Request to all Aircraft addon makers

[[frl]myke 14]

Since now ArmA 2 supports multiple missile/bomb mixing without some crude scripting and hiddenselection use, there might be time for a kind request which would open a few interesting possibilities. The idea is not new, had it back in the ArmA 1 days, i've called it Interchangeable Aerial Weapon System (IAWS).

The main idea behind is to keep weapon system usable on every plane made by addonmakers, maybe even later the original BIS planes adapted to it.

What was the usual way of applying missiles/bombs in ArmA 1?

Well, you got the plane 3D model in O2, you applied the desired proxy to the weaponholders and thats it. Without hiddenselections and scripting there aren't any other way and even with this it was limited to what has been scripted for.

Now, with the new proxy handling, things are a lot easier. You still have to apply a proxy shape to the model but now this is just handled as placeholder. You may take a look at the F-16 i've converted, the plane p3d has Sidewinders proxies on all weaponstations. But the different types in the editor does correctly show the added weapons/magazines.

So, with this new option, i guess something very useful can turn out. As long people (addonmaker) are willing to follow some simple standards. I'm surry, i'm usually not the guy telling others how they should do theyr work but i think this one is worth more than a try.

Rule nr. 1: Order of weapon proxies

In ArmA1, the numbering of the proxies handled the launch order only. Now in ArmA 2 it also handles where the missile shape of a weapon appears. They will start at lowest number and the raise (argh, bad english, i know). So a 2 round magazine will occupy proxies number one and two. Following weapons are placed according to this. You may again take a look at the F-16.

To make sure the arming result will be the same on every released plane, rule one says:

Proxy numbering start from wingtips to center. Alternate sides regulary (1 = left wingtip, 2 = right wingtip).

Rule nr. 2: Adjustement of proxy in the p3d model

On problem that arises is that usually weapon p3d model is centered, leading to the fact that the proxy has to be adjusted for each missile/bomb type due to difference in radials (correct word?). So a thin Sidewinder wont fit visually on a weaponholder which has been adjusted for i.e. a AGM65 or a GBU12 and vice versa.

So rule 2 would say:

Proxies has to be aligned with the weaponholder, regardless of the missile/bomb shape. Also here you may refer to the F-16 (will provide screenshots asap).

Rule nr. 3: Adjustement of weapon p3d model

The second rule directly leads to this one: weapon models have to offcentered downwards so it's upper edge is on zero line (Will also provide screenshot asap). Together with the rule 2, this kames sure the weapon model fits everytime to the weaponholder. Besides this, there is nothing special for weapon models.

Rule 3 says:

Weapon model has to be offcentered downwards so they'r upper shape border is zeroed.

Rule nr.4: Additional config entries

This rule is not related especially for modders but more for scripters which would have easiest possible access to the new possibilities. It is possible to add config entries which aren't supported by the game itself. Those entries can be accessed by various scriptcommands like i.e. getNumber which is one i plan to make usable for this. A script would have to know how many IAWS capable weapon holders a plane has, so we add this info in the config:

iaws_pylons = 8;
iaws_wingtips = true;

A script can read this value and therefor knows how many rounds can be applied to the plane. As magazines already have a count value in it, there is no change needed. The iaws_wingtips says if there are weaponholders on the Wingtips like on the F-16. This can be used to avoid loading heavy bombs on them.

One request at this point: even if you don't need it on your plane, please create magazines for 2, 4, 6, 8 and 10 rounds so people may choose the magazine that will fit theyr needs. Also add those magazines in the magazine array of the respective weapon.

But how will a script know if a magazine is made for IAWS? Well, i guess one single config entry in the weapon config should do it:

iaws_type = "all";  //defines where this weapon can be mounted

Planned are 2 different types:

"all": Weapon can be loaded anywhere

"body": weapon can't be loaded on wingtips

This in the respective weapons config and reading the related magazines array should give scripters enough possibilities to make some aweful solutions for it.

So rule 4 says:

Adjust the config so it can be better handled by possible arming scripts. Read codes above.

So, thats the idea, it's open to be shot down. :D

Benefits of this system:

- Weapons are easy changeable between different addons.

- Scripters may easily code some nice rearming scripts

- Weapons are always showed correct on planes.

- Easy adaptable for existing addons.

Downsizes:

- slightly increased workload for addonmaker.

I'm open for comments and suggestions. Also if you see things in the text that are not spelled correct or described in a manner that could cause misunderstandings, feel free to point me to it.

Edited June 10, 2009 by [FRL]Myke

[Junker 0]

wrong thread ???

shouldnt this be in addons discussion ?

[NeoArmageddon 958]

Its about making addons AND about making addons better usable in mission editing... i think this thread fits in both topics...

@Myke

Great idea! This will allow us scripters to make plug and play loadout menus. Maybe adding an action to the reammotruck "Edit Missile Loadout" and than you can drag the desired missile to an missileslot. And this will work with every iaws aircraft!

[[frl]myke 14]

@Junker

Indeed, you're right. It belongs more into a "ARMA : CONFIGS AND SCRIPTING (addons)" section....and now guess why it isn't there. :D....just kidding, hopefully they will make those sctions pretty soon and then it can be moved there.

[.kju 3245]

Myke posted your initiative in the DevHeaven forum.

Yet not much modelers around at the place so far.

[Serclaes 0]

I think there is a classification for the hardpoints needed. Take the F16 for example: the wingtips can take Sidewinders but not GBUs (at least i think so). Also: how does the proxy stuff work on wingtips? Or is it possible to rotate the rockets?

[[frl]myke 14]

@Serclaes

The proxy shape follows any rotation you apply to the proxy. So a 90 degree turn of the proxy will also turn the weapon shape accordingly

:EDITH:

Adjusted startpost to reflect some good thoughts given by Serclaes:

Indeed, a GBU would be ridiculous on the Wingtips. To avoid this, i guess it is sufficent to include the following config entries:

iaws_pylons = 8;
iaws_wingtips = true;

So the second entry would say that there are weaponholders on the wingtips, which then can be identified as proxy one and two.

Also the weapon config entry has to be adjusted:

iaws_type = "All";

This would define where the missile can be loaded, "all" saying everywhere and "body" below the wings and body only.

I guess this is a good compromise by givin as much rules as needed but without narrowing the freedom too much.

Edited June 10, 2009 by [FRL]Myke

[Serclaes 0]

how about reducing the number of variables by using one array:

iaws_hardpoints[] = {"TIP","HARDPOINT","HARDPOINT","BELLY","BELLY","BELLY","HARDPOINT","HARDPOINT","WINGTIP"};

The names can of course the reduced to integers. Since a list of weapons which can be placed at that hardpoint is out of question, if it has to remain easily adaptable for new addons, one has to go over the different stats and find some sort of general classifications. I thought about something like weight or whatever.

Or you could define some general "keys" and insert an array of keys into the array.

{{"key1"},{"key1","key2","key3"},etc

Then the ordnance config could have a "key".

Of course a weapon list would be easiest and is easily achievable in a project like ACES.

[kremator 1065]

What would be nice to see, and I can't remember who did the Arma1 addon, but is the ability to LOAD the bombs/missiles onto the aircraft in a GUI style.

Possible to do this in Arma2 as well ?

[[frl]myke 14]

@Kremator

This is the far goal of all this. If we get some kind of standards inside it, it will be possible to load any addonweapon currently active in ArmA 2 onto every plane that supports this system.

Also this would open the possibility to make missile and bomb addons without the need to fit a plane with it since it could be loaded with the kind of menu system you've mentoined.

I would love to see a scripter step in which would make a module out of this: place module, sync it with all planes that should use the Menu and with at least one ammo truck. When landed and engine is off, you would have a weapon loadout menu action which opens a menu with all available weapons and lets you load your plane as you need it. Once chosen, the Ammotruck (if within range) would come to you, some loons getting out and start work on your plane until it's loaded. Ah, sorry, i've started dreaming again.

[kremator 1065]

Myke, your vision sounds just perfect and I'm sure there is talent out there that can do this EASILY !

[[frl]myke 14]

I've been thinking about a coding for the weapon holders and how to define if a weapon might be added or not. I'm not that good in scripting or math soi just write it down as good as i can.

In general, a plane has 4 different types of weapon holder:

Wingtip

Single rail

Multirack

Body

I hope you understand the terminology as i use it.

Ok, obviously a GBU on the wingtips is definately a no-go. Also some might say that sidewinders on the body might look just funny. So i thought a math coding way could be the way to do this.

Goin through the different types of holder, assigning a number to each type like this could work:

Wingtip = 1

Single = 2

Multi = 4

Body = 8

Now creating an array with this, giving each holder it's number:

iaws_assignment[] = {1,2,4,4,2,1};

This is how it would look for the F-16: wingtip, single, multi, multi, single, wingtip.

Now in the cfgWeapon allow or disallow to load those weapon on specific rails:

iaws_define = 2 + 8;
iaws_define = 10;    //alternative writing

So this would allow the weapon only on type 2 (single rail) or type 8 (plane body).

I don't know how this method is called but i know it is used in ArmA(2) at some points.

With this combination of numbers it isn't possible to create the same result twice with different combinations.

I hope you get what i mean. I think this would give max freedom and also security, regarding misplacement of certain weapons.

[NeoArmageddon 958]

I just started with the loadout GUI. But i will finish it, when the first IAWS planes get released

[S7_Mega 10]

The F-18 mod for Arma had a menu where you select and create your own loadout, was very well done.

[massi64 10]

The F-18 mod for Arma had a menu where you select and create your own loadout, was very well done.

yes i agreed and someone should do the same think , a was good you could change your loadout in game before taking off , a was great

[nuxil 2]

the best idea i heard about in a long time :)

[Solid_s 0]

lulz. im gonna make it on my gripen

Edited September 26, 2009 by Solid_s
typo