The Iraq Thread

[USSoldier11B 0]

Quote[/b] ]Pretty amazing. Coalition troops have done far worse than the UN inspectors in finding WMDs and you have still the stomach to criticise the inspectors...

Considering the UN gave them 12 years to hide them this is not surprising.

[shrike 0]

Quote[/b] ]Considering the UN gave them 12 years to hide them this is not surprising.

*swallowing down a harsh flame*

Geez USSoldier....maybe you should try to remove the Star Spangled Banner tatooed on your retina...every time I regain faith in US' political intelligence when reading comments by Schoeler or Tex or whoever shows the slightest bit of flexibility you stumble across and contaminate every single political thread with your simplifying views.

PR I embrace you...

PS: As I don't have the time to participate in this discussion I will gladly accept your reply in a PM. Don't bother in this thread...

[USSoldier11B 0]

Quote[/b] ] regain faith in US' political intelligence when reading comments by Schoeler or Tex or whoever shows the slightest bit of flexibility you stumble across and contaminate every single political thread with your simplifying views.

I could really care less what you think of my views. Just another honey pissing liberal to me. Your opinions appear just as ignorant to people like me as mine do to you and yours.

[FallenPaladin 0]

Not enough intel, too little surprise, not enough freedom to do the proper job, under-funded, under-equipped and under-staffed.  

Well, that`s been a little different. They had a lot of freedom and could go wherever they wanted. They got intel from the famous CIA which was total crap obviously. The inspectors did a pretty good job, before they were kicked out of Iraq by Bush and Co. If they found no WMDs, there are no WMDs left.

Now you believe in those people from the CIA who weren`t able to give hints to ONE site with WMDs. If you really believe the US inspectors, no matter from which organisation they are (CIA, military, FBI, ... ) will come up with WMDs, you`re a little naive. There are either no WMDs in Iraq or there will be found some nice new WMDs ("Made in USA"). The second alternative would be pretty stupid for the USA, but who knows what the hawks come up with next... On the other side this new fu##ing the world wouldn`t even be needed, because the USA needs no reasons to go to war at all.

Quote from famous FallenPaladin`s left-wing propaganda book "Small brains need mini nukes"

[Blaegis 0]

Gen. Tommy Franks Quits Army To Pursue Solo Bombing Projects - The Onion is at it again  

[Tex -USMC- 0]

Well, just to inject a little reality into the above post, General Franks (a fellow Midlander, btw- we seem to have a lock on wars these days) resigned because he refused the position of Army Chief of Staff. Why wouldn't he accept the position? Mr. Rumsfeld.

I don't know why y'all don't like Rumsfeld- he wants to reduce the US Army to 8 active, full-strength divisions (there's a good-sized war going on in the Pentagon between Rumsfeld and the Army at the moment). Of course, that extra money will be going to JDAMs and other cool new ways to kill people that don't cost so much money to haul around the globe. But, since the recent action in Iraq involved personnel of no less than 6 divisions, you have to wonder how a Republican could possibly be forgetting Cold War doctrine: the US must be able to fight 2 regional conflicts simultaneously.

[Jinef 2]

USSoldier11b:

I would say that the UN and coalition have done equally on finding WMD, they both haven't.

'Honey pissing liberal'

I suppose you like a good hardline dictator to tell you what to do. Or a to have the shit kicked out of you if you do something wrong?

Do you laugh when American soldiers die? Do you think that war is fun to watch on TV? Do you add the names of KIA to the scoreboard of families who have had their lives changed miserably because of war mongering wankers? Are you one of these people who punches anti war demonstrators?

I hope you get eaten by a shark, it might not eat you of course because it could be a left wing, sissy liberal shark.

So do you urinate brine? I'm fascinated by that naff expression, pissing honey, lol what a doorknob.

I'm going to get PRed now because of your ludicrous views!

Can a mod put the 4th Reich under his name or something. Or empirical fascist. Either one is fine.

[Tovarish 0]

Can a mod put the 4th Reich under his name or something. Or empirical fascist. Either one is fine.

Why not? After all, in his views, discrimination by private companies is totally acceptable, and these are BIS's company forums.

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Quote[/b] ]There were cells in Italy and Britain too.  Part of it is that the justice system in Germany is weak, and part of it is that they are considering German targets

Yes Mr. Schoeller. I agree. But at least we have a justice system. And Germany so far is the "most sucessfull country" (NYT) in giving trials to terorists of 9/11. And we already closed most cases and put them into jail. (while many innocent are still being treated like xxxx in Guantanamo Bay).

Why should a suicide-bomber be afraid of the juridical system? I would rather assume they are not afraid of anything.

Why Al-Quaida was in Germany? Because Germany is a country with a massive Arab community (while UK is rather Indian, pakistan.... and france is rather Africa.....). Deutschland is not only a good place to recruit but also to be left alone since germany was obliged after WWII to give exclusive sovereignity to its minorities.

BTW: Suicide Attack against German soldiers in Afghanistan: Well those german soldiers were on their way to the airport to return back home to Germany. What an ugly coincidence. On the other hand they were lucky to wear their flak-vests cause otherwise the death poll would have been much higher!

[Crazysheep 1]

Quote[/b] ]I could really care less what you think of my views.

I'm sorry, but it annoys me when people say that. It's, "I COULDN'T really care less." If you COULD care less, that means you DO care....because it's possible for you to have less caring, because you've just said that you could.

Oh, never mind.

[bn880 5]

Yeah, it should be "I could not care less"

[Crazysheep 1]

Quote[/b] ]There are either no WMDs in Iraq or there will be found some nice new WMDs ("Made in USA").

No, WMDs are hard to sneak into a country without foreign satellites or a regular guy at the CIA or NSA seeing them....more likely, they will fake documents to keep happy the people who stubbornly refuse to believe their government would lie.

[Jinef 2]

Hmm it would not be hard at all, the people at CIA wouldn't say anything, you have all these big military ships and equipment being unloaded and offloaded, in the surge of equipment being moved through it could easily go unnoticed. That comes from a loadmaster.

[Crazysheep 1]

Quote[/b] ]Hmm it would not be hard at all, the people at CIA wouldn't say anything, you have all these big military ships and equipment being unloaded and offloaded, in the surge of equipment being moved through it could easily go unnoticed. That comes from a loadmaster.

But American satellites are not the only ones watching Iraq....if Europe catches them smuggling WMDs in, they're in big trouble. It isn't worth the risk for the Bush administration.

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Quote[/b] ]they will fake documents to keep happy the people who stubbornly refuse to believe their government would lie.

And they dont even need to be professional. I remember the satelites photos during the UN-council. There were 2 and they were called "before" and "shortly after". But in reality shortly after was at least"4 weeks later".

Or the picture of a decontamination vehicule which turned out to be an oridnary fire-truck!

[Jinef 2]

Hehe,

"it's a suspected terrorist weapon!"

"What this? It's a piece of chewing gum ffs"

"Gum rhymes with gun! Only we by the right of the constitutuion have the right to carry firearms! Die terrorist *bang*"

[Schoeler 0]

Not enough intel, too little surprise, not enough freedom to do the proper job, under-funded, under-equipped and under-staffed.  

Well, that`s been a little different. They had a lot of freedom and could go wherever they wanted. They got intel from the famous CIA which was total crap obviously. The inspectors did a pretty good job, before they were kicked out of Iraq by Bush and Co. If they found no WMDs, there are no WMDs left.

Now you believe in those people from the CIA who weren`t able to give hints to ONE site with WMDs. If you really believe the US inspectors, no matter from which organisation they are (CIA, military, FBI, ... ) will come up with WMDs, you`re a little naive. There are either no WMDs in Iraq or there will be found some nice new WMDs ("Made in USA"). The second alternative would be pretty stupid for the USA, but who knows what the hawks come up with next... On the other side this new fu##ing the world wouldn`t even be needed,  because the USA needs no reasons to go to war at all.

Quote from famous FallenPaladin`s left-wing propaganda book "Small brains need mini nukes"

If I'm a little naive, then I'd have to say you are a little paranoid.

[Crazysheep 1]

Quote[/b] ]If I'm a little naive, then I'd have to say you are a little paranoid.

How is he paranoid? I could equally say someone else is paranoid if they believed Saddam Hussein had WMDs and connections to Al Queda.

[FallenPaladin 0]

Not enough intel, too little surprise, not enough freedom to do the proper job, under-funded, under-equipped and under-staffed.  

Well, that`s been a little different. They had a lot of freedom and could go wherever they wanted. They got intel from the famous CIA which was total crap obviously. The inspectors did a pretty good job, before they were kicked out of Iraq by Bush and Co. If they found no WMDs, there are no WMDs left.

Now you believe in those people from the CIA who weren`t able to give hints to ONE site with WMDs. If you really believe the US inspectors, no matter from which organisation they are (CIA, military, FBI, ... ) will come up with WMDs, you`re a little naive. There are either no WMDs in Iraq or there will be found some nice new WMDs ("Made in USA"). The second alternative would be pretty stupid for the USA, but who knows what the hawks come up with next... On the other side this new fu##ing the world wouldn`t even be needed,  because the USA needs no reasons to go to war at all.

Quote from famous FallenPaladin`s left-wing propaganda book "Small brains need mini nukes"

If I'm a little naive, then I'd have to say you are a little paranoid.

If I was an american hiding in his fortress-like house with a wagonload full of M16s and enough ammo to start WW3 on my own (as selfdefense of course) I`d be paranoid.

The psychologist and the officer who talked to me last week regarding my enlistment told me I`m totally allright. Now that you tell me I`m paranoid I realize that they lied to my preemtively to get me into military service, bwoooooohoooooo      

Wait!! According to US americans I`ve chatted with lately the only difference between our european freedom to the US freedom is that you can own full auto rifles in the USA. That makes them more free than us!  

Hmhehehe, I`ll have my G36 back in 2 months alongside with lots of other full auto guns. Geez... , I bet I`ve never been that free!!  

You can happily call me paranoid over and over again if I can call anyone who believes the Bush administration naive.  

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

RELAX.. ladies and gentlemen and enjoy the fireworks

New york skyline? here firework

[Jinef 2]

Quote[/b] ]US americans

Hehe, sounds like something Bush would say.

The united states americans will not tolerate this act of utter barbarity, Barney must be destroyed!

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Very simply, there is no doubt that Sadam Housein has now wepons of mass destruction"

Dick Cheney

26th of August 2002

"At this moment, Iraq expands its production facilities of WMD's"

President Bush

12th of September 2002

"If he declares that he has not WMD's, then we will know that he is trying to foolish the people for one more time"

Ari Fleischberg

2nd of January 2003

"We surely know that there are wepons there"

Ari Fleischberg

9th of January 2003

"Our secret services estime that Sadam Housein has the ability to make 500 tons of sharin, mustard gases, VX and nerve gases"

President Bush

28th of January 2003

"We know that Sadam Housein is determined to keep the WMD's he has and he is also determined to make more"

Colin Powell

5th of February 2003

"We have sources who reveal us that Sadam Housein has recently given the authority to the Iraqi armyto use chemical weapons - the weapons that the dictator refuses their possesion"

George W. Bush

8th of February 2003

"The secret services of our government and of other governments leave no doubt that the regime of Iraq continues to posess and hide some of the deadliest weapons that have ever been designed"

George W. Bush

17th of March 2003

"For typical reasons we concluded to this reason, the WMD's (as an excuse to invade Iraq), because it was the only reason to which everyone could agree"

Paul Wolfowitz

Interview to Vanity Fair

28th of March 2003...

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

opsss, seem to have forgotten some

Anyway, the list continues:

"Has the regime of Baghdad decided to remove from Iraq the Weapons of Mass Destruction? Clearly not..."

Colin Powel

Speech at the UN Security Council

7th of March 2003

"There is no doubt that we have proofs and information that Iraq has WMD's, and especially chemical and biological ones; all these will be revealed during the military operations, for as long as it takes"

Ari Fleischberg

Press conference

12th of March 2003

"There is no doubt that the regime of Sadam Hussein possesses WMD's. And as long as these operations will be continued, these weapons will be revealed along with those people who constructed and keep them"

General Tommy Franks

Press conference

22nd of March 2003

"I have no doubt that we will find huge stockpiles of weapons of mass destruction"

Kenneth Antelman

Member of the Defense Policy Council

23rd of March 2003

“One of our main targets is to reveal and destroy the WMD’s. There are a lot of placesâ€

Victoria Clark

Pentagon Representative

Press conference

22nd of March 2003

[Jinef 2]

Nice quotes Albert!

[Schoeler 0]

Not enough intel, too little surprise, not enough freedom to do the proper job, under-funded, under-equipped and under-staffed.  

Well, that`s been a little different. They had a lot of freedom and could go wherever they wanted. They got intel from the famous CIA which was total crap obviously. The inspectors did a pretty good job, before they were kicked out of Iraq by Bush and Co. If they found no WMDs, there are no WMDs left.

There are either no WMDs in Iraq or there will be found some nice new WMDs ("Made in USA"). The second alternative would be pretty stupid for the USA, but who knows what the hawks come up with next... On the other side this new fu##ing the world wouldn`t even be needed,  because the USA needs no reasons to go to war at all.

I've never said I believe the Bush administration.  In fact, feel free to check my posts throughout this forum and you will see that I'm no fan of George Bush.  Better yet, ask some of the other participants of this discussion and they'll vouch for me.

To believe that the U.S. could smuggle in WMD and then pass them off as Iraqi WMD, is paranoid.  Its conspiracy theory bullshit.  Someone, somewhere would blow the whistle.  That kind of operation would be too big to keep concealed from a number of people (whistleblowers, foreign intelligence officers, someone would find out about it).  If any more than a handful of people were to find out about it, the risk of exposure and the political fallout would outweigh the possible benefits to be achieved.  The U.S. reputation, which is already damaged would be thoroughly destroyed for generations to come.  No one can claim otherwise.  It's simply too risky.  Besides, they would have done it by now anyway.  And don't give me any "they are waiting to make it seem more real" line of shit either.  Not finding WMD is becoming a major embarassment for the U.S. and the Bush Administration is already starting to feel the political falout from its failure to do so.  They are under enormous pressure right now to justify the war.  This would be the optimum time to plant the weapons.

Quote[/b] ]Now you believe in those people from the CIA who weren`t able to give hints to ONE site with WMDs. If you really believe the US inspectors, no matter from which organisation they are (CIA, military, FBI, ... ) will come up with WMDs, you`re a little naive.

Also, I never said I believed that the U.S. would do a better job of finding WMD.  What I said, was that the U.N. team was too hampered by circumstances to do an effective job themselves.  You're so fucking quick to jump on any statement made by an American.  Why not actually read our posts and try and deduce what we've said?

Quote[/b] ]If I was an american hiding in his fortress-like house with a wagonload full of M16s and enough ammo to start WW3 on my own (as selfdefense of course) I`d be paranoid.

The psychologist and the officer who talked to me last week regarding my enlistment told me I`m totally allright. Now that you tell me I`m paranoid I realize that they lied to my preemtively to get me into military service, bwoooooohoooooo      

Wait!! According to US americans I`ve chatted with lately the only difference between our european freedom to the US freedom is that you can own full auto rifles in the USA. That makes them more free than us!  

Hmhehehe, I`ll have my G36 back in 2 months alongside with lots of other full auto guns. Geez... , I bet I`ve never been that free!!  

You can happily call me paranoid over and over again if I can call anyone who believes the Bush administration naive.  

Just for shits and giggles, let me tell you:

I live in a one bedroom apartment about a mile away from the University of Arizona (where I'm finishing my senior year) in downtown Tucson, not in some Montana right wing compound.  The only firearm I own is a Marlin .22 semi-auto rifle that, at the moment happens to be broken (I pulled it apart to clean it and can't get the action back together).  If I decide to abandon my moderate stance and go leftwing, I'll come live with you.  If I go right wing, I'll start buying weapons and move to Montana or the Dakotas.  

Also, I always believed it was our written Constitution, and in particular, our Bill of Rights that distinguished American freedom from the freedom of other nations, not just the 2nd Amendment.