Ranking system?

[ELITE B MAN 10]

What do we have as far as the ranking system goes? Trueskill? XP based? Win based? None?

Could it be my 4th locked thread in 7 posts?

[max power 21]

Units in ArmA have ranks and skill levels set in the editor. Mission makers can use anything to influence those statistics, but they are not persistently part of your 'profile', and they aren't used to cash in on the 'golden ak' or anything.

There hasn't been any mention of anything different in ArmA2. So, the short answer is that units have rank and normally it's for the purposes of the simulation, however, mission makers can manipulate it.

Also there can be external 'ranking' applications on websites to establish a player or team ranking or other statistics, so you can see how you're doing compared to other players, I believe. None of that is native to the stock software, though.

Edited May 1, 2009 by Max Power

[W0lle 1049]

There is no ranking system. This is ArmA2 not BF2.

On a sidenote: This is the 2nd or 3rd thread you started since you joined which obviously is just for spamming the forums and/or raising your postcount.

Be advised that we can stop this real quick: These forums are no playground!

[ELITE B MAN 10]

There is no ranking system. This is ArmA2 not BF2.

On a sidenote: This is the 2nd or 3rd thread you started since you joined which obviously is just for spamming the forums and/or raising your postcount.

Be advised that we can stop this real quick: These forums are no playground!

Wrong. The first one was a joke and to say hello to the community, which 1 guy got. (newbie, go figure). Second one was real, locked due to uberzealous mods. 3rd one was commenting on the overzealous mods. And then there's this one. And no, you could not stop "this" if you wanted to. I know how to get around any sort of IP ban you have as long as you are using this site template.

On topic: So there are is no "matchmaking" or leaderboards or nothing of the sort? Just join a game and pray that the teams are balanced?

[Maddmatt 1]

Oh no, not one of those idiots...

[An-225 0]

The mission editor does not allow persistent ranking. Rank is individually assigned to a unit while creating a mission.

This is not a game that requires stats. Stat tracking can and will only harm the gameplay, as people play to get kills, not for true teamwork.

I think you have the wrong idea of what ArmA is or can be judging by your last comment.

Oh, and threatening the moderators with your IP changing crap won't get you very far.

[Maddmatt 1]

I think you have the wrong idea of what ArmA is or can be judging by your last comment.

Oh, and threatening the moderators with your IP changing crap won't get you very far.

Yea. It's like he came straight outta 4chan or some screwed up kiddie site.

Honestly, why come in here acting like such a prick? These aren't like Gametrailers or some other site where people just post stupid jokes all the time. It's usually more mature than that and you stick out like a pimple with the way you're acting.

"I know how to get around any sort of IP ban you have as long as you are using this site template. "

And the "Internet tough guy" attitude, oh boy...

Edited May 1, 2009 by Maddmatt
Edited several times to add stuff

[ELITE B MAN 10]

The mission editor does not allow persistent ranking. Rank is individually assigned to a unit while creating a mission.

This is not a game that requires stats. Stat tracking can and will only harm the gameplay, as people play to get kills, not for true teamwork.

I think you have the wrong idea of what ArmA is or can be judging by your last comment.

Oh, and threatening the moderators with your IP changing crap won't get you very far.

Not even win/loss leaderboards? So 1 game is completely and totally indepentdent from the next?

[Sniperwolf572 758]

Don't spam the thread with useless crap, stick to it.

[max power 21]

Not even win/loss leaderboards? So 1 game is completely and totally indepentdent from the next?

I believe that that's what 'no persistent ranking' means.

[ELITE B MAN 10]

I believe that that's what 'no persistent ranking' means.

Doesn't that seem a little behind industry standards? I mean, we have had leaderboards since pacman.

[nodunit 397]

Ranking leads to more hacks and cheating, also less teamwork because everyone wants the points for themselves most of the time, compare bf2 to PR, in bf2 points mean rank and award.

In PR points mean...well pretty much nothin, their only there because there are certain rules (Get this many points to reveal location of another weapons cache)

But that can be mission editor based stuff as far as Arma goes. Basicly ranking bad.

[Maddmatt 1]

Well I'll be on-topic then...

With the exception of the Evolution mission and maybe some others, this isn't meant to be a 'points whoring' type of game. The focus is on team work.

As many missions are played with custom content (mission and/or mods and addons), a points system would be a problem anyway.

[ELITE B MAN 10]

Ranking leads to more hacks and cheating, also less teamwork because everyone wants the points for themselves most of the time, compare bf2 to PR, in bf2 points mean rank and award.

In PR points mean...well pretty much nothin, their only there because there are certain rules (Get this many points to reveal location of another weapons cache)

But that can be mission editor based stuff as far as Arma goes. Basicly ranking bad.

Even a leaderboard, simply a win/loss leaderboard, anything that would allow you to actual make the game mean something. I mean, ya lose, no biggie, it's not like it's recorded on some board for all to see.

Does anyone know if gamebattles or mlg have said anything about picking up this game?

[nodunit 397]

If at the same winning actually mean something I'd be for it. Say...in single player mode you must complete X number of missions before you can use a certain vehicle (going from wheeled to aviation)

Online this unlocks the "lighter" kinds of aircraft, in order to access the higher level you must complete X amount of missions in the lesser aircraft or you can't use it.

BUT if you start screwing up (crashing, totalling, etc) then your score drops and your licsense is revoked for X amount of time and/or until you get your record straight.

But that's a bit pressing not to mention how it could screw up the more fun missions and custom made, would the rules apply to those? your own server? how would you get around it? In the end for this game of game it's simply better to have absolutely nothing.

Edited May 1, 2009 by NodUnit

[max power 21]

Win / Loss can be recorded by an external program for the purposes of tournaments and stuff, but like others have said, that's not really the focus of this kind of game. Is the business aircraft industry behind the racecar industry because they don't corner so well on the ground? You're not comparing the same things here. This game is not pacman and it's not COD or BF2. Il2 does not have any such ranking system either but they still have a highly competetive community, and server stats are available from servers.

[An-225 0]

Elite B Man: "Doesn't that seem a little behind industry standards?"

You may have inadvertently answered your own question here. Yes, it is behind industry standards.

But is ArmA a mainstream game? Is it "industry standard?"

I think you really have the wrong idea of what ArmA is. It is not a standard or unified gametype similar to Conquest in BF2.

ArmA is comprised of many different user created missions, which are generally not unified. These missions do not have the same balance standards, and it would be really hard to track stats. Even if you had stat tracking, would they truly mean anything?

No. Because each mission is different, and no unified basis is provided.

[walker 0]

Hi all

There are various people who have set up tournaments. There is a forum member called Cellery who makes such missions. Do a search for CTF on the forums.

Most people who play ArmA are not realy that interested in Kill ratings and the like, though there are a few, look out for CTF and Death match being played on ArmA servers, Partcularly Hexen Kessel.

The commonest tournament form is Capture and Hold (C&H) games like Berzerk where it is more about maximising the time your team holds the ground.

Realism missions are the ones you will see the most on ArmA servers. Many people who play ArmA are serving or former military. The people who play tend to be more mature. The Larger servers and clans tend to run a public server they recruit from and a private server that the clan play on. Public clan servers will usualy have clan Admin and run missions like Warfare or Domination. Choice of team leaders can volunteer or admin asigned.

Clan Private servers may be locked or hidden or both. Many Clans have a set times they play and regular participants. Who plays on what side is often ad hoc. Most missions reflect the asymetric Warfare concept. So you may be running a Convoy from town to town with CAS and be up against a lone human placing bombs or sniping. Or you might be conducting a presence patrol trying to get info from tribal leaders on the position of an Ammo Cach and have to deal with a larger force of insurgents. Or you might be a special ops team. Or you could be involved in 5 hour all arms battle group assault.

Coop and PvP coop are comon in ArmA

Standing up in the midlle of the street and spraying will get you dead quick.

Learn to crawl and hide.

Running ahead like Rambo will cause you to be blue on blued and it be will your fault not the player who shot you. You work as a team often split into squads performing bounding overwatch. Or working with a gungroup on a distant flanking hill.

Tanks and IFVs sit at the back 300m behind providing over watch for the infantry screen.

SOP for an Ambush is get away from it 200m or more by either driving through it or reversing damn quick if the road is blocked, you never juke it out.

Camping is considered very good form in ArmA. Whining that the other player keeps shooting you from the same spot and is there for camping will get you laughed at for being foolish enough to let them do it to you.

As will firing at the AI through a Bush. Bushes are concealment not cover.

Assuming the the AI are stupid in ArmA will cause you to spend a lot of time whining on the forums about AI shooting you. Often through a bush/tree by the way trees less than feet thick do not stop bullets in the real world and they dont in ArmA either. Oh and the AI are more than capable of head shooting you, supressing you and outflanking you.

Many of the missions can take hours to play.

If you play ArmA I Download the Ace MOD.

Kind Regards walker

Edited May 1, 2009 by walker

[maddogx 13]

Actually, I don't believe leaderboards are "industry standard". In my opinion, leaderboards and achievements are just there to provide an artificial sense of "purpose", so players are content to keep playing less diverse games for a longer time. I've played games like BF2142, COD4, ETQW etc. and while they're all decent enough games, they don't provide much variety in the long run. Most games have a fixed number of maps, some with a couple of different modes, but generally not too dynamic. After a few months, you've learned the maps by heart, know the best positions etc. The games are essentially static.

In ArmA, it is easy to create simple missions, and not too hard to make more complex ones. These can easily be shared and played with others, creating potentially endless variety with little effort. Since with BIS' games people don't need to wait for an SDK before they can make missions, the community usually creates tons of missions within the first few weeks of release. I'd be willing to bet that you could play a different unique mission every few days when Arma 2 comes out. You can just hop on a server, have some fun, and when if you don't like a mission or get bored with it, you find a different one. And the great thing is: there will always be different ones.

What I'm really tryin to say is, ArmA (2) doesn't need official leaderboards, because it's generally not about being "better" than anyone else. Sure, there will be sites hosting their own leaderboards, tournaments etc. but that is for them to decide.

Edited May 1, 2009 by MadDogX

[Deadfast 43]

...anything that would allow you to actual make the game mean something...

Just the fact of having a good time means nothing to you?

There is no need for any statistics IMO.

[bravo 6 0]

Even a leaderboard, simply a win/loss leaderboard, anything that would allow you to actual make the game mean something. I mean, ya lose, no biggie, it's not like it's recorded on some board for all to see.

Does anyone know if gamebattles or mlg have said anything about picking up this game?

There are alot of core players and fans that don't need score tables to have fun, imo thats the spirit these core player look for. ArmA2 meant to be a Simulation not a game, maybe thats one of the reasons ArmA2 is for age 18+.

[Kimmeh 0]

I'm rather happy there's no statistic-recording or whatever in ArmA. I hate games like BF2, Supreme Commander, Company of Heroes etc. because of their ranking systems. If SupCom didn't have a ranking system I might actually play it against other people. See, I don't want to put copious amounts of time into a game to avoid looking ridiculous on the stat-board and have random people bashing me coz of my newbie score(until I get better at the game, then it's time to slowly erase the newbie-statistics).

Too much pressure behind it. And as said before it's behind industry standard, as in, it's "modern" to have a ranking system for a game. However not all 'progress' is an improvement over the old situation.

I personally am really glad that ArmA and ArmA 2 don't use it, it improves people's behaviour(no score-whoring) and keeps it relaxed, without people using glitches to get that oh-so-needed kill/death ratio or whatever.

Also, this ELITE B MAN guy had a very funny introduction with his first thread and gave me and someone else at least a good laugh. While opening threads simply to argue may be a tad provocative, I cannot help but agree with him that the mods do seem a tad over-controlling sometimes. I hope I am allowed to voice that opinion in this respectful way, without receiving anger or a 'warning' in reply.

Anyway, no to ranking systems. Thanks BIS for not following the herd!

Kimmy

[celery 8]

Multiplayer missions are so different from eachother that implementing profile bonuses can break them. You could also make achievement and stat farming missions that would break the system itself, making those who don't deserve it the ones who most often have the highest rank and privileges.

[W0lle 1049]

Judging from the recent post and the duplicate accounts from ELITE B MAN aka ADVANCED TACTIX this thread is closed now.

If someone seriously wants to discuss this again, for whatever reason please ask a Mod to unlock it.