CTF and Armed Assault horrible

[Shashman 0]

 Yet we were both happy, now its only people like you.  So I rather leave.  

As was said earlier,

"Please don't let the door hit you on your way out"

If by "people like you", you mean Walker, then I'll even help you leave

Walker is a model OFP/ArmA player/community member in my opinion. The few games I played with him (over a year ago on Zeus) are what OFP was designed for, and is best suited to.

[Luciano 0]

wow, in terms of how they look, every FPS is pretty much the same.

Way to go Einsten...

[max power 21]

wow, in terms of how they look, every FPS is pretty much the same.

Way to go Einsten...

LOL. Perhaps you misunderstood me. Maybe that is my fault. Perhaps you aren't replying directly to me- this is also a possibility since you're not making any sense... in either case, I was saying that the way everything works (ie. the way the guns shoot, the damage done, the physics (their ODE calls seem to function much in the same way as havoc does, only the ragdolls seem looser and more floaty), and the way everything moves (ie. people run around like hovercrafts with a prerender gun waving in front of their face) very similar to the way they do in CS. Also, the costumes are stupid...

I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say with your personal attack. I'll just take it as you couldn't find anything better to say and therefore you have nothing further to add or to challenge my argument with. Have a nice day.

[Luciano 0]

Edit: Since you played it, you probably know more, so I'll just take your word.

But lets get back on topic, and Shahman, have fun trying to find a populated server a few months from now on. Remember, your the minority, and how many people will play this Game 3-6 months from now on will prove me right.

[hoz 0]

Moving to MP.

Lets keep this on topic, if you have a complaint use the Complaint thread

Luciano if you have nothing constructive to add then move along.

[PlayeR87 0]

going solo to capture a flag is a stupid idea

teamwork is what gets it done

and whats this about combat being slow? its only as slow as you make it

[Shashman 0]

Shahman, have fun trying to find a populated server a few months from now on.  Remember, your the minority, and how many people will play this Game 3-6 months from now on will prove me right.  

I play single player

And "minority"? I beg your pardon?

[aus_twisted 0]

Ever played the original Unreal Tournament in a CTF with good players on both sides? I can tell ya right now it's far harder to bring the flag back then ArmA. Good teams will always have people protecting the flag along with others to try and take the enemy's, if you have 3 or 4 good players in defence you can pretty much make it impossible for the other side to take the flag obviously depending on the map or mission size and how many players etc.

In the ArmA demo I once managed to take the enemy flag 3 times in a row without dieing using the good ole M249 lol, some luck and help from players on my side.

[celery 8]

What exactly is the problem with the CTF combat in ArmA? All I have gathered this far is that "it sucks" and "it's slow". Your memory is tricking you if you think that OFP was a lot faster. In OFP you could have a battle between two guns sticking out of corners for a minute with nothing going on except the corner campers shooting that poor guy who thinks advancing is the key to win the game.

The action in ArmA is a lot more straightforward, mainly because you're not invincible in a certain position and so moving about the map doesn't increase the already high risk of getting shot so much comparatively.

[Mora2 0]

I just wonder if Bis will ever make CTF fun to play again. Alot of clan matches depend on CTF, so are we going to lose alot of clans due to the fact CTF is total rubbish now.

when i played OFP i always played in a clan. Team work depended on getting a flag, but once near the flag you had to be ready to take out... maybe 3 or 4 guys on your own, its only then you could make good your escape.

This game suffers badly when it comes to CTF, it just doesn't allow you the skill and speed needed to get a flag like OFP did. I remember the times i used to go for flags single handedly, and return them. The adrenaline used to pump and it felt good, unlike this.

Armed assault doesn't do this at all, its near on impossible to collect a flag and then tackle more then one player at a time. If your a confronted by more then one player you die most times.

I know people will say "yes but its a sim" and you cannot do that in real life, but wasn't OFP a sim back then according to most people? and lets all be honest, it was alot more fun getting a flag capped back then, without going a full 30 mins of constant play and no flags.

I don't only speak for myself here. I have alot of ofp players on my MSN who are feeling the same as me.

totally agreed man.

Someone opened a very similar post some months ago and someone will open a very similar thread in a few months.

This game has failed in this aspect.

And thats is quite an error cause MP and CTF is nearly a 75% of a games life for most players.

And for that poster that says this system now requieres more brain, well, that is utter crap, it just requieres being most sadomasochist and more ability to support this clunky playable system that favorises coops.

If the soldiers are Stalingrad would have acted like the robot soldiers in ARMA, it would have taken 10 years to end that battle.  

     

So true.

[whisper 0]

I disagree with that last figures. OFP sold million+, and I never saw million + people online, far far from that. The main OFP crowd are the solo campaign players I guess (and there, they'll be disapointed by ArmA)

[celery 8]

Anyone like to answer my question a few posts above, or is it too difficult? I also want to know how the system favors coop style of play.

[whisper 0]

Nono, Celery, it just "sucks", that is all.

From what I gathered :

- new 3D ironsight wobble way too much and it's too difficult to aim. Or too long to bring up scopes, stop breathing, etc... making it too slow. Personnaly, I disagree, as all this stuff is only needed for long range shooting, CQB stays the same. It just reduced long range easiness of OFP, which was, let be honest, way too much easy-mode laser-like precision, imho. ArmA system just reduced the effective range of all, it's just about tactic adaptation.

- animation are clunky. I kinda agree on this one for a few aspects, mainly the unstoppable anims and the delay between anim that can be annoying. Nothing showstopper for me yet (keeping in mind I'm not great in the game so it may be more annoying to better people), and Suma stated they are working on the grenade unstoppable anim, so that is definitely something BI can correct.

That's the 2 gripes I've understood so far.

[froggyluv 2136]

Well i have not come across you on the maps i have played, because most of the CTF i have played have ended in stalmate.

Probably because you have the full game while I'm on the measly demo

I play on the {LOL} Big Top Demo dedicated server which is always full under the name 'Greg'. Just finished 3 games ending in 3-0; 2-1; 4-0. I play about 10-12 games a day and they end in 0-0 about 20% of the time.

[walker 0]

Hi all

What I find interesting here is people who have admitted they do not play the game making pronouncements on it

I do play the game. So my comments are at least based in observation of the game.

Over this weekend I played 6 hours solid of CTFs a mix of Closed Box Urban Hexen Castle and Big Battle CTF.

Lots of flag captures and touches and normal levels of completed flag runs with scores of 1<> 0 to 2<>0 so none of those comments I have seen by people who have admitted they do not play ArmA are born out in reality.

Dont believe me?

See me on the Shark server or the others and find out for your self.

Kind Regards Walker

[celery 8]

- new 3D ironsight wobble way too much and it's too difficult to aim. Or too long to bring up scopes, stop breathing, etc...

People didn't take time to aim through scopes in OFP, why should ArmA be different? A purebred CTF player uses only the crosshair in maps where distance is not an issue. The sights in OFP were a bit too static to be realistic and the insta-scopes should be obsolete in every game by now.

What I'm trying to understand is, why should CTF have special needs, afterall it's only a game mode (kill people and take flags) inside Armed Assault, and Armed Assault is what it is.

[=jps=sgtrock 4]

Lots of flag captures and touches and normal levels of completed flag runs with scores of 1<> 0 to 2<>0 so none of those comments I have seen by people who have admitted they do not play ArmA are born out in reality.

Dont believe me?

I wouldn't be bragging about CTF scores like that. If those are typical, then vanilla CTF is broken. Scores should be more like 6-4 or 7-3.

There is a nice way of opening up the game, though. The Team Fortress design team figured out an elegant answer years ago. You simply set a timer on the flag once it's dropped instead of returning it as soon as the friendly team touches it. As long as the opposing team doesn't touch it, it eventually returns on its own. Makes for great battles all over a map instead of constantly battling in the same couple of places. It enhances CTF by making it more open ended. Defensive minded types need to adapt to constantly changing circumstances. All in all, it's a great way to play CTF.

[froggyluv 2136]

What I find interesting here is people who have admitted they do not play the game making pronouncements on it

I do play the game. So my comments are at least based in observation of the game.

I can only assume your referring to my post as I stated that I play the demo. It's the same engine and maybe not 1.04 but it's over the 1.02 czech/German engine so whats your point?

Obviously you had the Demo and made 'observations' on it as well before you got the full game. Were those observations not based in 'reality'?

[celery 8]

I wouldn't be bragging about CTF scores like that. If those are typical, then vanilla CTF is broken. Scores should be more like 6-4 or 7-3.

Maybe in Unreal Tournament or Soldier of Fortune 2, scores like that are almost impossible in a game like OFP or ArmA. If one side is bound to win, they either do it 2-1 or 5-0 because you can't just grab a flag and run away with it as a fragile soldier and teams are rarely so equal that they kick each others' asses in turns.

[=jps=sgtrock 4]

If scores are so low, then the game isn't worth playing because it becomes virtually impossible for a team to come back once they're down by two caps.

Look, I'm not advocating hard core Rambo play. However, if we're going to use a game goal like CTF then we should recognize that we've already stepped away from the idea of the game as a military sim to some degree.

Why not reward a team by giving them an opportunity to advance a flag slowly across a map by constantly touching a flag to prevent its return? If you've ever played the original Team Fortress or any other mod that used the same mechanism, you'd know how much more fun it can be. Trust me, it really adds a lot to a CTF mod.

P.S. I'm also not advocating a really long timer on a flag before its return. IIRC it was something like 60 or 90 seconds for TF. Believe me, it seems a lot longer when you're a flag defender!

[Luciano 0]

Quote[/b] ]Maybe in Unreal Tournament or Soldier of Fortune 2, scores like that are almost impossible in a game like OFP or ArmA. If one side is bound to win, they either do it 2-1 or 5-0 because you can't just grab a flag and run away with it as a fragile soldier and teams are rarely so equal that they kick each others' asses in turns.

I had scores like that and I know many people who did. A lot of clanplayers had scores like that back in the day. It seems you were just a lonewolf player who never played in tournaments with good clans.

I'm out of this thread. When you can find only few populated servers in ARMA, think of what I said.

[celery 8]

If scores are so low, then the game isn't worth playing because it becomes virtually impossible for a team to come back once they're down by two caps.

Look, I'm not advocating hard core Rambo play. However, if we're going to use a game goal like CTF then we should recognize that we've already stepped away from the idea of the game as a military sim to some degree.

Why not reward a team by giving them an opportunity to advance a flag slowly across a map by constantly touching a flag to prevent its return? If you've ever played the original Team Fortress or any other mod that used the same mechanism, you'd know how much more fun it can be. Trust me, it really adds a lot to a CTF mod.

Removing the return flag action is very hard if not impossible, of course I'd be intrigued to try a different approach. But CTF is still CTF, and the best team gets the most flags to win. There shouldn't be downright handicaps to allow a victory based on more luck than already is involved.

There is CTF in this "military sim" because it's a game mode like all others, and no other game compares to the gameplay of OFP and ArmA. So people want to play an unrealistic game mode in a realistic setting, in contrast to BF2 being based on C&H (for argument's sake let's call it realistic). They do CTF in military trainings to perfect a team's cohesion and tactics.

[celery 8]

I had scores like that and I know many people who did. A lot of clanplayers had scores like that back in the day.

So you're referring to the ancient days when nobody even knew about corner camping. Sad to break the bubble, but OFP has been a different game since 2003.

It seems you were just a lonewolf player who never played in tournaments with good clans.

Funny of you to mention, I have been with the MercenaryS (Biki article) since 2004 and Balance of Power before that.

[aus_twisted 0]

Lots of flag captures and touches and normal levels of completed flag runs with scores of 1<> 0 to 2<>0 so none of those comments I have seen by people who have admitted they do not play ArmA are born out in reality.

Dont believe me?

I wouldn't be bragging about CTF scores like that.  If those are typical, then vanilla CTF is broken.  Scores should be more like 6-4 or 7-3.

There is a nice way of opening up the game, though.  The Team Fortress design team figured out an elegant answer years ago.  You simply set a timer on the flag once it's dropped instead of returning it as soon as the friendly team touches it.  As long as the opposing team doesn't touch it, it eventually returns on its own.  Makes for great battles all over a map instead of constantly battling in the same couple of places.  It enhances CTF by making it more open ended.  Defensive minded types need to adapt to constantly changing circumstances.  All in all, it's a great way to play CTF.

I guess games like Football/Soccer are broken then with such low scores, I wonder why the game even exists

Some CTF games can be like this depending on the teams and map/mission with very low scores which is what makes it so special like Football/Soccer when your team wins because it's very challenging.

If you want higher scoring CTF games then thats really easy to do, move spawn points further away from the flags or change the respawn timer to higher values. The weapons and vehicles available also decides on how hard it is to score.

[--DST-- HIGHLANDER 0]

im with dudster on this, there aint anymore CTfS anymore  with this slow anims is more like a 30 min TDM, thats being honest as i play both ARMA and ofp still, BIS  why did you have to fuck up player anims, and not leave them the way they were, i think the majority of people, and when i say people i dont mean coop ai killers, that the anims are to slow   p.s i still like the game but i think faster anims will take this game for CTF players to a new level