BIS, enforce your own license

[Siege-A 4056]

On 5/31/2019 at 7:25 AM, FallujahMedic -FM- said:

Incorrect. We have documented proof in each instance, this includes Siege-A. I would post it for all to see, but I am prevented from doing so. 

 

Well to be accurate, both your statement as well as Haleks in regards to the USP Gear mod are partially correct, but not entirely. The only thing we were guilty of was using a verbally disapproved format with our mod, which means any accusations beyond that were in fact false. This would be just one instance, not multiple ones as you have made it seem. Can't imagine there being much 'documented proof' in concerns to that. And why would you want to share it to the public, when it wasn't even shared with the parties involved in the matter, unless you had some type of personal reason for doing so? Seems like a poor attitude to have on a subject that was mostly handled in private, especially coming from a moderator. So lets try and refrain from spreading misinformation or making it sound like more than what it was. Many of us know the facts and truth to the matter and you are doing nothing more than attempting to raise further suspicions. 

[FallujahMedic -FM- 867]

There is a saying that you should be quite familiar with and it's "Quit while you're ahead". 

Also, I think you've confused Written with Verbal, one is spoken and the other is, you guessed it, in writing. 

No misinformation has been spread, only the great extent of what you have done has been withheld. 

[Defunkt 431]

I don't know anything about the alleged IP infringement. What I do know that leads me to support the moderators' decision to shutdown the USP mod on these forums is this;

 

USP Early Access will make it's [sic] return in the near future as a benefit for current and new $10+ pledgers. - https://www.patreon.com/onmaar

 

[haleks 8212]

17 hours ago, FallujahMedic -FM- said:

There is a saying that you should be quite familiar with and it's "Quit while you're ahead". 

Also, I think you've confused Written with Verbal, one is spoken and the other is, you guessed it, in writing. 

No misinformation has been spread, only the great extent of what you have done has been withheld. 

 

Seen as you are unable to produce proof of any wrongdoing (what good are proofs if they can't be produced anyway) and that the matter has been kept private, throwing around morality lessons and insinuations in public seems way out of place.

 

We are veering a bit off-topic, but we are still in the dark as to the status of USP, and the last post still says "this thread has been locked temporarily"... Making insinuations in that context, when there is still a lot of uncertainty, and all while saying "I am being kept from saying more in public" is definitely not how a moderator should interact with his community. Either keep your beef with Siege-A away from public space, or go through and tell us explicitely what's going on - any in-between stance is only fueling doubts and gripes.

[haleks 8212]

2 hours ago, Defunkt said:

I don't know anything about the alleged IP infringement. What I do know that leads me to support the moderators' decision to shutdown the USP mod on these forums is this;

 

USP Early Access will make it's [sic] return in the near future as a benefit for current and new $10+ pledgers. - https://www.patreon.com/onmaar

 

 

I'm not sure that's really relevant though... If it's really 'early access', then it's certainly not locked behind a paywall (this would be the issue), as it implies that it would be followed by a public release.

Pledging to their patreon remains optional and, unless I missed something, not doing so won't prevent you from subscribing to the workshop release?

[Defunkt 431]

8 minutes ago, haleks said:

 

I'm not sure that's really relevant though... If it's really 'early access', then it's certainly not locked behind a paywall (this would be the issue), as it implies that it would be followed by a public release.

Pledging to their patreon remains optional and, unless I missed something, not doing so won't prevent you from subscribing to the workshop release?

 

What guarantee, or indeed motivation, exists that there will be a public release as long as they can make money off it remaining in 'testing'? Seems like it's already been in testing a long time. These things are best governed by black and white rules that aren't subject to interpretation or second guessing of intentions.

[Tankbuster 1746]

Early access? I don't think anybody is falling for that one.

[haleks 8212]

1 hour ago, Defunkt said:

 

What guarantee, or indeed motivation, exists that there will be a public release as long as they can make money off it remaining in 'testing'? Seems like it's already been in testing a long time. These things are best governed by black and white rules that aren't subject to interpretation or second guessing of intentions.

 

I don't have an answer to that, although I would point out that, if the rules were stricly applied, a lot of content creators activity on Patreon would be deemed illegal, including some famous youtubers (technically they are monetizing videos or feeds produced with Arma 3).

The patreon model has muddied the waters a bit I think, but on the other hand, BIS's approach is perfectible too : their politic on monetized servers creates a disparity between modders and server owners in terms of what is allowed or not when it comes to monetizing content.

[Siege-A 4056]

9 hours ago, Defunkt said:

I don't know anything about the alleged IP infringement. What I do know that leads me to support the moderators' decision to shutdown the USP mod on these forums is this;

 

USP Early Access will make it's [sic] return in the near future as a benefit for current and new $10+ pledgers. - https://www.patreon.com/onmaar

 

First off, I don't manage OMA's patreon page or do the updates/comments there, nor do I check up on it often. He doesn't play/own Arma, interact with this community, or stays updated on what is happening around here. This is a side project for him and as such, statements made there should be clarified through official USP discussions. Secondly, that post was made back in March and this would be my first time reading that part of it. So now that I'm aware of it, I'll have that taken care of, as we won't be offering early access anymore due to the confusion it causes among people that believe it puts something behind a paywall. Think what you will about it, but we don't offer that feature anymore and it isn't coming back.

 

EDIT: Done, it's been removed. Does that help sway your judgement at all?

 

Quote

No misinformation has been spread, only the great extent of what you have done has been withheld.

 

It hasn't been withheld, I just explained the extent of it above in my last post. Nothing more to tell beyond that and would be a lie to say otherwise.

[Homesick 290]

Response to some of Haleks questions: 

1. Siege-A's / USP teams thread lock has been discussed privately with them, and they are well aware of why the thread is locked. Their thread will stay locked until their mod is fully released to the public. 

2. Obviously copyright protection is important for us, especially when it comes to ripped content from other games such as Star Wars, Fallout etc. This is something we have full control over on the forums, however WS is more than just find the item, and ban it, hence why you might see more of this on the WS itself than on the forums. If it was as simple as find the mod, press 1 button = solved, I would have personally done it on a daily basis. 

3. I do understand your concerns in regards to the subject, and if I'm being honest I was also not too sure about this specific subject when I started at Bohemia. However it is not something I can comment on too much, as it is simply not something I can do much about personally. If you have any complaints or concerns in regards to "illegal" mods or so, feel free to contact our infringments department at infringments@bohemia.net. 

4. As I mentioned before our forums and the Steam Workshop is two different platforms, whereas one we have full control over, and the other one is more complicated than just ban and done. I can assure you that it is something we are aware off, and will hopefully improve upon when it is possible. (no promises though). 

 

5. As for the USP/Siege-A discussion that has once again occured for some reason: 

 - We have been discussing the subject with Siege-A and his team for over 2 months now in private, and we have provided them with answers for every question they have asked. They are well aware of the reasoning behind our decisions, so I don't believe it is a subject that needs to be discussed further in public. If the USP team have any more complaints/concerns feel free to DM me. Siege-A: "The only thing we were guilty of was using a verbally disapproved format with our mod, which means any accusations beyond that were in fact false." We both know this is incorrect, so I am not entirely sure why you're bringing this up, once again. 

 

This thread has been locked due to heading into a direction it should not be heading in. If you have any questions or concerns, feel free to PM me directly.