Chopper down

[Longinius 1]

An American chopper has been shot down in Afghanistan, or so MSNBC claims.

http://www.msnbc.com/news/627086.asp

So, does this mean the pukes finally got one? After what, several months and tons of ammo they managed to hit something?

[foxer 0]

I guess they got shot down from all the hard fighting in the area.This is where they are fighting i believe.

[foxer 0]

NEvermind the link don't work,but heres what it says

"US Chopper Shot Down Over Afghanistan

By PAULINE JELINEK

Associated Press Writer

Afghan fighter mans post

AP/Lefteris Pitarakis [22K]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

WASHINGTON (AP) — An American helicopter was shot down over eastern Afghanistan, raising casualties in the largest ground operation of the 5-month-old war, Pentagon sources said Monday.

The Army helicopter was taking part in an assault on suspected al-Qaida and Taliban fighters the Pentagon says were regrouping south of Gardez.

It would be the first American aircraft taken down by enemy fire in the war, following accidental crashes of other craft since the anti-terror campaign opened in October.

Bombing continues

AP/Lefteris Pitarakis [15K]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Defense officials declined to give details, indicating they were unsure whether a search-and-rescue mission for the troops had been completed.

The incident came as the largest coalition force assembled so far in the campaign — some 1,500 from America, Afghanistan and at least six other nations — engaged an estimated several hundred al-Qaida and Taliban in intense fire fights backed by air strikes.

Before the downing of the helicopter, the casualty toll of the operation started Friday stood at one American and three Afghans killed and an undisclosed number injured.

That raised to 20 the number of American military personnel who have died since the campaign began. The most deadly incident came Jan. 9 when six Marines were killed in the crash of a tanker plane into a mountain in Pakistan.

In the latest fighting, U.S. Chinook helicopters were ferrying in supplies to American and other troops in the hills following the start of the coalition ground attack in the area. In addition to allied Afghan fighters and U.S. Special Forces, troops from Australia, Canada, Denmark, France, Germany and Norway were participating.

The assault was believed to be the largest joint U.S.-Afghan military operation of the 5-month-old terrorism war. Pro-U.S. Afghan troops approached the hide-outs from three directions to isolate the fighters and prevent them from escaping.

Safi Ullah, a member of the Gardez town council, or shura, said the first stage of the offensive was designed to cut the road from Shah-e-Kot to trap al-Qaida and Taliban forces in the mountains. He said the plan also involved setting up checkpoints to prevent them from getting out.

Pakistan has closed its border with eastern Afghanistan and deployed extra army units and members of the Khasadar tribal militia to catch any who try to cross the frontier and filter into its Northwest Frontier Province.

"

[foxer 0]

The thing i don't get is why,why are they attacking this place ? Why not just carpet bomb or daisy cutter ? I bet there is something there or someone.

[Longinius 1]

You could bomb those mountains for ten years and the enemy would still be safe in the caves. That is why they have to go in.

[foxer 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Longinius @ Mar. 04 2002,15:03)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">You could bomb those mountains for ten years and the enemy would still be safe in the caves. That is why they have to go in.<span id='postcolor'>

They made this special bomb to suck out the air of caves,i guess it doesn't work that great.

[Longinius 1]

Obviously not.

[Stealt Eagle 1]

Yesterday one american special soldier got killed along with a couple of afghanis where also Danish special forces took part on an attack on some caves

[Hilandor 1]

yep id imagine that if afgans put up with years of hiding in mountains and destroying the russians at the same time then this is nothing new to them

[Guest]

Mark my word Osama "Goat fondler" Bin laden and his Afghan Cronies aint out the fight yet.

[Wobble 1]

They made this special bomb to suck out the air of caves,i guess it doesn't work that great.

they did, but the thing is you have to know the layout of the cave.. so you can drop the bomb to penetrate into a tunnel.. or sles your just dropping a bomb into solid rock.. its pretty tricky..

I think there is something we (the public) are not being told.. there is either someone or something in that area that is very important to be kept intact.. you notice that area has not even pre-attack bombed.. with is rare.. something important in there and they want it alive..

[Assault (CAN) 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">They made this special bomb to suck out the air of caves,i guess it doesn't work that great.<span id='postcolor'>

Hmmm, I don't think that there is a special made bomb for that purpose.

The closest thing would be an 'FAE' Bomb. FAE=Fuel Air Explosive. Upon impact or just before; the fuel is released so that it will turn into a vapour that mixes with the air. When it ignites, it causes an incredible concusion and it also sucks up all the oxygen in the surrounding area.

I beleive the Russians have an FAE RPG that can kill everyone in a house, I think that they have used it in Chechnia.

For more info on FAE's go here.

Tyler

[jaxx 0]

They are using a "thermobaric bomb" - it's really an FAE, like assualt said.  The model is BLU-118/B and it was made specifically for afghanistan, so technically, it's a new bomb.

** EDIT: Corrected model #

[Assault (CAN) 1]

Can it be found on the FAS website?, LOL, that has to be the most usefull military website ever.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> Aldous Huxley <span id='postcolor'>

I read his book 'Brave New World", it was pretty good. Have you read it?

[Wobble 1]

the "new bomb" is nothing more than a fuel-air bomb that is encased as a penetrator insted of a normal bomb.. its just like the rest but insted of a solid HE compound its a highly explosive liquid with a detonator.. insted of it being like blowing up dynomoite,, its like blowing up dynomite instide a drum of jet fuel.. the resluting "flash fire" fries everything like chicken in the immdiate and the IMPORTANT part is that it burns AFTER its exploded.. consuming all the oxygen in the area.. pretty simple.. bascically it explodes and causes a massive fire which consumes all the oxygen..

[Frizbee 0]

What happened to the good old flame throwers... The best way of clearing out those caves if ever there was one. Just a HUGE tanker full of fuel, and a long hose leading to the flame thrower, and the man using it covered by a team of special forces... just vapourize all of the f**kers.

[Guest]

They would if they could but there is something called the geneva convention.

[Wobble 1]

I think (this is just me) that if one side breaks the geevamonkey convention than the otherside shouldent have to follow it.. see it like a contract.. if one side breaks teh contract.. its void to the other side aswell.. granted I know the implications of such a system and im actually glad its not that way... perhaps ole Wob has a little bloodlust left in his withered decreped mind

[Longinius 1]

"I think there is something we (the public) are not being told.. there is either someone or something in that area that is very important to be kept intact.. you notice that area has not even pre-attack bombed.. with is rare..  something important in there and they want it alive.."

In the article I read about the chopper being shot down they said that the area HAD been bombed.

Edit: According to a follow up on the same site there has been dropped 270 bombs over the area where the fighting is taking place.

It also mentions that a second chopper was fired at and damaged. One crew / passanger KIA. That chopper made it back to base though.

Aparantly one chopper had taken fire and a passanger had fallen out. The chopper pulled out and headed back to base. A second chopper was sent in to retrieve the fallen soldier, who they found to be allready dead (killed by an rpg through the body). That chopper also came under fire and was shot down, killing some six or seven soldiers.

[Wobble 1]

well thats just dandy

[Ex-RoNiN 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Wobble @ Mar. 05 2002,08:34)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">well thats just dandy <span id='postcolor'>

nope, its war, and in war shit happens

[Tovarish 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Monkey Lib Front @ Mar. 05 2002,04:57)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">They would if they could but there is something called the geneva convention.<span id='postcolor'>

Bit offtopic here but wanted to put in my 2 cents about the Geneva Convention. Although I fully understand why it exists, from what I've seen it is practically useless and sometimes illogical. First of all, in every conflict, there is always at least one side that completely ignores it, and it is usually only democratic nations that follow it, at least "officially". Heck, it is now known that in the Soviet Union, soldiers were not educated about the Geneva Convention. They didn't know not to shoot at a vehicle with a red cross on it for example.

Moving onto my second point, the flawed logic of it, especially when it comes to banned weapons...IMHO, if ANY weapon should be banned by it, it should be nukes. But no, we get things like no flamethrowers,no napalm, 50 cal sniper rifles can only be used against equipment, but hey let's let countries have a nice little bomb that can royally screw over the whole planet. I mean, how many times did the world almost get blown to hell? More than we can immagine I bet but I can name the Cuban missile crisis, the Vietnam war, where Nixon wanted to use it, the Korean war & Mcarthur, that recent little mess with India & Pakistan, heck during the cold war there was even an incident where NORAD mistook a flock of Canada Geese flying over the Canadian artic as a flight of Soviet bombers & launched their Bombers & interceptors, luckily one fighter pilot realised those were birds and not Tu-95's :O

So, what I'm trying to say is, I think governments should take a long look at the Geneva Convention, and revise it so that it makes some sense, or scrap it.

[Wobble 1]

nope, its war, and in war shit happens

tel that to all the "oh my god some civilians got killed in afghanistan!!' people.. they often forget..

[Assault (CAN) 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">50 cal sniper rifles can only be used against equipment<span id='postcolor'>

I think that's just a myth, and I will continue to think so until I see the actual thing on paper.

As recently a '93 (Somalia) U.S. soldiers used the .50 BMG against people. In Canada we are still trained to use the .50 BMG on dismounted infantry. So I don't believe its banned.

I think the same goes for 'dum-dum' (expanding) bullets.

Tyler

[ralphwiggum 6]

AFAIK, dum-dums are illigal for ordinary ppl, but not for military. heck, they even use depleted uranium ammos(?) for tank shells.