ArmA 2 on Xbox 360

[Stone48420 0]

This is the kind of game that the 360 needs. I have more but I don't see how I can express myself with out pissing somebody off.

[maxqubit 1]

is it just me or do all pc gamers seem to be extremely aggressive and elitist? this is BIS we're talking about, they won't "dumb down" anything. the only reason elite didn't do very well is because of codeies awful job of marketing and the delays. another thing, how can you say console controllers are less accurate e.t.c than a keyboard with its four movement buttons, thats the same as a nes.

Yes they were and they still are and presumably will be 4ever:(:(:(

This (pc)community even KILLED it little kid-brother Elite in stead of give it the love it deserved.

I really don't expect anything anymore from the pc guys. Always the same stupid arguments like mouse/keyboard control and stuff like that.

And now ArmA2 seems to go 360 also, some guys swing, well jeeeez, where were you when those few Elite gamers really needed you??????

IF you want your beloved Flashpoint universe to shine, plz embrache a good 360 'port' and be happy about it.

But the 'keep it for ourselves' mentality made me sick a long long time ago, and yes, perhaps i'm over to the OFP2 side, not because i dislike ArmA2/360 but i'm very tired of this community ...

Proof? Just look how DEAD this 360 thread was, and this was the ONLY thread in which the word 360 was allowed!

Ok, enough rant, but i'm not gonna give it all a second time. It is up to BIS to make/break the ArmA2/360 idea, i just wait for 2008 and play a lot of other great 360 games (Bioshock anyone:)

[maxqubit 1]

The Xbox crowd just isn't into these kinds of games, as the sales of Elite reflect that.

Sorry but dumb remark ... let see:

rls Elite - nov 2005

rls 360 - ehhh hey wow NOV 2005 also!

(23 of 24 of my clan buying a 360 in nov/dec 360 and not spending anymore money on old xbox AND Elite is not backward compatible AND BIS/CM splitup ... you want more arguments?????)

It should have been:

rls 360 - nov 2005

rls Elite/360 - feb 2006 (in a world were CM & BIS worked happily together)

But well, i know, i'm just a simple guy:)

[maxqubit 1]

Just to clarify - OFP:E has a subtle autoaim implemented, even in iron sights mode, where it works like a very slight magnetization towards the target. We did not find any other possibility to implement controls so that you can hit distant targets precisely enough. Still, the autoaim is subtle and it server only as a helper, it is definitely not a magical targetting device - which is perhaps why people often do not notice it is present at all (which was out intention when implementing it).

Well, let me make one (1) thing clear. I frigging LOVED!!!!!! OFP:Elite ... i admire the dedication which went into the product guessing it was difficult to complete Elite (due to BIS - CM troubles and such) ...

... so for me Elite proofs BEYOND ANY DOUBT that these kind of shooters are possible on console (and on 360 XBL there a loads of mature gamers just waiting for such a game)

.. so plz BIS go on and make ArmA2/360 ... if done properly you could sell 100k's of copies ... i hope you will pull it off and wish you all the luck.

[Heatseeker 0]

I hope the PC version release date wont be afected by the console versions.

A few negative OPF:E features found their way to Arma.

Loading map, no vehicle interiors (tanks, bmp), screen turns black when you leave a vehicle or dismount a mg emplecement, zoom on ironsights (imo)...

No more of that please.

[Guest Ti0n3r]

Quote[/b] ]If ArmA2 comes to consoles....well... I'm not sure many will appreciate an xbox360 game thats still in alpha.

Haha, so true Sure, Elite felt pretty much perfect, but then again it was more of a reworked OFP than a whole new game.

[Coffin Joe 0]

As far as consoles go you have to get your game certified before being made. Sure buggy games get through but not to the degree of PC games.(I don't think[there are some bad ones...]) Though I fear it might go in that direction with the online capability of all the new systems.

And judging by Elite no one should have any worries on control.

One thing I'd like seeing made better(imo) is the analog movement with the left stick. PC games movement is of course done with keyboard. Modifier keys for slower walking/running.(digital) Aiming is with mouse.(analog) It felt like Bis essentially mapped wsad to the left stick with maybe a little blending between running/walking/creeping.

Embrace the full analog movement of the left stick Bis! Either way I love Elite and still play it so I'm looking forward to '08

[RAKtheUndead 0]

Quote[/b] ]is it just me or do all pc gamers seem to be extremely aggressive and elitist?

Pretty much, yeah - and I'm guilty as charged. I'm fairly elitist when it comes to certain genres - FPS games leaning towards the realistic, RTS games, Western Hemisphere RPGs.

Quote[/b] ]Well, PC with Geforce 8800 GTS 320mb, 2 GB and Dual Core e6600 is only a little better than Xbox 360.

Some of the parts are only slightly better than the Xbox 360 - the RAM, a lot of which is taken up by the operating system, and the processor, which is a CISC design in home PCs, whereas it's a RISC design in the X360. However, the 8800 GTS graphics processing unit is far superior to the Xbox's by this point. The Xbox programmers must be coding really well to get such parity with the PC (or the PC programmers aren't coding well enough).

Now, for the main part of this topic. Do I think that an appropriate ArmA 2 could be coded for a console? Well, yes, but I'd be questionable about it. It would have to be done a certain way, I think, to make sure that the noticeably more argumentative PC gamers don't blow a head gasket. Firstly, the PC version would have to play as well as possible (don't care as much about graphics right now), meaning a control system pretty much like the standard OFP/ArmA controls, things not being cut out because of cross-development.

Secondly, I think a lot could actually be done to streamline the controls of this game for console gamers. I find some of the commands in ArmA slightly superfluous - some of the movement commands, etc. Basically, for consoles, I'd be thinking in terms of commands, movement, shoot trigger, a dedicated "change stance" button, reload, change weapons, optics, and then do a lot of the rest through the action menu. I know the action menu isn't the smoothest way to get things done, but it's probably the best way to ensure full functions without having to chop anything big off the PC version.

Now, I think the Dual Shock would probably be a better controller for the purpose, but I'm not exactly going to promote the PS3 as a platform, seeing as I dislike it for one, and also think that it costs too much for what turns out to be a minimal increase in performance so far from the Xbox 360. (Not to mention that it's already outdated in terms of the GPU as well - the 8800 GTS can convincingly thrash the RSX's 7800 GTX equivalent in benchmarks.) Thus, I'd be supporting this project on PC and Xbox 360.

[suma 8]

A few negative OPF:E features found their way to Arma.

Loading map,

This, for one, was really introduced during OFP:E, but it would be necessary anyway. It is necessary because of the island data streaming, and without such streaming even PC would not handle the huge and detailed landscape present in ArmA.

[Maddmatt 1]

A few negative OPF:E features found their way to Arma.

Loading map,

This, for one, was really introduced during OFP:E, but it would be necessary anyway. It is necessary because of the island data streaming, and without such streaming even PC would not handle the huge and detailed landscape present in ArmA.

Just one thing about that I don't understand. Why then does the GPS not need to load? Or maps that are part of custom dialogs (such as the minimap in the CoC Command Engine or in Bezerk maps)? Are they handled in a different way? Those maps seem to have no issues being shown on top of gameplay.

They do seem to have a slight FPS hit though, which is understandable.

The loading isn't as much of an issue as it was in earlier ArmA versions though. And upgrading to 2Gigs of RAM seems to make the delay very short so it doesn't really bother me now.

[suma 8]

Why then does the GPS not need to load? Or maps that are part of custom dialogs (such as the minimap in the CoC Command Engine or in Bezerk maps)? Are they handled in a different way? Those maps seem to have no issues being shown on top of gameplay.

They do seem to have a slight FPS hit though, which is understandable.

GPS does not need almost any data, only a few textures. The map needs quite a lot of data, and the larger and more detailed the map is, the more data it needs. In case of custom minimaps you most often pay the price always, as they are mostly implemented in such a way that they are streaming their data even when you are not using them at given moment (you could imagine it like they are drawing even when they are not visible).

[jtec 0]

I love the idea of BIS branching out to consoles. Its a company after all and needs to make profits or that company goes bust which means no games for us.

Bugs will not be a big issue like they are on PC's due to the fact each Xbox has the same hardware and software. Unlike us silly PC users with numerous different hardware setups and operating programs/drivers.

Custom addons should be bought at a price (maybe BIS introduce a community program where we the pc addon makers produce packs/addons for the xbox 360 players) depending if they make enough profit on sales of the game. (some will moan about that but BIS will not make them for free, only reason why we get them free is due to the community)

As some guys have said the only bad point with BIS in the past-time has been the publishers who dont advertise the game very well. My advice for them is to look at other means of advertisements, Youtube must have helped boost sales when Dslyecxi released that vid of his which beat atari's and 505 games vids hands down, also thinking along the lines of myspace a nice lil flash advert for arma 2 would look sweet on my profile page, even having a arma 2 myspace page may boost peoples knowledge of arma2, as i have told loads of people about this game who never had a clue it existed.

[maxqubit 1]

I love the idea of BIS branching out to consoles. Its a company after all and needs to make profits or that company goes bust which means no games for us.

Bugs will not be a big issue like they are on PC's due to the fact each Xbox has the same hardware and software. Unlike us silly PC users with numerous different hardware setups and operating programs/drivers.

Custom addons should be bought at a price (maybe BIS introduce a community program where we the pc addon makers produce packs/addons for the xbox 360 players) depending if they make enough profit on sales of the game. (some will moan about that but BIS will not make them for free, only reason why we get them free is due to the community)

Great post.

But remember with Elite, BIS was already onto something good for Xbox.

BIS needs to focus on the matter of DLC (downloadable content, even 'BIS Approved' mods would be possible:). And they would need to look into making usermissions TRANSFERABLE (if MS allows for such a feature that is)

[Maddmatt 1]

GPS does not need almost any data, only a few textures. The map needs quite a lot of data, and the larger and more detailed the map is, the more data it needs. In case of custom minimaps you most often pay the price always, as they are mostly implemented in such a way that they are streaming their data even when you are not using them at given moment (you could imagine it like they are drawing even when they are not visible).

Thanks for the reply. So I guess one reason for the loading is to keep FPS up when viewing the map.

[maxqubit 1]

Another reason why a 360 version is 'good'. I don't have to understand this thread or even (in ArmA) a whole Forum ...

... believe me, i have tried to understand it but alas, i'm too old and have not enough time to become a 'rocket scientist', this 360 'Ring of Death' thing already gives me and my clan a headache:) (40% failure rate, would you believe it .. well MS got 1 billion in reserve to help us out here:)

[Grimnirsson 0]

Quote[/b] ]As some guys have said the only bad point with BIS in the past-time has been the publishers who dont advertise the game very well.

Get a demo on Xbox Live and everyone will take a look. I'm glad that both Codemasters and BI will publish an Op Flash game for the 360 - there are so many killer games in the pipeline but to have two Op Flash games in 2008n makes having a 360 the best thing ever

Grim

[maxqubit 1]

Get a demo on Xbox Live and everyone will take a look. I'm glad that both Codemasters and BI will publish an Op Flash game for the 360 - there are so many killer games in the pipeline but to have two Op Flash games in 2008n makes having a 360 the best thing ever :D

Grim

The ease of downing/playing demo's on 360/XBL is so beyond anything on any other platform, it is just fab

1. select demo

2. background downloading

3. play demo

A good demo will do wonders (sometimes it even becomes a hype as in CoD4 mp beta) and as Grim says 'everybody will take a look'. It is a great way to show your game, and i'm sure OFP2 will come as a demo too

[jtec 0]

Great post

But remember with Elite, BIS was already onto something good for Xbox.

BIS needs to focus on the matter of DLC (downloadable content, even 'BIS Approved' mods would be possible:). And they would need to look into making usermissions TRANSFERABLE (if MS allows for such a feature that is)

Thanks

Would also be good to be able to play against xbox users using our pc's, i know of games already out but they are only currently substandard, Xbox 360 vs pc leagues ha i can see the sheer competition to prove whos best now  

And yeah your right about everyone trying the demos, well unless they look utter pants

[maxqubit 1]

And yeah your right about everyone trying the demos, well unless they look utter pants  :D

Just at this very moment a good example. The PES2008 (360) has just been released. I'm at work but friends already downed it and played it and giving the 'first impressions'

Ok, one might say, that is normal ... yep, but you have to realize that they talk just gameplay. No word on 'it doens't run/install' no words on 'how many fps', no words on 'what with this security stuff' or 'which mirror can i get it' .... No, just download, play and have fun (unless it is 'utter pants':)

[jtec 0]

That is a big draw to having the xbox and why games sell more. As long as the pc version doesnt suffer due to the xbox then all is fine, maybe having a arcade version on the xbox and pc could be beneficial to the game drawing people in, all it would need is a different config with higher hit points, shooting while walking and other arcadey stuff that the younger generation like, sure that would intice them into the world of arma.

[maxqubit 1]

... maybe having a arcade version on the xbox and pc could be beneficial to the game drawing people ... into the world of arma.

Imho any game should focus on its strong points. ArmA should focus on SIMULATION (as realistic as possible, without forgetting the 'fun'/game side) ... SIMULATION is per definition non-arcade so i would argue for ArmA (and OFP2) to forget the idea of adding a arcade setting. Ppl on pc don't want that, and i don't want it either:) (and for arcade there is already a lot of competetion, so why bother anyway)

[Stone48420 0]

There is nothing but arcade like shooters for the 360 trust me we don't need anymore of that crap.

[maxqubit 1]

There is nothing but arcade like shooters for the 360 trust me we don't need anymore of that crap.

The last 'crap' i bought was Bioshock. A true mindless arcade shooter.

The 'utter crap' before that was RS:Vegas ... how they dare to invent the fluid 3rd person 'cover' system. Those devs came directly from hell i would argue. Ppl should be banned for live if they play that game.

Fun? Games are not intended for that. Games are work, you have to work very hard. You need a pc, a mouse, a keyboard, a desk, a lot of time AND money. Know your hardware, software, patches, buglists, tweaks. Know all current military tactics, know all zillion keyboard commands, know how to script your own missions (by spending countless hours in the wiki's of all kinds), better still, you have to become a 'modder', the highest rank in gaming you can achieve. You can spend years with just one game. It is hard work i tell you ... but it is worth it. You have this feeling you really achieved something. Fun? What are you talking about.

[ziiip 1]

Hopefully, by the time ArmA2 comes out for the 360, a proper mouse/keyboad attacher device will be released. That way the 360 version would be just as good as the PC version, total eye candy with no stuttering.

[Maddmatt 1]

The 'utter crap' before that was RS:Vegas ... how they dare to invent the fluid 3rd person 'cover' system. Those devs came directly from hell i would argue. Ppl should be banned for live if they play that game.

Oh yea, the amazing realistic cover system that let you see clearly around a corner without actually sticking your head out. Sorry but that's about as arcade as it gets!

Rainbow Six Vegas is nothing like the old Rainbow Six games on PC, now those were proper tactical shooters (except for Lockdown, that was total crap).

As for Bioshock, well I wont argue that one. I still think the shooting in it is arcade like, but at least that game seems to stay true to it's roots (System Shock). Unlike Rainbow Six.

I don't think a game needs to be dumbed down for console. BIS didn't dumb down OFP: Elite, so I trust they wont dumb down ArmA 2. I would be pretty disappointed if they did and the PC version suffered.