pls sign this petetion!

[operation madman 0]

We need 40,000 sinatures for this to be possible and we are more then half way there so pls sign if you feel that we dont need more troops in iraq as this will be bad for both iraq and americans

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/994055313?ltl=1174500956

[Journeyman 0]

Nice touch, but do you really think that Bush and his mery men are going to take a blind bit of notice of the American public on this issue?  

By the way I'm British so I cant sign, but I wish you luck all the same!  

[baddo 0]

I support the idea of stopping the war in Iraq as soon as possible - but it must be done carefully so that all hell won't break loose, as is the danger if your troops are just pulled out of Iraq quickly. In that sense Mr. Bush is right that the troops cannot be pulled out of Iraq right now. The damage is done already, now it must be ensured the end result does not become a total catastrophe.

Quote[/b] ]it is time to admit a tragic mistake

This is what I said in another thread here in this forum: U.S.A. must admit their mistakes so the situation can start healing. Then it will be significantly easier to get help from other nations. If the leaders of U.S.A. ignorantly just keeps telling us they are always doing The Right Thingâ„¢, they will not get much sympathy.

One comment from the website showing how well the people of U.S.A. are informed:

Quote[/b] ]We sholud have nuked them when they hit New York why did we have to send our troops away

Yeah right... WTC towers are down, go nuke Iraq as a solution!

Thankfully there seems to be more people who choose their words better.

I remember some European countries told U.S.A. not to start a war in Iraq and yet they did, along with calling French Fries Freedom Fries *sigh* among other childish behaviour like making fun of French and German people (ad hominem at work when reasonable arguments are all used up).

You are now paying the price for your leaders not listening to people who knew better and saw further.

You know what to do: vote different kind of people to be the leaders of your country. Your country has way too much military and economical power to be lead by people like Bush and his neo-conservative advisors.

[shinRaiden 0]

There is a distinct difference between grass-roots activism and militancy, a distinction that is largely lost or perhaps deliberately abused by organizations that prey on the naivety of youth. There's a quote attributed to Churchill poignantly referencing this to the effect of "If you're not a liberal at twenty, you have no heart, and if you're not a conservative at forty, you have no head".

The foremost problem is that your idealism in internet activism means that far from actually making your voice heard by the establishment you seek to influence, you sign on to a horde of culpable lemmings to be exploited as another reliable demographic to be pandered to in grandstanding, then casually ignored in realpolitik.

Regardless of your Iraq position, this method of pseudo-activism merely stokes a vain hope that clicking a button on a web page or sending a nickel via paypal, then going back to your own bubble makes a difference. It doesn't, and you're just a gullible sucker for thinking so. Furthermore, the effect of that will entrench you in angst or apathy, making you even more exploitable to the bureaucracy.

[Sc@tterbrain 0]

Council for a Livable World? More political mud on a serious issue.

Madman I will sign it if you can answer these three questions.

1. The petition says :

"It is time to admit a tragic mistake and bring American soldiers home. Send a message to your member of Congress and urge them to vigorously oppose any military escalation in Iraq!"

So your contention is that we remove ALL troops from Iraq and let them sort it out themselves?

2. When the slaughter of civillian Iraqi's increases in the security void we leave behind...then what?

3. Do you hold the belief that by leaving the Middle East alone the hatred for the West by many will be reduced?

[Monkwarrior 0]

1) of course

2) all support can be given but not military support

3) of course

Monk.

[walker 0]

Hi all

If we had not been lied to. If they had sacked Rumsfeld early on. If they had put in enough troops. If they had put Patreus in charge earlier. Ah all the ifs.

I think there is one thing above all others would allow Iraq to heal quicker.

That would be a trial of those who falsely lead us to war.

Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, Douglas Feith and Larry Franklin (he has already plead guilty and been imprisoned on espionage charges) and any others: who during investigation are found either to have encouraged or to have deliberatley contributed to; the Office of Special Plans falsification and or selective distribution of intelligence that lead us to a wrongfull decision to go to war.

Providing false information to the government is of course a crime. Especialy when that information is used at time of war; when it is of course espionage.

I have not included George Bush Junior in this because I believe he is a sad little figure, used as a puppet by others more intelligent than he, all though not that bright themselves, after all look at the mess we are in.

I also personaly think George Bush Junior has been blackmailed by others; probably for his supposed bisexuality. It is no coincidense that the Gay community in Washington now call it The Pink House.

Sadly walker

[-ZG-BUZZARD 0]

The withdrawal will happen, sooner or later... What remains to be seen is wether the iraquis will calm down afterwards or not - the issues at hand between them are ethnic and religious, not political as was the case in Vietnam... oh well...

[baddo 0]

That would be a trial of those who falsely lead us to war.

That's what I said before in another thread, too. It would be a justified consequence for the people who are responsible for the false claims, to explain what they did in a court of law. No matter what the outcome of the trial, it would show people in high political positions that they too must have something reasonable to back up their actions. It's even more important than for average citizens as their actions can lead to a World-wide catasthrophe.

[Necromancer- 0]

BUZZARD @ Mar. 22 2007,15:19)]the issues at hand between them are ethnic and religious, not political as was the case in Vietnam... oh well...  

I have to disagree..

In Iraq it's morally acceptable to fuse religion and politics together.

Either way.. It's always political. It's about power.

[-ZG-BUZZARD 0]

BUZZARD @ Mar. 22 2007,15:19)]the issues at hand between them are ethnic and religious, not political as was the case in Vietnam... oh well...

I have to disagree..

In Iraq it's morally acceptable to fuse religion and politics together.

Either way.. It's always political. It's about power.

Politically-motivated conflicts have a chance of ceasing, sooner or later. Religiously-motivated conflicts are much harder to solve, and apparently last forever (most of them). That was the point I was trying to make.

[raedor 8]

This turns out as Iraq Thread 4a. Please go on int Iraq Thread 4