sickboy 13 Posted December 29, 2006 ... As I have been saying for a while now, people should stop GUESSING and start KNOWING... Just use Rivatuner and enable the plugins to check your memory usage of the videocard and i'm sure you will confirm the following: Your problem clearly describes that ur vram is overloading, as textures are loaded along the way, and thats why your fps is good at the start, then textures get loaded more, and your fps is really really bad... then you alt tab = clear texture cache, get back in game and it's all good again until the needed textures are loaded again. Texture quality = normal or high and no or low anti-aliasing should keep it under ur max though! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lee_h._oswald 0 Posted December 29, 2006 As I have been saying for a while now, people should stop GUESSING and start KNOWING...... Texture quality = normal or high and no or low anti-aliasing should keep it under ur max though! And here is another thing for you to KNOW. It does NOT help. The only difference is, that the frames jump up and down and up and down... LOD's switching right in front of you making the game: playable/unplayable/playable/unplayable/playable/unplayable/ Friend of mine with a "slower" pc can play on very high settings without alt+tab every 3minutes and he has also no huge frame drop looking at trees/bushes. I am pretty sure, the trees and bushes are the problem. Looking at those in e.g. a backyard of a house in a medium city let the framerate go down(on my pc). --- MfG Lee Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sickboy 13 Posted December 29, 2006 ... Well, you say that ur fraames drop, ALWAYS, after a few minutes of being in the game, you didn't say that it was only near bushes, as that would change the statement to: When near bushes I can only play well for about 3 minutes... Anyway, how about knowing instead of guessing, check ur graphic card mem and make sure it's fine... It's nice that others can play it on high/very high, still resolution, shader model used etc. can have various effects on used memory... I think you got the 8800 if i'm right... Nvidia has driver problems with it and this is hopefully resolved soon, for me the original delivered driverws, and not the last 2, works best. I NEVER change any settings in the nvidia control panel about graphics quality/performance preferences etc... Suma already mentioned that these profiles etc. can have major impact... Suggesting you could best remove the currently installed driver completely and installing a clean new/old driver without touching the profiles, if you did touch em before Again, there is no use in testing things only on feeling and guessing... numbers talk for themselves.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lee_h._oswald 0 Posted December 29, 2006 Ok, I stop talking here... Fact is, many people here and in 1000 other forums have nice ideas(vsync on/off, triple buffer on/off, different driver, different settings, overclock your cpu/gpu, underclock your cpu/gpu, defrag, etc. pp.) All those tips may help with badly installed/configured pc's, but it does not help me.. --- MfG Lee Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heatseeker 0 Posted December 29, 2006 Ok, I stop talking here...Fact is, many people here and in 1000 other forums have nice ideas(vsync on/off, triple buffer on/off, different driver, different settings, overclock your cpu/gpu, underclock your cpu/gpu, defrag, etc. pp.) All those tips may help with badly installed/configured pc's, but it does not help me.. --- MfG Lee Lee.. i take it you have a very high end machine? Could you share your specs? Im not taking sides in this discussion, Arma is demanding and whats worse.. not very scalable (forget about those minimum specs), maybe the xbox optimisations ignore current PC's or maybe the designers were too optimistic about the engine capabilities.. People with high end systems shouldnt have to "tweak", thats what we do on dated PC's to get those miserable 2/3 fps that make it a little more playable.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sickboy 13 Posted December 29, 2006 Lee.. i take it you have a very high end machine? Could you share your specs? Im not taking sides in this discussion, Arma is demanding and whats worse.. not very scalable (forget about those minimum specs), maybe the xbox optimisations ignore current PC's or maybe the designers were too optimistic about the engine capabilities.. People with high end systems shouldnt have to "tweak", thats what we do on dated PC's to get those miserable 2/3 fps that make it a little more playable.. Well, I don't think we can say that high end computers should just run everything fine and dandy, especially not when there is a videocard in the system that is also known for giving many troubles at the moment as it's a completely different shader technology. Another Example is... if 1600x1200+several settings etc... create a vram usage of 1024mb or even higher, then it's nice that we have a high end 768mb that's supposed to run everything... still it aint gonna work, high end or not, you miss the nececairy memory, simple as that... Besides, I haven't said anywhere that I find it normal that it's running as it runs. Â There will certainly be bugs that are causing some or most of the performance stuff.. Still, having facts instead of guesses and a load of "well my system is high end so it should work" isn't getting anyone anywhere As such, I keep on recommending ppl to use tools to monitor the things they can monitor, in this case graphics memory... as I have done and found out that it was even too much for my 8800GTX 768mb at certain settings... Ppl are only giving tips to try to help, not to piss off ppl or put them on the wrong road... Seeing that there is a decent amount of players that can play properly, I still feel that there must be things to do or good explainations for the performance issues for most ppl... Apart from the obvious bug; some folliage is creating (very) low fps when nearing it. There are enough examples of showing that the engine is pretty scalable... sure there are problems everywhere, but that's what they are... problems, as it seems that there are also many (who are not really posting in a troubleshooting thread ), that do not have problems with the performance, or have decent performance on low end machines on low settings etc. etc. I'm playing daily with a bunch, and believe me when I say they ain't computer technicians and especially not high end computers in most cases .. and the bigger part reports 'running fine', aswell as some report the 'but it's less near the bushes etc' problem, but that's it... Altough i'm sure there can be optimizations from ends like BIS but also NVIDIA/ATI, I won't deny that Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heatseeker 0 Posted December 29, 2006 ... If an xbox with a 700mhz CPU, 64 megs of system ram and a GF3 chip can run OPF:Elite smoothly you should have no problems running Arma in full settings on high end current PC hardware, if you do something is wrong somewhere and no "tweak" will solve it. I understand your card is a DX10 capable card, SM4.0 ready but we have all seen it chew DX9 games at incredible resolutions with incredible frame rates. Maybe Arma isnt taking advantage of it properly and lacks optimisation? I take it that by Vram you mean video ram? You say Arma at full settings and 1600x1200 uses more than 1024mb of video ram? . Why? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevlar2007 1 Posted December 29, 2006 Forget it Lee you can't achive anything here, I allready tried but BIS loverboys and ignorants are only repeating rubbish like a big, juicy mantra. I know you tried everything, more then myself, to get this game running because you were posting also in german official forum like me too, but there is no use of it. Engine is screwed up for many people and there is no clear solution for the problems only a new patch hopefully. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sickboy 13 Posted December 29, 2006 Quote[/b] ]Forget it Lee you can't achive anything here, I allready tried but BIS loverboys and ignorants are only repeating rubbish like a big, juicy mantra.I know you tried everything, more then myself, to get this game running because you were posting also in german official forum like me too, but there is no use of it. Engine is screwed up for many people and there is no clear solution for the problems only a new patch hopefully. Says an ati 9800 pro user... besides, nice attitude against people that only tried to help you with tips etc. etc. Try a punchbag man Besides I don't know what "Ignorant" or "BIS Lovers" have to do with rather trying to look things from the bright side, be real, but also get over things, look a little the other way for the small things but enjoy the big things, be real but also suspect BIS optimizing and patching anyway, without them being needed to be called *ssholes and what more all the time? Anyway, I love BIS Games for sure, doesn't mean that it makes me unrealistic I take it that by Vram you mean video ram? You say Arma at full settings and 1600x1200 uses more than 1024mb of video ram? . Why?No I said it as an example, to show that no matter how high end a system is, it doesn't mean it fulfills the requirements of the higher/highest settings of a game...1600x1200 everything on very high eats up all my vram and becomes laggy/problematic when the textures are loaded that are needed for the place/surroundings where you are. Why if Elite worked fine on xbox, should arma run fine on our pc's? As Elite is a DX8 engine-derrivate, geforce 3 = dx8.... As ArmA is a followup on Elite and OFP, and not a copy, aswell as the texture sizes and poly counts probably being a lot higher, you can't really compare them... I also don't know what the viewdistance was on Elite @xbox, plus that the engine etc was completely optimized for this 1 type of hardware, which in the end is easier than to optimize for hundreds of different hardware configurations, driver possibilities etc. etc. Of coarse I agree that there is probably a lot that can be optimized still by BIS, aswell as videocard manufacturers... Still I believe that seeying the results of some others, there must be explainations for certain performance issues aswell, they only need to be recognised/found BTW, even for the DX9 side of the 8800... Nvidia has broken unified driver architecture and had to write a seperate driver for the 8800, it's not just the dx10 capabilities in general, but the card is build up pretty different in general! Many games have issues and troubles with it, and especially the drivers are nowhere near the quality of other cards. Still I recognise of coarse that it's not just the 8800 users reporting problems... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevlar2007 1 Posted December 29, 2006 Don't need punchbag, thank you for your great help that was pretty much useles. You are talking around without use m8, as I know Lee has tried many configurations wit different Cards and clean PCs and nothing worked and is reasonably frustrated I only simpatise with him. I have an 9800XT m8 and it does nothing to do with my post. Thank you for your help Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sickboy 13 Posted December 29, 2006 Thank you for your help  As you adressed the "BisloverS" and "ignorantS" I wasn't really talking about myself alone as someone who might've or not've helped you... as u were talking about groups of ppl.... Anyway, here I am again, wasting time, have fun Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevlar2007 1 Posted December 29, 2006 @sickboy: sure I am having fun, wasting my time you know.. as usual! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Goldenwings2002 0 Posted December 29, 2006 Sickboy, and Lee... I feel your pain. For the people that haven't read yet or may have missed it, this is pretty much a top of the line computer: Intel Core 2 Duo e6700 - Latest Drivers XFX 8800 GTX - Latest Drivers eVGA 680i Motherboard - Latest BIOS 2GB DDR2 Corsair Memory Thermaltake Toughpower 850W PSU 2x 320GB Seagate Barracuda - RAID 0 It will NOT run shading detail above "Low," Texture Detail above "Normal," & AntiAliasing above "Low." If these settings are changed by 1 degree the game will have slideshow FPS near the trees and forests. In order to compensate for this, I run my game at the following settings: (The game is now playable just about anywhere.) Resolution: 1600x1200x32 Aspect Ratio: 16:10 View Distance: 3130m Quality Preference: Very High Advanced Settings - Terrain Detail: Normal Objects Detail: High Texture Detail: Normal Shading Detail: Low Anisotropic Filtering: High Shadow Detail: High Antialiasing: Low Blood: High Post Processing: Low Oh wait, this is something pre-8800GTX users should be using. We are talking about the latest and greatest. Not so great is it for this game. I can run most of my other games with maximum resolution supported by monitor with every setting maxed out. So don't try and tell me there is something wrong as there is obviously nothing wrong with my system, but something wrong with the implementation of coding/modeling in the game. While I am upset that I have to run this game at such low settings compared to the type of system I have, I guess I will not complain. I only hope BIS puts this issue to Priority #1 instead of the #3 they have marked for it, currently. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lee_h._oswald 0 Posted December 29, 2006 ...there is something wrong as there is obviously nothing wrong with my system, but something wrong with the implementation of coding/modeling in the game. And that is FACT for me too! --- We can set everything to maximum, but then we get the frame drop. Alt+Tab and everything is fine for a moment. This is not because we are running out of video memory or using bad drivers or driving the wrong car or having the wrong color of hair, it's the GAME! Oh wait, Arma maybe can't handle the new shader technologie the 8800 are using? Wake up! In a few days is 2007 and in a few weeks/month the next generation of graphic cards is knocking at the door! I build this damned new PC because my "old" one couldn't handle ArmA for whatever reason. And now my new one can't handle because it's using "~magic thingies~" that ArmA's engine don't like? This is getting ridiculous! MfG Lee Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevlar2007 1 Posted December 29, 2006 ...there is something wrong as there is obviously nothing wrong with my system, but something wrong with the implementation of coding/modeling in the game. And that is FACT for me too! --- We can set everything to maximum, but then we get the frame drop. Alt+Tab and everything is fine for a moment. This is not because we are running out of video memory or using bad drivers or driving the wrong car or having the wrong color of hair, it's the GAME! Oh wait, Arma maybe can't handle the new shader technologie the 8800 are using? Wake up! In a few days is 2007 and in a few weeks/month the next generation of graphic cards is knocking at the door! I build this damned new PC because my "old" one couldn't handle ArmA for whatever reason. And now my new one can't handle because it's using "~magic thingies~" that ArmA's engine don't like? This is getting ridiculous! MfG Lee Word, Woooord! It is my opinion too, I was trying to express(in not so good manner)! Well said Lee! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sickboy 13 Posted December 29, 2006 ... Ur simply turning around my words and skipping the details... Like I said, nvm... And have fun Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quiet_man 8 Posted December 29, 2006 This is getting ridiculous!MfG Lee I have a 7800GT with 256MB RAM after reducing resolution to 1024*768 and reducing texture detail to low the game is running fine. It still looks MUCH better than OFP and I can run with MUCH higher view distance then OFP! I wonder what machine you had when OFP came out? If the ARMA engine stays only half as long, we will play it on much stronger machines in some years, so why not keep some options for later? Don't compare it with games with limited map size and scripted missions. I know no other game with so high details and dynamic environment at a view distance of 3000m. Infantry & Tank battles are much more realistic and for me ARMA made a good step forward to a real simulation compared with OFP. I recommend you stop focusing on those fancy sliders, instead select a setting which works and enjoy. QuietMan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lee_h._oswald 0 Posted December 29, 2006 You have no clue. - I did not compare ArmA with any other game. - I did run ArmA at ~100000 different settings. - I am using a widescreen lcd(1680x1050). I will NOT run a 4:3 resolution on an 16:10 display. - I am not interested at smooth gameplay with 10000m viewdistance at the moment. - I am interested in smooth gameplay at 1200m viewdistance. - I have no clue what pc I got ~5,5years ago, but I remember that the cwc demo and cwc itself run ok, without 80% framedrop looking at trees... - I will play ArmA for the next ~5years and buy whatever product BIS will produce, to support their company politics. - *Insert fancy sliders here: [ ]* --- MfG Lee Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WhiskeyBullets 0 Posted December 29, 2006 Lee_H._Oswald what type of hard drive are you using? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lee_h._oswald 0 Posted December 29, 2006 I am using a "fast enough for ArmAâ„¢" Raid 0, made out of two 80GB Samsung S-ATAII 7200rpm hard disk drives. MfG Lee Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chris Death 0 Posted December 29, 2006 hmm - something i took notice off: is it my RAM is a thread here started not long ago, where a guy is writing about having to alt+tab after some time, because it's getting very laggy. Before he can run everything on high/very high but after 30 mins he must alt+tab. Now the point is: his graphics card is a GF8800. I didn't find other ppl having to alt+tab so that we could compare which GPU they'd be using - maybe you know some from threads where you been talking about the problem. Mabe 8800 got an issue with clearing V-RAM, when using some certain technique (or BIS' way). I didn't experience any fps drop after any time yet with my GF 7950 GT KO. ~S~ CD Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lee_h._oswald 0 Posted December 29, 2006 Mabe 8800 got an issue with clearing V-RAM, when usingsome certain technique (or BIS' way). I'm pretty sure you are right and it's the GF8800 + ArmA. Question is: Who solves our problem? BIS, NVIDIA, Kegetys? MfG Lee Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heatseeker 0 Posted December 29, 2006 Well thats just perfect, the 8800 is on my list so i just hope this is a nvidia driver problem to be fixed asap . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bangtail 0 Posted December 29, 2006 Well thats just perfect, the 8800 is on my list so i just hope this is a nvidia driver problem to be fixed asap . I have an 8800 GTX and have 0 performance problems. Couple of lighting problems and some other very small glitches, but runs very well. E Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lee_h._oswald 0 Posted December 29, 2006 My 8800 is a GTS. What driver are you using? MfG Lee Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
