[TRANSLATION] Interview about ArmA 2

[oscar19681 0]

Thanks for the translation...the interview was looking promising on the first 4 or 5 questions but then I kinda felt like it rolled into soft balls or direct marketing when not.

First of all... maybe AI is scripted not to see through bushes etc... but in fact they do... or they have also a spiderman-like hearing that can hear you 500m away in the middle of a firefight sneaking behind bushes...area target is a joke...they shoot you in the f·"$"g head.

Scipting AI to take acount own weight to dont consume stamina is hard to code?????

This is when I start to be suspicious that the interviewer is speaking with someone at the marketing department rather than anybody else.

Some pending questions IMHO:

- Will the game support SLI and Crossfire tech?

- Will the game run better on 64 bit OS?

- Will there be strategic level AI?

- Will the transparency render fps drop be fixed?

- Will AI be capable of going inside buildings to chase you?

- Will AI be capable of using not solid buildings to cover?

- Will the vehicles and armor be fully funtional or will we see those useless monitor inside the strykers for example?

- Will armor warfare be more realistic?

- Will aircrafts carry counter measures?

- Will there be G/A weapons cappable vehicles?

- Will BIS only release patches in the aftermatch or will they also deliver new official maps? (some people over here will puke if they see something like Evolution ARMA II)

- Will there be mortars?

- Will there be whiteboard alike cappabilities for the comander on the map?

- Will there be weather seasons?

- Will there be more weather effects (wind, snow storm, iced terrain)?

- Will there be usable friendly-user tools for server admins?

- Will there be cheating protection?

- Will it be improved the hand-nade launching....you now...like being capable of softly droping them by a cliff if necessary

- Will there be cappability to dig trenches?

- Will there be engineer vehicles (anti-mines, bridge-trowers..etc?)

- Will there be not depleted-uranium-maded destroyed vehicles?

- Will destroyed vehicles models be more realistic?

- Will there be realistic use of hellfires and mavericks?

- Will we see tanks flying 400m in the air when hitting a rock?

.......I´m tired now but can go on later......  

Yeah i hear ya. I understand that bis is trying to hype the game by not hyping so much. But in my opinion this really works the other way around. It will only result in urban myths and lots of other bs and people will post all kinds of useless stuff in the forums that in turn get locked in a blink of an eye. Why dont they start for example a Q&A in the forum and when time is there some questions can be awnsered. For most games i follow so late in the development state i normally am oversaturated with info and get a fairly good idea of what its all about and what to expect. Not so for arma2 . And why is this nessecairy. Its not like they are working on some top secret program ?

[NeMeSiS 11]

Thanks for the translation!

About the viewblock stuff: Watch

video and read the description.

(Dunno why the removed the HD version, made it easier to see what was going on.)

[oscar19681 0]

Thanks for the translation!  

About the viewblock stuff: Watch

video and read the description.

(Dunno why the removed the HD version, made it easier to see what was going on.)

Is this vanilla arma of some moded one.

[sparks50 0]

It says default bushes.

[NeMeSiS 11]

Vanilla bushes indeed, i made the video a while ago when this discussion popped up somewhere. It shows that the AI cannot see you when you are behind the correct LOD, but when you move they will still shoot at the position the sound came from. (If i was further away they wouldnt have shot me when crouching as long as a stayed behind the LOD).

I planned to do more of such video's to bust some myths but then i thought of interesting things to do.

[7 0]

- Will the game support SLI and Crossfire tech?

Most likely.

- Will the game run better on 64 bit OS?

Negative, ArmA2 is 32-bit.

- Will the transparency render fps drop be fixed?

I hope so.

- Will destroyed vehicles models be more realistic?

Somewhat.

See the replies in the quote-box.

[Kimmeh 0]

Thanks for the translation...the interview was looking promising on the first 4 or 5 questions but then I kinda felt like it rolled into soft balls or direct marketing when not.

First of all... maybe AI is scripted not to see through bushes etc... but in fact they do... or they have also a spiderman-like hearing that can hear you 500m away in the middle of a firefight sneaking behind bushes...area target is a joke...they shoot you in the f·"$"g head.

Scipting AI to take acount own weight to dont consume stamina is hard to code?????

This is when I start to be suspicious that the interviewer is speaking with someone at the marketing department rather than anybody else.

Some pending questions IMHO:

- Will the game support SLI and Crossfire tech?

- Will the game run better on 64 bit OS?

- Will there be strategic level AI?

- Will the transparency render fps drop be fixed?

- Will AI be capable of going inside buildings to chase you?

- Will AI be capable of using not solid buildings to cover?

- Will the vehicles and armor be fully funtional or will we see those useless monitor inside the strykers for example?

- Will armor warfare be more realistic?

- Will aircrafts carry counter measures?

- Will there be G/A weapons cappable vehicles?

- Will BIS only release patches in the aftermatch or will they also deliver new official maps? (some people over here will puke if they see something like Evolution ARMA II)

- Will there be mortars?

- Will there be whiteboard alike cappabilities for the comander on the map?

- Will there be weather seasons?

- Will there be more weather effects (wind, snow storm, iced terrain)?

- Will there be usable friendly-user tools for server admins?

- Will there be cheating protection?

- Will it be improved the hand-nade launching....you now...like being capable of softly droping them by a cliff if necessary

- Will there be cappability to dig trenches?

- Will there be engineer vehicles (anti-mines, bridge-trowers..etc?)

- Will there be not depleted-uranium-maded destroyed vehicles?

- Will destroyed vehicles models be more realistic?

- Will there be realistic use of hellfires and mavericks?

- Will we see tanks flying 400m in the air when hitting a rock?

.......I´m tired now but can go on later......  

Hey there Wittman, I've listened to the interview with jerry hopper and Ivan Buchta, and I may be able to answer a few of your stated questions.

- Will there be strategic level AI?

He says they are not going to make the AI larger than squad-based, as a larger tactical scale than that requires a whole new AI system. What he said was that "AI have only 5% of the command creativity a human does".

- Will aircrafts carry counter measures?

This one he also mentioned. He said they have discussed it in the team, but in the end they decided against it. Aircraft can allready obliterate large amounts of enemies easily and they didn't want to remove the few ways the guys on the ground could fight back. "never say never" he added, so there's a very faint chance they might implement it anyway.

- Will there be mortars?

There will be both artillery and mortars. Whether they are the infantry-carriable kind he didn't say. They are trying to make a small firing system for it, but nothing overly complex he said.

- Will there be weather seasons?

This one he also answered, he explained they couldn't make a whole new map for every season, such as a snow map, a spring with early trees and flowers and stuff, it would be too much work.

- Will there be cappability to dig trenches?

Digging trenches will not be in sadly enough, he said it'd require a rework of the AI and it'd be very hard to make it work for the mapmakers. Other stuff had priority. Ah well we still got sandbags. I hope they'll be able to use those normally now, in ArmA sandbags made the AI do funny stuff.

As for your mentioning of implementing weight and stamina, he vaguely mentioned something about becoming tired quicker when sprinting or something, but I might very likely be mistake on that one. Otherwise they were not gonna make it much more complicated like slowing people down coz of weight, as this'd need an AI rework, you'd need to teach them to wait for each other etc.

Hope I helped.  

Kim

(Edit: Typo.)

[KeyCat 131]

First of all thanks to Deadfast for the translation, appreciated!

I'm worried that people still has idea that this is in ArmA. Why doesn't people test these things before making their conclusions. As a side note: I have tested it and i can agree that this is mere urban myth. Trust me it takes just 15 minutes to test that.

Your post's last part isn't 100% on mark. As: If you hit to head they go down without anyone knowing it as they don't scream. I had long debate about this over year ago in these forums. Test it, i will take less then 15 minutes.

@ Second: I don't know how your test procedures are setup or what skill settings etc. you are using but to me the AI in ArmA is extremely good seeing thru ArmA stock vegetation (including clutter/grass), IMO way to good! As others said, it's a bit strange reading the comment about "being a myth" from BIS?

When it comes to the silenced weapons you are wrong! Read this thread and download my simple test mission and you will see what I mean. I've spent hours testing this and clearly something is wrong and I really hope this isn't carried over to ArmA II!

Direct link to a simple test mission to reproduce it...

http://keycat.no-ip.com/files....le2.zip

/KC

[Michael_Wittman 0]

Thanks for the answers anyway

[quicksand 0]

Hi all,

About the debate of the AI seeing through bushes in Armed Assault being a myth...Well I was just reading the videogamer interview and Marek Spanel is being quoted as saying when asked about improvements:

Quote[/b] ]They can't see through bushes, which was an imperfection in the last game"

Doesn't this put a nail in the coffin to the debate if the lead designer of the game admits it and thankfully states it was taken care of..

[HKFlash 9]

Hi all,

About the debate of the AI seeing through bushes in Armed Assault being a myth...Well I was just reading the videogamer interview and Marek Spanel is being quoted as saying when asked about improvements:

Quote[/b] ]They can't see through bushes, which was an imperfection in the last game"

Doesn't this put a nail in the coffin to the debate if the lead designer of the game admits it and thankfully states it was taken care of..

God really exists!

[NeoNiels 0]

Vegetation ArmA 2

On this site u can see what BIS has done with the vegetation for Arma2 and specificaly the AI viewblocks.

[sparks50 0]

The AI could never see through bushes, it was just that the viewblock model was a bit small for some of the bushes.

There are mods that makes these blocks bigger.

[bravo 6 0]

Vegetation ArmA 2

On this site u can see what BIS has done with the vegetation for Arma2 and specificaly the AI viewblocks.

problem here is that people do not know how to distinguish cluttler from models.

Ill say once more for ALL of those who still continue to say it Works properlly:

<span style='font-size:19pt;line-height:100%'>Clutter DO NOT block AIs Sights in ArmA1!</span>

<span style='font-size:16pt;line-height:100%'>For Those who say it does, they should be SLAP in the face twice with a fecking hammer!</span>

EDIT: GOD DAMNIT THIS IS PISSING ME OFF!

[Maddmatt 1]

Clutter DO NOT block AIs Sights in ArmA1!

That's what the fucking grass layer system is for for the millionth time

It makes no sense for grass to have view-block geometry because it is only created a short distance around the camera. Especially when you consider MP it's not hard to see why that would be ridiculous.

It's not perfect, but for something that is going to significantly affect vision you should use objects, like the wheat on the Avagni map.

[.kju 3245]

block != influence

clutter != the 'grass' layer

AI has hearing, and sharing of information too.

[Second 0]

And I'm worried about people that assume that others are idiot enough to not test things and post things without testing! So who said to you that I didn't test?? Really I'm worried about people who assume that others (who have diferent oppinions) are a bunch of idiots that never test things!!

But getting back on track, I DID TEST and I can confirm that in the same bush I CAN NOT hide from enemy soldiers and worse even from enemy vehicles such as BMPs while with Durgs Vegetation instead I CAN (sucessfully) hide from enemy soldiers and vehicles!

And pal, If you don't have problems hidding behind bushes (in vanilla ArmA - Without Durgs Vegetation) you must certainly have a diferent version of ArmA than the vast majority of players because most of us don't have the same experience that you have (regarding this issue).

BTW, did you read the post from oscar19681? He clearly stated that he tested and confirmed basically what I said. But I forgot, no-one on earth test things except you

Regading your comment "If you hit to head they go down without anyone knowing it as they don't scream", this is simply not true because even when I hit enemy soldiers in the head, THEY WILL ALWAYS SCREAM! (again unless you have a diferent ArmA game than mine)

LOL

I lied behind bush in ArmA (ran test just for you!. While Opfor soldier is standing (aware behaviour) just 15 meters away from me. There lone bush in between us two. He didn't see me

I fired a clip of bullets to sky and he still didn't see me.

Now... Which one of us is wrong?

Another test (took 2 minuties to test):

I have man in front of me 15 meters away another one is 30 meters away. both look opposite direction then i'm in.

I shoot first one with suppressed M4 to head and he goes down without screaming (don't shoot shoulders but to head!. Guy 30 meters away don't react in anyway but keeps staring those beatutiful butterflies at opposite direction.

Ofcourse if they are in same group thing are handled bit differently, and at that point of time they become alert because i killed one of their group. Which is lame and should be taken into count by mission designers.

Vanilla ArmA 1.14 in both cases. So chill down and buy another copy of ArmA, play vanilla ArmA or something

[Second 0]

@ Second: I don't know how your test procedures are setup or what skill settings etc. you are using but to me the AI in ArmA is extremely good seeing thru ArmA stock vegetation (including clutter/grass), IMO way to good! As others said, it's a bit strange reading the comment about "being a myth" from BIS?

When it comes to the silenced weapons you are wrong! Read this thread and download my simple test mission and you will see what I mean. I've spent hours testing this and clearly something is wrong and I really hope this isn't carried over to ArmA II!

Direct link to a simple test mission to reproduce it...

http://keycat.no-ip.com/files....le2.zip

/KC

I maxed every thing. AI skill to max, their seeing ability to max. Dunno bush type but those large ones in Rahmidi.

Test was in "labratory" condition. Just including me, bush and enemy

Enemy ----> bush -----> Me

No "background noise" no additional factors which i can't control or take into consideration.

Like i said in my earlier post about silenced weapons (not the one you quoted). If troops are grouped together they will understand instantly that their groupmate got killed. If they are seperated they dont' have a glue. I too have used rather much time and effort to sort this out in the past.

EDIT: It was either late 2007 or early 2008 when i had pretty strong debate about this silenced weapon thing in ArmA general forums, about that one default misison where player is to sneak in base and stuff. Haven't seen that silenced weapon bug thread you linked here.

[KeyCat 131]

Dunno bush type but those large ones in Rahmidi.

I know exactly what bush you refer to and that particular bush type provides pretty good consealment but there are other (stock) vegetation that don't.

Quote[/b] ]

Like i said in my earlier post about silenced weapons (not the one you quoted). If troops are grouped together they will understand instantly that their groupmate got killed. If they are seperated they dont' have a glue. I too have used rather much time and effort to sort this out in the past.

Actually, the AI can react even if they are not in the same group and without LOS. My testing indicates it to be somehow related to what direction AI currently look at so I recommend you to experiment with the AI looking at different directions as well and not just turned strait away from you.

Again I refer to the above mentioned thread/test mission for a complete description of the issue.

/KC

[mr.g-c 6]

What disappoints me is that there is no proper weight simulation like many of us already got used to by ACE-Mod.

A simulation where you can jog indefinitely with 50KG of gear - bravo to the "Most Realistic/Ultimate Combat Simulation"

Rest is OK though.....

[whisper 0]

Quote[/b] ]

Like i said in my earlier post about silenced weapons (not the one you quoted). If troops are grouped together they will understand instantly that their groupmate got killed. If they are seperated they dont' have a glue. I too have used rather much time and effort to sort this out in the past.

Actually, the AI can react even if they are not in the same group and without LOS. My testing indicates it to be somehow related to what direction AI currently look at so I recommend you to experiment with the AI looking at different directions as well and not just turned strait away from you.

Again I refer to the above mentioned thread/test mission for a complete description of the issue.

/KC

Well, imho, if the AI reacts when a fellow soldier is killed while it is watching in the very soldier's direction, even in a different group, I wouldn't find that too unrealistic

But I guess you meant some other kind of issue

[Second 0]

I know exactly what bush you refer to and that particular bush type provides pretty good consealment but there are other (stock) vegetation that don't.

Quote[/b] ]

Like i said in my earlier post about silenced weapons (not the one you quoted). If troops are grouped together they will understand instantly that their groupmate got killed. If they are seperated they dont' have a glue. I too have used rather much time and effort to sort this out in the past.

Actually, the AI can react even if they are not in the same group and without LOS. My testing indicates it to be somehow related to what direction AI currently look at so I recommend you to experiment with the AI looking at different directions as well and not just turned strait away from you.

Again I refer to the above mentioned thread/test mission for a complete description of the issue.

/KC

Yeah. There are less concealing type of bushes and stuff, that is why there is fix for that. My point was that bushes do provide concealment, not that do they offer enough.

They do spot killed guys outside their LOS under certain conditions? That sounds interesting.

[4 IN 1 0]

Dunno bush type but those large ones in Rahmidi.

I know exactly what bush you refer to and that particular bush type provides pretty good consealment but there are other (stock) vegetation that don't.

you see thats the problem

good consealment = good AI blocking ability

poor consealment = poor AI blocking ability

thats the simple fact

i would agree that some of the vegetation view blocking is just made too poor that can almost be consider as a bug, but just because their view blocking area is not enought, you cant say that they are non-exist because there is vegetation that have the view blocking large enought to do the job

[KeyCat 131]

Well, imho, if the AI reacts when a fellow soldier is killed while it is watching in the very soldier's direction, even in a different group, I wouldn't find that too unrealistic

But I guess you meant some other kind of issue

As long as the fellow soldier have a chance to have LOS to his buddy within his FOV I agree but with houses/fences/vegetation/etc. blocking his view it becomes unrealistic IMO. I'm just guessing here but the "magical detection" doesn't seems tied to his visual FOV but instead to the hit/kill event and to some degree what direction the AI is looking (his hearing cone?)

Quote[/b] ]

They do spot killed guys outside their LOS under certain conditions? That sounds interesting.

I don't want to derail this thread so I suggest you guys read this thread and we can continue that particular discussion over there if need be....

/KC

[Kimmeh 0]

I shoot first one with suppressed M4 to head and he goes down without screaming (don't shoot shoulders but to head!. Guy 30 meters away don't react in anyway but keeps staring those beatutiful butterflies at opposite direction.

Ofcourse if they are in same group thing are handled bit differently, and at that point of time they become alert because i killed one of their group. Which is lame and should be taken into count by mission designers.

Which is yet another reason why they should lift the group limit in the mission editor. I even made a thread about it( http://www.flashpoint1985.com/cgi-bin....t=77780 ).

I saw the youtube vid of Second and it looks pretty convincing that bushes do work sometimes. As he said, it's prolly coz they're in the same group, which is a tad silly but nothing overly game-breaking, unless you're trying to make a stealth mission. :/

Kim

(P.s. please don't discuss about lifting group limit here, do it in the other thread.)