Oxygen not being freely distributed online!

[madmike 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (UKD_Private_Pile @ Mar. 01 2002,00:01)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><span id='postcolor'>

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Damage Inc @ Feb. 28 2002,21:10)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I think this is a good decision becuase now we're not going to get a lot of useless addons.<span id='postcolor'>

Why if an addon is bought out do you have too put it in your addons folder, or leave it there when you realise its rubbish!<span id='postcolor'>

Becuase its bad enough at the moment with people reskinning them, there are missions where I have to download stuff I dont need and if you play on the net then you will have to get stuff you dont want.

It needs to be "policed" to keep high standards.

also I hope nobody does go against BIS and try to relased it to everybody

I bet if some twat does it will ruin this game

[kegetys 2]

Ok the situation seems to have been clearing up a bit now, and it doesnt after all seem as bad as the first news that hit me made it look like. (I read "Editing tools only to be released to selected mod teams says BIS. And under a Non Disclosure Agreement." from an IRC channel topic. I just wanted to apologise BIS for my first post that might have been a bit harsh... I was quite shocked. But still I really hope that the whole community would get the tools as fast as possible because there are some really talented people out there.

[colt 0]

I think everyone should chill for a minute or two and cut BIS some slack ( I support BIS on their decision - marginally ). Although no doubt it's a kick in the teeth for some, lets just see how their proposal works.

1. OpFlash isn't your ordinary 'game' for a start. You don't have levels, you don't have to progress from A -> B -> C in a linear fashion. If you had created a groundbreaking game wouldn't you try to protect the tools you had created from scratch? ( And let's remember, the tools ARE being released )

2. BIS are a young company and have several irons in the fire - Independance Lost, Resistance and VBS. It is possible that because of these projects ( especially the Marine connected VBS ) that contractual obligations had to be met at the last minute. If you were the Marines or Coalescent Technologies wouldn't you be slightly miffed if you could have waited a waited and picked up the tools for free instead of spending X amount of money on BIS ( money that may well be ploughed back into future BIS games that WE will the opportunity to play ! )

3. As already stated, the tools will be more openly available to the wider public in the future. Every game has a shelve life and OFP is no different. BIS will no doubt move on as will us gamers as technology itself improves.

And finally,

4. To all of modders who say that they will 'leak' the tools, think of how pissed you get when someone releases a compilation of user mods that have your name / credit removed. How does it make you feel when someone takes your hardwork, simply puts on another texture and claims it as their own?

Yes, this whole situation could have been handled better and that's unfortunate ( possibly due to point 2 ?). BUT BIS have shown their dedication to the game and to us - just look at how often they respond to queries on this board.

Let's put our faith in BIS. We have done for the last year and through countless gaming accolades haven't we...

[Maddock 0]

.....and BIS and the OFP Community lived happily ever after.

I like a nice ending.  

[madmike 0]

So people, for those of you who say that releasing these will make OFP last just that much longer, remember this. Releasing this to MOD teams, will give you MODS to play for months. And, they are using there discretion to make sure the MOD is worth while, to make sure that YOU have an enjoyable experience. So, when you are finally done playing MODS they deam fun and worth while, they will release the tools so you can do your own thing. I, for one, am all for this idea. For those of you who aren't, well, poo on you and your dirty dog too

[Maldita Vecindad 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (madmike @ Mar. 01 2002,02:05)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">So people, for those of you who say that releasing these will make OFP last just that much longer, remember this. Releasing this to MOD teams, will give you MODS to play for months. And, they are using there discretion to make sure the MOD is worth while, to make sure that YOU have an enjoyable experience. So, when you are finally done playing MODS they deam fun and worth while, they will release the tools so you can do your own thing. I, for one, am all for this idea. For those of you who aren't, well, poo on you and your dirty dog too<span id='postcolor'>

mike are you the P.R. guy of BIS?

I have seen you in all the forums trying to defend what can't be defended.........

BIS promised that they were gping to release Oxigen to all the users......and they didn't...

I though I was never going to say this but even Ghost Recon will have free tools for us to play...

I only hope that those third party aditors aout there can be finnished so we "the lone wolf" comunity can create whatever we want...whenever we want......

[Guest]

My opinion regarding the general release of modelling/island tools changes daily. I can see how easily it would be for the days/weeks/months post-tool release to become total anarchy. One of the most frustrating things I found is trying to get a game of OFP together and getting thrown back to my desktop every other mission because I dont have the addon..I can only imagine this could be become 5, 10 times as frequent as more and more people begun making addons and the quality drops below acceptable. Most peoples responce to that is "Well dont download them then" but that isn't always an option when you want to play online but you have to use the addon etc. Untill a more complex addon system can be created that checks each client for addons and then marks the missions that use addons that the clients dont have in red for example, I can see chaos.

Though having said that I feel some-what let down because not only were we expecting the tools after reading interviews with members of BIS but we were expecting them THIS month. I fear that my work, and the work by the entire team on WinterMarch will just of been a big waste of time...I dont want to appear negative but I just hope BIS will keep their promise in sending the tools to those who sign up for the "initiative idea".

[Random 0]

To all the people who are only planning on releasing a couple of models or one new island, or something small... Yoshiro had a great idea a few posts back. Why don't you get a group together and dedicate yourselves solely to releasing small things like new weapons or vehicles? If BIS approves of it, you could really get into it and release a ton of new models!

[M-N-0N 0]

here is what i said in the "mods /addon forum

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">what about the newbs ... they are basicly saying .. no you have to get better ... keep useing them 3rd party tools ... and if i am not mistaken .. you cant make new models with them ... you have to edit useinf the polys that are there....

so they arnt gonna learn much ... unless they just keep makeing models till they get sick of it ....

thats why ... like someone made a post about ... with this tool being released we need an official site for the addons ... so they can be reviewed and sorted out so ppl knew what they were downloading and if it was good or not ...

and i am sure for the skilled ppl, they would get to be know well for there work and would be populer .. i mean no one starts off modelling perfect ....

tobe honest i am a well known modeller around the HL / Cs modelling community for my work i used to do. "not being ego.. it is true"

but it took me a while to get to that point.... but what got me to that point was, i made awsome models "at that time!" when CS started 2 come out ... i was editing gooses models = but i did a damn fine job of it 2 =

anyways back to the point ... how can the newbs get anywhere without the proper tool and not being able to use the work they create....??? ... they will just give up after a while..." cozz it take a good 5-8 months to get skilled enough maybe less if you are talented"<span id='postcolor'>

and what i said is basicly true

1) we need an addon reviewing site

2) the newbs have no chance to learn "unless someone make a 3rd party tool that can import newly made models"

and how hard will it befor someone say like me that wants to play around with the tool and maybe add one or 2 models ...

i mean i realy wanna try putting one or 2 of my model into OFP .. but that will be it, since i am working on a game right now, i dont have all the time in the world, but i would like to have a look at this tool and have a play around....

in the end, i think this is a bad idea...

[NVA Killer 0]

i agree with dave, but i would still like to download non mod related downloads, i hardly play online anyways, so im not affected. Isn't there a way to have OFP download it for you when you connect?

[sergeant rock 3]

Well, I am disappointed, but I think their decision not to release the tools is purely financial.  In releasing these tools to the general public, I think they run the risk of some really creative MOD's being built, and thereby killing the earning potential of their own "official" releases.  

    Think about it, RESISTANCE is not slated to be released until June, that gives the numerous mod'ers in the community several months to build more interesting and innovative things than BIS can.  Why pay for a new island, improved textures, and some new vehicles when there will be many others floating around the community for free.  Money and financial stability are the bottom line....that's the nature of the beast.

[Guest Scooby]

BIS has done great job in past and especially at change of

year 2000 / 2001 when I found out about OFP they were very

responsive about feedback but as games release got nearer

and OFP proved to be hit they and their core group around

them seemed to stop interacting with rest of the community.

I've been following OFP for long time. Not nearly as long as

some people but still damn long. Unless BIS finds some way to

please people I can see that there wont be many people left

to play new BIS supported mods or Operation Flashpoint:

Resistance because there is nothing to keep people

interestied on OFP while they are coming.

Now as Oxygen will be only given to selected group there is

no change of seeing for example mines, Russian 12.7 NSV

(which BIS for some odd reason refuses to add into OFP),

RPG-29, Apilas, TOW or proper Russian AT-4 (not the one BIS

claims to be AT-4, in real life Russian AT-4 is not man

portable but operated on tripod).

Because of BIS decision to give Oxygen and other tools only

to smaller group of people I am afraid that there will be not

many mods for example of armed forces of different countries.

Atleast not for a long while.

I waited mostly Oxygen because I just wanted to toy around

with it. With Visitor I would have wanted to try to create

small but far more detailled map which would have allowed far

more realistic battles than flat terrains OFPs maps have. With

Oxygen I wouldnt have mind to try to do small changes to

existing models and try to make OFP bit more realistic since

BIS seems to have no intentions of doing so... Besides

changing speed and adding trajectory to AT weapons but

thats it... And still some people claim that OFP is realistic

infantry simulator...

I wouldnt be putting too much trust on this statement made

by Marek:

"Yes, we still plan to make the tools available to wider public

audience later. There are more options how to do it and after

we decide what will be the final way, I can say more about it."

As bad as it feels to say this BIS is beginning to lose their

credibility in my eyes(or actually it has been happening for a

long while already) because they simply have failed to keep

their word too many times already.

I could easily foresee that now they've got plans on releasing

oxygen and other tools as part of one of their forthcoming

addons.

[Tigershark 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Yoshiro @ Mar. 01 2002,08:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I think Maddock has the right idea here.  How many people have applied?  and if you haven't go try.  If never hurts to try.<span id='postcolor'>

Mmmm....mixed feelings about this, and a very interesting discussion happening in here. I won't divulge my opinion just yet until I ponder on this a little more....but will say that Tigershark and Jellybelly Productions has applied for the toolkit.

Our work will center around accurately modelling the Pavehawk series of choppers (USAF and US Army) and the Littlebird. As well as other specialist choppers like the MH-47E.

The textures are done (although they could be improved) but really we want to add the correct armament and sensors and such.

We also want to work on the VH-60 presidential chopper and Medevac choppers.

We will focus on air units primarily.

We have applied....lets see what comes of it.

[Peroxide 0]

I think this is the worst idea the BIS has ever had! "We choose who gets the tools" is the dumbest thing ive ever heard! Im mean Discreet released a free version of 3D Studio Max and look howmany people love them! People are creating new games with it! This is kinda like Live365.com charging everyone to broadcast when it used to be all free! Now you are being the moneygrubbers! Everyone has some cool idea for models and you have crushed there dreams! That is the most rude thing someone can do to someones dream of building C130's, M4's, and countless other creations! Im looking down on BIS as a stuckup bunch of pricks that are picky as hell about every one elses creation so they have to be dicks and not allow these creations that no one would have to download in the firstplace! Its sad that they would take back on their word of free to everyone! Your credability has shot down through the floor and into hell. HOW DARE YOU STEP ON OUR DREAMS!

[Brentk 1]

i still havent heard the official reason BIS didnt release it to the public.....

[Antichrist 0]

Good decision BIS!

I'm fully behind it !!!!!!!!!!!

For those who claim they gonna be using Oxygen for practicing! U won't!!! If u're not good enough to make a decent model using some other 3d-modeller I don't want to see your addons in my game!!!

[M-N-0N 0]

Antichrist

let me stick a nail in ya ass

ok ... first up ... true there models will suck ... but they will keep trying and trying ....

but they will get sick of remoddelling the models they want ...

and it will also take 6-8 months to get skilled enough....

and they wanna see there stuff in OFP.....

so what you said is lame!

and BIS is lame for it 2.....

sad them saying we will release it 2 the public after the selected mods have been released ... WELL fuck me! and how long till them mods will be released?? fucking 9-12 months from now ... like any other fucking mod that gets made for other game!  fuck waiting that time .....

also dont say well OFP if diff....

makeing maps night not be hard cozz the maps are already made ... all that is needed is codeing ... well thats true ... but makeing models and textureing and animateing then codeing how the mod work wih these new models and all that will take ages .....

i think this is a bad idea....

what they should do it make an official site  and get a bunch of reviewers ... and review mods and sort them out on a 0-5 basis so you know whats best and whats not....

[Tigershark 0]

[Antichrist 0]

I don't think anyone that can't make models for shit is going to get better after 6 months!!

[M-N-0N 0]

and have you modelled before??? gues not ...

cozz you do get better after every model...

[ufo_hk 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Antichrist @ Mar. 01 2002,03:33)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Good decision BIS!

I'm fully behind it !!!!!!!!!!!<span id='postcolor'>

I am too !!!!

Well having followed the Falcon4 3rd party/patch situation for a number of years now, I've seen what a mess it can become if not well managed.

I have to appluad BI for their stance not only are they giving the community the option to use the tools, they are showing they are fully commited to continuing to ensure OFP meets a level of quality that exceeds most games. They offer to supply the dev tools to those who are interested as long as they adhere to an agreement.

BIs stance very much parrellels G2s stance with regards to F4 which has shown what can be achieved if the situation is well managed. G2 brought order into an what was otherwise a total disarray and made the community stronger for it. BI have taken the lead in showing they will do this and ensure a strong community and product for the followers of OFP.

IMHO if you take BIs stance as a reason to bug out of OFP, then you don't have what it takes to make a commitment to OFP and hence a worthwhile mod or addon for OFP.

For those who take up BIs offer and succeed - I'm looking forward to seeing what I believe will be a quality effort. But for gods sake ...... hurry up

[Antichrist 0]

2 M|N|ON

Well they all can practice using GMAX

[M-N-0N 0]

like i said .... dont expect anything soon ... mods take ages 2 get to a release version ... right now ... since this tool is being released to selected parties ... i am not expecting to see a mod .. say like veitnam or the ww2 mod to be out for atleast 12 months from now ... unless if BIS is gonna work hard with them and giveing pointers ...

[Antichrist 0]

Well if u've got some great models just send them to BIS and they might give you the tools!

[M-N-0N 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Antichrist @ Mar. 01 2002,03:57)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">2 M|N|ON

Well they all can practice using GMAX  <span id='postcolor'>

pont being wut?

most ppl prolly are useing that to make models... i see some use milkshape 3d ... but that is a semi free tool based on the max layout...