'Smart Scope'

[Gordy 0]

Might interest you.

Quote[/b] ]Smart scope

An electronic rifle scope that automatically compensates for unsteady aim and recoil is being developed by US defence contractor Raytheon. Using the sight, snipers and police marksmen would no longer need to manually adjust their sight to account for the slight sideways movement that occurs when they pull the trigger.

The digital sight uses a high-resolution digital camera to...

zoom in on a test target and superimposes a cross-hair in the centre of the image. When the marksman aims and fires, an accelerometer detects the small shock pulse created as the pin strikes the cartridge cap and starts the camera snapping. It captures a rapid series of digital images, which record the motion caused by the gun's recoil.

An image processor then compares the aim in the original picture with an image of the where the target was hit and electronically moves the cross-hair to compensate for any discrepancy. From then on, anything seen in the scope should, in theory, be a guaranteed bull's eye.

Click here to read the original article on Raytheon's electronic rifle scop (a.k.a. "smart scope", from New Scientist Magazine.

[DBR_ONIX 0]

Soon we will just need to point the gun in the general direction, and the gun will kill all the enemys. Yey! More and more ingenious ways to kill each other!..............

Sarcasim aside, does sound impressive

- Ben

[shadow 6]

Quote[/b] ]Using the sight, snipers and police marksmen would no longer need to manually adjust their sight to account for the slight sideways movement that occurs when they pull the trigger.

Uh what if they pull the trigger the way it was meant to be pulled... like not jerking it?  

Would'nt be any "slight sideways movement" then. What does that magical scope do then? Help you miss the target?  

Quote[/b] ]An image processor then compares the aim in the original picture with an image of the where the target was hit and electronically moves the cross-hair to compensate for any discrepancy. From then on, anything seen in the scope should, in theory, be a guaranteed bull's eye.

Correcting the aim after the shot has gone off... is'nt that kinda late?

This sounds like a fairytale at best.

[Daddl 10]

I always thought sniper rifles had triggers like a good hunting rifle, where you can prime the trigger (usually by pushing it forward) to be much more sensitive than normal. So that when you aquire your target you push the trigger forward, then wait a moment, take the final aim and trigger the gun without the weapon jerking from the (only very soft and slight) movement of your finger.

If all the super scope does is compensate for shooters unable to use the mechanism properly - or for guns not really intended as sniper rifles - then what's the point?

[ralphwiggum 6]

If all the super scope does is compensate for shooters unable to use the mechanism properly - or for guns not really intended as sniper rifles - then what's the point?

My idea too. If a soldier can't operate his weapon using fixed sights that is questionable. I've seen some idiots in the shooting range with those tacticool sights, only to be out shot by a guy with $450 pistol with fixed sights.

Of course, the idea is that with this technology, the snipers will eliminate more variables, thus landing the bullet where the shooter want it to land. That is the good news. But I really don't want see basic markmanship compromised because of this.

[EiZei 0]

Not to mention spending less time fiddling with the scope configuration and more time firing them bullets.

[shadow 6]

Well the biggest variable still remains. You know your wind direction, but in long-range sniping, how is the wind at your target?

Will they make a anti-wind-device to blow out the wind too?

Quote[/b] ]Not to mention spending less time fiddling with the scope configuration and more time firing them bullets.

A good sniper only needs one bullet pr target.

Quote[/b] ]I always thought sniper rifles had triggers like a good hunting rifle, where you can prime the trigger (usually by pushing it forward) to be much more sensitive than normal.

Never heard of that before. But I do know all sniper-rifles have a factory-tuned trigger to begin with, but all snipers have them tweaked and tuned further, just like a competition-weapon.

[Panda-PL- 0]

Shouldn't it be called Dumb Scope instead?

And if it compensates for wind then what will happen if I turn before shooting the second time? Would't it double the error?

If it would compensate for distance using automatic range finder and then apply a "sliding" reticule for firing at moving targets like in jetfighter or calculate the time bullet will travel that would sure be nice for newbies, yet a well skilled marksman will do it even better without such distracting electronical stuff.

[DBR_ONIX 0]

Quote[/b] ]I always thought sniper rifles had triggers like a good hunting rifle, where you can prime the trigger (usually by pushing it forward) to be much more sensitive than normal.

Never heard of that before. But I do know all sniper-rifles have a factory-tuned trigger to begin with, but all snipers have them tweaked and tuned further, just like a competition-weapon.

I think he means that when you pull the trigger in a bit, it doesnt' immeditly fire the weapon, so it has various stages of stiffness..

May be wrong though

"Dumb scope" doesn't have the "shiney new technology"-fell to it. They'll probobaly end up calling it the VK423x˛432.2 Supershiney Intelliscope...

- Ben

[Panda-PL- 0]

Quote[/b] ]I think he means that when you pull the trigger in a bit[.....]

From description that would be something called in polish "trigger accelerator". It is simply speaking a device that uses a counter-spring a bit stronger then the trigger's spring, yet mounteted under slightly different angle then the exactly opposite one. The trick is that as You pull the trigger the resistance lightens to the point where there is none and the trigger then is pulled by the device's spring all the way back leaving Your trigger finger hanging in air. At least that's the simpliest system of this type. Maybe they've invented something different now?

The most basic pro is that the possible unsteady trigger pull error is eliminated. Also You can have trigger that is very hard at the beggining but softens durring the pull. The against is that the device, once actiuvated might cause accidents of obvious reason - it is great durring shooting range seasions, yet when adrenaline rushes in any trigger is really easy to pull.

Also I havent read of any military or police sniper riffle that uses the device. It is simply too risky to make a rifle capable of shooting on its own . Also such instruments might be fragile, so if You drop a riffle or don't menage to keep it clean it its trigger might then not work properly.

A more interesting matter would be using electrically-fused cartridges, which would allow trigger pull and its streanght to be regulated anyway you'd like, or even shifting the task of pulling the trigger to the observer.

About the scope: It is clear that it has moving leans - so if I dropped it it would propably decalibrate just as a handheld camera could.

However a digital camera mounted on a traditional scope would be a good idea. It could be used to for example tahe shots of enemy's face before devastating it. I've read that in Vietnam snipers were ordered to aim at enemy's head from side only, so they could approach later on and make a photo of their pray's face for ID.

Such devices are cheap and already available for hunters.

[shadow 6]

I have a feeling the team using this "super" scope will loose if they face a team using a regular AK74 or G3A3 with the good ol' ironsights  

Too much fragile electronics and fine-mechanics I think.

[Daddl 10]

@ Aug. 19 2005,18:12)]

Quote[/b] ]I think he means that when you pull the trigger in a bit[.....]

From description that would be something called in polish "trigger accelerator".

That might be it. Not sure how it works - never finished my hunting license (to lazy to get out in the cold winter mornings anyways).

Well, this kind of trigger is used on many hunting rifles at least here in Germany. Basically it makes the trigger extremely sensitive and you don't need to pull it through all the way - simply touching it with your fingertip will trigger the gun. Of course you have to specifically prime the trigger first and you can unprime the gun again, too. if the trigger isn't primed it will fire just like any other rifles trigger.

Of course - once the trigger is primed mister gun isn't your friend (or anyone's) anymore, that's why you only prime it after actually aquiring and verifying the target - directly before you fire your shot.

That kind of "hair trigger" is perfect for precise shots on mid/long range using scoped weapons. Which is just what a sniper does, so I was expecting those rifles to have the same mechanism.

[Panda-PL- 0]

Yup. One small 50Kton blast somewhere up in atmosphere and the "shiny scope" can only offer you a black screen.

And anyway everyone know that batteries won't least for more then few days, so maybe it is not so bad idea? You make a gun without any mechanical sights and add the shiny scope on top. Then if enemy beats you and take your gun he won't be able to use it.

So not to take me wrong: US army has the best equipment from all the armies around the world, I just wonder why wasteing cash on useless reaserch while soldiers beg for a new .45 handgun and uparmoured HUMMVEs.

With all that stabilisation mission's gonna cost US army will have no resources to use this new technology anyway, not to mention expensive reaserch project.

And anyway the sniper scope is a bad idea. They'd better invent a system like beretta did to allow grenade launcher to be fired at fast driving vehicles using simple electronic reticule in a normal, optical scope and an automatic range finder - might save someones life in Iraq or Afghanistan. Or just go to beretta and buy it at instance.

BTW Iron sights on AK's are really good. They are harder to operate then ghost rings, yet they give a sharp view of rear sight allowing more precission in skilled hands.

Plus You can actually set their range durring combat (not in OFP :[).

@Daddl

The system is also often used for brench firing competitions at mid/long ranges. Theese are competitions in which You use a support for a gun, sit on a chair or lay down and have a really powerfull scope. But that's totally different from field.

[Tigershark_BAS 0]

Soon we will just need to point the gun in the general direction, and the gun will kill all the enemys. Yey! More and more ingenious ways to kill each other!..............  

Sarcasim aside, does sound impressive

- Ben

Remeber that movie with Tom Selleck in it about robots being programmed to kill. Was it called Runaway?

It had Gene Simmons (of KISS fame) in it as well.

They had those cool heat seeking, hand gun fired missiles trained to the heat signature of the individual.

I'm sure the days of point and shoot/guaranteed kill aren't too far away.

[DBR_ONIX 0]

Dont think I've seen it

But what I'm.. confused? about is.. Where will it stop?

When someone (The US?) can kill absolutoly anyone they want by pointing a shiney-gun out the window and pulling a trigger. What next? Shoot every other human so there's no chance of being shot your self?

Then does the world end up with one supreme president? In which anyone who resists it would be shot with this shiney-gun that requires no thought to operate, just say their name and press the button?

Sounds fun..

(Yeh I'm over-exadurating, and probobaly going of topic, a bit anyway.. But it's the idea that's important, infact, ignore everything but the idea )

- Ben

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]What next?

Micro helo-drones with lethal capabilities and the ability to move as a swarm. They operate on their own and can enter almost any facility. They are hard to spot, hard to fight and capable to clean huge regions.

Science fiction ?

Nanotechnology is already there. It´s just a matter of time.

The german Carolo and the israelian Mosquito are already built and the Mosquito is in field use.

The US are thinking about the third eye technology for their ground troops. A micro-drone that will be used by ground troops on platoon or squad level for their personal recon.

Honeywell mini-drone:

Now transport this to nanotechnology and you get the perfect recon and weapon system. Thousands of micro-drones with a swarm instinct and a preprogrammed target scheme and search routine will be there soon.

Literature:

Office of the Secretary of Defense, August 2005 (9 MB PDF file)

Defense Science Board, February 2004 (850 KB PDF file)

[Espectro (DayZ) 0]

Quote[/b] ]What next?

Micro helo-drones with lethal capabilities and the ability to move as a swarm. They operate on their own and can enter almost any facility. They are hard to spot, hard to fight and capable to clean huge regions.

Science fiction ?

Nanotechnology is already there. It´s just a matter of time.

The german Carolo and the israelian Mosquito are already built and the Mosquito is in field use.

The US are thinking about the third eye technology for their ground troops. A micro-drone that will be used by ground troops on platoon or squad level for their personal recon.

Honeywell mini-drone:

Now transport this to nanotechnology and you get the perfect recon and weapon system. Thousands of micro-drones with a swarm instinct and a preprogrammed target scheme and search routine will be there soon.

Literature:

Office of the Secretary of Defense, August 2005 (9 MB PDF file)

Defense Science Board, February 2004 (850 KB PDF file)

Lol, been reading Michael Crichton as well, ey?

Anyway, this sounds stupid... why not just build some remote controlled robots with weapons? Well, just remotecontrolled tanks would do it... Or better yet, why not just give some money to the poor instead of shooting them?

[ran 0]

Anyway, this sounds stupid... why not just build some remote controlled robots with weapons? Well, just remotecontrolled tanks would do it... Or better yet, why not just give some money to the poor instead of shooting them?

because it makes some nice TV footage

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]Lol, been reading Michael Crichton as well, ey?

No.

Quote[/b] ]Anyway, this sounds stupid... why not just build some remote controlled robots with weapons?

Remote controlled means people needed who control them with either radio or other methods. This is very manpower-consuming.

The ultimate solution is a weapon or surveilance system that operates on its own and needs noone to control it and as there is no remote operator the traffic between controller and machine can´t be disrupted by electronic countermeasures.

I guess remote controlled tanks would be looted in no time in central Whatsoeverfunnywarcountry.

[shadow 6]

I know what you're talking about, Bals.

I'm a fan of the Dark Angel (read Jessica Alba )  series too with them hover-drones surveilancing the city.

Problem with all this technology: where does it stop? whats to become of privacy?

I have nothing to hide but that does'nt mean I accept being watched by big brother.

[DBR_ONIX 0]

Problem with all this technology: where does it stop? whats to become of privacy?

My point exactly.. People are finding more and more ingenious ways to kill each other, as are the enemys.. So the obvious lead on from all of this is one f***ed world, no?

I really dont see what people (in general) are trying to acchive by shooting each other (Simply put). It's a pointlessly decending circle, eventualy leading to something outta some film. Why? I can't see everyone will think "Hey, I think you win, lets stop fighting", it's just doesn't seem in most peoples nature to step back and look at what their doing (By that I mean a lot of people)

Yeh I'm being really general, and overexaduating a little, still.. But I hope you get the idea..

- Ben

[Daniel 0]

Good old Flashpoint "You Are Dead" quotes come to mind...

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]Problem with all this technology: where does it stop? whats to become of privacy?

I guess the last 10 years have shown that public security is measured much higher than individual privacy. I don´t like that also. But just check out the video surveilance of bigger cities like London for example. There are hardly any corners without cameras and the attached face recognition software gives criminals a hard time to cover.

I think it´s domestic overkill and just the reason doesn´t justify all means, but just look what happened after major terrorist attacks. People were throwing their rights away in tons for little to none sucess.

The warfare technology is a different matter though. People certainly have no problem with drones hovering over Aghanistan or Iraq and I bet they will applaude the micro-drones as they will be replaceable and effective weapons. They just don´t think about that technology beeing used in their own countries.

Wars will sooner or later become very clinical. They get especially sterile if one war party doesn´t rely on human manpower on the ground for political and survey reasons. That´s where we are going. Cynical ? I guess it´s just that people are very much afraid of the death. This is what makes people developing substitute warriors for the cause.

[Necromancer- 0]

we're getting a bit off-topic..

I actually do not understand the "fuzz" about scopes for people with terrible aim..

Aren't red-dot scopes enough?

[shinRaiden 0]

There is one usage those that I'm suprised has not recieved any mention, and that's compensating optics for extreme range resolution.

You could take a couple laser beams (on the shark-shaped scope) and not only use the return for ranging, but also measure the refraction and deflection. That way you could dynamically shape the lense to compensate for heat and other environmental effects on visibility.

There's a big problem though with automatic dynamic focusing systems, and that's that they cause a lot of eye strain and fatigue from your brain constently trying to play catch-up with the focus. A more appropiate compromise would be to have it normally locked, then press a button to snap to the new focus and lock there, with manual overrides if you want to set the focus at a specific range.