review than ArmA2 everywhere. At least that's what I gathered from my "pre-purchase research" otherwise I won't have bought ArmA1 and subsequently ArmA2 (yeah, ArmA2 was already out when I bought ArmA1... loser... I know)...hehehe

[Herbal Influence 10]

I just did two hours of cti - and left frustrated:

Guys coming on the server do not even say "Hello!", not even guys comin into your team.

It's like playing with dumb robots or ... autistic gamers. (Whereas I don't want to discriminate real autists ...)

The explanation given to me when I asked whether they were robots was: "I don't want to socialize ... "

The "lol" stuck to my throat.

Well - mature co-gamers - pls help to make this game more attractive by saying "Hello" if you join a server. Instruct instead of bash noobies ... and they will feel welcome and "online-gaming" will be more fun for all.

Like in the ol' nice days with OFP ... ;-)

EDIT: With "saying" I meant chatting/writing - not Teamspeak etc. Sorry for the confusion. I am so used to that mode of "speaking" .... :o

Edited February 2, 2010 by Herbal Influence

[Zipper5 74]

One thing that I always loved about OFP was you could have an awesome game of crcti or MFCTI whenever you wanted, and you would almost always have a good bunch of people to play with on every public server running it. Man, was that ever fun! I miss OFP more and more these days... :(

[NoRailgunner 0]

Why isnt A2 as appealing as OFP was back then?

- expectations were growing during time

- people still remember the release of Armed Assault

- among many other things the A2 campaign and missions weren't properly tested+fixed before release

- only few training missions are teaching how A2 works

Community Issue Tracker

[avibird 1 154]

We all are calm and relaxed...The only thing which we dont wanna see is the lack of support from BIS and as you said, BIS is a small company and every man working on a console version or making dlc for the console is a missing man for improving ArmAII on PC!

I would really like to see ArmAII as the most popular game on the consoles, but one thing you dont see is what makes OFP, ArmedAssault and ArmAII great, its the community around it with all the support with addons and mods.

This great thing wont be possible on consoles, so BIS would have to do it by themself and that would mean more work for the consoles and less support and improvement for the PC and i guess its clear what PC users prefer, so its really a waste of time to discuss your point on and on and on with us here, because we have a different opinion on that as yours and we wont change ours, sorry for that! :p

And its definitely clear, that a console version wont increase the popularity of ArmAII on the PC, which is the topic here and not a console version of ArmAII!

So please give up and stay at your thread. You can discuss your opinion there and please stop raping other threads!

Thanks! :p

OK that's fair but YOU the PC BOYS need to do the same in the our threads. I have ask you guys for months to stay out with all the crap about PC vc consoles. If you guys can do it ,I can do it but I feel you guys can't. only time will tell if I will be back the ball is in your hands BOYS.